The Rise Of The Fourth Reich

[HousesOfApollo]

Re: RE: The Rise Of The Fourth Reich

Most americans vote with their hearts, not with their minds. Whoever is able to exploit this reality the best, wins.

Heh. I believe that if you could 'color' parts of the brain like states, then your brain stem would be a Red part, while your cerebral cortex, and all the higher parts would be blue .. :lol:

 

[Rick van Opbergen]

Voting with your heart is not solely an American thing. Ever heard of Pim Fortuyn, the right-wing populist who was shot? His party got more than 1.5 million votes in the Netherlands (with a total population of 16 million). If people would not vote with their hearts, but with their minds, world politics would be so much different.

 

[HousesOfApollo]

RE: The Rise Of The Fourt

They vote with their brains, but just the impulse part, the animal part; this is no reasoning involved. Just fear, we saw that on tuesday, the absolute power fear has over people, it shuts down the rest of the brain...

 

[Rick van Opbergen]

But than you can claim a lot of people who favored Kerry and voted for him and his Democratic Party also voted out of fear - fear of Bush. Not?

 

[HousesOfApollo]

RE: The Rise Of The Fourt

Sure you could, but it was a more reasoned, and legitimate fear, it's the kind of fear that moves down from reason. The kind of fear the Bushie have, it's a 'Boogieman' sort of fear, while ours seemed to be a genuine concern.

 

[Rick van Opbergen]

And what about those people who voted Republican not because of the fear for terror, but out of fear that their traditional values will deteriorate (with a Democratic president)?

 

[HousesOfApollo]

RE: The Rise Of The Fourt

Misinformation, they're just basically conditioned to believe that Democrats are pro-gay marriage (which gets you good old-fasioned homophobia), pro minority (racism), and some will just say 'Pro Gay Agenda', which is just retarded. And some say Democrats would allow foreigners too much influence (Xeno phobia), so it's basically just a conduit for all these fears; they are only called 'values'.

 

[Rick van Opbergen]

And what about Christian values? As in: is Bush not more a openly Christian president than Kerry? Is it not logical out of that point of view that devout Christians are more pulled towards Bush than to Kerry?

 

[HousesOfApollo]

RE: The Rise Of The Fourt

You're asking me to try to understand devout Christians, and that's something I'm never going to get. I haven't been inside of a church since I was baptized (Catholic), and I never will step foot inside as long I as possess free will. I guess all I could say is that Religion is illogical, and the actions of its believers are thus...

 

[Rick van Opbergen]

Hmmm OK ... so that question stays open?

 

[HousesOfApollo]

RE: The Rise Of The Fourt

Hmm, you can ask them. A lot of them didn't even make up their minds for themselves. They have these things called 'Christian Voter's Guides' that, under the pretext of being a faith-based guide, basically just say Vote Republican. Then their Churches said to Vote for Bush, and Christianity by it's very nature is a Religion of followers...

 

[ElPolaco]

I'm a Christian and our religion is indeed, not one of logic, but of faith. My political opinions are based on my faith. my belief that corparate capitalism is greed and war is murder puts me on one side of the political spectrum and my belief that abortion is murder puts me on the other. Unfortunately, most adherents of Christianity turn it into a civic religion and think that capitalism and war are, in some way, established by God.

 

[jamie]

moghrabi-
your comment:
"The government prefers it that way as a fearful people are easier to rule than a courageous one."

No, that sounds like Australia, U.K. and all the other countries that have taken away citizens rights to posses a gun (i.e. in their home, for protection), leaving only the government and criminals WITH guns.
Now that sounds like a country that doesn't want its people to to be courageuos and be able to defend themselves.
I mean what would you do if a criminal was about to break into your home, rape and murder you and your family....call the local PM and ask him to save you?
I know of someone who listened to a family being murdered while they were waiting for the police to get there to protect them....they might have had a better chance at surviving if they were allowed to defend themselves.

enjoy.

 

[Reverend Blair]

Jimmy said,

that sounds like Australia, U.K. and all the other countries that have taken away citizens rights to posses a gun (i.e. in their home, for protection), leaving only the government and criminals WITH guns.

Fear? The UK and Austrailia, as well as every other civilised country on earth, have far less gun crime than the United States.

I mean what would you do if a criminal was about to break into your home, rape and murder you and your family....call the local PM and ask him to save you?

I wouldn't do anything...according to your scenario I'm already dead, remember? Don't let the long hair and beard fool you...once I'm dead I have no intention of getting up and doing stuff.

Polaco said,

Unfortunately, most adherents of Christianity turn it into a civic religion and think that capitalism and war are, in some way, established by God.

I've never been able to figure out how they reconcile that. Everything in Christianity says to be peaceful and warns against greed. It's the over-riding message of the New Testament. How come these people who think killing (quickly or slowly) for wealth is okay get to represent your religion, Polaco?

 

[Rick van Opbergen]

About 54% of all gun-related deaths are suicides; in 2003, the number of "accidental firearm deaths" in the US was 776. In the last eleven years, a total of 360,000 US citizens died from "intentional firearm injury". 45% of these 360,000 were homicides (162,000 persons) (Centers For Disease Control National Center for Injury Prevention & Control)

 

[Rick van Opbergen]

Reverend: there are 2 billion Christians. You pick the ones who kill as them being the ones who represent Christianity (I think you are pointing at Bush & friends). Am I right?

 

[HousesOfApollo]

RE: The Rise Of The Fourt

This discussion right here, is one of the reasons that I'm an Atheist...

 

[Reverend Blair]

I'm an atheist too, Apollo. I've never been in an actual foxhole, but I've been some proverbial ones and the old saying just isn't true.

Reverend: there are 2 billion Christians. You pick the ones who kill as them being the ones who represent Christianity (I think you are pointing at Bush & friends). Am I right?

No, I question why they get to appoint themselves as the representatives of their religion when so many of the things they do contradict that religion.

As someone with a little bit more than a passing knowledge of the teachings of the guy the religion is named after (I actually read the book), I have great difficulty seeing how the Christian right in the US and Canada can call themselves Christians.

 

[HousesOfApollo]

RE: The Rise Of The Fourt

I can't even understand how religious people think. I have never been involved with any religion in my entire life. So I'm surrounded by people who are so fundamentally different from me. The way I see it, is that they're inside of a box, indoctrination has places four walls and a roof around their thinking, and the only people that can put anything inside of that box is the so-called 'Religious leaders', the Pat Robertson's, Jerry Falwells, etc etc...

 

[Rick van Opbergen]

Oh, but you're talking 'bout the US conservative Christian right ... explains a lot ... I thought you meant all Christians from Australia to Chile, from Japan to Israel ... I'm just babbling now ... anyway, can't answer that? Maybe misinformation by the conservative media?