Quebec as a Nation
- Thread starter John Muff
- Start date
That mentality is the problem, the 10 provinces are part of one country. Quebec is not special and doesn't deserve any special recognition. If they want to become a 'nation' then let them go. We don't need them. Canada can survive without them, they can't survive without Canada.
Quebec wants to protect its distinctiveness, and has a basis in being one of the "founding nations".
It is not Quebec's problem that other provinces were established later.
Your attitude of "Quebec needs canada, canada doesn't need quebec" is a problem. They want to be distinct, let them be.
It is not Quebec's problem that other provinces were established later.
Your attitude of "Quebec needs canada, canada doesn't need quebec" is a problem. They want to be distinct, let them be.
And Ontario was the other, possibly including Nova Scotia and New Brunswick? C'mon, you should know better than that. It was France, not Quebec, that was one of the founding nations.
Discriminating witout even knowing it...
So Hotshot, by saying so, your telling palestinans in the same time that they don't deserve a "nation", because they need International funding to "survive".
I don't think that Québec would need subsidized revenue, since, on the morning of the independence, you won't ask yourself if your at war with your neighbor, but instead you'll seek to understand us better as we really are. Not "melted" in Canadian British rules and laws, monarchy link is another question there. Do you think we are bound to it as the rest of you are ???
Think twice. Québec is a STRONG nation (recognizing Québec is not a "Country", but "nation"), therefore we would do well, and probably better mutually because we are peaceful and share some values. Don't be afraid of who you are so we can know you better is what I would suggest you Hotshot...
Til' then... Have a good one... Love Ya ;-)
John Muff
So Hotshot, by saying so, your telling palestinans in the same time that they don't deserve a "nation", because they need International funding to "survive".
I don't think that Québec would need subsidized revenue, since, on the morning of the independence, you won't ask yourself if your at war with your neighbor, but instead you'll seek to understand us better as we really are. Not "melted" in Canadian British rules and laws, monarchy link is another question there. Do you think we are bound to it as the rest of you are ???
Think twice. Québec is a STRONG nation (recognizing Québec is not a "Country", but "nation"), therefore we would do well, and probably better mutually because we are peaceful and share some values. Don't be afraid of who you are so we can know you better is what I would suggest you Hotshot...
Til' then... Have a good one... Love Ya ;-)
John Muff
If the folks in Quebec want to secede from Canada, it is their right to do so. A few years ago the Cree considered seceding as well but tabled the discussion. Again, if they want their freedom, it is their right.
All who believe in democracy should also believe in the inalienable right of secession.
All who believe in democracy should also believe in the inalienable right of secession.
It seems that people here don't understand exactly what a nation is. Based on most replies, members seem to think the word nation is synonymous with state. This is simply not the case.
I would move to say that the results of this poll are inaccurate as it's obvious people don't understand the question clearly.
I would move to say that the results of this poll are inaccurate as it's obvious people don't understand the question clearly.
Well, if the anglos feel the need to explicidly call themselves a nation, so be it. Of course, we know that won't happen. Just because one group isn't vocal about itself doesn't mean other groups should be denied their distinctiveness by said group. If that is how you feel, then perhaps you would be of the camp that thinks "let quebec try to separate, and when the anglos defeat them again, this time don't give them their culture".
Quebec is recognised by Canada as a distinct society and they were never forced to use the British law system.. unlike every other province in Canada. I also disagree that Quebec would do just fine without subsidies. I love Quebec and miss being there (minus Montreal winters), but even with subsidies, the cities in Quebec are still ailing. There just exists little business prosperity in the province... especially compared to the past when Mtl was the heart of the Canadian economy. Take Canadian crown corporations and government subsidised companies out of the equasion and you have the recipe for disaster... Even Bombardier moved their transportation headquarters to Berlin, Germany recently.
Economy as it is treated today is, in itself, a huge recipe for disaster... Any place in the world is vulnerable... You just wait and see...
I'm always very suspicious of those who snort the "economic-disaster" argument against Quebec nationalism and Quebec seperatism... As if Quebec was a blank spot in the world where there was no possible opportunity for prosperity... As if Canadian federalism was the only possible option for a thriving economy... As if the remnants of British imperialism was the only way to create peaceful prosperity...
BULL****!
There is business to be done in Quebec like anywhere else and it's foolish to think otherwise...
Unlike many Canadians, I'm not religious about Canada. I don't act as if Canada was eternally bound to its nationhood... I don't act as if Canada was the frickin' best thing in the world... I apply the same logic to Quebec and its nationalism. All I want is positive change and the more nations I can relate to, the happier I am.
I'm always very suspicious of those who snort the "economic-disaster" argument against Quebec nationalism and Quebec seperatism... As if Quebec was a blank spot in the world where there was no possible opportunity for prosperity... As if Canadian federalism was the only possible option for a thriving economy... As if the remnants of British imperialism was the only way to create peaceful prosperity...
BULL****!
There is business to be done in Quebec like anywhere else and it's foolish to think otherwise...
Unlike many Canadians, I'm not religious about Canada. I don't act as if Canada was eternally bound to its nationhood... I don't act as if Canada was the frickin' best thing in the world... I apply the same logic to Quebec and its nationalism. All I want is positive change and the more nations I can relate to, the happier I am.
true separation
true separation has nothing to do with Quebec
true separation should happen at both borders of ontario, leaving us westerners and the maritimes with
our own nations,in every aspect of life, politics, sports, etc. the west is forgotton, we are the ones who
are different, ontario and quebec love each other, they belong together, live happily ever after, you both
have most of our money now, so what more do you need from us.
true separation has nothing to do with Quebec
true separation should happen at both borders of ontario, leaving us westerners and the maritimes with
our own nations,in every aspect of life, politics, sports, etc. the west is forgotton, we are the ones who
are different, ontario and quebec love each other, they belong together, live happily ever after, you both
have most of our money now, so what more do you need from us.
Ontario and Quebec love each other? I can't say I agree with that.
We both of most of your money now? Last time I checked, Ontario wasn't sucking up all the transfer payments like some provinces.
Quebec a nation?
Quebec was given most of her land on joining Canada. Quebec's developement has been generously subsidised by the rest of Canada. My feeling is that Quebec can leave with what they came with, no more. The "nation", in this equation is Canada not Quebec.
Quebec was given most of her land on joining Canada. Quebec's developement has been generously subsidised by the rest of Canada. My feeling is that Quebec can leave with what they came with, no more. The "nation", in this equation is Canada not Quebec.
Well say DurkaDurka
This is the first time I agree with "Kim II" Hehe !!! Dut it's far from being Quebec too... There is't clear numbers and democracy as for returning money to provinces...
Québec is far from being included as it's share in that transfer.
Québec doctors are making in average 70 % less than their neighbors. My family is lucky to be living close to the Ontario border nevertheless when I need it. Imagine, I'm back home earlier if I visit Ontario's hospitals. Wow, but were not talking about few millins, but way more. It's not like if education was sucking up the money too, Québec is strangled by lack of funding. ie: The war of flags on check... Come on...
Annyways, you are right, the share in provinces isn't equal... at all...
John Muff
This is the first time I agree with "Kim II" Hehe !!! Dut it's far from being Quebec too... There is't clear numbers and democracy as for returning money to provinces...
Québec is far from being included as it's share in that transfer.
Québec doctors are making in average 70 % less than their neighbors. My family is lucky to be living close to the Ontario border nevertheless when I need it. Imagine, I'm back home earlier if I visit Ontario's hospitals. Wow, but were not talking about few millins, but way more. It's not like if education was sucking up the money too, Québec is strangled by lack of funding. ie: The war of flags on check... Come on...
Annyways, you are right, the share in provinces isn't equal... at all...
John Muff
Remind you of something...
The more and more I think about it, the more it remind me of the palestinians... We even eard stories of giving Quebec, as someone said, only what it had. If thoses peoples are talking about the colonisation, may I remind you that there was peoples living here before us, and we share their lands.
s_lone is right and it point in one direction...
Québec would make the first step to become a country, and canada would be the second, third, and fourth to start a war over it. As it's CANADIAN CITIZENS want's it... Israely... Did I said that... hooo sorry !!!
Thanks "s_lone", your support for a peaceful deal is appreciated, have a good one !!!
John Muff
The more and more I think about it, the more it remind me of the palestinians... We even eard stories of giving Quebec, as someone said, only what it had. If thoses peoples are talking about the colonisation, may I remind you that there was peoples living here before us, and we share their lands.
s_lone is right and it point in one direction...
Québec would make the first step to become a country, and canada would be the second, third, and fourth to start a war over it. As it's CANADIAN CITIZENS want's it... Israely... Did I said that... hooo sorry !!!
Thanks "s_lone", your support for a peaceful deal is appreciated, have a good one !!!
John Muff
From the Canadian Oxford Dictionary, first definition for nation, third definition for state:
nation
1
a a community of people of mainly common descent, history, language, etc., forming a state or inhabiting a territory.
b the state or territory itself.
state
3
a an organized political community under one government; a nation.
b a political unit forming part of a federation, as in the United States of America.
Sorry Andem, you're wrong, the words are indeed synonymous and most people understand them to be so. There are shades of meaning in certain usages, but you can't really call people wrong for saying they're synonyms.
Agreed, but I don't see that Quebec's suffered particularly in that way, or that I suggested that it should.
That's not how I feel and I'm not of that camp. That's a remarkably silly straw man argument.
I have pretty much avoided this topic for various reasons, one of which is my loathing of Quebec and its politics.
In the past there was a very deep seeded hatred directed at Quebec and French Canadians in general, a sort of racism, for lack of a better term.
As the Quebecious infiltrated Canadian politics it began to secome to some form of self importance complex. It over rides Federal Treaties with Natives, it has ignored Native claims and issues, it has entrenched an anti "canadian" phylosophy within its borders to the point of having French only signage, no manditory English language class at the grade 9 compulsary level( as in the rest of Canada, grade 9 French is compulsary) and negated the rights of English speaking Canadians with a Draconian style of self righteous nonsense and megalomanical ideologies. Not to mention the Bloc, a sigular provincial party that under the parliment act, as far as i can remember is not capable of being a Federal party.
The more we give in the more they want. It is time to sit them down like the spoiled children they are and give them the spanking they so richly deserve.
In the past there was a very deep seeded hatred directed at Quebec and French Canadians in general, a sort of racism, for lack of a better term.
As the Quebecious infiltrated Canadian politics it began to secome to some form of self importance complex. It over rides Federal Treaties with Natives, it has ignored Native claims and issues, it has entrenched an anti "canadian" phylosophy within its borders to the point of having French only signage, no manditory English language class at the grade 9 compulsary level( as in the rest of Canada, grade 9 French is compulsary) and negated the rights of English speaking Canadians with a Draconian style of self righteous nonsense and megalomanical ideologies. Not to mention the Bloc, a sigular provincial party that under the parliment act, as far as i can remember is not capable of being a Federal party.
The more we give in the more they want. It is time to sit them down like the spoiled children they are and give them the spanking they so richly deserve.