Backing Suicide Bombers

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
201
63
RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
Re: RE: Backing Suicide Bombe

aeon said:
orpheus said:
Well, Indonesia may be the most populous Muslim country, however they are still the minority. I would say that the majority of hatred comes from the lack of proper education. You see it in the west and you see it in the east. Human ignorance is universal. If you want a rational society create a proper education system. Education goes farther then math and English; it is necessary that we integrate cultural awarness and political discourse in our elementary schools (in a more affective way than how it is currently being handled.)





True, human ignorance is universal, and you just proved it.Education has little to do with it.....


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dying_to_Win:_The_Strategic_Logic_of_Suicide_Terrorism

Pape claims to have compiled the world’s first “database of every suicide bombing and attack around the globe from 1980 through 2003 — 315 attacks in all” (3). “The data show that there is little connection between suicide terrorism and Islamic fundamentalism, or any one of the world’s religions. . . . Rather, what nearly all suicide terrorist attacks have in common is a specific secular and strategic goal: to compel modern democracies to withdraw military forces from territory that the terrorists consider to be their homeland” (4). It is important that Americans understand this growing phenomenon (4-7).

I heard this material in a CBC lecture last month, He concluded that the majority of suicide bombers were not religious fanatics it
was found that the religious were unreliable as suicide bombers, and that most suicide bombers were not Moslem.
 

#juan

Hall of Fame Member
Aug 30, 2005
18,326
119
63
darkbeaver

Sorry to pick just a small part of your post.

I heard this material in a CBC lecture last month, He concluded that the majority of suicide bombers were not religious fanatics it
was found that the religious were unreliable as suicide bombers, and that most suicide bombers were not Moslem.

I profess no expertise about suicide bombers but religious or not, they are most certainly fanatics. If they were not Muslims, what would be their motivation for killing themselves and others?

It also strikes me that higher education would lessen the chances of someone becoming a suicude bomber.
 

aeon

Council Member
Jan 17, 2006
1,348
0
36
Re: RE: Backing Suicide Bombe

darkbeaver said:
[

I heard this material in a CBC lecture last month, He concluded that the majority of suicide bombers were not religious fanatics it
was found that the religious were unreliable as suicide bombers, and that most suicide bombers were not Moslem.


Was it in fifth estate??( not sure of this word)


CBC is a great tv network, one of the best in canada, if not the best.Michael moore/farenheit 9-11 got most of his facts in fifth estates.
 

aeon

Council Member
Jan 17, 2006
1,348
0
36
I think not said:
You guys like wikipedia right?

Profile of a bomber
A common reaction to a suicide bomber is to assume that he or she was motivated by despair, and probably hailed from a poor, neglected segment of society. Both President George W. Bush and the Dalai Lama have made this claim. However, anthropologist Scott Atran found in a 2003 study that this is not a justifiable conclusion. A recently published paper by Harvard University Professor of Public Policy Alberto Abadie "cast doubt on the widely held belief that terrorism stems from poverty, finding instead that terrorist violence is related to a nation's level of political freedom." [4] More specifically this is due to the transition of countries towards democratic freedoms. "Intermediate levels of political freedom are often experienced during times of political transitions, when governments are weak, political instability is elevated, so conditions are favorable for the appearance of terrorism" Quote Original Paper.



That could make sense for some terrorist, but according to robert pape, who collect data from 300 terrorist attack from 1980 to 2005, conclued, it is mainly cause by foreign occupations.
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
201
63
RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
JAUN

I agree they were deemed to be fanatic but not necessarily religious. No sorrow necessary. I don't think a higher education or intelligence offers any real barrier to fanaticism though. Also many who commit suicide are above average in intelligence.[/b]
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
201
63
RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
Re: RE: Backing Suicide Bombe

aeon said:
darkbeaver said:
[

I heard this material in a CBC lecture last month, He concluded that the majority of suicide bombers were not religious fanatics it
was found that the religious were unreliable as suicide bombers, and that most suicide bombers were not Moslem.


Was it in fifth estate??( not sure of this word)


CBC is a great tv network, one of the best in canada, if not the best.Michael moore/farenheit 9-11 got most of his facts in fifth estates.

It was CBC radio, I try to listen to the programe called Ideas it's on at 09:00 pm , good stuff most of the time.
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
201
63
RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
Re: RE: Backing Suicide Bombe

aeon said:
darkbeaver said:
[

I heard this material in a CBC lecture last month, He concluded that the majority of suicide bombers were not religious fanatics it
was found that the religious were unreliable as suicide bombers, and that most suicide bombers were not Moslem.


Was it in fifth estate??( not sure of this word)


CBC is a great tv network, one of the best in canada, if not the best.Michael moore/farenheit 9-11 got most of his facts in fifth estates.

It was CBC radio, I try to listen to the programe called Ideas it's on at 09:00 pm , good stuff most of the time.
 

orpheus

Nominee Member
Mar 14, 2006
85
0
6
Canada, I would presume.
JAUN

I agree they were deemed to be fanatic but not necessarily religious. No sorrow necessary. I don't think a higher education or intelligence offers any real barrier to fanaticism though. Also many who commit suicide are above average in intelligence.[/b]

They have an above average level of schooling. Saying abover average in intelligence is a possiblity. However, many people living in eastern and western nations are misinformed...about a lot.
 

Mogz

Council Member
Jan 26, 2006
1,254
1
38
Edmonton
1.

So do I, it's an environmentally friendlier way to deliver bombs, think of the fuel savings as opposed to a helicopter or B52s which require enormous ammounts of expensive tech stuff and years of crew training all to arrive at the same product, terrorism!

Yeah that's exactly what's going through allah-hala-oopdity-bah's head when he sets off his suicide vest on a bush full of school kids. "I do this for mother nature". Please.

How desperate does one have to be to commit suicide by explosives in order to kill other people?

Or how religiously brain washed? Truth be told, suicide bombings serve no purpose other than to harm. Blowing ones self up on a bus full of innocents doesn't further your cause, in fact it works against any form of political recognition. A marked fact is that the people who show up to "devote themselves to Allah" are some of the most socially and ignorant people their nations produce. People who've bought in to religion in every aspect. Ever see the 60 minutes piece on the suicide bombers whose vests didn't go off? Those people are right out of their gourds.

And Juan is correct, a person has to be extremely desperate to become a sucicide bomber.

Desperate for what? More like religiously blinded. We have tons of desperate people on Western society. Homeless, people living with terminal illness, yet they don't strap on a bomb and blow themselves up in a crowded market do they? You cannot make the mistake that these people are desperate, they're not. They're religious idealists that use violence to try and bend the will of good people. Do don't see some Christian strapping on a kilo of C-4 and some det-cord and blowing himself up at West Edmonton Mall, and that's because he ISN'T Islamic. Now don't get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with Islam in and of itself. There is however a problem with radical clerics who bend the minds of young people to blow themselves up in the name of an ideal that completely contradicts the religion they "follow". No, suicide bombers are not desperate, and they don't deserve any respect. They blows themselves up because they're too big of cowards to fight conventionally, and the vast majority of the time their victims are their fellow countrymen and women.

The point is that the Japanese did not begin the war with suicide tactics it was only done at the end.

Might want to go back and take a history class there bud. The Japanese employed kamikaze pilots at Pearl Harbour, the first day of the Japanese War against the U.S. In fact the USS Arizona was sunk partly due to a suicide bomber that crashed his Nakaijma dive-bomber in to the bridge after dropping his payload.
 

#juan

Hall of Fame Member
Aug 30, 2005
18,326
119
63
A question Mogz

If the Palestinians had a modern military; an airforce, army, navy, would they be using suicide bombers? If they had a hope that things will get better, would anyone be blowing themselves up? I don't think so.
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
201
63
RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
RE: Backing Suicide Bombe

Fanatic=Latin: fanaticus, inspired by diety, frenzied,
French= fanum: temple
: markedby excessive enthusiasm and often intense uncriticle devotion.
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
201
63
RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
Re: RE: Backing Suicide Bombe

I think not said:
darkbeaver said:
The point is that the Japanese did not begin the war with suicide tactics it was only done at the end.

No, the point is, you do not require desperation to commit suicide raids. You have a reading comprehension issue? Beavers are known for that.

Yes you do.
 

orpheus

Nominee Member
Mar 14, 2006
85
0
6
Canada, I would presume.
RE: Backing Suicide Bombe

Do don't see some Christian strapping on a kilo of C-4 and some det-cord and blowing himself up at West Edmonton Mall, and that's because he ISN'T Islamic.
This must be twenty-seventh time I've said this, but it isn't Islam that leads these people to bomb themselves. If the government situation in the west was similar to that of the Middle East, I would venture to say that Christians would be strapping bombs on themselves as well. It is much more difficult in the Middle East to seek conventional ways of solving a problem due to their government structure.

Pape claims to have compiled the world’s first “database of every suicide bombing and attack around the globe from 1980 through 2003 — 315 attacks in all” (3). “The data show that there is little connection between suicide terrorism and Islamic fundamentalism, or any one of the world’s religions. . . . Rather, what nearly all suicide terrorist attacks have in common is a specific secular and strategic goal: to compel modern democracies to withdraw military forces from territory that the terrorists consider to be their homeland” (4). It is important that Americans understand this growing phenomenon (4-7).
Most suicide bombers are currently being centered in Iraq and Palestine. They share the common problem of territorial rights, foreign influence etc. etc.