U.S. vetoes UN resolution condeming Israel

[I think not]

If the best you can come up with is chastising me for my views and opinions, that says more about your failed understanding of the world than it says anything about me.

Next time you presume I get dictated from the likes of neo-conservatives, you will be on the receiving end of a not so politically correct post. Keep your opinions to what you think you know about world politics, and your assumptions about me at the door.

 

[MikeyDB]

The fact is that America although unwilling to accept the lions share of responsibility for creating the problem of Israeli-Palestinian difficulties....for trading with Iran when America regarded Iran as its enemy...for supplying technology to Iraq when America was cozied-up-to by Saddam Hussein that the entire history of the United States from immediately after the Spanish American war is little more than interventionism taken to a ridiculous extreme in the name of well take your pick...Manifest Destiny or the Monroe Doctrine...

Your notion of the simplest answer applicable to the situations in Iraq and Afghanistan is the idea that America has the right to do whatever the hell it pleases where ever it pleases based on its phoney mouthing of being a nation of laws....what a joke!

Your constitution is a model for any nation, unfortunately it's a constitution left vulnerable to the greed and obssessions of a great number of people like yourself...

People unable or unprepared to live by the standards and philosophy that contributed to its writing.

And by the way, if instead of sitting here in CAN CON valiantly attempting to besmirch my character for stating the truth is the spirit behind the first ammendment than maybe I should re-examine that constitution....

 

[MikeyDB]

Just read your post about keeping the topic general...

why don't you do the same huh??

 

[#juan]

You know ITN, I didn't lie to Americans about trading missiles with Iran, I didn't lie to Americans about illegal espionage at the Watergate hotel, I didn't lie regarding anything I' ve written and that you can't admit that America has been led down the garden path by successive American administrations suggests that your sense of Occams razor and understanding of cause-effect is at least as handicapped as what you accuse me of exercising.

Good post MikeyDB

And you didn't mention all the WMD in Iraq, or Bush's "mission accomplished" BS, or Abu Grab'em, or Guantanamo bay.....etc ......

 

[Curiosity]

MikeyDB

I prefer to read other sources than the one you have offered Mikey.....

Here is a link from the archives of CSIS - if you have time and any desire to read some facts on Iran....

http://www.csis.org/media/csis/congress/ts980506cordesman.pdf

Regarding your remarks about me personally - I will not begin an argument againstyour mistaken accusations as that is exactly what I was posting in my original message. I cannot rely on personalized charges against people or the U.S. or whichever nation du jour is under fire here.

I have never suggested Canada "ignore" the U.S. - but I have on many occasions suggested Canada would be better off if they became more independent of the United States.

Translations involving personal opinion can become personal opinion only rather than reality. It is the point I was trying to make.

People throw posts in here as if they have heard the word from god's mouth - when in fact they are doing no more than throwing more fuel to inflammatory fires with which they hold court on a regular basis.

I think that is not in the best interest of learning about anything except how uninformed some people wish to be .... even if they are way off target.

I know the topic wasn't Iran here but Israel which comes under fire every time the word is printed out, combined with additional rhetorical bash at the U.S. But as you brought up Iran....thought you might find some interest in the article.

 

[MikeyDB]

Sure I understand Curiosity...

Canada should be more independent of the United States and although I can't stand and didn't like Chretien I give him full marks for not buying into the "Let's invade Iraq" frenzy so popular with Americans.
I quite agree, Canada should be independent enough to tell America that it is obligated to pay for the devastation of Iraq and Afghanistan without the blood of Canadian soldiers being involved.

Israel has conducted war on all of its neighbors (and yes they have suicide bombed and launched missiles as well...) but how is handing over arms and bundles of cash to Israel any way to bring solution to the problem?

If America wants to arm the Contras and arm the mujahadein and arms the forces of Suharto and several bloody dictatorships around the world....How does this contribute to a peace among nations?

 

[Curiosity]

MikeyDB

Well I tried - perhaps when you in a more receptive frame of mind?

 

[MikeyDB]

Receptive to what Curiosity?

Receptive to an enthusiasm for re-writing history to place the United States above and beyond culpabilty for prolonging the hostilities in Israel and the ME in general?

Receptive to ignoring the history of American governments in facilitating aggression and war while profitting at the expense of others all over the world???

Or receptive to the notion that only the United States ought to enjoy the right to do whatever the hell it feels exclusively....

If the government of the United States stops interfering all over the world and claiming the moral high ground amid the slaughter...then yes I'd be more receptive to a great many more ideas coming from America and Americans, but the fact of the matter is that the United States has used its political and economic influences (not to mention its military)backing bloody regimes and dictatorships all over the world.....

The conflict between Israel and everyone else in the ME isn't resolved by the United States throwing its political and fiscal power behind Israel...

If that had a hope of working it would be reasonable to find evidence over the past fifty years that it has...

No evidence supporting that contention appears available Curiosity and there is a great deal of evidence supporting just the opposite in fact.

 

[CDNBear]

CDNbear

I’m not going to play this game with you. You seem to feel you need to personalize commentary and your contributions suggest you’re beyond getting over yourself….about anything….

You’ve stated that you believe that the deaths of Canadian servicemen in Afghanistan is appropriate. You’re entitled to your opinion just remember that other people are entitled to their opinion as well.

The war in Afghanistan isn’t about the altruism of “freedom” and “democracy” for the people of Afghanistan. It was predicated on the convenient excuse of finding that al-Qa'ida was granted permission by the Taliban to conduct training exercises in Afghanistan.


The fact that he mujahadeen were armed and organized against an attempt by Russia to secure a gas pipeline ‘right-of-way’ through Afghanistan by the United States doesn’t seem to come into play in your consideration of why Afghanistan is the festering boil that it is….

Warlords took those arms and became petty empire-builders and had to necessarily oppress all freedoms in Afghanistan to ensure that their opium trade and criminality could continue. Afghanistan is a primitive nation that was used by the United States as a pawn in interdicting the advance of Russian petroleum interests.

Canadians are fighting and dying in an econo-imperialist war perpetrated by the petroleum cartels of the United States in their efforts to secure dominance in the world petroleum marketplace….PERIOD.

America hasn’t invaded or attacked China or Russia or North Korea where there have been human rights and civil rights abuses for decades. The reason is because the United States is willing to invade Iraq on a pretext of lies and exaggeration…and because it could get away with it. It has involved Canada (there’s no escaping the influence of American foreign policy on any country never mind Canada…despite that Curiosity thinks that Canada should just ignore the U.S…. {yeah right} and like the good puppies we are, we fall into line with this pack of lies.

Canada shouldn’t be in Afghanistan and the world community should try George Bush, Donald Rumsfeld and others in a court for international crimes. The United States had no reason (facts not let’s pretends…) for invading Iraq. The United States has done more to destabilize Afghanistan through the CIA involvement with Pakistan and the Taliban than any other nation on earth.

The reason why there’s anti-Americanism around the world is because that reputation is justly deserved.

I’m happy to be a Canadian and believe that we can find other ways to bring balance to the world than killing innocent people half a world away. Al qaida and Osam bin Laden are terrorists indeed….

They are criminals and should be treated as criminals…i.e. brought before a court of justice and tried for their actions. If the situation is that all the trillions of dollars finding their way into the pockets of defense contractors in Britain and the United States were instead spent on locating and bringing these people to justice, innocent men women and children wouldn’t be sacrificed. Bring the perpetrators of this carnage to justice absolutely but don’t let’s all pretend that killing a bunch of people who’ve come to believe that they’re expendable in the name of western “prosperity” is either right or even called-for.

That’s not the way the United States has ever ‘played-the-game’ however.

From Indonesia to Chile from East Timor to Nicaragua, the United States has always played the altruism game to hide its preparedness to take by force if necessary the political and economic control of anyone weaker than themselves. If setting up Suharto was an act of kindness….

If illegal deals with the Contras was to promote peace in the world….

If missile attacks without a declaration of war as OK for America, by what right does America come up with the nonsense that they’re interested in peace?

Canada is rube to the American war-mentality and it’s a good sign that more Americans are waking up to the fact that the Bush Clinton, Reagan and Nixon policies that have seen America grow more hated in the world are the source of this hatred and have decided to think before voting.

Canada shouldn’t be in Afghanistan, and the sorry song about “well we agree as a member of NATO to support our “friends” is counterfeit reasoning from a bankrupt morality.

Because your “friend” decides to kill thousands upon thousands of people around the world in the name of its own greed and sense of entitlement…and is just as willing to tell you to stick your “free-trade-agreement” where the sun doesn’t shine….doesn’t inspire a great deal of faith in the “good” intentions of a war-minded folk like Americans.

Of course you won't play this game with me. Because you will lose. You can not back up your accusations as i stated so retract them. You made it quite clear to me to stop accusing you of plagerism without proof, so I did. i would have also retracted my accusations had you asked. But you did not.

So once again, prove what you accused me of in both this post or the other or retract them.

 

[MikeyDB]

What's your problem BARE?

I've read your crying and whining over someone calling you names.....neocon fascist whathave-you..

From one zit to another....

Get a life.

 

[CDNBear]

What's your problem BARE?

I've read your crying and whining over someone calling you names.....neocon fascist whathave-you..

From one zit to another....

Get a life.

Now you all cry and whine when someone calls you names. But when the tables are turned we "neo cons" should get over it. How interesting. Childish, but interesting.

I have a life, I've had more then one person should. Yet here I am trying to get you to hold yourself to the same standards you hold me. Put up or shut up.

 

[Curiosity]

MikeyDB is having a bad day folks....

Here Mikey....a little picture might help....

 

[CDNBear]

This would work better I think.

Here mickey, you dropped something.

 

[MikeyDB]

Yes it really is infantile what passes for comment on this board.

We have Curiosity telling us we (Canadians) should be more independent from the influences of the U.S. and yet when we examine the record of America over the past fifty years what do we find?

We find the United States up to its eybrows in Indochina, in the Middle East, in South America in Central America...you name it!

Then we have CDNbare availing himself of every opportunity to garner sympathy from the crowd....

Man it sure would be nice to meet an adult on this board!

 

[CDNBear]

Yes it really is infantile what passes for comment on this board.

We have Curiosity telling us we (Canadians) should be more independent from the influences of the U.S. and yet when we examine the record of America over the past fifty years what do we find?

We find the United States up to its eybrows in Indochina, in the Middle East, in South America in Central America...you name it!

Then we have CDNbare availing himself of every opportunity to garner sympathy from the crowd....

Man it sure would be nice to meet an adult on this board!

Well hey who was the one stomping to the door crying the whole way...

"I'm leaving now,,,really, I'm leaving,,,Ok this time I'm really gunna do it!,,,Ok this time I'm serious,,,all you nazis can kiss my ass!" That was you.

Did you drop it again?

Here ya go...

 

[CDNBear]

Here mickey, this is a direct quote from you in your Hemmingway thread...

"Dexter I don't mind being corrected if my facts are wrong"

I corrected your error in facts, and yet you still play childish games?

You are a typical person at best, in the fact that you are not and will always refuse to account for your actions.

All I asked you to do, is show documentation, to prove I support Bush or the war in Iraq.

Can you?

For once, be an adult and answer the question instead of just beating around the bush(no pun intended).

I doubt you can. That's my prediction.

 

[MikeyDB]

Well Bare If I've made the allegation that you supported the Bush invasion of Iraq, I don't recall and will accept your premise that it did occur.... and in light of some of your contributions that I have read, then yes I will apologize.

Do I still believe you do be a fascist at heart yes. Do I believe you to be in favor of sending Canadians to die in Afghanistan for the wrong reasons....the same reasons that the neo-conservatives promulgate...yes.

If my appology for calling you a Bu****e is acceptable then swell and if it isn't then....swell.

 

[CDNBear]

Well Bare If I've made the allegation that you supported the Bush invasion of Iraq, I don't recall and will accept your premise that it did occur.... and in light of some of your contributions that I have read, then yes I will apologize.

Do I still believe you do be a fascist at heart yes. Do I believe you to be in favor of sending Canadians to die in Afghanistan for the wrong reasons....the same reasons that the neo-conservatives promulgate...yes.

If my appology for calling you a Bu****e is acceptable then swell and if it isn't then....swell.

Well in part Thank you, you have moved up a couple notches in my eyes.

But I can assure you I do not support sending not just Canadian Soldiers, but some very close brothers/friends of mine to Afghanistan to die for oil.

I do support the premiss and preception of why my brothers/friends are volunteering for duty in Afghanistan. They see the mission as rebuilding project that will ensure a safer country and by way of such a safer world. Are these thoughts lofty? Yes. But that does not negate their sentiment, nor my willingness to support them with out wavering and till death. 1, because of oath and the brotherhood there of, 2 because I hope that the ends will justify the means. If that sounds stupid, i apologise, but i have hope and faith in them to accomplish where all have failed, as our Military has done time and time again.

I don't want to fight with you. All I ask is that you not accuse me of things I have not said or done. I satnd guilty of so manythings, that being charged with things I have not done seems irratating,lol.

Once again I accept your apology and I offer mine to you for my more then lack luster attacks.

 

[MikeyDB]

I have no trouble acknowledging my mistakes. I'm confident that over the past sixty years I may have made more than a couple.....

What I wouldn't do is suggest that anyone's opinion be dismissed until they've satisfied my criteria for holding an opinion....like for instance (I'm paraphrasing here...) "If you haven't been to the ME and participated in XY or Z...then you don't have a right to hold an opinion..."

You see that's how fascists operate.

Anyone who's afraid of citing the historical record and is prepared to squelch dialogue and intercourse on particular events or situations isn't behaving like someone who prizes freedom of speech or appreciates cultural political or any other form of diversity....

The United States is absolutely in the wrong when it comes to militarizing Afghanistan and supporting the right-wing regime in Jerusalem. It is informative that frequently when the issue of Israel and Palestine is raised in the context of discussing geopolitics that the very first parry is often "anti-semitism" and I applaud your insight in not falling into that particular trap.

I'll warn you right here bare that If you're not careful you'll find yourself discussing issues with me in a rational and positive manner....

 

[gopher]

http://www.middleeastnews.com/unresolutionslist.html

A List of United Nations Resolutions ​

​

​

A List of UN SECURITY COUNCIL RESOLUTIONS against Israel A list of UN Resolutions against "Israel"

• 1955-1992:
• * Resolution 106: " . . . 'condemns' Israel for Gaza raid".
• * Resolution 111: " . . . 'condemns' Israel for raid on Syria that killed fifty-six people".
• * Resolution 127: " . . . 'recommends' Israel suspends it's 'no-man's zone' in Jerusalem".
• * Resolution 162: " . . . 'urges' Israel to comply with UN decisions".
• * Resolution 171: " . . . determines flagrant violations' by Israel in its attack on Syria".
• * Resolution 228: " . . . 'censures' Israel for its attack on Samu in the West Bank, then under Jordanian control".
• * Resolution 237: " . . . 'urges' Israel to allow return of new 1967 Palestinian refugees".
• * Resolution 248: " . . . 'condemns' Israel for its massive attack on Karameh in Jordan".
• * Resolution 250: " . . . 'calls' on Israel to refrain from holding military parade in Jerusalem".
• * Resolution 251: " . . . 'deeply deplores' Israeli military parade in Jerusalem in defiance of Resolution 250".
• * Resolution 252: " . . . 'declares invalid' Israel's acts to unify Jerusalem as Jewish capital".
• * Resolution 256: " . . . 'condemns' Israeli raids on Jordan as 'flagrant violation".
• * Resolution 259: " . . . 'deplores' Israel's refusal to accept UN mission to probe occupation".
• * Resolution 262: " . . . 'condemns' Israel for attack on Beirut airport".
• * Resolution 265: " . . . 'condemns' Israel for air attacks for Salt in Jordan".
• * Resolution 267: " . . . 'censures' Israel for administrative acts to change the status of Jerusalem".
• *Resolution 270: " . . . 'condemns' Israel for air attacks on villages in southern Lebanon".
• * Resolution 271: " . . . 'condemns' Israel's failure to obey UN resolutions on Jerusalem".
• * Resolution 279: " . . . 'demands' withdrawal of Israeli forces from Lebanon".
• * Resolution 280: " . . . 'condemns' Israeli's attacks against Lebanon".
• * Resolution 285: " . . . 'demands' immediate Israeli withdrawal form Lebanon".
• * Resolution 298: " . . . 'deplores' Israel's changing of the status of Jerusalem".
• * Resolution 313: " . . . 'demands' that Israel stop attacks against Lebanon".
• * Resolution 316: " . . . 'condemns' Israel for repeated attacks on Lebanon".
• * Resolution 317: " . . . 'deplores' Israel's refusal to release Arabs abducted in Lebanon".
• * Resolution 332: " . . . 'condemns' Israel's repeated attacks against Lebanon".
• * Resolution 337: " . . . 'condemns' Israel for violating Lebanon's sovereignty".
• * Resolution 347: " . . . 'condemns' Israeli attacks on Lebanon".
• * Resolution 425: " . . . 'calls' on Israel to withdraw its forces from Lebanon".
• * Resolution 427: " . . . 'calls' on Israel to complete its withdrawal from Lebanon.
• * Resolution 444: " . . . 'deplores' Israel's lack of cooperation with UN peacekeeping forces".
• * Resolution 446: " . . . 'determines' that Israeli settlements are a 'serious
• obstruction' to peace and calls on Israel to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention".
• * Resolution 450: " . . . 'calls' on Israel to stop attacking Lebanon".
• * Resolution 452: " . . . 'calls' on Israel to cease building settlements in occupied territories".
• * Resolution 465: " . . . 'deplores' Israel's settlements and asks all member
• states not to assist Israel's settlements program".
• * Resolution 467: " . . . 'strongly deplores' Israel's military intervention in Lebanon".
• * Resolution 468: " . . . 'calls' on Israel to rescind illegal expulsions of
• two Palestinian mayors and a judge and to facilitate their return".
• * Resolution 469: " . . . 'strongly deplores' Israel's failure to observe the
• council's order not to deport Palestinians".
• * Resolution 471: " . . . 'expresses deep concern' at Israel's failure to abide
• by the Fourth Geneva Convention".
• * Resolution 476: " . . . 'reiterates' that Israel's claim to Jerusalem are 'null and void'".
• * Resolution 478: " . . . 'censures (Israel) in the strongest terms' for its
• claim to Jerusalem in its 'Basic Law'".
• * Resolution 484: " . . . 'declares it imperative' that Israel re-admit two deported
• Palestinian mayors".
• * Resolution 487: " . . . 'strongly condemns' Israel for its attack on Iraq's
• nuclear facility".
• * Resolution 497: " . . . 'decides' that Israel's annexation of Syria's Golan
• Heights is 'null and void' and demands that Israel rescinds its decision forthwith".
• * Resolution 498: " . . . 'calls' on Israel to withdraw from Lebanon".
• * Resolution 501: " . . . 'calls' on Israel to stop attacks against Lebanon and withdraw its troops".
• * Resolution 509: " . . . 'demands' that Israel withdraw its forces forthwith and unconditionally from Lebanon".
• * Resolution 515: " . . . 'demands' that Israel lift its siege of Beirut and
• allow food supplies to be brought in".
• * Resolution 517: " . . . 'censures' Israel for failing to obey UN resolutions
• and demands that Israel withdraw its forces from Lebanon".
• * Resolution 518: " . . . 'demands' that Israel cooperate fully with UN forces in Lebanon".
• * Resolution 520: " . . . 'condemns' Israel's attack into West Beirut".
• * Resolution 573: " . . . 'condemns' Israel 'vigorously' for bombing Tunisia
• in attack on PLO headquarters.
• * Resolution 587: " . . . 'takes note' of previous calls on Israel to withdraw
• its forces from Lebanon and urges all parties to withdraw".
• * Resolution 592: " . . . 'strongly deplores' the killing of Palestinian students
• at Bir Zeit University by Israeli troops".
• * Resolution 605: " . . . 'strongly deplores' Israel's policies and practices
• denying the human rights of Palestinians.
• * Resolution 607: " . . . 'calls' on Israel not to deport Palestinians and strongly
• requests it to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention.
• * Resolution 608: " . . . 'deeply regrets' that Israel has defied the United Nations and deported Palestinian civilians".
• * Resolution 636: " . . . 'deeply regrets' Israeli deportation of Palestinian civilians.
• * Resolution 641: " . . . 'deplores' Israel's continuing deportation of Palestinians.
• * Resolution 672: " . . . 'condemns' Israel for violence against Palestinians
• at the Haram al-Sharif/Temple Mount.
• * Resolution 673: " . . . 'deplores' Israel's refusal to cooperate with the United
• Nations.
• * Resolution 681: " . . . 'deplores' Israel's resumption of the deportation of
• Palestinians.
• * Resolution 694: " . . . 'deplores' Israel's deportation of Palestinians and
• calls on it to ensure their safe and immediate return.
• * Resolution 726: " . . . 'strongly condemns' Israel's deportation of Palestinians.
• * Resolution 799: ". . . 'strongly condemns' Israel's deportation of 413 Palestinians
• and calls for their immediate return.

but, somehow, Israel is ever so innocent {sic} and everyone else is guilty