The New Paganism and the Culture of Death

sanctus

The Padre
Oct 27, 2006
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Yall talk so much better than I do. I just see red and fume. If people are gonna call names then they better make sure their spotless. Take false idols for example. Whats all those statues in the church? They worship gods, christ, god and the holy spirit. I worship a trinity too. In fact they took the idea from MY ancesters. I dont care what you call me but you better look in the mirror as you do it.

I have to go to PT I'll be back *she says in her best Arnold voice*

The statues in a Church are representations, a hold-over from a time before they had cameras. Nobody worships them, they are to suggest the Saint , be it the Holy Mother or which-ever the statue is of.

And no, God did not "borrow" Himself from pagan mythology. It is more accurate to suggest that paganism prior to the existence of the Church gleaned some of the truth about the one God.
 

m_levesque

Electoral Member
Dec 18, 2006
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Modern Neopaganism, and Wicca in particular, grew out of a social milieu that was originally Anglican (Britain), then Protestant (America, where it mixed with radical feminism, and was transported back to Britain to change the shape of Wicca there). Many of the concepts of Neopaganism owe a direct debt to Protestant thought--things like the priesthood of all believers, which was not present in any of the ancient cultures of which I am aware. As Wicca is the largest Neopagan religion, it is not surprising that the forces that shaped it have also influenced other Neopagan religions that followed.

The very lack of continuity also contributes. These are modern religions, whose worshippers have been formed and shaped in large part by the ideals and worldview of a primarily Protestant society.
 

hermanntrude

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Jun 23, 2006
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The statues in a Church are representations, a hold-over from a time before they had cameras. Nobody worships them, they are to suggest the Saint , be it the Holy Mother or which-ever the statue is of.

And no, God did not "borrow" Himself from pagan mythology. It is more accurate to suggest that paganism prior to the existence of the Church gleaned some of the truth about the one God.

you are aware, however that many of the christian festivals are set on erroneous dates, due to them being placed on the pre-existing pagan festival's dates. Maybe you could say the Christians gleaned some of the validity of the celebrating of pagan festivals such as the equinoxes and the solstices. After all they're very relavent to humans who live in temperate zones.
 

m_levesque

Electoral Member
Dec 18, 2006
524
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you are aware, however that many of the christian festivals are set on erroneous dates, due to them being placed on the pre-existing pagan festival's dates. Maybe you could say the Christians gleaned some of the validity of the celebrating of pagan festivals such as the equinoxes and the solstices. After all they're very relavent to humans who live in temperate zones.

The church may be many things, but it is not stupid. It knew, in its early days, that to fully integrate itself into the lives of the people it had to merge itself in various ways into existing traditions. This did not deny the truth of the faith, but rather a move to replace the pagan holidays with Christ.
 

sanctus

The Padre
Oct 27, 2006
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you are aware, however that many of the christian festivals are set on erroneous dates, due to them being placed on the pre-existing pagan festival's dates. Maybe you could say the Christians gleaned some of the validity of the celebrating of pagan festivals such as the equinoxes and the solstices. After all they're very relavent to humans who live in temperate zones.


Indeed I am, as as m_levesque has already pointed out, a wise move on the part of the Church at the time to counter paganism. Replace their holidays with Christian symbols, and eventually those holidays would be forgotten as pagan holidays. At that time, whether for right or wrong reasons, the church very much had a siege mentality after suffering years of persecution at the hands of those same pagans.
 

sanctus

The Padre
Oct 27, 2006
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which seems to me like an acknowledgement of the validity of the pagan's beliefs that solstice and equinox are important markers and worthy of celebration. Hence the christians learning something from the pagans


Bit of a stretch.Let's not forget that the early Church existed in a pagan world, so obviously they would have been exposed to, and familiar with, pagan customs.
 

hermanntrude

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Jun 23, 2006
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no more of a stretch than you suggestion that paganism had somehow learned about the "one god", previous to being taught the rest of it by the christians who arrived, burning and murdering on their way.
 

RomSpaceKnight

Council Member
Oct 30, 2006
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Paganism is an evolution of ideas based on thousands of years of observation of the natural world intertwined with cultural references and legends. Christianity is an artificial construct imposed on the world based on the sins and weaknesses of humankind. Only now is paganism able to crawl out from under the monthestic thumb. Many valid references and teachings have been lost, through centuries of oppression. Eventually paganism will retake it's place amongst the world's recognized religions. We will no longer hide from the inquisitors and the witch hunters. 1500 years of murder, oppression, suppression and hatred are at an end. It is our time now. Paganism has the ability to lead folk back to simpler ways where individuals could worship as they want not as dogma states. Respect for all the worlds inhabitants from people to fungi could be the rule not the exception. Acceptance of the differences in others is one of the benefits to polythesism. A new age of enlightenment awaits us all. The age of Pisces is coming to an end. The age of Aquarius is upon us. We must seize the opportunity the gods have given us not squander it away in vilurent remarks ,insults and open warfare between people. Together as a united folk the children of mother earth can accomplish anything. Cast of your rhetoric. Discuss, debate, talk don't quote, argue and preach.
 

hermanntrude

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Jun 23, 2006
7,267
118
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Newfoundland!
Paganism is an evolution of ideas based on thousands of years of observation of the natural world intertwined with cultural references and legends. Christianity is an artificial construct imposed on the world based on the sins and weaknesses of humankind. Only now is paganism able to crawl out from under the monthestic thumb. Many valid references and teachings have been lost, through centuries of oppression. Eventually paganism will retake it's place amongst the world's recognized religions. We will no longer hide from the inquisitors and the witch hunters. 1500 years of murder, oppression, suppression and hatred are at an end. It is our time now. Paganism has the ability to lead folk back to simpler ways where individuals could worship as they want not as dogma states. Respect for all the worlds inhabitants from people to fungi could be the rule not the exception. Acceptance of the differences in others is one of the benefits to polythesism. A new age of enlightenment awaits us all. The age of Pisces is coming to an end. The age of Aquarius is upon us. We must seize the opportunity the gods have given us not squander it away in vilurent remarks ,insults and open warfare between people. Together as a united folk the children of mother earth can accomplish anything. Cast of your rhetoric. Discuss, debate, talk don't quote, argue and preach.

wow. pretty strong statements there.
 

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
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The church may be many things, but it is not stupid. It knew, in its early days, that to fully integrate itself into the lives of the people it had to merge itself in various ways into existing traditions. This did not deny the truth of the faith, but rather a move to replace the pagan holidays with Christ.
It "had to merge itself"??? It didn't merge, it waltzed in and slaughtered those that refused to comply, then lambasted the holidays with its own rhetoric to cover up the past. Much like the pios prudes that smashed priceless artifacts found in and on Egyptian tombs, depicting self flatulation and erect male phalus's. If you can get it, crush it, that's the motto of the church.
it also seems to acknowledge that the pagan holidays are at sensible times in the year, since they're based on measurable fact...
Not only a measurable fact, but calculated and well placed, something very difficult for the low IQ'd Pagans to accomplish. Especialy since they recognised how the solsr system functioed, whilst the Christians beat their chest and proclaimed the world flat and the center of the universe. Funny how the Pagans knew oh so much more then the Christians.
No doubt a further factor in their selection.
No doubt at all.
Bit of a stretch.Let's not forget that the early Church existed in a pagan world, so obviously they would have been exposed to, and familiar with, pagan customs.
I don't think it's a stretch, it's near bang on.
no more of a stretch than you suggestion that paganism had somehow learned about the "one god", previous to being taught the rest of it by the christians who arrived, burning and murdering on their way.
Pretty much...


While all you so called Christians sit and lament these preceived attacks as your own personal stigmata, remember this...

The first word in sanctus's religion is???

Roman.

This was, if my memory serves me correct, the first empire to fall under the spell of the Cross. IMHO, they knew a WMD when they saw it, so they embraced the Cross and adopted it. Mutated it and bent it to their will. They unleashed it on the masses as the "Be all" and "End all" of social structural engineered bondage.

We the free, do not scare you, we make you jealous. You only wish you were as free as us, but alas, you are to afraid to shead your Christian coils. So you will instead, judge us and condemn us, from a petty "If we can't join them, crush them" mentality.
 

sanctus

The Padre
Oct 27, 2006
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The first word in sanctus's religion is???

Roman.
.

Ah, but it was not the Roman Catholic Church until the first great split between East and West. One the Eastern and Western parts of the church split, and both referred to themselves as Catholic, it became necessary to contrast the two..one ended up calling itself "Orthodox" and the other "Roman".

In fact, the usage of the word Roman Catholic was not used thoroughly until the Reformation.Until that time, it was just The Church, or The Catholic Church.And it was not called Roman because of the Roman Empire, but because the Pope was in Rome, which was the centre of the Church
 

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
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I'ld like to add that we the First Nations, the Pagans and Heathens that inhabitted North America prior to the appearance of the European Christian menace, were doing quite fine, praying to one Great Spirit and worshiping her spirit in all creation.
 

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
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Ah, but it was not the Roman Catholic Church until the first great split between East and West. One the Eastern and Western parts of the church split, and both referred to themselves as Catholic, it became necessary to contrast the two..one ended up calling itself "Orthodox" and the other "Roman".

In fact, the usage of the word Roman Catholic was not used thoroughly until the Reformation.Until that time, it was just The Church, or The Catholic Church.
None the less, it was and still is, measured by your contempt and intolerance a WMD.
 

sanctus

The Padre
Oct 27, 2006
4,558
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Ontario
www.poetrypoem.com
I'ld like to add that we the First Nations, the Pagans and Heathens that inhabitted North America prior to the appearance of the European Christian menace, were doing quite fine, praying to one Great Spirit and worshiping her spirit in all creation.

WAs the Great Spirit really referred to as "she"? I had always thought they referred to it as "him".
 

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
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WAs the Great Spirit really referred to as "she"? I had always thought they referred to it as "him".
The Great Spirit, Manitou, Mother Earth, Turtle Island, all Femine.

A matriarchal society as well. Women were honoured as the givers of life, hence...