Passing Health Care Reform in the Senate

[SirJosephPorter]

With all the bickering going on about health care down in the states i dont think they will ever get a national healthcare plan,
Curious how the potential for maybe a minor tax increase to cover healthcare for all is a major item but the billions of tax payer $$ spent per week on Americas military operations around the world is a non issue.seems like priorities should be the other way around.

It is increasingly looking like they will pass something, jambo. Just yesterday CBO issued a favorable assessment of the health care plan that is being discussed in the Senate. This, combined with the fact that Democrats will lose a lot of face if they don’t pass anything, tells me that something will very likely be passed. I don’t think Democrats want to repeat the mistake of 1994.

How comprehensive it will be, I don’t know. But chances are that something will be passed.

 

[ironsides]

What exactly do you know about our health system, that you have not picked up from the left wing liberals crying the sky is falling all the time, you put to much faith in those female liberal's Pelosi and Clinton, what do they have to worry about, there health care is secure. We were doing just fine, every citizen who wants it can get free medical care. Seems no one has taken into account that California the state that Pelosi represents is bankrupt and health care is one of the main reasons it is. Massachusetts is another state on the verge if not already bankrupt because of health care. Why is it that misery love company. No most of us do not want to be like you and the rest of the world.


This you maybe right about, the Left will pass something that will put an unnecessary tax burden on one group or another. It will be a foot in the door that others will either expand or close completely at some other time.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

What exactly do you know about our health system, that you have not picked up from the left wing liberals

Not much, except that USA spends much more on health care (per capita) than any other country in the world and gets poor results for that, it ranks near the bottom among developed countries in most of the health indicators.

This you maybe right about, the Left will pass something that will put an unnecessary tax burden on one group or another. It will be a foot in the door that others will either expand or close completely at some other time.

Whatever the Democrats pass, it will be very difficult to repeal. In order to repeal it, Republicans need a Republican president, a majority in the house and 60 seats in the senate. I don’t see that happening for quite a while yet.

Short of that, it will be repealed only if it is universally acclaimed as a failure (and not just by the Republican base). I think whatever Democrats pass is here to say for a long time. It may be expanded, but I don’t see it being repealed.

 

[normbc9]

Now lets review the statements made so far by the politicians. No new taxes; no additions to the National Debt and yes we want to insure everyone. I wonder who the magician is that will keep all of this factual and straight? There is some big money at stake here and it is really fighting hard to try to maintain the status quo.

 

[ironsides]

Not much, except that USA spends much more on health care (per capita) than any other country in the world and gets poor results for that, it ranks near the bottom among developed countries in most of the health indicators.




Whatever the Democrats pass, it will be very difficult to repeal. In order to repeal it, Republicans need a Republican president, a majority in the house and 60 seats in the senate. I don’t see that happening for quite a while yet.

Short of that, it will be repealed only if it is universally acclaimed as a failure (and not just by the Republican base). I think whatever Democrats pass is here to say for a long time. It may be expanded, but I don’t see it being repealed.

If our health care is so bad as to cost per patient, how come we have a higher than most survival rate as to major disease's and other illness's? Why do people come from all over the world to use our medical system? Both of our countries are rated in the 30's world wide (Canada - 30, U.S. - 37), so things are not that much different. I still would prefer what we have because of quicker response time. We have the money to pay for our current health system, including those who cannot pay. One thing we are not is a predominantly middle class country, we do have a very large poor population that we support also. We do not have to create another goverment bureaucracy for another health system the ones we now have are enough. This Democratic idea will push the country over the edge and bankrupt it along with driving up unemployment. Then who will pay for it? Now is not the time to try anything new.

 

[gopher]

Health Care For America Now:

Health Care for America NOW - Statement of Common Purpose



And why not? It works everywhere else and can do so just as easily here.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Why do people come from all over the world to use our medical system?

People don’t come from all over the world to use your health care system, ironsides; it is only a few Canadians. People from all over the world do go to places like India for health care.

In India, health care is totally private; one gets what one can afford. They do have very good, first world standard available. While it is hideously expensive as far as Indians are concerned, it is much cheaper compared to what is available in USA, Canada, Britain etc.

So people from developed world do go to India sometimes, for elective surgery, if they don’t want to wait. Also people from places like Saudi Arabia go to third world countries like India for health care.

But USA? Not likely. It is only a few Canadians and perhaps a few rich Saudis.

 

[ironsides]

Why do people come from all over the world to use our medical system?

People don’t come from all over the world to use your health care system, ironsides; it is only a few Canadians. People from all over the world do go to places like India for health care.

In India, health care is totally private; one gets what one can afford. They do have very good, first world standard available. While it is hideously expensive as far as Indians are concerned, it is much cheaper compared to what is available in USA, Canada, Britain etc.

So people from developed world do go to India sometimes, for elective surgery, if they don’t want to wait. Also people from places like Saudi Arabia go to third world countries like India for health care.

But USA? Not likely. It is only a few Canadians and perhaps a few rich Saudis.

Oh yea, I can just see someone running off to India for health care. India is the bargain basement store of health care. There are people who run off to Mexico also, again it is cheap. I am not referring to people going to countries to get the cheapest treatments, I have talking about people who really want to live. Are you aware that it is possible to get free health care in the finest hospitals in the U.S. Down here we have people from France, Germany, England, Italy and yes Canada checking into hospitals, mainly for cancer surgery and treatment. Yes they have the money to do it, as non citizens, I hope they have a good insurance policy.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Oh yea, I can just see someone running off to India for health care. India is the bargain basement store of health care. There are people who run off to Mexico also, again it is cheap. I am not referring to people going to countries to get the cheapest treatments, I have talking about people who really want to live. Are you aware that it is possible to get free health care in the finest hospitals in the U.S. Down here we have people from France, Germany, England, Italy and yes Canada checking into hospitals, mainly for cancer surgery and treatment. Yes they have the money to do it, as non citizens, I hope they have a good insurance policy.

I don’t know about other countries, ironsides, but those from Canada do not have any insurance policy. You cannot buy insurance for cancer treatment in Canada, since the treatment is covered by the government health plan.

If the want to try some experimental treatment, the government (rightly) won’t pay for that. Then they may go to USA to get the cure from the doctor who developed it.

And contrary to what you may think, people do go to India for health care. They get top quality health care at a fraction of the cost. I will see if I can find a web link for this.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Check this out, ironsides.

Lower costs lure U.S. patients abroad for treatment - CNN.com

 

[ironsides]

I don’t know about other countries, ironsides, but those from Canada do not have any insurance policy. You cannot buy insurance for cancer treatment in Canada, since the treatment is covered by the government health plan.

If the want to try some experimental treatment, the government (rightly) won’t pay for that. Then they may go to USA to get the cure from the doctor who developed it.

And contrary to what you may think, people do go to India for health care. They get top quality health care at a fraction of the cost. I will see if I can find a web link for this.

Your supposed to buy insurance when your healthy, then if anything happens to you your covered. If what you are saying is that because Canadian Health care covers cancer that private insurance will not/cannot cover you then you have made a bad deal with goverment. I know that was something similar that Pelosi/Obama was proposing here. No, I wasn't referring to experimental treatment, we all have Mexico for that. We still have no idea what they will throw at us, hope they will give us a choice.

 

[ironsides]

Check this out, ironsides.

Lower costs lure U.S. patients abroad for treatment - CNN.com

This is scary, but if it is all someone can afford and it means saving their lives it is worth it. You do what ever you can to stay alive. Personally I would look for a bargain somewhere within the U.S., Canada, France, Germany or Italy.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Your supposed to buy insurance when your healthy, then if anything happens to you your covered. If what you are saying is that because Canadian Health care covers cancer that private insurance will not/cannot cover you then you have made a bad deal with goverment. I know that was something similar that Pelosi/Obama was proposing here. No, I wasn't referring to experimental treatment, we all have Mexico for that. We still have no idea what they will throw at us, hope they will give us a choice.

In Canada you cannot buy insurance for the services that are covered by the government. That is why there is practically no medical insurance industry in Canada. The only people who are allowed to buy medical insurance are non immigrants; visitors, students, on temporary work visas etc.

As to cancer, excellent care is available in Canada; Canada has one of the highest cancer survival rates in the world. However, government will not pay for experimental, untested cures. If somebody wants to try that, he will have to go to USA, or Mexico or wherever.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

This is scary, but if it is all someone can afford and it means saving their lives it is worth it. You do what ever you can to stay alive. Personally I would look for a bargain somewhere within the U.S., Canada, France, Germany or Italy.

It is not only USA, but people from many countries go to India for treatment. People in Canada, Britain etc. may have to wait for nonessential procedures, such as hip replacement. Rather than wait in line and get it done for free, some of them prefer to go to India (where it costs a faction of what it would cost in Canada) and get it done there.

 

[ironsides]

In Canada you cannot buy insurance for the services that are covered by the government. That is why there is practically no medical insurance industry in Canada. The only people who are allowed to buy medical insurance are non immigrants; visitors, students, on temporary work visas etc.

As to cancer, excellent care is available in Canada; Canada has one of the highest cancer survival rates in the world. However, government will not pay for experimental, untested cures. If somebody wants to try that, he will have to go to USA, or Mexico or wherever.

"In Canada you cannot buy insurance for the services that are covered by the government. That is why there is practically no medical insurance industry in Canada. The only people who are allowed to buy medical insurance are non immigrants; visitors, students, on temporary work visas etc."





Now this is an excellent reason not to have health care like you have. A person should have a choices as to they type of health care they would like. No government should be able to tell you what is the best treatment for you, the should be a decision between your doctor and yourself only. No wonder health care is so much cheaper up there.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Now this is an excellent reason not to have health care like you have. A person should have a choices as to they type of health care they would like. No government should be able to tell you what is the best treatment for you, the should be a decision between your doctor and yourself only. No wonder health care is so much cheaper up there.

Sorry about the bold, has a mind of its own.

Government does not tell you what care you should receive, ironsides, that is between you and your doctor. However government generally will not pay for experimental, pie in the sky cures. But if you have a heart attack, stroke, diabetes or whatever the treatment is decided between you and the doctor, not by the government. Doctor doesn't have to get permission from some burocrat before he can give you the treatment.

 

[ironsides]

Government does not tell you what care you should receive, ironsides, that is between you and your doctor. However government generally will not pay for experimental, pie in the sky cures. But if you have a heart attack, stroke, diabetes or whatever the treatment is decided between you and the doctor, not by the government. Doctor doesn't have to get permission from some burocrat before he can give you the treatment.

I don't know of any insurance plan that will include experimental treatments, that is usually up to the patient to pay. Does the U.S. offer any newer treatments than Canada does if so that is a plus for us. In most cases treatments must have been approved by the American Medical Association (usually takes years for approval). We do have places where experimental treatments drugs etc. are give to patients during the testing phase. But they control who and how many people get into the program.

 

[gopher]

''
''Lower costs lure U.S. patients abroad for treatment''



It's no secret. Yes, the far right likes to play the game of denial but its truth cannot be questioned.

 

[ironsides]

U.S. Senator George LeMieux Delivers Weekly Republican Address about health care. 10/14/09

YouTube - U.S. Senator George LeMieux Delivers Weekly Republican Address