Fighting Has No Place in Hockey

[talloola]

The REAL game of hockey ~ shinty (Camanachd) played in the Scottish Highlands:

2012 Lovat Cup - YouTube


Played with good sportsmanship and without needless violence.

you don't seem to understand the risks and certain levels of violence in MANY MANY differenct sports.

all of the athletes who participate in those sports at the highest levels will play them the way
they want.

you seem to think, that because YOU would like all of them to be played the way YOU want, they
should be, well, the world doesn't work like that.

shinny hockey is only 'one' way of playing hockey, not the best way, or the
only way.
shinny hockey is lots of fun, an age old way of playing the game, and will always be, but its
not the highest level, its the fun level, harmless, mostly non contact, open to everyone,and thats great,
for
those who want to play at that level, or do not have the talent to rise any higher, BUT for those
who DO, let them do it.

there are many people like you, who can't stomach heavy contact thru sport, guess you'll just have
to live with it, everything isn't for everyone, and the players would not call body checking,
violence, but you do.

ever watched austrailian rules football, very enjoyable., but I wouldn't suggest
it for you, 'they touch each other'.

Just grab a book and have a read, but make sure the cover isn't sharp, wouldn't want you to cut
yourself, might be violent reading.

 

[Omicron]

Pretend you are Russian and no matter what government gone through, you end up with bully tyranical Oligarchical Tzars.

Pretend you are Chinese, and no matter what government... you end up with Mandarins where the greatest honor is to maintain social order as a middle-government worker.

Http://tunes.digitalock.com:/crawlingfromthewreckage.mp3

 

[TenPenny]

,
Everyone who demands a certain kind of behavior from the players, always forget, it is the players who
play the game, who have played the game from little children, it is their game, not YOURS, or mine,.

That's a good idea, we should eliminate all rules for the game, because it's the players' game, not ours. Nobody should be able to tell the players what to do.

I know you like to watch sweaty guys punch each other in the face, but I like to watch skating, puck handling, and body checking.

Maybe you should stick to boxing, if that's what you like.

You can have violent physical games with body contact that don't involve fighting - look at rugby. Most of the 'tough guys' in the NHL wouldn't survive a recreational rugby game. Fighting in hockey is only there to feed the appetites of people in the stands.

 

[Spade]

NHL hockey is bread and circuses without the bread.

 

[Spade]

A diversion from NHL hockey. All this talk was getting boring...
boxing knockouts - YouTube

 

[talloola]

That's a good idea, we should eliminate all rules for the game, because it's the players' game, not ours. Nobody should be able to tell the players what to do.

I know you like to watch sweaty guys punch each other in the face, but I like to watch skating, puck handling, and body checking.

Maybe you should stick to boxing, if that's what you like.

You can have violent physical games with body contact that don't involve fighting - look at rugby. Most of the 'tough guys' in the NHL wouldn't survive a recreational rugby game. Fighting in hockey is only there to feed the appetites of people in the stands.

don't make things up to suit yourself, and change what I said or didn't say.
and, no you don't now what I like at all, that is very apparent after your
interpretation of my posts.

I SAID NOTHING ABOUT ABOLISHING RULES, THATS RIDICULOUS

yes, the people in the stands do seem to enjoy the fighting, I have never enjoyed it, but I'm
not going to push myself onto other peoples business, just because I don't like something, I
love hockey very much, and the fighting is such a small part of the game, it comes and goes
so quickly, then forgotton about.

After all of the posts I have sent in concerning this subject, you didn't really
understand anything I said at all, because I didn't say I liked boxing, and
I didn't say I liked sweaty guys punching each other,

 

[Spade]

The game can be improved. As part of the national psyche it is all our business. It is the message being conveyed about how to handle disputes that is faulty.

 

[talloola]

The game can be improved. As part of the national psyche it is all our business. It is the message being conveyed about how to handle disputes that is faulty.

Yes, the game, (and other games) can always be improved, and hockey is much improved from 20 years ago,
and i'm sure in 20 years from now we will say the same, and maybe at that time fighting will be gone from
the game, 'IF' the players, the players association and the NHL have moved to a point where they can
agree and see that is an unecessary part of hockey.

I have said before, that I don't care if it stays the same, I can watch it as it is, or without fighting,
because I don't dwell on that part of the game, it is only a tiny part of a game, and many times, not
part of a game at all.

When someone wants to talk to me about how a game was played I can think of numerous things to chat
about, goals, nice plays, speed, intensity, individual talent, points and assists, the balance between
the two teams, the excitement of the crowd, and 'oh yeah, there was one fight, lasted 20 seconds.

ooooh, ooooh, I don't think I can watch it again, that fight was so scary, I might
never come back.

I actually find the fights kind of boring and childish, and it stops the flow
of the game, so i'm glad when the game gets going again, but i'm still not
going to interfere with what they want to do on the ice, it is their business.

if the fight was not there, I would not be wishing I had seen a fight, that is silly, and people don't pay all of that money to sit there waiting for a fight, they could spend the money and go to one
of those kick boxing matches, or a boxing match, or just stand around late at night down town, they
will probably see one for nothing.

 

[Spade]

Enjoy the All-Star Game, Talloola.

 

[L Gilbert]

Like I said, fighting isn't a part of the game, it's in the culture of the game. If most games can be played without fighting, there's no reason to think that hockey can't be playeD without fighting. And who gives a crap whether the media likes fighting or not?

 

[Spade]

The fight.
Goalie Fight: Brent Johnson KOs Rick Dipietro [2-2-11] - YouTube
The media apologists.
NHL HNC's Don Cherry in Defense of Hockey Fighting 03/29/08 - YouTube

 

[talloola]

Like I said, fighting isn't a part of the game, it's in the the culture of the game. If most games can be played without fighting, there's no reason to think that hockey can't be player without fighting. And who gives a crap whether the media likes fighting or not?

I agree with the media part, hockey doesn't do anything to please the media, the media is not a friend
to the hockey world, they are in it for themselves, not for the good of players or the game.

Sure it can be played without fighting, and it would be just fine, but at this point, they allow
fighting, (to a point), not all out brawls, or uncontrolled fighting, but yes, it is allowed, it
is their game, and they will decide when they want it 'gone' or 'not'.
It isn't about us, it is about them.

The only way they will change anything about their game because of 'us', is when no one shows up to
games, and explains why, then they will take notice, until that happens, they probably will continue
unless the concussion issue becomes part of the problem with fighting, up to this point, the concussion
issue doesn't seem to enter into the fighting side of the game, the concussions happen from head shots
when body checking, or just hitting one's head on the boards etc., from a hit that wasn't intent to
injure, and is a clean body check.

Hockey is a rough, fast game, and always will have injuries, they will never disappear, its just part
of the game.
Same as many other contact sports.

 

[L Gilbert]

I agree with the media part, hockey doesn't do anything to please the media, the media is not a friend
to the hockey world, they are in it for themselves, not for the good of players or the game.

or the fans.

Sure it can be played without fighting, and it would be just fine, but at this point, they allow
fighting, (to a point), not all out brawls, or uncontrolled fighting, but yes, it is allowed, it
is their game, and they will decide when they want it 'gone' or 'not'.
It isn't about us, it is about them.

Actually it's about the game. It's unprofessional to not stick with the game.

The only way they will change anything about their game because of 'us', is when no one shows up to
games, and explains why, then they will take notice,

Too many "fans" like to see fighting for that.

until that happens, they probably will continue
unless the concussion issue becomes part of the problem with fighting, up to this point, the concussion
issue doesn't seem to enter into the fighting side of the game, the concussions happen from head shots
when body checking, or just hitting one's head on the boards etc., from a hit that wasn't intent to
injure, and is a clean body check.

So no injuries result from fighting? The Hockey News: Campbell's Cuts: Campbell's Cuts: Will grave fighting injury serve as wake-up call?
Once a player sheds his gloves he opens himself up to a variety of injuries just relating to bare hand, let alone injurioes to another players head and body.

Hockey is a rough, fast game, and always will have injuries, they will never disappear, its just part
of the game.
Same as many other contact sports.

Yup. And fighting only serves to worsen injury stats in the game.

 

[talloola]

or the fans.

Actually it's about the game. It's unprofessional to not stick with the game.

its their game, the players, they will decide how to play it, along with their rules,
their officials, their union, and the NHL.
________________________________________________________________________
Too many "fans" like to see fighting for that. So no injuries result from fighting?

And, if that is the case, then the fans will not stay away because of the fighting.
If those who won't watch NHL hockey because of the fighting, can watch many different types
of hockey, some which don't allow fighting at all, some don't allow body contact at all,
their are choices.

nce a player sheds his gloves he opens himself uYup. And fighting only serves to worsen injury stats in the game.

_______________________________________________________________________________
Thats right, of course it isn't going to lessen the injuries, but again, it is their choice to fight or
not fight, let them decide it, it's not our decision, we don't play the sport, they do.
They are grown humans in all sections of the NHL, they can govern and control the rules for themselves, it
is their game at that level, to do with what they want.

p to a variety of injuries just relating to bare hand, let alone injurioes to another players head and body.
_________________________________________________________________________________
yep, majority of fighting injuries are to the hands, one would think they would get
tired of that, but it seems at this moment time, they aren't.

But again, that is their choice, not yours or mine, and again and again, so many talk about fighting as
though it a big part of a game, it is a very tiny part of a game, and if one wants to find some sort of a link
to show an exception, there are exceptions in everything, I am talking of the rule.

I feel I have a good handle on games, as I watch so many games a week, and I assume most of you don't.


Actually it's about the game. It's unprofessional to not stick with the
.[/QUOTE]

As you see it. When they decide it should be thrown out, they will do it. Hopefully they will
get rid of the staged fights very soon, don't know where they came from, kind of a new strategy,
and it is criticized by many who are close to the game.

Those who want to ban fighting can show what ever they want, but I know from all
the games I have watched, and all of the stats I have read, that fighting does
not cause grave or serious injury MOST of the time, it is the other parts of the
game that does that, and those areas of the game are being addressed, and there is
lots of improvement. I can see that for myself.

Again, don't expect the game of hockey to be free of injury, that won't happen, and
the players go into the sport knowing that, they love their game, and take their
chances, just as many others do in other sports.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

Canadians like anarchy in hockey. We are willing to "kill the ref" when he makes a call we don't like. In the NFl, when a ref makes a call on a player and throws a flag, fans blame the player, not the ref. In Canada, when the ref calls a penalty in the last minute of a game or the playoffs, we want to blame the ref. Even "kill" that cyclops that made our team lose.

In a recent item in the news, about one third of amateur refs say they have been physically assualted by players or parents.
Whistleblower study: Amateur hockey referees feel threatened

 

[talloola]

Canadians like anarchy in hockey. We are willing to "kill the ref" when he makes a call we don't like. In the NFl, when a ref makes a call on a player and throws a flag, fans blame the player, not the ref. In Canada, when the ref calls a penalty in the last minute of a game or the playoffs, we want to blame the ref. Even "kill" that cyclops that made our team lose.

In a recent item in the news, about one third of amateur refs say they have been physically assualted by players or parents.
Whistleblower study: Amateur hockey referees feel threatened

without even reading the article, I believe it, we have had years of experience with minor hockey
and minor ball, and the behavior of parents is disgusting, (not all, but some).


At one of our girls hockey games, (jr. girls), one parent climbed right up the wire mesh, look like a
monkey, hollering and screeching at the ref.
We had parents telling my husband to sit 'the dead wood' on the bench, they shouldn't be on the ice,
they will cause the team to lose.
I had one boys parent tell me that our girls hockey team shouldn't be given ice time, because we
are preventing boys like her son from possibly making the NHL.
I could go on------

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

without even reading the article, I believe it, we have had years of experience with minor hockey
and minor ball, and the behavior of parents is disgusting, (not all, but some).

At one of our girls hockey games, (jr. girls), one parent climbed right up the wire mesh, look like a
monkey, hollering and screeching at the ref.
We had parents telling my husband to sit 'the dead wood' on the bench, they shouldn't be on the ice,
they will cause the team to lose.
I had one boys parent tell me that our girls hockey team shouldn't be given ice time, because we
are preventing boys like her son from possibly making the NHL.
I could go on------

And all perfectly justifiable reasons to cause violence and mayhem, after all, the hockey integrity of the nation is at stake in our local rinks. The majority let it go on and on. We're a law abiding country, but not when it comes to hockey.

Hockey in Canada does not go through universities like football, basketball and baseball do in the USA. Hockey in Canada has always been small town and manual laboring class at its core, so it maintains a very gritty feel. It appears there's very little respect for authority among the hockey crowd.

 

[talloola]

And all perfectly justifiable reasons to cause violence and mayhem, after all, the hockey integrity of the nation is at stake in our local rinks. The majority let it go on and on. We're a law abiding country, but not when it comes to hockey.

Hockey in Canada does not go through universities like football, basketball and baseball do in the USA. Hockey in Canada has always been small town and manual laboring class at its core, so it maintains a very gritty feel. It appears there's very little respect for authority among the hockey crowd.

would much rather play hockey here, than soccer in south america.

one only hears tantrums from parents at 'minor hockey', but at the professional level, jeers and cheers,
seem quite harmless to me, although some fans do get into fisticuffs with each other, and the game
goes on, those fans get tossed, and all is well again.

It is human behavior, and can happen anywhere, but I would point the insanity to the drinking of beer
and i'm sure other drinks as well, hidden away somewhere, and i've always indicated that I totally
hate the selling of alchohol at sporting events, but its all about the 'dollar', and profits, but
people have beer spilt on them, and those particular drunk fans are very out of place.
No different than one's drunk uncle at the gathering in a house, who makes everyone else feel
very uncomfortable.

the most sane and logical are the officials, the players, the coaches, as they must continue with
their task at hand, until the buzzer goes, and then off they go, home, just like any other person
at the end of their work day.
It's fun to be a fan, its fun to cheer for one's team, but I also have been close to the opposition
group of fans who make a point of loudly trashing my home team, and it is obviously done for those close
around them to hear, but I also notice it is almost always ignored, as we canadians are a polite
group for the most part, and we just answer by cheering a bit louder for our side, that also seems
very normal behavior.

The hockey is not the cause of any of this behavior, that is a cop out. humans behaving badly must
look into themselves and figure out why they can't seem to watch a game of hockey without becoming
unruly, I remember going to soccer games with my dad when I was a little girl, he was irish, and
loved soccer, but he couldn't focus on the game only, he would end up argueing with fans who shouted
things he didn't like, very embarrassing for me indeed, and this was soccer, not hockey.

But we are speaking of a VERY SMALL GROUP OF FANS, not the majority, so lets not get carried away.
I have sat at many canuck games, and the atmosphere is quite calm for the most part, then lots of
cheering, looing, sometimes booing, seems quite normal to me.

This silly thing about small town hockey is just that, silly. I can imagine many events in a small
town becoming unruly because it is probably not monitored with the security of a big building, and
people can misbehave easier, without some security guard grabbing their arm, and also everyone will
know each other more in the small town event, whether it be hockey or many other events.
People are just people, dummies are always a part of a big crowd, thats just life.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

would much rather play hockey here, than soccer in south america.

one only hears tantrums from parents at 'minor hockey', but at the professional level, jeers and cheers,
seem quite harmless to me, although some fans do get into fisticuffs with each other, and the game
goes on, those fans get tossed, and all is well again.

It is human behavior, and can happen anywhere, but I would point the insanity to the drinking of beer
and i'm sure other drinks as well, hidden away somewhere, and i've always indicated that I totally
hate the selling of alchohol at sporting events, but its all about the 'dollar', and profits, but
people have beer spilt on them, and those particular drunk fans are very out of place.
No different than one's drunk uncle at the gathering in a house, who makes everyone else feel
very uncomfortable.

the most sane and logical are the officials, the players, the coaches, as they must continue with
their task at hand, until the buzzer goes, and then off they go, home, just like any other person
at the end of their work day.
It's fun to be a fan, its fun to cheer for one's team, but I also have been close to the opposition
group of fans who make a point of loudly trashing my home team, and it is obviously done for those close
around them to hear, but I also notice it is almost always ignored, as we canadians are a polite
group for the most part, and we just answer by cheering a bit louder for our side, that also seems
very normal behavior.

The hockey is not the cause of any of this behavior, that is a cop out. humans behaving badly must
look into themselves and figure out why they can't seem to watch a game of hockey without becoming
unruly, I remember going to soccer games with my dad when I was a little girl, he was irish, and
loved soccer, but he couldn't focus on the game only, he would end up argueing with fans who shouted
things he didn't like, very embarrassing for me indeed, and this was soccer, not hockey.

But we are speaking of a VERY SMALL GROUP OF FANS, not the majority, so lets not get carried away.
I have sat at many canuck games, and the atmosphere is quite calm for the most part, then lots of
cheering, looing, sometimes booing, seems quite normal to me.

This silly thing about small town hockey is just that, silly. I can imagine many events in a small
town becoming unruly because it is probably not monitored with the security of a big building, and
people can misbehave easier, without some security guard grabbing their arm, and also everyone will
know each other more in the small town event, whether it be hockey or many other events.
People are just people, dummies are always a part of a big crowd, thats just life.

The idea that reffing in hockey changes when the game is close in the last five minutes or in the playoffs is unique to hockey, no other sport does it. This makes for a two tiered system, and some think a little chaotic. Fans side with players, not authority here, and expect authority to adjust when necessary, and if it doesn't, then you can rightly protest mightily. We move our goalposts when we think they should be.

It's not the alcohol, as many sporting venues around the world sell beer and they don't want to kill the ref like in Canada. And parents around the world hire personal trainers for their kids in their teens so they can make the big leagues. It's very competitive everywhere, but we may have it more refined in Canada.

My dad was from Europe and couldn't understand why hockey parents here got so intense over watching kids play. He endured hockey for me, in the cold rinks. Canada has a unique culture.

 

[Mowich]

It's not the alcohol, as many sporting venues around the world sell beer and they don't want to kill the ref like in Canada.

IMHO, you should read up on other sporting events in Canada, DTM..........I have personally attended several football games over the years where liquored up fans have screamed for the heads of the refs when they felt their team was unfairly penalized. I have also witnessed refs getting pelted with everything from empty beer cups to garbage. It doesn't happen often, but it does happen.