The Quran gives the easier way

[Corduroy]

The non-religious wants to be free

And vice versa?
.

 

[eanassir]

I don't believe you, you've emphasized the horrors that await unbelievers too many times without expressing anything I can detect as empathy for them, the only attitude you display is that they deserve it. I think the idea pleases you.

This meaning is told in the Glorious Quran in many revelations, when the apostle comes and warns his people of the idolatry, then they disbelieve him, then the punishment settles on them; the apostle will say:
As in the Quran 7: 79 about Salih the apostle to the tribe of Thamood:
فَتَوَلَّى عَنْهُمْ وَقَالَ يَا قَوْمِ لَقَدْ أَبْلَغْتُكُمْ رِسَالَةَ رَبِّي وَنَصَحْتُ لَكُمْ وَلَكِن لاَّ تُحِبُّونَ النَّاصِحِينَ

The explanation:
(Then he left them and said: "my people, I did convey to you the message of my Lord, and advised you sincerely, but you do not love sincere advisers.")

Also Shaib said to his people who were destroyed by the earthquake, as in the Quran 7:

فَتَوَلَّى عَنْهُمْ وَقَالَ يَا قَوْمِلَقَدْ أَبْلَغْتُكُمْ رِسَالاَتِ رَبِّي وَنَصَحْتُ لَكُمْ فَكَيْفَ آسَى عَلَىقَوْمٍ كَافِرِينَ​

The explanation:
(So he left them, and said: "my people, I have conveyed to you the messages of my Lord, and advised you sincerely, so how should I grieve for such disbelieving people!?")

 

[Corduroy]

This thread makes me feel blue

edit: I broke the trend!

edit2: ****, it went back to blue? It must be a sign from Krishna (the blue-skinned Hindu god) that all this talk of false gods upsets him. Turn away from monotheism! And embrace the many-armed gods of Hinduism!

 

[Retired_Can_Soldier]

I am a hanief [following Abraham's devotion to God alone), and a Muslim: submitting myself to God alone.

What exactly is hanief? Is that also Muslim or Jewish?

 

[eanassir]

What exactly is hanief? Is that also Muslim or Jewish?

A hanief is one who follow the creed of Abraham who was exclusively devoted to God alone and was against the idolatry. The Muslim is commanded to follow this way of Abraham who was neither a Jew nor a Christian.

So I am a Muslim: submitting myself to God alone.

This thread makes me feel blue

edit: I broke the trend!

edit2: ****, it went back to blue?

It does not change after edition: the color icon does not work when one edits.
It may be to let you feel blue or to smoke more cigarettes

 

[Corduroy]

Abraham was the guy that would kill his own son for God. He's a great role model for all murderous fanatics in the Abrahamic religions . I mean, if God ever told me to do that I'd tell him to go **** himself.

 

[eanassir]

This is in complement of the post #22

Following the destruction of disbelievers, the apostle was ordered to praise God, like Noah after the drowning of his people; as in the Quran 23: 28
فَإِذَا اسْتَوَيْتَ أَنتَ وَمَن مَّعَكَ عَلَى الْفُلْكِ فَقُلِ الْحَمْدُ لِلَّهِ الَّذِي نَجَّانَا مِنَ الْقَوْمِ الظَّالِمِينَ

The explanation:
(And when you [Noah] have mounted on the Ark together with those with you, then say:"Praise be to God Who has saved us from the people of thewrong-doing.")


Another apostle Gamaleil (following the destruction of Jerusalem by Titus) said as in the Quran 36: 30
يَا حَسْرَةً عَلَى الْعِبَادِ مَا يَأْتِيهِم مِّن رَّسُولٍ إِلاَّ كَانُوا بِهِ يَسْتَهْزِؤُون

The explanation:
("Alas for servants! [For] there never comes to them an apostle, but they mock at him."

Do [your people, Mohammed] not consider how many [past] generations We destroyed before them [when they denied their messengers]? Will they not refer to their [condition and be not like them]!?)

Abraham was the guy that would kill his own son for God. He's a great role model for all murderous fanatics in the Abrahamic religions . I mean, if God ever told me to do that

God may not tell you; He only told His loyal friend Abraham to see is his love to God more or is his love to his only son: Ismael (the first son born for Abraham and who was his only son before the birth of Isaac.)

 

[Dexter Sinister]

"... how should I grieve for such disbelieving people!?"

Yes, people who disbelieve deserve no consideration, might as well kill them all off. And you cannot even conceive of the possibility that you might be wrong.


Little history lesson here for you:

In Baghdad between the years 800 and 1100 or so, there was a flourishing scientific and mathematical enterprise involving Muslim, Christian, Jewish, and other, scholars and the free exchange of ideas. These are the people who named over two thirds of the stars that have names, invented algebra (and gave us the word), invented the Arabic numerals we still use, promoted zero as a useful mathematical idea, preserved much of the ancient Greek learning while Europeans were busy disemboweling each other, and a whole lot of other stuff. And then along came Imam Hamil al-Ghazali. He was to Islam about what St. Augustine was to Christianity. He took all the various ways people were observing Islam, codified it all, wrote it all down, and it became the authoritative guide on how to be a proper Muslim. One of the things he said was that manipulating numbers is the work of the devil, and he objected strongly to searching for knowledge for its own sake, without an immediate practical application. He destroyed the philosophical basis of that scholarly enterprise, replaced information with revelation. There has been no significant scientific or engineering advancement associated with Islam ever since, it's never recovered. That's what submission gets you: a dead end.

 

[CUBert]

Einestein when he was child, he exposed your fallacy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MKWNXqa5g0

My disbelief comes from how God wired my brain, my disbelief is directly the result of God

Einestein when he was child, he exposed your fallacy

My disbelief comes from how God wired my brain, my disbelief is directly the result of God

Einestein when he was child, he exposed your fallacy

My disbelief comes from how God wired my brain, my disbelief is directly the result then of God

 

[Dexter Sinister]

Einestein when he was child, he exposed your fallacy.

I can't imagine Einstein, even as a child, making such a specious argument, which is itself just a semantic fallacy that demonstrates nothing. Cold is the absence of heat, dark is the absence of light? Silly word games, and Einstein wasn't a believer anyway.

 

[gopher]

I'll go to any mosque or synagogue that will give me a wealthy wife or two.

 

[eanassir]

I'll go to any mosque or synagogue that will give me a wealthy wife or two.

Go to the church, if your teeth are not fallen.

Yes, people who disbelieve deserve no consideration, might as well kill them all off.

Now, I have realized that you are not that scientific. How can you deduce this and accuse me with such a thing?
The idea is that when God decides to afflict anyone and any people with any calamity or bestow mercy --> then none can avert this.

As in the Quran 13: 11
وَإِذَا أَرَادَ اللّهُ بِقَوْمٍ سُوءًا فَلاَ مَرَدَّ لَهُ وَمَا لَهُم مِّن دُونِهِ مِن وَالٍ

The explanation:
(If God intends evil to any folk, then it cannot be averted, and – apart from God – they will have not any patron.)

And like His saying - be glorified - in the Quran 10: 107
وَإِن يَمْسَسْكَ اللّهُ بِضُرٍّ فَلاَ كَاشِفَ لَهُ إِلاَّ هُوَ وَإِن يُرِدْكَ بِخَيْرٍ فَلاَ رَآدَّ لِفَضْلِهِ يُصَيبُ بِهِ مَن يَشَاء مِنْ عِبَادِهِ وَهُوَ الْغَفُورُ الرَّحِيمُ

The explanation:
(If God inflicts you [man] with some affliction, none but He can remove it;
and if He wills for you any good [: the prophethood], then none can prevent His favor [from reaching you];
He bestows it [: the prophethood] on any of His servants He pleases [: that servant being kind-hearted and good-doer]; and He is the Most Forgiving, the Most Merciful.)

While as regards Abu Hamid Al-Ghazali whom you mentioned; I don't think he said as you stated; but he did not like the way the philosophers think; and another one Ibn Rushd contradicted him later on in the next generation, I think. Abu Hamid was from Persia, and Ibn Rushd was from Andalusia.

Anyhow, to each one of these two scholars was his own opinion which is not compulsory, and they were not prophets bringing revelation from God.

My disbelief comes from how God wired my brain, my disbelief is directly the result then of God

No, it is not compulsory; God let man have the free choice to believe and be grateful, or to disbelieve and be ungrateful.

As in the Quran 76: 3
إِنَّا هَدَيْنَاهُ السَّبِيلَ إِمَّا شَاكِرًا وَإِمَّا كَفُورًا

The explanation:
(We have shown to him the [correct] way; [and have given to him the choice] whether to be grateful or ungrateful.)

I can't imagine Einstein, even as a child, making such a specious argument, which is itself just a semantic fallacy that demonstrates nothing. Cold is the absence of heat, dark is the absence of light? Silly word games, and Einstein wasn't a believer anyway.

Whether he is Einstein or not; the idea is he refuted their claims of ascribing the evil to God - be exalted.
So he proved to his teacher that the evil is only the absence of good from the heart of the disbeliever, and the atheist in the first place lies to himself by denying his Creator, and at last will lose.

 

[CUBert]

Studies have shown significant differences in brain activity between believers and non-believers
Brain Differences Found Between Believers In God And Non-believers
God wired my brain to be a non-believer

 

[Dexter Sinister]

... when God decides to afflict anyone and any people with any calamity...

Why would a merciful loving god do that? Surely an omnipotent, omniscient deity could come up with something better than that to bring people to the correct path. That makes god the agent of inflicting evil on people.

Whether he is Einstein or not; the idea is he refuted their claims of ascribing the evil to God - be exalted.
So he proved to his teacher that the evil is only the absence of good from the heart of the disbeliever, ...

Obviously that wasn't Einstein, that was an actor in a movie, a work of fiction. And if you think the script writer's argument that he put in the child's mouth constitutes proof of anything, you are very much mistaken. It makes just as much sense (i.e. none at all) to argue that good is just the absence of evil. You're also implicitly arguing that only a disbeliever can be evil, which is, or ought to be, obvious nonsense to any thinking person. Philosophers and theologians who've thought far more deeply about this than you and I have been debating the problem of evil for millennia, without resolution. If that simple bit of casuistry were adequate, they'd have figured it out long ago.

 

[Durry]

The quran keeps the Muslims following a barbaric culture.

Here's another stoneing example of how they still manage to accomplish this barbaric mentality.

Yahoo! Canada News

 

[gopher]

''Go to the church, if your teeth are not fallen.''

My teeth are almost perfect for a 60 year old. Now, what church do you suggest.

 

[eanassir]

Studies have shown significant differences in brain activity between believers and non-believers
Brain Differences Found Between Believers In God And Non-believers
God wired my brain to be a non-believer

1- Such studies are not exact and precise; it is suggesting and according to the caprice of the researchers.
2- Any thinking and any experience will have its stamp on the brain, in addition to many chemical, psychological, and life experiences.
3- Certainly, it is you that wire your brain to some extent or another: if one denies God and acts as ungodly --> he will be like the wandering-about cattle, in addition to many other acts like alcohol drinking, cigarette smoking, the hatred towards others --> all this will influence your brain.

While believing in God, on the contrary it will give you steadiness of thinking and soundness of emotion and your insight and wisdom in life will be better, and specially when one keeps up reciting the Quran and remembering God day and night --> this will certainly give better consequences on the brain.

But some disbelievers and atheists work hardly to prove by lying that religion (the true religion of God of course, not the religion of ignorance and idolatry and enthusiasm) that it leads to bad effect on the brain; but they are wrong and their brains are badly harmed by their own selves.

It has happened that whenever I read the soora 47, I have much relief from any distress that I encounter in the daily life:

This is in the Quran 47: 1-3

الَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا وَصَدُّوا عَنسَبِيلِ اللَّهِ أَضَلَّ أَعْمَالَهُمْ .
وَالَّذِينَ آمَنُوا وَعَمِلُواالصَّالِحَاتِ وَآمَنُوا بِمَا نُزِّلَ عَلَى مُحَمَّدٍ وَهُوَ الْحَقُّ مِنرَّبِّهِمْ كَفَّرَ عَنْهُمْ سَيِّئَاتِهِمْ وَأَصْلَحَ بَالَهُمْ .
ذَلِكَ بِأَنَّ الَّذِينَ كَفَرُوا اتَّبَعُواالْبَاطِلَ وَأَنَّ الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا اتَّبَعُوا الْحَقَّ مِن رَّبِّهِمْكَذَلِكَ يَضْرِبُ اللَّهُ لِلنَّاسِ أَمْثَالَهُمْ .​

The explanation:
(Those who unbelieve and bar [people] from God's way [: His religion]; God [will] make their works void.

But those who believe [in God alone] and work righteous [deeds] and believe in [the Quran] revealed to Mohammed – and it is the very truth [coming] from their Lord – He concealed their evil acts [from the sight of souls], and improved their condition [into peace and easiness.]

That [is the rewarding of the two parties] because the unbelievers follow the falsehood [so they deserve the punishment], while the believers follow the truth [coming] from their Lord [so they deserve Paradise]; thus does God expound to people their parables.)

quran-ayat.co

Why would a merciful loving god do that? Surely an omnipotent, omniscient deity could come up with something better than that to bring people to the correct path. That makes god the agent of inflicting evil on people.

God is Merciful in this World towards both the believers and the non-believers: to each He gives much of His bounties and grace: each has children, wealth, safety, health and a large number of uncountable bounties and favors.
The believer should be grateful: although most of people including the believers are ungrateful or forget to thank God for His blessings and grace. A little number of people do give thanks and show gratitude.

As God said in the Quran 34: 13
اعْمَلُوا آلَ دَاوُودَ شُكْرًا وَقَلِيلٌ مِّنْ عِبَادِيَ الشَّكُورُ

The explanation:
(Work in [a way to show] gratitude [to God], O members of [Prophet] David's house [to build the Holly Mosque at Jerusalem];
for few indeed are those, that are grateful, among My servants.)

But it is among His program is to bring the people deserving the guidance to the true guidance, and to misguide the wrong-doers.

Obviously that wasn't Einstein, that was an actor in a movie, a work of fiction. And if you think the script writer's argument that he put in the child's mouth constitutes proof of anything, you are very much mistaken. It makes just as much sense (i.e. none at all) to argue that good is just the absence of evil. You're also implicitly arguing that only a disbeliever can be evil, which is, or ought to be, obvious nonsense to any thinking person. Philosophers and theologians who've thought far more deeply about this than you and I have been debating the problem of evil for millennia, without resolution. If that simple bit of casuistry were adequate, they'd have figured it out long ago.

As I said whether it be Einstein or another one; and certainly he was an actor telling the story of Einstein in his childnood, and when I saw this movie part, I thought that God rewarded this Einstein for his defending and gave him such science and fame. Anyhow many admire Einstein exceedingly, so he is in this time like Ptolemy in his time who was once thought to be infallible, and the church adopte his teachings although he did not bring any revelation from God.

What that child said was genius and answered their fallacies by few words that dumbed the teacher.

If one contemplates, he will discover that: take e.g. the cancer: it is a disease: the disease is the distortion of the health; you cannot appreciate the health unless man suffers the disease: the headache, the pain ...etc. Now to every disease there is the medicinal drugs, but it may be unknown, then will be discovered (may be the people of Mars know the cure of the cancer as do we know the cure of the bacterial dieseases )

The police man carries his staff to hit the thief with it; if he does not hit the theif, the property of people will be robbed. God created the snake to bite the religious who follows the idolatry and the association with God and to bite the atheist who denies God his Creator and he works strenuously to disprove God and to contradict God.

The snake will bite the wrong-doer whom God knows, but he conceals his wrong-doing from people; such snake or tiger will go searching until she leaves many people but she comes to theis God's enemy to bite him or the tiger devours him.

And this World is a home of trial to see who will pass the examination and who will fail: we are under the invisible camera as they call it. We are pictured while we are unaware: the patient will suffer to see will he keep up to his belief or will he disbelieve.

The Wold is not a home of everlasting; it is of a very short duration.

There in the next afterlife, man will live - in case he pass the trial and examination - will live without disesase, and will be happy with his wives, and children (if his children die in their childhood) and prosperity, and wine and milk and fruits and every pleasure to which God invites man.

So while the disbeliever insists on his disbelief --> let him go to whatever he has chosen.

As God said in the Quran 7: 185

أوَلَمْ يَنْظُرُوا في ملَكوتِ السّماواتِ والأرْضِ وما خَلَقَ اللهُ مِنْ شَيْءٍ وأنْ عَسَى أنْ يَكُونَ قَد اقْتَربَ أجَلُهُمْ فبِأيّ حَديثٍ بَعْدَهُ يُؤمِنُون ؟​

The explanation:

(Have they not considered the kingdom of the heavens and the earth, and what things God has created,
and it may be their term is already drawing nigh;
in what revelation, after this [Quran], then will they believe?)

That is because there will not be any new revelation following the Quran (other than only the interpretation of the Quran)


Nature

''Go to the church, if your teeth are not fallen.''

My teeth are almost perfect for a 60 year old. Now, what church do you suggest.

Go to your church and plead them to give you a wife or two, specially you are a poor 60 years old; it may be some 50 years old rich girl will accept you (and tell her you teeth are almost perfect. Such a woman will be good for gopher, specially she is depleted of her tobacco - a parable. i.e. she will not give you sex; only she will clean your room and cook your food

 

[The Old Medic]

The Quran was supposedly DICTATED by an illiterate person, to three other fellows, who wrote down what the illiterate person said, but not till after he had died. Yes indeed, and we are to believe that this is an inspired book of God, when Mohammed himself is NEVER known to have actually said any of the things that are in the Quran. There are no accounts from any other source that he wanted, or even tried to make, a new religion.

Muslims are supposed to eat only "halal", which is actually exactly the same as Kosher. But, the vast majority of Muslims do NOT follow Halal explicitly, do they? So, they do not follow the Quran, except when it suits them to do so.

You can find almost diametrically opposing statements in the Quran. Little things, such as that all peoples of "the book" are to be accorded respect. This means that they are not to be treated poorly, they are NOT to be forcibly converted and they are NOT to be murdered. To do so is to put oneself outside of the rules of the Quran, and makes one an apostate. According to the Quran, all Apostates are to be killed, so this literally means that any Muslim that kills a Christian or a Jew is to be killed as an Apostate.

Yet, other passages state that any non-believer is to be put to the sword. What is a non-believer? Once again, according to some passages, all peoples of the Book are believers. Yet, in other passages, Christians and Jews are non-believers.

So, what is any person to do? If they follow one set of passages, they are in violation of the other. This literally makes no sense at all.

Te day that the leaders of the Muslim religions stand up and state: ALL believers in the book are to be accorded respect for all Muslims, they are not to be harmed, killed or in any way displaced; then I will accept Islam as a Religion of Peace.

 

[gopher]

''only she will clean your room and cook your food''

You are kind. But all I'm looking for is wealth. I'm a good housekeeper and excellent cook.

------------------------------------------------

 

[eanassir]

The Quran was supposedly DICTATED by an illiterate person...

When Abdullah son of Salam - who was one of the Jews contemporary to Prophet Mohammed - submitted himself [to God] , converted and became a Muslim, together with few other Jews, he invited the others to convert to the Islam, but they did not agree with him, did not submit themselves [to God] and did not become Muslims; that is his saying- be exalted- in the Quran 46: 10

قُلْ أَرَأَيْتُمْ إِن كَانَ مِنْ عِندِ اللَّهِ وَكَفَرْتُم بِهِ وَشَهِدَ شَاهِدٌ مِّن بَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ عَلَى مِثْلِهِ فَآمَنَ وَاسْتَكْبَرْتُمْ إِنَّ اللَّهَ لَا يَهْدِي الْقَوْمَ الظَّالِمِينَ​

The explanation:

(Say [Mohammed to them] “Tell me your opinion: If the [Quran] be from God, and you disbelieve in it [: what will your fate be in the afterlife, before God?]

Moreover, a witness [:Abdullah son of Salam] out of the Children of Israel testifies to its similarity [with the Law of Moses];

so [the witness] has believed, whereas you have become arrogant [; because you are wrong-doers]

; surely God guides not the wrong-doing people.”


Therefore, God warned them and threatened them that He has decided to punish them in the future.

A Warning to Jews of Perishing, If they do not believe in the Quran