The 10 worst Britons in history

Blackleaf

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Where's Richard III. Shakespeare's most famous villain.. suddenly reinstated as a misunderstood Plantagenet 'victim' now that his grave has become a potentially lucrative tourist attraction.

Of those presented.. i suppose i'd have to vote for Titus Oates... although Elizabeth I was a far more villainous and bloodthirsty persecutor of Catholics.. but even she pales in treachery to England's all time worst.. Henry VIII.. the butcher tyrant.

Elizabeth did not persecute Catholics. She just outlawed Catholic worship in private as she feared Catholics could plot against her whilst pretending to be merely worshipping together in private residences. She very much allowed Catholic worship in public. Those Catholics executed were those caught (those who didn't manage to evade the authorities, when they came calling, by hiding in 'priest holes') worshipping together

The REAL persecution of a religious group was that carried out by her Catholic half-sister Mary I, who earned the nickname 'Bloody Mary' because of her burning at the stake hundreds of Protestants during her short reign (1553-1558 ).

Elizabeth allowed Catholics to worship, so long as it was in public. Mary, on the other hand, didn't allow Protestants to worship at all.

Also, calling Henry VIII, one of England's greatest kings, a 'butcher tyrant' is taking things a step too far.
 
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coldstream

on dbl secret probation
Oct 19, 2005
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Chillliwack, BC
Elizabeth did not persecute Catholics. She just outlawed Catholic worship in private as she feared Catholics could plot against her whilst pretending to be merely worshipping together in private residences. She very much allowed Catholic worship in public. Those Catholics executed were those caught (those who didn't manage to evade the authorities, when they came calling, by hiding in 'priest holes') worshipping together

The REAL persecution of a religious group was that carried out by her Catholic half-sister Mary I, who earned the nickname 'Bloody Mary' because of her burning at the stake hundreds of Protestants during her short reign (1553-1558 ).

Elizabeth allowed Catholics to worship, so long as it was in public. Mary, on the other hand, didn't allow Protestants to worship at all.

Also, calling Henry VIII, one of England's greatest kings, a 'butcher tyrant' is taking things a step too far.

It was in fact Mary 1st who instituted laws allowing freedom of worship amongst her subjects, overturning the vicious persecution of her father Henry VIII, who forbade all recognition of or obedience to the Church of Rome. Mary's own prosecutions were targeted at those carried out that ruthless persecution.. or those who plotted to ovethrow her reign to reestablish a Protestant hegemony.

Henry VIII by the time of his death was a murderous, psychotic megalomaniac and thug.. whose victims included all who fell within his increasingly paranoid delusions.. most completely innocent of the charges.

Elizabeth I banned the Catholic Mass, public or private. All who celebrated were deemed to be traitors, especially priests, who were hanged drawn and quartered when caught. Enablers were hung or pressed (crushed by weight of rocks). Elizabeth set up a police state under her spymaster Francis Walsingham which imposed a regime of fear, intrigue and oppression to eradicate all vestiges of the Roman Catholic Faith from her kingdom.
 
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Danbones

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Sep 23, 2015
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Not in Ukip. The only hatred Ukip have is towards the liberal, metropolitan Establishment, the EU, mass unchecked immigration, Islamism, and multiculturalism.

Ah.....the GOP, Lodge 001

Interesting point about the seal and the quill
 

Blackleaf

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Oct 9, 2004
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It was in fact Mary 1st who instituted laws allowing freedom of worship amongst her subjects, overturning the vicious persecution of her father Henry VIII, who forbade all recognition of or obedience to the Church of Rome. Mary's own prosecutions were targeted at those carried out that ruthless persecution.. or those who plotted to ovethrow her reign to reestablish a Protestant hegemony.

No. It was Mary I who was responsible for the burning to death of at least 300 Protestants in just five years. These became known as ghe Marian Persecutions and they earned her the nickname "Bloody Mary." To say she allowed freedom of worship amongst her subjects is ludicrous. Try telling that to these people: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Protestant_martyrs_of_the_English_Reformation

Henry VIII by the time of his death was a murderous, psychotic megalomaniac and thug.. whose victims included all who fell within his increasingly paranoid delusions.. most completely innocent of the charges.
I think Henry's "crimes" pale into comparison with those of his daughter Mary.

And you say that most of Henry's "victims" were "completely innocent of the charges" yet can provide nothing to back that up with.

Elizabeth I banned the Catholic Mass, public or private.
No, she didn't. Elizabeth banned Catholic worship in private, as she was worried that Catholics gathering together in provate might plot against her. So she allowed Catholics to worship in public but not in private. And you can't blame Elizabeth - Plots such as the failed 1571 Ridolfi plot, which intended to assassinate Elizabeth and replace her with her cousin's daughter, Mary, Queen of Scots, did nothing but increase Elizabeth's suspicion of Catholics. Protestants as a whole in England were suspicious of Catholics after being persecuted by the Catholic queen Mary. And then there was the Papal Bull of 1570 which called Elizabeth "wicked" and a "heretic". So much of Elizabeth's negative feelings towards Catholics were instigated by the nefarious Catholics themselves. They brought much of it upon themselves.

Also, England had, thankfully, broken away from idolatrous Catholic Church and destroyed the authority of the Pope in England thanks to the great efforts of Henry VIII and Elizabeth did not want England to fall under the nefarious sway of the idolatrous Catholic Church again.

So Elizabeth allowed Catholics to worship in her country as long as they were loyal to her and did not gather together secretly to plot againmt her.

Elizabeth set up a police state under her spymaster Francis Walsingham which imposed a regime of fear, intrigue and oppression to eradicate all vestiges of the Roman Catholic Faith from her kingdom.
Thagt's just not true. The only monarch at that time who wanted to wipe out a whole religion was the Catholic Mary I, who wanted to wipe out Protestantism and whose marriage to the catholic Philip II of Spain was hugely unpopular.

Walsingham was a great principle secretary to Elizabeth. He helped the fledgling English Empire by supporting colonialism, exploration, England's maritime strength and the plantation of Ireland. He worked to bring Scotland and England together, then separate states. He scuppered Spanish military plans, gathered intelligence from across Europe, and disrupted a range of Catholic plots against Elizabeth, one of which saw the execution of Mary, Queen of Scots.

It was mainly the Catholics out to get Elizabeth, not vice versa.