Abortion

joellewoodruff

New Member
Jun 4, 2004
30
0
6
Toronto
In the news this has been the topic of choice, but how do you guys feel about abortions, I mean, is it the woman's choice or is she murdering a human being? There are a lot of extremes on this one, I know how the politicians feel, but how about Canadians?
 

Daniel_Klassen

New Member
Jun 4, 2004
3
0
1
I personally agree with abortions, I think that it is a woman's choice whether or not they want to carry the baby and if they want to have to handle the responsibility to look after it. There is no way that any government will get rid of abortions, if they aren't done in clinics or in hospitals, then they will be done in some back-alley special where disease or infection are sure to follow. The only safe bet is to keep this legal and fund it better.
(I don't agree with abortion as a method of birth control though, if people have repeated abortions, they need to look at themselves and change something in there lives.)
 

ponygurl

Nominee Member
Jun 3, 2004
63
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6
Ottawa
I would like to see abortions only available to women if they have been raped or if carrying the baby to full term will endanger her life.

There are consequences to all actions..
 

ponygurl

Nominee Member
Jun 3, 2004
63
0
6
Ottawa
Numure said:
Sure, but should a child suffer does consequences? No.
There are many options open to young mothers or women who have unwanted pregnancies. Do you know what the demand is for babies to adopt?
Are you seriously trying to suggest Numure.. that a woman who spreads her legs isn't aware that pregnancy could result?
I think that if the possibility of adoption for an unwanted pregnancy is too"easy an out", stupid ass women will ALLOW themselves to become pregnant by having unprotected sex even more often than they do.
And I am sorry ladies.. I know it is " the guys responsibility" to use protection too.. but I am old.. a whole 39.. and I have learned throughout my life that the only one TRULY responsible for me is me. So it IS the lady's responsibility when she enters a sexual bond to ensure that there is protection of some sort.

Birth control fails.
Whe one uses birth control, they are aware that there is a 2% or more chance said birth control will fail. If they are not willing to take on the 2% or more chance of raising the result of their sexual union, they SHOULD NOT be having the sexual union.
 

Prometheus

Electoral Member
Jul 12, 2003
198
0
16
Eastern USA
Although I am pro-choice on almost every issue there is, abortion has always carried the stigma of murder with it, mostly due to the religious orders.

I feel everyone should have the right to choose what they do with their bodies, time and money, as long as it doesn't impose on anyone else's right to do the same.

That said however, I agree with ponygurl's posts above completely. There are other options for "unwanted" or "unexpected" pregnancies. Taking responsibility is one.

When it was first learned that my girlfriend was pregnant with my son, we weighed the options. We were young, unmarried and financially not prepared for raising a child. I must admit abortion was the first thought that popped in my mind.

Melissa decided to carry full term, and deal with the consequences as they came. My son will be 10 years old in July. He is well mannered and courteous. He is an honor roll student and an outstanding athlete in baseball, basketball and soccer. Although his mother and I are no longer together, we see each other almost daily and have a healthy family relationship.
When I think back now how quick I was to jump on abortion as an "easy out", it makes me sick to my stomach. Although I still feel people have a right to choose, I find it hard as a parent to justify making it too easy for someone to duck responsibility for their actions.
 

Démocrite

Nominee Member
Jun 1, 2004
63
0
6
I am pro-choice. We've seen Women in Los Angeles, where abortions are illegal, throwing away their new-borns. An unwanted child is worst than a abortion. Some women occasionally buried living child, which is worst than evry thing. Let women choose for themselves, even if the abortions are sad situations.
 

ponygurl

Nominee Member
Jun 3, 2004
63
0
6
Ottawa
Démocrite said:
I am pro-choice. We've seen Women in Los Angeles, where abortions are illegal, throwing away their new-borns. An unwanted child is worst than a abortion. Some women occasionally buried living child, which is worst than evry thing. Let women choose for themselves, even if the abortions are sad situations.
The problem in California is not the lack of abortions. The problem in CA is the abundance of crack and the loose morals they have come to live by.
Instil a moral system.. teach our daughters abstinance..teach them responsibility..
Why sit back and say " well California is fucked up.. so that must be the role to live by".
I do not believe for a second that our children here in Canada are either as promiscuous or as high as those in CA.
I cannot live with a " lesser of two evils" standard when it comes to human life.
 

Numure

Council Member
Apr 30, 2004
1,063
0
36
Montréal, Québec
ponygurl said:
Démocrite said:
I am pro-choice. We've seen Women in Los Angeles, where abortions are illegal, throwing away their new-borns. An unwanted child is worst than a abortion. Some women occasionally buried living child, which is worst than evry thing. Let women choose for themselves, even if the abortions are sad situations.
The problem in California is not the lack of abortions. The problem in CA is the abundance of crack and the loose morals they have come to live by.
Instil a moral system.. teach our daughters abstinance..teach them responsibility..
Why sit back and say " well California is fucked up.. so that must be the role to live by".
I do not believe for a second that our children here in Canada are either as promiscuous or as high as those in CA.
I cannot live with a " lesser of two evils" standard when it comes to human life.

Morality is such a loosly used term... It just doesnt apply anymore. As its subjective to ones beliefs.
 

joellewoodruff

New Member
Jun 4, 2004
30
0
6
Toronto
ponygurl what about women who do not willingly "spread their legs" as you so lovingly put it!!! What about pregnancies as a result of rape, or even pregnancies where the mother could be seriously harmed by carrying the baby to full term???

And although girls who spread their legs should know the consequesnces, children, young teenagers with psycological problems (including severe self-consciencness) are often the ones giving into the pressures of sex and end up pregnant WAY too young. By carrying their babies to full term in order to be given up for adoption many of them may be beaten by family members or even their boyfriends, o they have to drop out of school for so long that it seriously impaires their education. There have even been many cases where women have been murdered by their boyfriends because they wound up preganant and couldn't get an abortion!!! Are you saying these women should not be able to get an abortion????
And look at the options a woman has if abortion is illegal. Many of themm try to do it themselves. Almost killing themselves by taking a multitude of illegal drugs to kill the fetus or they'll attempt to hook or cut the baby out themselves. Babies still end up thrown into garbage cans, that may be a woman's only choice without being able to get an abortion. What's worse killing an embryo or killing a living baby by dropping it into the garbage?
It's the woman's choice before that fetus is three months old, it's not even a human being by then! So please, if you can tell me how getting rid of abortion is a better alternative to all of this, I would be very interested to hear it!
 

ponygurl

Nominee Member
Jun 3, 2004
63
0
6
Ottawa
joellewoodruff said:
ponygurl what about women who do not willingly "spread their legs" as you so lovingly put it!!! What about pregnancies as a result of rape, or even pregnancies where the mother could be seriously harmed by carrying the baby to full term???
Read my previous post pertaining to that.
 

ponygurl

Nominee Member
Jun 3, 2004
63
0
6
Ottawa
Numure said:
ponygurl said:
Démocrite said:
I am pro-choice. We've seen Women in Los Angeles, where abortions are illegal, throwing away their new-borns. An unwanted child is worst than a abortion. Some women occasionally buried living child, which is worst than evry thing. Let women choose for themselves, even if the abortions are sad situations.
The problem in California is not the lack of abortions. The problem in CA is the abundance of crack and the loose morals they have come to live by.
Instil a moral system.. teach our daughters abstinance..teach them responsibility..
Why sit back and say " well California is fucked up.. so that must be the role to live by".
I do not believe for a second that our children here in Canada are either as promiscuous or as high as those in CA.
I cannot live with a " lesser of two evils" standard when it comes to human life.

Morality is such a loosly used term... It just doesnt apply anymore. As its subjective to ones beliefs.
Not in my house.
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
1
38
Winnipeg
We aren't in your house, Ponygurl...we're out in the real world.

When abortions were illegal, women risked their lives to get one. Coat hangers, douching with lye, drinking poison. Sometimes it worked and sometimes it didn't. Sometimes it only partially worked and the kids suffered birth defects. Sometimes the mothers died. Sometimes girls and their doctors went to prison. That's the real world reality of banning abortions.
 

LuShes

Electoral Member
Mar 25, 2002
868
1
18
42
Kamloops, B.C.
www.canadiancontent.net
Abortion is a sad subject. But in some situations, its an option. If a young girl is raped, espeically by a family member or something, or if the pregnancy is unsafe. And is performed by a professional doctor, at a timely mannor before 12 weeks. I hate to even think of a little tiny heartbeat and 10 little fingers and toes formed at 10 weeks of pregnancy could be destroyed. But in some cases its for the better.

I just don't think it should be used as a method of birth control!
 

ponygurl

Nominee Member
Jun 3, 2004
63
0
6
Ottawa
Reverend Blair said:
We aren't in your house, Ponygurl...we're out in the real world.

When abortions were illegal, women risked their lives to get one. Coat hangers, douching with lye, drinking poison. Sometimes it worked and sometimes it didn't. Sometimes it only partially worked and the kids suffered birth defects. Sometimes the mothers died. Sometimes girls and their doctors went to prison. That's the real world reality of banning abortions.
Whe I referenced to my house, I was speaking of " morality". It had been stated that moralty was a dead issue.. that really things are what we believe.
I said what I said because..in my home..I have a moral standard that is to be upheld. Of course, as with everything in this blame free society, children and adults can make their own choices despite moral expectations. However.. IN MY HOUSE there are consequences to such choices. I will not lower my expectations or moral standards because they maybe won't be followed. They are my beliefs and will remain intact.
And please quote where I said I would like abortions banned?
 

ponygurl

Nominee Member
Jun 3, 2004
63
0
6
Ottawa
Numure said:
I was stating, that you follow your moral code, and I folloew mine. Both are quite different I presume.
You presume correctly.
And despite your deficit.. you remain a worthy debate opponent..(at least you read before you post). :lol: :wink: 8)
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
1
38
Winnipeg
Ponygurl, when you take a position of moral superiority when opposing a viewpoint, you imply all that opposition entails...in this case banning abortions. Don't support a viewpoint if you don't believe in it. This is a public forum, not your living room.

As for whether you are any more moral than anybody else on this page...No you are not.
 

EternalSunshine

Electoral Member
Jun 3, 2004
219
0
16
Montreal
I believe abortion should definitely be legal. At same time there is so much more that can and should be done to avoid it: yes, teaching abstinence too, but in general, education, prevention and different options, so that it really is last possible resort.

And those of us, who are fortunate enough to have been raised to be responsible and have high moral values, and fortunate enough to be able to raise our children the same way, we should not be so quick to judge those that didn't have such luck. Some people just don't know any better, they didn't have anyone to teach them.