The Dying Art of Femininity

Martin Le Acadien

Electoral Member
Sep 29, 2004
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Re: RE: The Dying Art of Femi

Reverend Blair said:
It claims that feminism is a plot between the communists and the CIA, Mr. Mom. Not really much to say about it after that.

Besides, most of the feminists I've met in my life are as feminine as can be...they just refuse to be helpless chattel.

As a Man living in a feminine household, Five Ladies and 3 Female pets, I have learned to have the last word, Yes Dear.

I know the true meaning of having 40000 pairs of shoes, 5 closets full to the brim, lingerie of all sorts hanging all over! :D

Le père de la famille, une banque a fourni par la nature! 8)

"Father of the family is a bank nature provides!"

Rue de Porche Vide o Rue de Jolie Filles! :wink:

Is femininity dead, hell no!
 

Twila

Nanah Potato
Mar 26, 2003
14,698
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RE: The Dying Art of Femi

As a Man living in a feminine household, Five Ladies and 3 Female pets, I have learned to have the last word, Yes Dear.

People like you really deserve a reward! My poor father had to survive 4 women. I don't know how you guys do it. I'd have gone insane if it wasn't for the fact that I'm already there every 28 days!
 

GL Schmitt

Electoral Member
Mar 12, 2005
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Ontario
Sorry mom, but I had to take several runs at it, just to get through.

From what I retained of that reading, I take it that Henry Makow is a bachelor.

In addition, the writer whose work he appears to endorse, Helen Andelin, makes unsubstantiated declarative sentencers which make her sound like she is channelling Harrison Fisher.

Everything stated (so far as I could force myself to absorb) was both undoubtedly true, and patently false, depending upon whom one has in mind at the time. This is the case with all generalities that one tries to apply to actual human beings.

If I am asked to believe what was described is what a woman should endeavour to be, or already is, then it my opinion is that Helen Andelin is writing total balderdash, and Henry Makow is endorsing it.

A woman must be what that woman is. She, like her mate, might have to adjust her schedule, some of her interests, possibly even her career, to accommodate her significant other. She need not, and must not, change her personality to conform to what she believes a mate might desire.

The whole pretending to be what he wants to attract him, then afterwards try to change him so you can be who you really are, only causes pain and animus.

The same is true for a man, but, as a theory, I would say that men are less susceptible to attempting change to attract a mate, but once caught, are more amenably to being changed by their mates, than most women whom I have met seem to be.

On the other hand, the previous statement might be totally wrong, based on that fact that most of the men whose pre and post nuptial situation I am familiar with, were too lazy to change before, but once forced to, found their new conditions to be such an immeasurable improvement that they had no reason to object.

That recognized, I suppose I must earnestly oppose Makow’s assertion that a woman must surrender her power to her man. In my observations, the woman who exerts her power to help her mate embrace change in his living arrangements (especially where change will improve their overall comfort) will usually strengthen her marriage.

But, still, I will stick by my original opinion: No one should be willing to change in order to attract, but all should be flexible about changing in order to coexist.
 

HTO

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Sep 9, 2004
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I enjoyed the article (and the funny comments that came after).

I've been a stay-at-home mom for five years now and while I agree that femininity and grace go hand-in-hand, I think feminism isn't as bad as the person is making it out to be.

When I think of feminism, I think of the virtues (some of them mentioned) but even more so are Justice and Courage.

Just look at Sister Rosa Parks (God Bless her Soul) who fought for Justice which took Courage, when she refused to give up her seat. Her act sparked the civil rights movement in the United States. This woman changed the world.
 

manda

Council Member
Jul 3, 2005
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Hmm... allright

I have some of the aspects of femininity, I step lightly, love my partner and mother my children with all of my being. My Loooonnnngggg hair is my crowning jewel, and for the most part I speak softly...at least until I'm backed into a corner and have to unleash the beast within :evil:

I am also known to curse like a sailor if the situation merits, I belch louder than most men while wearing a skirt and heels, and am able to kick the ass of people at least twice my size!

I guess I ride the fence :roll: :lol:
 

HTO

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Sep 9, 2004
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Well, the article also made me think about how I must look to my husband when he gets home from work. I'll try not to look so homely (t-shirt, sweat pants, messy hair, a laundry basket in one hand and a spatula in the other) from now on!

If feminism is what he wants, feminism is what he gets! (Or should I say femininity?)
lol. I'll admit, I kept the sweat pants on but at least did my hair today.
 

manda

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Jul 3, 2005
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Re: RE: The Dying Art of Femininity

HTO said:
Well, the article also made me think about how I must look to my husband when he gets home from work. I'll try not to look so homely (t-shirt, sweat pants, messy hair, a laundry basket in one hand and a spatula in the other) from now on!

If feminism is what he wants, feminism is what he gets! (Or should I say femininity?)
lol. I'll admit, I kept the sweat pants on but at least did my hair today.

Mr. Manda loves most of my sweatpant, especially the tight ones...I think I'll wear them on my days off all the time now! :wink:
 

pastafarian

Electoral Member
Oct 25, 2005
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I’ve decided to make this thread my first on this board. (Hi all!) There are a couple of reasons for this. My mate wanted me to read the article that kicks off the discussion, which I slogged through to the bitter end only because of my unnaturally strong devotion to her; and (more important), I am really impressed with the tone of the responses the article provoked.
Usually, any discussion of gender roles attracts two kinds of idiot: autocratic, theory-spewing “feminists” of both sexes who want us all to burn the heretics who fail to acknowledge the insidious partriarchal oppression of “history” and “manufacturing” or socially-stunted boys channeling Rush Limbaugh and Pat Robertson from their parents’ basement, between solo sweaty encounters with digital representations of the opposite sex.
I saw no replies that could be attributed to either group. Congratulations people!

For the record, it puzzles me why the pretentious twit, “Henry Makow, Ph.D” would advertise that he possesses a PhD, thus depriving himself of the only plausible excuse –lack of access to education-- for the drivel he has attached his name to.

I mean c’mon:

“Society is the target of a long-term hate campaign designed to degrade and discredit heterosexuality. Domestic violence and rape are highlighted to make women fear men, reject femininity and become masculine. The destruction of the family has always been the goal of the financial elite in order to control people.”

Of course, Dr. Makow, and genocide and torture are highlighted to makes us fear other people, reject empathy and charity and join PETA.

“Feminism's Marxist principles of "equality" do not apply to loving heterosexual relationships and are in fact toxic. As I often say, heterosexual marriage is based on the exchange of female worldly power for male love. Equal power neuters both sexes. “

Quite. And Fascism’s principles of “obedience to overwhelming force and terror “ are, in fact, the bedrock of life-affirming heterosexual relationships. As I often say, a battered and cowering spouse is a happy one. Absolute power creates just and moral men, while complete humiliation and powerlessness allows women to achieve fulfilling lives

Makow would need a truckload of “smart drugs” just to aspire to the status of “idiot”, so enough about him.

The celebration of femininity that breaks up Makow’s tedious inanities is more interesting.

My own belief is that women are generally more inclined to be “feminine” and men to be “masculine” for reasons rooted in biology. I think those who say that gender is a “social construction” are, at best , misguided and wrong or , at worst, pushing an agenda for ideological reasons and thus, traitors to the ideal of impartial investigation of truth and, frankly, sexist.

What I mean by the last term is “contemptuous of the values implied by “perfect” examples of stereotyped males or females”. To make it simple, idealized males are stoic, assertive, physically robust, intelligent in spatial-physical ways, reserved. Idealized females are empathetic, nuturing, socially intelligent, conciliatory, hospitable.

To imply that either list is superior to the other is sexist in my terminology.

To suggest that real men and women should or do conform to this list is sexist in the conventional sense, is putting arbitrary and stupid limitations on people and I don’t buy it. These are archetypes.

That being said, these archetypes are exceedingly important to us culturally and our mythologies are filled with conflicts and reconciliations of the Masculine and Feminine principles. The former is conventionally the force of destruction and aggression, while the latter is the force of birth and acquiescence. Both impulses are required in balance. Most Tragedies, for example, involve the ascendancy of the Masculine principle over the Feminine, with disastrous results. I’d say modern progress is a result of the Masculine principle, whereas, the great threats to our planet and our species come from ignoring the Feminine principles.
None of this implies that any particular man or woman needs to live in any particular way. Most people are amalgams of “masculine” and “feminine” qualities, up to and including hetero-homosexuality. Personally, I have no problems with feminine men or masculine women.
I do have problems with people who tell me that women shouldn’t be soldiers or men, daycare workers. Or people who tell me that a construction worker is worth more than a nurse. Don’t tell me that homosexuality shouldn’t creep me out or that homosexual marriages deserve less status then childless heterosexual ones.
Heterosexuality in humans is the manifestation of the preferred means by which Life has perpetuated itself for billions of years. Shortly after there were bacteria, these cells evolved to transmit genetic material from one cell to a receiver cell, via a hollow tube called a “pilus”. Algae also share genetic material whereby the “+” mating type produces a tube-like organ to transfer DNA to the receiving “-“ type. And so it goes through the plant and animal kingdom, sexual reproduction as a means of preserving genetic diversity and flexibility in the face of natural selection.
I’m sure homosexuality has a purpose in higher animals, but the perpetuation of the species requires two sexes except in exceptional circumstances.

I like feminine women . I like the way they look. I like the way they smell.
Feminists who dis them are making the same mistake as the knuckle-dragging men who disrespect them. The Masculine Principle has been well-established in human societies now for long enough. We need to balance it by giving less glory to conquest, aggression and thoughtless action. We need to celebrate compassion, co-operation and thoughtfulness.

That means respecting the wisdom of the Feminine, not just the strength of the Masculine.
 

HTO

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Sep 9, 2004
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Interesting post, pastafarian.

That being said, these archetypes are exceedingly important to us culturally and our mythologies are filled with conflicts and reconciliations of the Masculine and Feminine principles. The former is conventionally the force of destruction and aggression, while the latter is the force of birth and acquiescence. Both impulses are required in balance. Most Tragedies, for example, involve the ascendancy of the Masculine principle over the Feminine, with disastrous results. I’d say modern progress is a result of the Masculine principle, whereas, the great threats to our planet and our species come from ignoring the Feminine principles.

Your statment above reminded me of something else I read recently:

All created thngs, whether tangible or intangible, come into being as a result of the intercourse between two elements which assume the functions of male and female. This pattern is followed throughout the whole of creation and the birth of a religion is no exception.

Consider a table which comes into being when a carpenter chooses a piece of wood to work on. In this operation, the piece of wood assumes a female role and is shaped to the carpenter's design. The table- the child born of the intercourse between the mind of the carpenter and the piece of wood, combines within itself the characteristics of both its parents. Its style its beauty and proportions, its shape and construction all represent the art and craft of its father, the carpenter; wheras its colour, quality, and consistency are inherited from its mother, namely, the piece of wood.

A similar principle governs the birth of a civilization whose founder, by imparting his ideas and principles to a society, plays the part of the male. The society, the recipient of his teachings, acts on the other hand as a female agent. The child of this mystical intercourse is a new civilization which reflects the characteristics of the founder as well as those of the society within whose womb it was coneived.

Religions are born as a result of the spiritual intercourse between God, on the one hand, and the person of the Manifestation of God, on the other. In His inscrutable wisdom, God chooses one of His servants from among humanity and makes Him the recipient of His Revelation. He releases within the soul of His chosen One the spiritual forces of His Revelation, while the person of the Manifestation, emptying Himself of self and human qualitie and submitting Himsself entirely to the will of His Creator becomes a worhty recipient of these spiritual energies.

Once this relationship is established, as a result of the interaction between God and His chosen Mouthpiece, the child of a new religion is conceived and the Manifestion of God, in fullness of time, by declaring His mission gives birth to this child and presents it to humanity.

...sorry had to leave the post unfinished as ran out of HTO time today.

Anyway, I found the similarities about male and female roles interesting.