The Truth About Taxes

[The Philosopher]

Re: RE: The Truth About Taxes

The NDP's record of fiscal responsibility is as good or better than the record of the Conservatives, Philospher. Check the records. Don't go whining about Bob Rae either, he served one term.

You've never made a point, BA. What you've done is yark (that's a combination barking and "yacking" off).

You're comparing apples and oranges. Even you admit that the Conservative Party of Canada is not the same as the Progressive Conservative Party OR the Reform Party.

 

[Numure]

Re: RE: The Truth About Taxes

To be fair, the original post gave tones of statistics. Bluealberta pulled out a bunch of them that favored Conservatives. Instead of working with those numbers and other numbers the debate has turned from the statistical tax break of families to "but who's going to be poor." It's obvious that Bluealberta realizes that tax cuts for the rich will not be tax cuts for the poor.

The model is that a tax cut for the rich helps keep Canada competitive against the out-migration that is present in America (they rarely cut corporate tax as we do). Conservatives support this tax cut and Liberals support this tax cut. The NDP is the only one that doesn't. Not to form an ad populem BUT, the NDP lacks credibility as a financial party considering they are socialists.

Mulro0ney did such a grewat job while in office... And Bush, a conservative, is doing such a great job fiscaly in the US. I call bullshit.

 

[The Philosopher]

Re: RE: The Truth About Taxes

Mulro0ney did such a grewat job while in office... And Bush, a conservative, is doing such a great job fiscaly in the US. I call bullshit.

Once again, apples and oranges. Mulrooney used a "spend into debt to gain wealth" model that Reagan used. A lot of his policies the Chretien Liberals liked. So much that they butchered healthcare to keep a lot of them in place (in the short term NAFTA hurt us but in the long run it helped).

Bush is using a more libertarian method. He is closing down military bases, decreasing military spending overall, and tax cuts. Tax cuts are a proven way to help the economy. Ask Chretien he gave two tax cuts while in office and saw the largest booms during these times. In the US after each tax cut was a sudden boom of traffic.

Another thing to remember is that standards in America and Canada are different. In Canada we start calling high unemployment when it hits 20%. In the US once it goes above 4% its called high unemployment. America's unemployment is somewhere around 5-6%. By American standards Canada is in hard shape in terms of employment. The economy has moved back up in the United States. Their problem has never been about the economy. No policy could change what their problem is, inflation growing faster than wages. Wages is determined between a company and the employer, not the government.

Now the Harper Conservatives are not like the Mulrooney Conservatives. Harper's economic policies rival those of Alberta's Ralph Klein. What's the big thing about Alberta? It is one of the few provinces in Canada that actually pays into equalization and gets nothing out of it.

Harper presented a massive budget, a debt budget. But what is interesting and unique about his is that he wrote it as a priorities list where he'lll have a balanced budget but will not actually spend all the money at once. On the end of the list is a carrier (military craft) from the Americans. Because of its unique character other politicians attacked it as if it was a one-year budget like they were proposing.

 

[Derry McKinney]

Blue, you are purposely obtuse.

Phil...I'm comparing the fiscal records of governments.

 

[bluealberta]

Blue, you are purposely obtuse.

Phil...I'm comparing the fiscal records of governments.

DM, Then you are not in favor of increasing womens wages?

 

[Derry McKinney]

I am in favour of equal pay for work of equal value.

 

[Jay]

Conservatives don't bother with small change though, Twila.

They don’t? Gee I’m a conservative, I’m concerned about small change. I keep it in a jar. I’m not as concerned about it as the left though…they wish to take it for their own uses, or only leave me with small change to live with so they can buy your next vote.

They make a whack of money and expect to keep it all.

Funny I don’t make a whack of money, but I can only expect to keep 50% of it.

See how it is. If your conservative and complain that 50% tax is too much, your really saying that you want to pay no taxes at all, or your greedy for wanting most of the money you earn (for crazy things like education and bettering your family and retirement…)

Of course their habits pollute more, require more infrastructure, contribute less,

I suppose so. If going to work and paying transfer payments are habits…I suppose I would rather be a conservative and go to work in an ingenuity driven market rather than sitting on my ass all day living off of other people….

How does a conservative contribute less? And we all use the infrastructure…

We all know that anyone who generates pollution must be conservative…

and are completely unsustainable unless you are insane enough to buy into the doctrine of unlimited growth with limited resources, but don't ask questions. If you do ask questions you are a commie or something.

Conservatives call lefties commie for reasons like taking half and more of our money and engineering our society with it, and for things like keeping lists of people with guns, and inventions like hate laws... not for questioning whether or not we can sustain growth with limited recourses.

Yeah. I've been a commie for a long time now. It comes with being left handed and not dispising Fidel Castro.

Surly Twila, you can understand that some people don’t understand how other people can not despise a leader who keeps political prisoners and won’t allow free elections. It is hard to fathom why anyone wouldn’t despise Castro.

 

[Derry McKinney]

Nice try, Jay. You really didn't say anything though.

 

[Jay]

Other than the part directed a Twila, I said your post was BS. (I just said it in a nicer way, cause I'm a nice guy.)

 

[Derry McKinney]

No, what you did was spew right wing platitudes.

 

[Twila]

Surly Twila, you can understand that some people don’t understand how other people can not despise a leader who keeps political prisoners and won’t allow free elections. It is hard to fathom why anyone wouldn’t despise Castro.

Jay. I can understand how some can't understand. I work extremely hard to understand why people believe what they do. I also know that Fidel is not the ONLY leader to do the things he does. But what I find particularly alarming about most peoples with negative views on Fidel is that they ignore Guatanamo bay and they ignore the fact that the only reason the US has a hate on for them is because Fidel would not bend over for the US. Instead He chose to deal with the USSR.

and as most US citizens don't like communists so won't support Cuba they will still shop at Walmart and by things made in China.

There is nothing that Fidel has done that Bush Cheney. and Rumsfield haven't done either. They however are better able to control the leaks.......That and they a larger support base.

 

[Jay]

Against left wing platitudes.

 

[Derry McKinney]

bullshit, Jay. You never addressed what I said, just tossed up the usual, "The left are all communists and will take away individual rights," even though the record of the left in Canada does not support that.

 

[Jay]

Re: RE: The Truth About Taxes

Surly Twila, you can understand that some people don’t understand how other people can not despise a leader who keeps political prisoners and won’t allow free elections. It is hard to fathom why anyone wouldn’t despise Castro.

Jay. I can understand how some can't understand. I work extremely hard to understand why people believe what they do. I also know that Fidel is not the ONLY leader to do the things he does. But what I find particularly alarming about most peoples with negative views on Fidel is that they ignore Guatanamo bay and they ignore the fact that the only reason the US has a hate on for them is because Fidel would not bend over for the US. Instead He chose to deal with the USSR.

and as most US citizens don't like communists so won't support Cuba they will still shop at Walmart and by things made in China.

There is nothing that Fidel has done that Bush Cheney. and Rumsfield haven't done either. They however are better able to control the leaks.......That and they a larger support base.

I just needed to say that to you, to appeal to your intellectual side, as I supposed you understood why people have a hard time with people who "support" Castro.

I wonder though…. if there wasn't a ban on Cuban trinkets, and they were for sale in Wall mart, would Americans buy them? I bet they would. I suppose gone are the days of political shopping, good or bad.

 

[bluealberta]

Re: RE: The Truth About Taxes

I am in favour of equal pay for work of equal value.

As am I, and we have made great strides in that area. There are fewer and fewer instances where this happens.

My point about taxes is still the same though. If Female A is paid the same as Male B, no matter if the same job or not, then Female A should pay the same tax as Male B, correct? So if Female B started $10k below Male B, and paid less taxes because of lower wages, but has now reached the same income as Male B, how does the NDP propose to reduce Female A's taxes? The NDP is not advocating that in this instance Female A pay less tax than Male B, is it?

 

[bluealberta]

Re: RE: The Truth About Taxes

No, what you did was spew right wing platitudes.

Actually, what we did was state truths, no left wing or right wing bias in them. They were very good points and rebuttals.

 

[Twila]

I wonder though…. if there wasn't a ban on Cuban trinkets, and they were for sale in Wall mart, would Americans buy them? I bet they would. I suppose gone are the days of political shopping, good or bad.

I believe that people are people and follow the path of least resistence. If this were not so we'd have alot less addicts in the world.

 

[Jay]

Re: RE: The Truth About Taxes

I wonder though…. if there wasn't a ban on Cuban trinkets, and they were for sale in Wall mart, would Americans buy them? I bet they would. I suppose gone are the days of political shopping, good or bad.

I believe that people are people and follow the path of least resistence.

And In that case it is probably best to ban trinkets from China too.

 

[Derry McKinney]

My point about taxes is still the same though. If Female A is paid the same as Male B, no matter if the same job or not, then Female A should pay the same tax as Male B, correct? So if Female B started $10k below Male B, and paid less taxes because of lower wages, but has now reached the same income as Male B, how does the NDP propose to reduce Female A's taxes? The NDP is not advocating that in this instance Female A pay less tax than Male B, is it?

Your point on taxes is completely irrelevant because you are basing it on a purposeful misinterpretation of NDP policy. As I've told you several times already, there is nothing in the NDP policy that would tax men and women making the same incomes at different rates.

What the policy says is that because there are more women who earn less money, that women would, as a group, get more of a tax break. So now that your misinterpretation has been corrected again, maybe you can drop the crap.

Actually, what we did was state truths, no left wing or right wing bias in them. They were very good points and rebuttals.

I realize that reading and comprehension aren't your strong suits, BA, but I was responding to Jay's post which was full of nothing but the usual lies and half-truths that he likes to put forth.

 

[bluealberta]

My point about taxes is still the same though. If Female A is paid the same as Male B, no matter if the same job or not, then Female A should pay the same tax as Male B, correct? So if Female B started $10k below Male B, and paid less taxes because of lower wages, but has now reached the same income as Male B, how does the NDP propose to reduce Female A's taxes? The NDP is not advocating that in this instance Female A pay less tax than Male B, is it?

Your point on taxes is completely irrelevant because you are basing it on a purposeful misinterpretation of NDP policy. As I've told you several times already, there is nothing in the NDP policy that would tax men and women making the same incomes at different rates.

Whatever, it was your article. And yes, you have several times been wrong, but go ahead.

What the policy says is that because there are more women who earn less money, that women would, as a group, get more of a tax break. So now that your misinterpretation has been corrected again, maybe you can drop the crap.

No misinterpretation. How does your petard feel? :twisted:

Actually, what we did was state truths, no left wing or right wing bias in them. They were very good points and rebuttals.

I realize that reading and comprehension aren't your strong suits, BA, but I was responding to Jay's post which was full of nothing but the usual lies and half-truths that he likes to put forth.

Gee, I did not know that you were responding to Jay. 8O :roll:

I read his post and was responding to your criticism of his post, which was true, not untrue as you claim. Or is that not allowed any more here? 8O :wink: :twisted: