Bhutto follows her father

[gopher]

``the "Electra Complex" of which Hitchens writes is not meant to be taken literally.``


And because you say so, it is, of course, properly right and everybody else is wrong.

Ho hum.:roll:

As for silliness, you take the cake, buddy.:lol:

 

[wallyj]

.
. Right on schedual the murder has been pinned on Al-Queada, christ they're handy to own. All purpose bad guys with a huge network on at least three planets that seems to have the same intelligence capabilitys as you know who. It makes it easy to understand why he's never been arrested.

No you didn't mention GB by name. Who were you implying? You even BS yourself.

 

[gopher]

Well, at least the ISI didn't say BLAME CLINTON!!

 

[darkbeaver]

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=7699
While Bhutto’s relationship with both the ISI and the Taliban were marked by turmoil, it is clear that Bhutto, when in power, supported both---and enthusiastically supported Anglo-American interventions.
In his two landmark books, Taliban: Militant Islam, Oil and Fundamentalism in Central Asia and Jihad: The Rise of Militant Islam in Central Asia, Ahmed Rashid richly details the Bhutto regime’s connections to the ISI, the Taliban, “militant Islam”, multinational oil interests, and Anglo-American officials and intelligence proxies.
In Jihad, Rashid wrote:

“Ironically it was not the ISI but Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto, the most liberal, secular leader in Pakistan’s recent history, who delivered the coup de grace to a new relationship with Central Asia. Rather than support a wider peace process in Afghanistan that would have opened up a wider peace process in Afghanistan, Bhutto backed the Taliban, in a rash and presumptuous policy to create a new western-oriented trade and pipeline route from Turkmenistan through southern Afghanistan to Pakistan, from which the Taliban would provide security. The ISI soon supported this policy because its Afghan protégé Gulbuddin Hekmatyar had made no headway in capturing Kabul, and the Taliban appeared to be strong enough to do so.”
​

In Taliban, Rashid provided even more historical detail:

“When Bhutto was elected as Prime Minister in 1993, she was keen to open a route to Central Asia. A new proposal emerged backed strongly by the frustrated Pakistani transport and smuggling mafia, the JUI and Pashtun military and political officials.”
“The Bhutto government fully backed the Taliban, but the ISI remained skeptical of their abilities, convinced that they would remain a useful but peripheral force in the south.”
“The US congress had authorized a covert $20 million budget for the CIA to destabilize Iran, and Tehran accused Washington of funneling some of these funds to the Taliban---a charge that was always denied by Washington . Bhutto sent several emissaries to Washington to urge the US to intervene more publicly on the side of Pakistan and the Taliban.”
​

Bhutto’s one mistake: she vehemently supported the pipeline proposed by Argentinean oil company Bridas, and opposed the pipeline by Unocal (favored by the US). This contributed to her ouster in 1996, and the return of Nawaz Sharif to power. As noted by Rashid:

“After the dismissal of the Bhutto government in 1996, the newly elected Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif, his oil minister Chaudry Nisar Ali Khan, the army and the ISI fully backed Unocal. Pakistan wanted more direct US support for the Taliban and urged Unocal to start construction quickly in order to legitimize the Taliban. Basically the USA and Unocal accepted the ISI’s analysis and aims---that a Taliban victory in Afghanistan would make Unocal’s job much easier and quicken US recognition.”
​

Her appealing and glamorous pro-Western image notwithstanding, Bhutto’s true record is one of corruption and accommodation.
The “

 

[darkbeaver]

No you didn't mention GB by name. Who were you implying? You even BS yourself.

Wallyj, I was implying that it was you. You wouldn't know BS from shaveing cream.:lol:

 

[gopher]

If it is true that she had such a strong connection to the ISI, how did they slip up and allow her to get killed with not one of their agents in her presence??

 

[darkbeaver]

If it is true that she had such a strong connection to the ISI, how did they slip up and allow her to get killed with not one of their agents in her presence??

Oh, well I don't think it was a slipup, the one thing that Bush/Chenny/Neocon world can't allow is even the slightest bit of stability in Pakistan Gopher. The thought of any working coalition is not in the interests of the players in my opinion. You will get your invasion I think.

 

[darkbeaver]

They Don't Blame al-Qa'ida. They Blame Musharraf

By Robert Fisk

12/29/07 "The Independent" -- Weird, isn't it, how swiftly the narrative is laid down for us. Benazir Bhutto, the courageous leader of the Pakistan People's Party, is assassinated in Rawalpindi – attached to the very capital of Islamabad wherein ex-General Pervez Musharraf lives – and we are told by George Bush that her murderers were "extremists" and "terrorists". Well, you can't dispute that.

But the implication of the Bush comment was that Islamists were behind the assassination. It was the Taliban madmen again, the al-Qa'ida spider who struck at this lone and brave woman who had dared to call for democracy in her country.

Of course, given the childish coverage of this appalling tragedy – and however corrupt Ms Bhutto may have been, let us be under no illusions that this brave lady is indeed a true martyr – it's not surprising that the "good-versus-evil" donkey can be trotted out to explain the carnage in Rawalpindi.

Who would have imagined, watching the BBC or CNN on Thursday, that her two brothers, Murtaza and Shahnawaz, hijacked a Pakistani airliner in 1981 and flew it to Kabul where Murtaza demanded the release of political prisoners in Pakistan. Here, a military officer on the plane was murdered. There were Americans aboard the flight – which is probably why the prisoners were indeed released.

Only a few days ago – in one of the most remarkable (but typically unrecognised) scoops of the year – Tariq Ali published a brilliant dissection

 

[darkbeaver]

Gopher:

You misrepresent me (and what I have very clearly written) when you say that I say Hitchens can do no wrong. Also, the "Electra Complex" of which Hitchens writes is not meant to be taken literally.

I think I'm done with you. You're kinda silly and literal minded. Such a shame.

Pangloss

You should let your hair down a bit Pangloss, if you don't develope a bit of layedbackedness how you going to have fun.You can't write the whole team off, you'd be talking to yourself eh.:smile:

 

[gopher]

``I don't think it was a slipup, the one thing that Bush/Chenny/Neocon world can't allow is even the slightest bit of stability in Pakistan``


Yup. Agree 100 %.

And they sure as hell don't want anyone as emotionally unstable as Bhutto who entertained notions of killing her mother in order to screw her father, at least according to Hitchens and his supporters.

 

[darkbeaver]

Benazir Bhutto named her assassins almost two months ago
Pinning down the financiers of these extremists groups with their known connection to Pakistani intelligence

By Rev. Richard Skaff

Global Research, December 29, 2007

Benazir Bhutto the former Pakistani prime minister named her assassins almost two months ago during her interview on November 02, 2007 with the world famous interviewer and British establishment pundit David Frost on his show “Frost over the world” (interview available on youtube titled “Benazir Bhutto: Bin Laden murdered”).
The late Bhutto discussed with Frost the initial failed assassination attempt on her life that killed 158 Pakistanis two weeks after her return to Pakistan.

The return of the late Ms. Bhutto to Pakistan was encouraged by the Anglo-American establishment under the guise of re-establishing democracy to this artificial country that was originally created by the colonial powers as a toxic thorn in the heart of India , and as a prospective tool for the destabilization of the region.

In her interview with Frost, the late Ms. Bhutto also discussed her knowledge of three people in the Pakistani government who are in collusion with the Islamists, and who might have been behind this failed assassination attempt. She also specifically stated that she wanted the Musharraf government to trace the finances of the terrorists instead of just naming them.

She also added that one of these three men whom she suspected of orchestrating the assassination was a former military officer man who is also well connected to the Pakistani security agency, and who had dealings with another man named “Omar Sheikh” “who murdered Osama Bin Laden.” Ms. Bhutto did not make any attempt to correct herself about the murder of OBL, and the shrewd David Frost did not inquire either about this extraordinary statement, considering that the Anglo-American establishment’s war on terror has been totally choreographed around OBL. The late Ms.Bhutto also emphasized again in her interview the importance of pinning down the financiers of these extremists groups with their known connection to the ISI the Pakistani intelligence services. It is well known that the ISI was originally created and subsidized by western intelligence agencies to do their dirty work in the central Asian region. It has been the main mover and shaker of drug trafficking as well as the financing and training of Islamic militants since the Soviet-Afghani war in the late 70s and 80s. The ISI was also reportedly connected to 9/11. ​

Ms. Bhutto’s return to Pakistan was no accident, but a well orchestrated move by the global establishment to create further conflict in the region, knowing well that Pakistan is a nuclear power in which this same establishment had furnished these weapons to help Pakistan defends itself against its nemesis India , the largely populated other nuclear power. A conflict between these two countries will definitely help the population reduction process that the elite has always enthusiastically encouraged. It is also ironic that the Pakistan dictator (Musharraf) was given a contract by an American power house publisher “Simon and Shuster” to publish his book “In the Line of Fire” as a pay off for his services to the global establishment, or as an eventual retirement gift, once the turmoil totally engulfs Pakistan . Every Moslem country that has been infected with the fundamentalist virus will eventually self-destruct and re-mapped by the global establishment to fit the map of the new world order.

The nagging questions that many people have are the following: If Bin Laden was murdered, how come the corporate media has never picked up on it? How much collusion exists between the corporate media and the global establishment to perpetuate conflict and wars? Is the disinformation campaign is actually a war against the minds of the masses? Why is it, that the boogey man (OBL) must remain alive? Why is it that the war on terror myth (as called by the critically acclaimed BBC documentary “the power of nightmares,” also available on youtube) must proceed? Is martial law going to be implemented following a catastrophic event? Is every human being going to be micro-chipped and controlled?

Has the corporate media simply become a tool of the global government?

Has all programming become a strategy to perpetuate myth, ideology, and propaganda?

When will the public be told the truth?

Do people actually care about what happens internationally? Does the majority of the public even know what Pakistan is, or where it is located on a map?

Is the public’s apathy and ignorance for international affairs are the key ingredients that fuel the lies, the manipulation, and the globalization process?


Rev. Richard Skaff is author of the recently released book “The Human Manifesto”

 

[darkbeaver]

``I don't think it was a slipup, the one thing that Bush/Chenny/Neocon world can't allow is even the slightest bit of stability in Pakistan``


Yup. Agree 100 %.

And they sure as hell don't want anyone as emotionally unstable as Bhutto who entertained notions of killing her mother in order to screw her father, at least according to Hitchens and his supporters.

Hitchens writing does not appeal to me, I usually avoid his stuff. I did read somewhere today the Ms Bhutto may have been instumental in the death of one of her brothers while she was PM. I think she's done what she was brought back to do. There has been talk for months about the need to assert more control over Pakistan and secure the nukes.

 

[missile]

Do you think that if she had looked like Golda Meir, she would have gotten as much news coverage? Hitchens writings are amusing tho,he thinks up angles no one else would dare..like his story on Mother Teresa. Only he would say and think those thoughts. A twisted but educated mind in that man.

 

[gopher]

``Hitchens writing does not appeal to me, I usually avoid his stuff.``

``twisted but educated mind``


What would Asif Ali Zardari (Bhutto's husband) think about the notion that his late wife screwed her father. Ditto for her son Bilawal Zardar. Can you imagine him screaming as a child ''Daddy, Mommy screwed Grandpa!''

Hitchens is a hate filled sicko. You have to wonder who would give any credibility to a psycho like him.

 

[JBeee]

martyrdom ?

 

[normbc9]

Isn't it funny the pakistani government couldn't find any of the communications nets the bad guys were using for intel gathering but now they hear on the net (they previously couldn't find) that the insurgents are responsible for this assassination? It must be like the Immaculate Reception in football. All of a sudden it was there. I guess they hoped this revelation would stave off the demonstrations they are now experiencing. Musharaff will get his soon too. I'm not sure if it will terminal lead poisoning to the head or shrapnel to the entire body. Tit for tat over there.

 

[gopher]

excellent video should settle the issue as to whether Bhutto was or was not killed by a bullet:

 

[normbc9]

One thing we all have to bear in mind is that the nation of Pakistan is basically a spin-off from the stone age and the only thing the citizens have in common is most males are Madrassa educated and therefor violence towards westerners and Christians alike is always a threat. Few are truly literate and most of the female population is subjugated to the total dominance of the male citizenry. The only quick fix is rather inhuman and it involves their prescious resource of the nuclear technolgy the now have. My biggest fear is that the technolgy will fall into the wrong hands. if we think Iran is a problem wait until this scenario presents itself. Death is commonplace in their society and life has little if any value. The recent assassination and it's aftermath must be a teacher to all of us in the west. I hope we are lsitening.

 

[darkbeaver]

One thing we all have to bear in mind is that the nation of Pakistan is basically a spin-off from the stone age and the only thing the citizens have in common is most males are Madrassa educated and therefor violence towards westerners and Christians alike is always a threat. Few are truly literate and most of the female population is subjugated to the total dominance of the male citizenry. The only quick fix is rather inhuman and it involves their prescious resource of the nuclear technolgy the now have. My biggest fear is that the technolgy will fall into the wrong hands. if we think Iran is a problem wait until this scenario presents itself. Death is commonplace in their society and life has little if any value. The recent assassination and it's aftermath must be a teacher to all of us in the west. I hope we are lsitening.

Well normbc the west has been doing more than just listening, it's been arming Pakistan for years and is responsible in part for Pakistan having nuclear weapons. The technology is already in the wrong hands it always has been they invented it and used it on a defenceless beaten enemy. Death is commonly delivered at the hands of Americans in our world, men women and children in the many millions have died because Uncle Sam pushed the bang your dead button on them, many millions more were simply starved to death, many millions more were dozed off thier land and out of thier homes. Your worry about Pakistani agression is unfounded and illinformed. How is it Bhutto came to power in the totally patriarchal totally backward country you portray Pakistan as being? As for christians who cares they got it coming.

 

[gopher]

``the nation of Pakistan is basically a spin-off from the stone age``

Not really. It's judicial, educational, and political systems were based on the British system. Women are quite liberated by our view of Islamic standards and education has always been available.

If it were not for fascist dictator Musharraf, Pakistan would be in far better shape. Its problems cannot honestly be attributed to Islam the way some would have you believe.