Faith & Politics

GL Schmitt

Electoral Member
Mar 12, 2005
785
0
16
Ontario
Just my opinion, but:

A politician may profess religious verities as part of his humanity, which will be manifested through his entire life’s history — both public and private. On the basis of his humanity (possibly instilled by religion) as it has affected that politician’s past actions, voters can judge his fitness (in their opinion) for public office.

Where religion makes itself unwelcome in public office, is when religious dogma is used as argument in debating secular life, or when one set of religious values is militantly employed to override another religion’s values.

Only in a country where everyone shares the same religion, is equally fervent in following its rules, and posses no diverging opinions in the proper way of following that religion, could religion mix comfortably with politics. That would be possible because, only in such a condition, there would be no need for politics, as everyone would be following the same path, and require no regulation by the state.

Fortunately (to my way of thinking) this world is far more diverse than that.

In order not to have one person’s beliefs impinge upon another person’s differing beliefs, all must agree to try to make their secular decisions based upon observable fact, measurable truth, and logical discussion.

Faith-based beliefs must be left aside, for action only amongst members of their church, where all agree.

Anything less destroys a democracy and leads to elitism, oligarchy, or theocracy.
 

Dexter Sinister

Unspecified Specialist
Oct 1, 2004
10,168
539
113
Regina, SK
Good post GL. It's not about what any particular politician does or does not believe, it's about religious and secular authority in general.

Vesting religious and secular authority in the same institutions is a recipe for repressive, authoritarian dictatorships in which nobody's life, liberty, or property is safe, and women are at best second class citizens, especially if the religion in question is Christianity or Islam. America's founders knew that, about Christianity at least, and that's why the constitution forbids congress from making laws about any establishment of religion. All other modern states have also figured that out, though few (in fact none that I know of) enshrine it so specifically in their constitutions.

I can't think of any nation on the planet in which individual freedoms and human rights have any real meaning for most citizens except those in which the church and the state have no real authority over each other. And I can think of many nations in which the church and the state are one and there's realistically no such thing as individual freedoms and human rights for most citizens.

I don't believe that's a coincidence. And that's where the Jerry Falwells and Pat Robertsons of this world want to take us. No thanks.
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
1
38
Winnipeg
I disagree that "W" brings any religion into his policies. He uses the buzzwords of Christianity to get elected, sure. But W's policies have as much to do with the Gospel as Abu Grahib has to do with the ideals of freedom and democracy.

I disagree. While Georgie's beliefs may have very little to do with Christianity, he very much espouses views held by the religious right. Anti-choice, anti-science, and homophobic sums up a certain radical sector of Christianity. Those beliefs may have as much to do with the teachings of the New Testament as the ravings of radical Islamists have to do with the teaching of Mohammed, but there is little doubt that those religious beliefs are affecting political motives and actions to a large extent.
 

pastafarian

Electoral Member
Oct 25, 2005
541
0
16
in the belly of the mouse
While Georgie's beliefs may have very little to do with Christianity, he very much espouses views held by the religious right. Anti-choice, anti-science, and homophobic sums up a certain radical sector of Christianity. Those beliefs may have as much to do with the teachings of the New Testament as the ravings of radical Islamists have to do with the teaching of Mohammed, but there is little doubt that those religious beliefs are affecting political motives and actions to a large extent.

...which is my point, re-stated. The reason I balk at calling it Christianity is that I think the designation misses the point, which is that fundamentalism is evil, whether it's Christian, Muslim, Communist, Capitalist...
My opinion is that when we alienate our potential allies (Social Gospel Christians, for example) against the real enemies, we're working against ourselves,

I think the issue of belief/non-belief in God is an unfortunate red herring. More inportant is belief/non-belief in a humanitarian society, even for those who worship Clapton over the true God, Jeff Beck.
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
1
38
Winnipeg
My opinion is that when we alienate our potential allies (Social Gospel Christians, for example) against the real enemies, we're working against ourselves,

My experience has been that members of the Christian left, for lack of a better term, respect the separation of church and state though, pastafarian. They do not expect people to share their religious beliefs so when those beliefs clash with the greater whole of society, they generally stay quiet.
 

Karlin

Council Member
Jun 27, 2004
1,275
2
38
Re:pat Robertson - Religion in disrepute

http://www.vheadline.com/readnews.asp?id=46506

Christians should publicly disavow Robertson; brings religion into disrepute

No man who publicly advocates cold-blooded murder for political reasons can claim to be a follower of Jesus Christ.

Robertson did that on his television show, saying it would be cheaper to murder the President of Venezuela than to overthrow him with a war.

Nuff said!!!
Karlin
 

technicalpoet

New Member
Oct 31, 2005
12
0
1
Canada
peapod said:
blunt tool, used to munipulate da people :roll: A guy in the sky, and always broke! Get somebody else for dat job! a women!

Then no one will ever know why all men went to Hell.

As far as manipulating the people, that is correct, if you look in History, there is a lot of blood that is shed in the name of religion.
There are horrific things that has happened in the name of religion. But that does not make the religion bad. I have watched a TV show, that highlighted that about 75% of Americans are religious, that is probably why Bush is using religion a lot. I think that if you happen to be of a religious group "a religious person" or even a wanna be, your moral values that are derived mostly from your religion certainly shapes your views, but it certainly does NOT shape your policy or decision making. Just like a judge, it does mean because he is Christian, that he will deny other people their rights based on religion, sex, race, and so on.