More falsehoods/misperceptions about health care reform law

[Icarus27k]

One would think that after the health care bill became law, the controversy would die down a little. But sadly, critics are still crying about it like babies who just got a booster shot.

In the link below, FactCheck.org says the new law is the bill/law they have had to defend the most in their history. No other bill had so much insanity and BS thrown at it.

Some of the latest craziness the site has to debunk: whether the law requires all patients to be implanted with microchips and whether Muslims are exempt from the individual mandate to buy insurance.

More Malarkey About Health Care | FactCheck.org

 

[Cliffy]

Did anybody expect anything different from the right wing lunatic fringe?

 

[The Old Medic]

I wonder if either of the people that commented above have actually read the bill that was passed? I have, and it is nothing but a freaking disaster.

 

[Avro]

I wonder if either of the people that commented above have actually read the bill that was passed? I have, and it is nothing but a freaking disaster.

You actually read that monstrosity?

Wow, you need to get a life.:lol:

 

[The Old Medic]

Yes I did. I wanted to find out exactly what it says, and what it will do.

It will essentially destroy Medicare, making it cover about 20% of the actual cost of medical procedures, tests, hospitalizations, etc. Everyone on Medicare will be forced to purchase expensive supplemental insurance policies (I already pay out over $400 a month for my wife and i, and that will likely double).

Medicare Advantage Plans will be virtually non-existant (those are Medicare funded HMO's). The cuts in funding will mean that most of them will close down, dumping those poor senior onto regular Medicare (which right now pays about 45% of medical costs for seniors).

The controls on insurance will mean increasing health insurance premiums, not lower ones. Insurance companies will have to increase premiums in order to cover everyone, regardless of preexisting diseases. They are not allowed to charge higher premiums for someone that signs up after they are diagnosed with Cancer (as just one example), so they have to spread those anticipated costs over all of their customers.

Then there is the fact that there are nowhere near enough primary care physicians in the USA today. With virtually everyone being covered by insurance, lots more people will be trying to see the physicians that exist. This will mean much longer waiting times for an appointment, longer wait times for any form of treatment, etc., etc.

There is absolutely nothing in that bill to create more physicians, by the way.

Payments to hospitals will be cut. That means that hospitals that are barely keeping open now, will have to close down. It has already been estimated that as many as 25% of the existing hospitals in the USA will close within 5 years of this plan taking effect. That will really help the folks, won't it?

Congress specifically exempted themselves from this law, by the way. They often exempt themselves from the laws that they impose on the people. Just like they don't pay Social Security Taxes either.

How in the hell can you discuss a law like this, if you don't read it? You really don't have any idea what it actually does, you can only go by what someone else tells you about it.

 

[Icarus27k]

It will essentially destroy Medicare, making it cover about 20% of the actual cost of medical procedures, tests, hospitalizations, etc.

I want to focus on this claim. I assume you are referring to the fact that, before the new health reform law passed, 20% of Medicare beneficiaries had to pay out-of-pocket for certain preventive treatments, but now that 20% will be covered by Medicare. Is that what you're talking about?

 

[YukonJack]

"Did anybody expect anything different from the right wing lunatic fringe?"

At least the so-called "right-wing lunatic fringe" did read the bill, while the equally (or more so) left-wing lunatic fringe - including the most lunatic of them all His Majesty, the Annointed One, President Hussain Obama - did not even read it, just blindly voted for it and signed it into law.

 

[The Old Medic]

Icarus, I do not know where you get your information, but you are simply wrong.

Preventive care is not changed one little bit with this new law. There is not one word about it changing for people receiving Medicare. It does provide preventive service for people that do not have insurance now, but the only changes to Medicare are to take 500 BILLION dollars out of Medicare over the next 10 years.

Now, you tell us, oh learned one, how you can take 50 BILLION dollars each year, out of a program that is not covering its own costs now, without reducing services?

Come on great brain, explain how this will happen?

HOW CAN FIFTY BILLION DOLLARS BE REMOVED FROM A PROGRAM THAT ONLY PAYS AN AVERAGE 0F 45% OF THE ACTUAL COST OF MEDICAL CARE, WITHOUT SEVERELY DAMAGING THE CARE IT DOES PROVIDE?

You claim to know all about this bill (that you have not actually read, so explain this to us.

 

[Icarus27k]

Kaiser Health News seems to think the health reform law will cover preventive treatment for seniors. From their "Consumer's Guide to Health Reform":

“Beginning this year, the bill would make all Medicare preventive services, such as screenings for colon, prostate and breast cancer, free to beneficiaries."

Source: Consumers Guide To Health Reform - Kaiser Health News

That's pretty emphatic.

The preventive treatment coverage for Medicare beneficiaries is Sections 4103-4105, found in Title IV.

Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act/Title IV - Wikisource.

 

[The Old Medic]

I am focusing on the fact that this bill will remove 50 BILLION dollars from a program that already is incapable of covering the costs of medical care for those who have paid taxes into it for years.

Are you aware that in the US. you pay taxes into Medicare from the moment you begin working, but you are not entitled to utilize those benefits until you turn 65?

I personally paid into Medicare for 42 years without being allowed to use it. You tell me any other insurance program that exists anywhere in the world that you pay premiums into for 42 years, without gaining any benefits?

Kaiser by the way is an HMO. They already cover all preventive services for seniors. You may not have known that Kaiser is an HMO, but it is. They even have their own hospitals, they won't let their customers use regular community hospitals.

My sister in law made good money throughout her working life. She paid into Medicare from the age of 20 *when the law was passed), paid the maximum taxes allowed by law, but never got one cent paid back to her. You see, she was hit by another vehicle when she was 63 years old and killed. So, she paid into that system for nothing for 42 years.

Medicare Advantage plans offer seniors significantly more benefits than regular medicare does. It covers mots expenses, with a small deductible. It also covers things like eyeglasses, dentures, medications, etc. BUT, in order to get those extra benefits, you have to join an HMO or a PPO, and ONLY utilize the physicians and hospitals, etc. that are in that system. You give up some freedom, in order to have better benefits.

This law cuts the spending for Medicare advantage plans by over 20%. That means that the vast majority of them will fold (they don't make anywhere near 20% in profits", throwing a lot of people back on regular Medicare, and increasing their costs a great deal.

The preventive service that Mr. Obama touts were already covered for Medicare. Hate to tell you, but my pneumonia and flu shots, etc. were all covered. This is a SCAM, one that utter idiots like icarus and others are falling for.

READ THE BILL. You claim to know what it does and does not do, but you depend 100% on liberal sources for your information about it. READ THE BILL, and you will discover that it does NOT do what is being claimed, it is a disaster.

I xchallenge you, not to depend on any other source. Get the actual bill and read it. Then come back here and see if you can tout it like you have?

I was more than willing to give it the benefit of the doubt. Until I actually read what had been passed, I did not believe that the US Congress would actually pass something like this. But they did, and it will virtually destroy the health programs of the USA.

 

[jackie cox]

The USA has 400% more lawyers and doctors per capita than canada, the reason is canada has nofault insurance, and universal healthcare, everyone who works, insurance premium, around 8% is deducted. If you get sick you go to the hospital and get treated, if you have a non-emergency condition, then call and make an appointment with a doctor, the same like in the USA, the only difference is everyone is treated equally, and the legal-medical-insurancefraud accident chasing lawyers and their squad of medical staff who go by the preabjudicated rule, the lawyer gets a 3rd, the medical get a 3rd, the injured party not at fault gets a 3rd. The medical people and their good friends, the lawyer and the insurance company are very very creative, when it comes to diagnosis and treatment, the rule of thumb, is, the more medical cost the larger the settlement, thus where a canadian doctor sees a lot of patients and is generally very professional because of it. On the american side the MD and his Good Friend the lawyer work a few afternoons a week and spend a lotta time on the greens. In the USA both healthcare and automobile insurance is about 4 times as costly as canada. Since having lived in canada for about 22 years after I left the usa in 1972, I have experienced both countries healthcare and justice. Objectively speaking I would have to conclude we americans are held at ransom, by the power of the lobbyst who makeup the predatory laws, We have what I consider, a pseudo medical-Legal-accidentfraud-mafia. As a result and by way of aiding and abetting these crimes, academic ventures are as much to blame, and actually graduate a separation of classes. The common folks get the hireling degrees, the Nobility get the MD and legal degrees. They pretend it requires a few more years of academia, and charge what would be more than common man can afford, So its here a major separation of classes occurs. Its just corruption, plain and simple. The academic ventures embedded with law refuse to permitt information technology be applied fully to any of the nobility degrees, pretanding the human memory is capable of committing to memory the vast realm of human physiology, its variables, conditions and remedies. The military and VA are the only medical staff who even partially use but a small potential of networking engineers teaming up with medical technologists and industrial engineers to develop an autocad Matrix and the improved healthcare. They are allowed to go only so far, their attempt at automation is feeble at best, but infinitely better than private healthcare, where they read your financial history before going to work on you, The medical, and legal realm are common criminality, refusing adamently to adapt to instrumentation that would end both their nobility and vast numbers as well. Actually over the last 40 years a world class mafia has emerged as world class citizens, who treat any federal government as toys, they control the financial sectors, the salable information media, academia, the lobbyst behind the puppet governments as they are enforcing a one brand economy, where their servants, slaves, and hirelings are continually losing ground in the quality of life as their perception of their own spirals ever upward, a prison economy with virtual slavery has emerged, Clout rules the county judaicial kingdoms. Actual Nobility has emerged hidding behind the laws they create, these people are fueled by lust and greed, and have abandoned nature and are denaturing the earth. They rule the roost, from russia, china, the USA, The european community, Israelis are the blunt force behind this vast mafia, and the mossad the speartip, these commercial criminals deal in human slavery, body parts, illicit drugs, a false education realm, and control adamantly whatever the world sees hears, and are told through academia, where the regime de la pedagogic is the foundation of education, an enforced antiquity, when compared to what we could become were we to simply use the information technology at hand. Pretending to be gods special chosen people ment to rule the earth, they lie, cheat and steal virtually all productive assets on earth, or try to, and here in ameica with the clout that cash can buy they enforce insane patent laws, criminal laws, where fully 1.3 million men in jail for non-support are proven to not be the fathers, the benefit to this mafia=400,000,000.00 dollars a day/ Our current administration are among the worlds top 10 most corrupt politicians in the democratic world.