Canadian Peoples Party Platform

[the caracal kid]

jersay,

i still do not see anything that differentiates your party from what is already out there. A new party needs to bring something new to the table. Ask yourself why anybody would vote for this new party when it is just repackaging the old lib/con ideas that have had mediocre success rates in the past?

On education, the "old funding" methods you mention already exist to some extent. If we want to make education a priority in canada, we need to take a new approach to higher education.

On the military, rather than the tired old "increase the army" talk to appease warheads, propose specilalizing the armed forces. A smaller, but more capable forces that combined with advanced R&D becomes something that truly represents peace and protection. This type of effort ties well into a new approach in university R&D and investment in IP rather than weaponry.

On immigration: it is rather strange to list treason as a reason for denying access to canada, considering the person may well have been acting to overthrow a regime contrary to "canadian ways". Treason is relative: when it the person treasonous compared to a hero? The same argument can be made for "terrorists".

 

[FiveParadox]

When I had originally prepared the proposal in terms of immigration policy, I had intended for the charges of high treason and treason to be in relation to the Government of Canada and the Crown of Canada only. Sorry for the confusion there.

 

[Jersay]

When I had originally prepared the proposal in terms of immigration policy, I had intended for the charges of high treason and treason to be in relation to the Government of Canada and the Crown of Canada only. Sorry for the confusion there.

Oh okay.

jersay,

i still do not see anything that differentiates your party from what is already out there. A new party needs to bring something new to the table. Ask yourself why anybody would vote for this new party when it is just repackaging the old lib/con ideas that have had mediocre success rates in the past?

On education, the "old funding" methods you mention already exist to some extent. If we want to make education a priority in canada, we need to take a new approach to higher education.

On the military, rather than the tired old "increase the army" talk to appease warheads, propose specilalizing the armed forces. A smaller, but more capable forces that combined with advanced R&D becomes something that truly represents peace and protection. This type of effort ties well into a new approach in university R&D and investment in IP rather than weaponry.

On immigration: it is rather strange to list treason as a reason for denying access to canada, considering the person may well have been acting to overthrow a regime contrary to "canadian ways". Treason is relative: when it the person treasonous compared to a hero? The same argument can be made for "terrorists".

Thanks Caracel Kid. It's hard though because you don't want to do anything to rash, to make people afraid of your party but you also want to change the system.

 

[FiveParadox]

Une quéstion:

Qu'est-ce que votre (ou notre, lol) parti s'appelera en français?

Est-ce que je peux racommender, peut-être, « le Parti des peuples canadiens » ?

(I would like to know what to enter on the registration form for the French name.)

:!: (Revision) Added an English subtitle for clarity.

 

[Jersay]

Parti de Gens canadien

 

[Jersay]

So what do you guys think of my political reform idea on this thread;

http://www.canadiancontent.net/forums/about11106.html

And how is the rest of my platform?

 

[Freethinker]

Diplomas, and certificates from their home country would be accepted as good as a Canadian diploma as long as they pass a test within their first three months within Canada.

Nothing should be accepted until after they pass significant testing. When I was in college I was assigned to help a foriegn doctor in my class one day. This person couldn't solve 2x = 10 for x and was as dumb as a tree. They dropped out within a couple of weeks.

I have seen enough bad doctors trained in this country, we certainly don't need to let anyone with even lesser training in.

 

[Jersay]

Nothing should be accepted until after they pass significant testing. When I was in college I was assigned to help a foriegn doctor in my class one day. This person couldn't solve 2x = 10 for x and was as dumb as a tree. They dropped out within a couple of weeks.

I have seen enough bad doctors trained in this country, we certainly don't need to let anyone with even lesser training in.

That is where people are wrong. Now, Canada has a shortage and we need foreigners to come and fill in the positions unless more Canadians can get into these positions. Now, I believe that foreigners have the same education as a Canadian, and it makes sense because they mostly have the same kind of textbooks and equipment as in Canada.

Now, a foreigner with a foreign diploma doesn't need to do the exact same thing in Canada, the years in school if the person can answer the quiz that I propose which would be stringent at a minimum of 3 months. If they fail, they have a 3-6 month period to study before taking the test again. If they fail they would not be qualified to work in Canada's fields and can either go back to school or go into another profession.

 

[Freethinker]

RE: Canadian Peoples Part

Said quiz, would have to be difficult enough that I as a non doctor couldn't pass it after studying for a couple of months. It obviously should involve impromptu examination by a group of doctors as well.

I expect very rigorous testing.

 

[Jersay]

Said quiz, would have to be difficult enough that I as a non doctor couldn't pass it after studying for a couple of months. It obviously should involve impromptu examination by a group of doctors as well.

I expect very rigorous testing.

Exactly, couldn't come up with a name except quiz. But the vigorous examination once they arrive in Canada with their diploma. Once that is completed, if they pass they get an equivelent Canadian diploma and can go off to work, while if they fail they have only one chance in a 3-6 month period and if they fail it again in that period they can either go to school or go to another profession.

 

[sanch]

Exactly, couldn't come up with a name except quiz. But the vigorous examination once they arrive in Canada with their diploma. Once that is completed, if they pass they get an equivelent Canadian diploma and can go off to work, while if they fail they have only one chance in a 3-6 month period and if they fail it again in that period they can either go to school or go to another profession.

The CMA just submitted a series of proposals to the House of Commons Finance Committee. Perhaps a review of these proposals would give you more familiarity with how medical graduates are trained and what the issues are in Canada. You do realize that there are many different types of doctors and some of these fields are very specialized. Still all doctors undergo basic training as well as the specialities and then they go on to residencies. It would be almost impossible to test the breadth of this total training in a test as there would be too much material to test.

You are also trying to solve Canada’s physician shortage by raiding the labour stock of developing countries which need every doctor they train. Not very cool. If immigration announced that they were recruiting doctors and all that was needed was a diploma Canada would be inundated with applications. There would also be many applications from the Baby Docs which are medical schools in the Caribbean and Mexico. These do not have the same standards as US and Canadian medical schools. Also training of medical students differs from country to country and even culture can impact on what future doctors learn. In many countries where women are not accorded full rights medical subjects that pertain specifically to women are not taught. This would include gynaecology. Of course doctors who immigrated to Canada could cram for the tests on subjects they lack but they would probably soon forget all that they learned.

The Canadian Medical establishment knows fairly accurately how many doctors Canada needs. If Canada needs more doctors more places in the residencies can be created. So the number of doctors Canada needs and produces are equivalent. The problem is one of retention as many Canadian trained doctors move to the US.

Here is a quick plan. Health care in Canada should remain public. Certain expensive administrative areas though should be farmed out to outside contractors. Canada should try and train ethnically diverse physicians by offering generous student loans and repayment plans. Canada should also require all doctors to serve for either one or two years in rural underserved areas. For each year of rural service $25,000 would be subtracted off the student loan. Mexico used a plan similar to this and it was very successful. The goal is to build loyalty in the years immediately following residency as this increases retention.

 

[FiveParadox]

Suggestion

May I suggest guidelines such as these.

:arrow: Proposal

"wait time" means, in the context of these Sections, the amount of time that has passed between the request of treatment and the current date;

"wait expiration" means, in the context of these Sections, the maximum wait time that may take place from the date of the request of treatment;

"private care" means, in the context of these Sections, medical care that would not be covered by the Government of Canada before a relevent wait time had expired;

"public care" means, in the context of these Sections, medical care that would be covered by the Government of Canada before a relevent wait time had expired, or the same service after a relevent wait time expires.

1. No person shall seek private care in Canada who

(a) has not requested the treatment by public care of the Government of Canada; and

(b) has not allowed the wait expiration from the date of such a request for public care to occur.

2. In the event that a person experiences a wait expiration, then the Government of Canada shall seek to provide such care as soon as reasonably possible through private care, and all costs thereof shall be incurred by the Government of Canada.

3. If, after a person has experienced a wait expiration, and that person seeks private care without the aid of the Government of Canada, then the Government of Canada will be required only to pay for an amount that would be equal to the lowest cost of private care that the Government of Canada would have been able to private at the time that such private care had been administered.

:arrow: Explanation

What do you think? We could set very low wait expiration times for certain procedures (organ transplants, for example) — much lower than are presently deemed acceptable — and we could enable the Government of Canada to seek private care to compensate for any failure of the public system, at the expense of the Government.

:!: (Correction) Corrected the definition of wait time.

 

[Jersay]

Thank you Five Paradox for your suggestions.

Sanch, I am doing a program that is for people who is coming to Canada by themselves.

I am not forcing anyone to come to Canada.

People who come to Canada would go through this system to be doctors in Canada on their own choosing.

 

[sanch]

Jersey the world has ears. The way it works now is that in the US and Canada International Medical Graduates usually have to go through a residency. The CMA for example asked for funding for 600 new residencies for IMG’s. If granted this policy will promote brain drain. That is the intention. This means that poorer countries like India have to compete for doctors with richer countries like Canada. Or Canada with the US. The country that commits resources to training the doctor loses that investment.

The argument for a residency is that it provides practical experience so future doctors can learn the culture of medicine as well as be observed as they see patients by residency doctors. There any deficiencies in education can be addressed. This seems to be the preferred system over tests.

The testing idea does have a great deal of merit in other areas and professions. Special care has to be taken not to encourage brain drain from any particular area though.

 

[FiveParadox]

Perhaps, in that case, this would be more appropriate.

1. Any person in Canada may become a doctor where:

(a) such a person presents to the Government of Canada a current and recognized accreditation of their skills in their field of practice from a foreign country;

(b) the Government of Canada has not determined an accreditation pursuant to Subsection (a) to be not valid for the purpose of practicing in Canada; and

(c) such a person completes a practical assessment of skills, including simulations of several complex procedures within their intended field of practice.

 

[Jersay]

I don't know about that.

If they have a degree and they pass the test that I plan.

I just have to think about it.

 

[FiveParadox]

Acceptance of Qualifications

I think the issue here, Jersay, is that Canada currently has no particular "standards" in which foreign accreditations are to be recognized by the Government of Canada; whatever your decision on the matter — a test, or some other sort of exam — I would assert that we should come up with some sort of fair method to decide which types of accreditations would be recognized.

 

[Jersay]

I think the issue here, Jersay, is that Canada currently has no particular "standards" in which foreign accreditations are to be recognized by the Government of Canada; whatever your decision on the matter — a test, or some other sort of exam — I would assert that we should come up with some sort of fair method to decide which types of accreditations would be recognized.

Agreed.

However, I don't want to feel like I am stealing doctors from a foreign country when they are coming to Canada on their own free will.

 

[FiveParadox]

No, of course not! It wasn't my intention to imply anything like that.

We need to ensure, in my opinion, that we provide a method whereby a foreign doctor can acquire some sort of "equivalence" for his or her accreditation from a foreign nation (a Certification of Canadian Medical Profficiency, if you will), while ensuring that the method is fair enough so as to not crush the dreams of certain skilled doctors who would come to Canada with "invalid" accreditation in the eyes of the Government; we need to ensure that our way of judging credentials is fair.

 

[Jersay]

No, of course not! It wasn't my intention to imply anything like that.

We need to ensure, in my opinion, that we provide a method whereby a foreign doctor can acquire some sort of "equivalence" for his or her accreditation from a foreign nation (a Certification of Canadian Medical Profficiency, if you will), while ensuring that the method is fair enough so as to not crush the dreams of certain skilled doctors who would come to Canada with "invalid" accreditation in the eyes of the Government; we need to ensure that our way of judging credentials is fair.

Agred.