Lakeside Packers/ Tyson strike

no1important

Time Out
Jan 9, 2003
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RE: Lakeside Packers/ Tys

Man Hank you and Nero repeat the same old same over and over.

Why shouldn't people make a descent wage and benefits? Tyson ripped the farmers off from bse and are now trying to exploit workers. At least in BC we have anti scab law thankfully and even the right wing Liberals here never got rid of that law.
 

Nascar_James

Council Member
Jun 6, 2005
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Oklahoma, USA
Re: RE: Lakeside Packers/ Tys

no1important said:
Man Hank you and Nero repeat the same old same over and over.

Why shouldn't people make a descent wage and benefits? Tyson ripped the farmers off from bse and are now trying to exploit workers. At least in BC we have anti scab law thankfully and even the right wing Liberals here never got rid of that law.

Right Wing Liberals?????

 

MMMike

Council Member
Mar 21, 2005
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Re: RE: Lakeside Packers/ Tys

no1important said:
Thankfully we do not have "right to work" laws like 22 states in America do, including yours Nascar.

People have the right to join a union. Tyson has no say in the matter. The workers want a union so they have one. They do not want to work for Wal Mart wages.

And Tyson should have the right to fire the lot of them if they can hire new workers who will work just as well for less money. Unions are all about inefficiency and protecting the weakest, dumbest, laziest workers. A good friend of mine who was a godamn hard worker got hired for a union position in a big plant. He told me all kinds of stories - all the old guys with such a sense of entitlement.... He got told all the time to slow down because he was working too fast. Promotions not based on merit, but "seniority". That sums up unions for me.
 

MMMike

Council Member
Mar 21, 2005
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And then there's the time a worker got drunk, and came to work with a shotgun to kill his boss. He was charged, and of course fired. The union field a grievance over it!!
 

MMMike

Council Member
Mar 21, 2005
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Re: RE: Lakeside Packers/ Tys

no1important said:
well we may as well legalize slavery ..........

Sorry no1, i'm with Hank & Nascar on this one... these people are completely free to find a job elsewhere. Where do you get slavery from that?
 

Vanni Fucci

Senate Member
Dec 26, 2004
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the-brights.net
What sums it up for me is that if there was no labour movement in Canada, there would be places that payed their employees far less than minimum wage, and would work them for 60 hours or more a week...labour legislations arose from the labour movement which was started by the unions...

I agree that there are some disadvantages to unions, the entitlement issue being among the worst...but in the end they fulfill their mandates, for the most part, which is to protect the workers from unfair treatment by their employers...and nothing I've read here by the more conservative minded posters gives me any confidence that were unions to be abolished tomorrow, that we wouldn't be back to pre-1918 employment standards by next week...

Hank, you were going on about Tommy Douglas earlier...and that he based his policies on Christian values...hardly, but as you are well read in the life and times of Tommy Douglas so you already know that more than anything else his policies were driven by witnessing the violence of the labour movement and the General Strike in Winnipeg in 1919, and suffering through the Depression, which is when he became a minister...good career move at the time, don't you think?
 

Hank C Cheyenne

Electoral Member
Sep 17, 2005
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uhhaa...and why would you have anti scab laws? why can't the people who want to work....work....it just dosen't make any sence.....it's good to know that Alberta is the least unionized province...but its still a problem here....

shit just work and if you don't like the pay then f**ck off.. its how I and many others did in our younger days...

I am so far left I have not seen my right side in years

...I feel for you...but what do you say about them smashing and terrorizing the workers who want to work...where are their rights?

well we may as well legalize slavery

..what r u talking bout.... you are not bound to anything if you want to leave then leave...no one owns you and you don't have to do anything....
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
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Winnipeg
Nascar Nero said:
Right Wing Liberals?????

Apparently you know noting about the Liberal Party in BC, James. They are an amalgam of old So-Creds and federal Conservatives. They took over the provincial Liberal Party by signing up at riding associations in mass numbers, then nominating and electing their own people.

MMMike said:
Unions are all about inefficiency and protecting the weakest, dumbest, laziest workers.

Nonsense, managers are not within the scope of the union.

And then there's the time a worker got drunk, and came to work with a shotgun to kill his boss. He was charged, and of course fired. The union field a grievance over it!!

If the worker asked for a grievance to be filed, or if there was evidence of wrongdoing on managements part, then the union is required to file a grievance under most union charters.

Sorry no1, i'm with Hank & Nascar on this one... these people are completely free to find a job elsewhere. Where do you get slavery from that?

Again, just go and look at our history. When corporations are allowed to act as they want, the people and the country suffers.

Hank said:
and why would you have anti scab laws? why can't the people who want to work....work....it just dosen't make any sence.

Union people do want to work. They also want to be paid a decent wage, be treated as people, not be exposed to unnecessary workplace dangers, and get reasonable benefits.

The claim that union workers do not want to work or are lazy is a myth perpetuated by those who would have us all working for a nickel an hour if they could.
 

missile

House Member
Dec 1, 2004
4,846
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Saint John N.B.
As most of Tyson's work force was imported from another nation for the sole reason of working there,I submit that it is a form of slavery and the only freedom remaining to those folk is deportation back home. I wonder if any of the posters supporting Tyson are Scabs themselves ,or have such in their families.Oh well,another good reason to stop eating Alberta beef :evil:
 

Nascar_James

Council Member
Jun 6, 2005
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Reverend Blair said:
Nascar Nero said:
Right Wing Liberals?????

Apparently you know noting about the Liberal Party in BC, James. They are an amalgam of old So-Creds and federal Conservatives. They took over the provincial Liberal Party by signing up at riding associations in mass numbers, then nominating and electing their own people.

I am aware that some memmbers of the BC Liberal party were initially under the Federal Conservatives. You still don't tag the whole party as such.

One exmaple, is Jean Charest. He was head of the Federal Conservatives before he became the Quebec Liberal leader. Would you tag the Quebec Liberal party as Right wing? Surely not. They are almost as far left as you can get without tipping the scales.

Another example is with the BQ party in Quebec. Many of the members of the BQ were initially members of the Progressive Conservatives with Lucien Bouchard et Al. These "Separatist" individuals are everything but conservative. I surely do not call them right wing. Hah ... that's a good one.
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
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Winnipeg
RE: Lakeside Packers/ Tys

You referred to the Liberal Party of BC, then gave examples from Quebec, James. The dynamics are quite different.

The Liberal Party of Canada, and their cohorts in the provinces, have taken a giant step to the right though. They have basically taken over the position of the Mulroney Conservatives. If you stand so far to right, and are so ignorant of Canadian politics, that you cannot or will not recognise that, it is your loss.
 

Nascar_James

Council Member
Jun 6, 2005
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Re: RE: Lakeside Packers/ Tys

Reverend Blair said:
The Liberal Party of Canada, and their cohorts in the provinces, have taken a giant step to the right though.

Giant step to the right? That is indeed a good one Rev. You are joking I hope?

By forming an alliance with the NDP during the Gomergy Scand..er I mean inquiry on eliminating tax cuts from corporations? By allowing gay marriage? By openly supporting abortion? By having a useless gun registry that has wasted billions of tax dollars? By not supporting capital punishment?

Rev, maybe I'm missing something here, but it appears to me the Liberal party of Canada is as far left as you can get.How can you get anyomre far left? The only way possible would be to combine the Green party's environmental platform and you would have it.
 

peapod

Hall of Fame Member
Jun 26, 2004
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Ya you are missing something...knock knock! anybody home??? gay marriage is legal in this country... a women can obtain a legal abortion in this country, if she so chooses. You don't like it, tough! suck it up.
 

Nascar_James

Council Member
Jun 6, 2005
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It is Peapod. I am not arguing that. What I am arguing is Rev's assertion that the Liberal party has taken a giant step to the right. That is really comical. With all the factors that I listed above, how could the party be anything but far far left?
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
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Unlike you, James, I am aware of the history of the Liberal Party and of their policies past and present. While you choose to cherry-pick issues that erroneously think demonstrate your point of view.

Let's have a look at those issues though.

By forming an alliance with the NDP during the Gomergy Scand..er I mean inquiry on eliminating tax cuts from corporations?

That's the way minority governments work. The Liberals first tried to appease the Conservatives by introducing a budget that Stephen Harper said, "could be a Conservative budget." Harper was, in fact, so happy with the original Liberal budget that he rushed out into the hall to gush about it before the House had risen for the day.

By allowing gay marriage?

The Liberals really had no choice in this. The Supreme Court had found that denying same sex marriage was against the constitution of Canada. Martin was not leader when the court recognised the rights of individuals to marry partners of the same sex.

By openly supporting abortion?

Abortion is another right that was won in court. A woman's right to choose is also supported by the majority of Canadians. It's important to note that Martin was not leader when this issue was settled.

By having a useless gun registry that has wasted billions of tax dollars?

As opposed to effective gun control that would outlaw handguns completely and spend those billions keeping American guns out of our country. Again, not a Martin initiative though.

By not supporting capital punishment?

Once again not a Martin initiative. You are suggesting that Martin is left-wing because he adheres to a law passed before he was in politics. Not only that, but the United States is the only developed nation that carries out state-sanctioned murder. It isn't a left-right issue, it's one of civilised behaviour.

Rev, maybe I'm missing something here, but it appears to me the Liberal party of Canada is as far left as you can get.

That's because your understanding of politics is limited to parrotting the crap that spews from Bill O'Reilly's mouth.

You have no understanding of politics, James. You don't have a grasp of the issues or the stances that the parties have taken. You don't have a clue as to the history behind those policies or the reality of what those policies mean to people. You have no clue as to the tenets of democracy, the importance of rights, the court's role in upholding rights, the role science should (and sometimes does) play in establishing policy, or the near-oligarchy that the right (including the Liberal Party) have formed to support corporatism.

I suggest that you look into taking some political science courses that do not centre on the futherance of severely flawed Straussian theory and actually learn what the hell you are talking about before try to have discussions with intelligent people.
 

Nascar_James

Council Member
Jun 6, 2005
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Reverend Blair said:
By not supporting capital punishment?

Once again not a Martin initiative. You are suggesting that Martin is left-wing because he adheres to a law passed before he was in politics. Not only that, but the United States is the only developed nation that carries out state-sanctioned murder. It isn't a left-right issue, it's one of civilised behaviour.

The US is the only developed nation that supports capital punishment? Does that mean that countries such as Singapore and Japan are undeveloped? hmmmm ... I'd like to see your definition of what constitutes a developed nation, Rev.
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
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Winnipeg
RE: Lakeside Packers/ Tys

Anyway...ignoring Bigot Boy's ignorance of politics for a minute...

Two Tyson managers and two Tyson employees have been charged with dangerous driving after the union leader in charge of the strike was run off the road. That's right, they crashed his car. They should be charged with attempted murder, but the neo-con Alberta government would never go for that.
 

no1important

Time Out
Jan 9, 2003
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RE: Lakeside Packers/ Tys

Japan has a death penalty, but uses it sparingly, executing "only" two or three prisoners a year. Not like what happens in the US. More opponents of the death Penalty are being elected in Japan and a strong move to remove it. It is wrong and should be banned. One has to wonder why such lower crime in Japan? Lack of gun crazy neocons maybe?

But yet the US executes more people by far and only stopped child executions because of the courts.

Eight countries since 1990 are known to have executed prisoners who were under 18 years old at the time of the crime – China, Congo (Democratic Republic), Iran, Nigeria, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, USA and Yemen.

China, Pakistan and Yemen have raised the minimum age to 18 in law, and Iran is reportedly in the process of doing so. The USA executed more child offenders than any other country (19 between 1990 and 2003).

Now back on topic.......