I've seen people die without death bed conversions. People are different. We don't all need or want religious faith.
I think the Pope steers people away from the church.
I think the Pope steers people away from the church.
Pope scolds Canada on gay marriage, abortion
- Thread starter Gonzo
- Start date
I'm telling you now that I have done so more than most and I am not afraid of his path or any other.
I don't remember saying that a god was impossible. We don't know everything about the universe, so obviously we can't know with absolute certainty that there is no god. However, we can look at the evidence (or lack there of), and come to a reasoned conclusion.
Unless of course you don't believe in the theory of doxastic voluntarism. Or that, if there is a god, that she wouldn't be able to tell the difference between real belief and deceptive belief. And given that, that she wouldn't punish more the person trying to deceive her than the person using their 'god given' gift of free will to come to a reasoned conclusion about her existance. Right?
Well I am against the norm so I expect to get blasted, but as usual, I don;t care...
A> God (or monkeys if you believe in evolution) did not create two men nor two women...that is just wrong, nasty and totally going to end pro-creation if we keep allowing it...If you want to be gay, be gay all day long, but don't expect the same rights as a MARRIED couple as it was intended...a MAN and a WOMAN!!
B> Who the hell are you to decide whether a child should be born or die...are you God, ( or master monkey)?? A life is a life, and if you don't want a child, keep your legs shut, if you are raped, give it up for adoption to the MILLIONS of people who LONG to have a child but can't!! NO EXCUSES..... MURDER is not the answer. I guess the next move is AFTER you have the child and get fed up in about five years, it will be ok to shoot or stab the child to death because you "don't" want them anymore??
Imagine if YOUR parents decided to MURDER you..may have been a good thing in some of your cases....
A> God (or monkeys if you believe in evolution) did not create two men nor two women...that is just wrong, nasty and totally going to end pro-creation if we keep allowing it...If you want to be gay, be gay all day long, but don't expect the same rights as a MARRIED couple as it was intended...a MAN and a WOMAN!!
B> Who the hell are you to decide whether a child should be born or die...are you God, ( or master monkey)?? A life is a life, and if you don't want a child, keep your legs shut, if you are raped, give it up for adoption to the MILLIONS of people who LONG to have a child but can't!! NO EXCUSES..... MURDER is not the answer. I guess the next move is AFTER you have the child and get fed up in about five years, it will be ok to shoot or stab the child to death because you "don't" want them anymore??
Imagine if YOUR parents decided to MURDER you..may have been a good thing in some of your cases....
Why? Because you feel that way? Why do you get to make that decision for everyone else?
If anything is going to end procreation it'll be what is currently causing the trend towards smaller and smaller families. Homosexuals make up a tiny portion of our population, certainly not enough to halt procreation entirely, or, frankly, to any significant extent.
I'm not even going to get into the choice element of homosexuality. As for the same rights... Again, why do you get to make that decision? What business is it of yours? Why do you care what other people do with their lives? Why do you feel that you deserve special treatment just because you were born a certain way, and these people were born a different way?If you want to be gay, be gay all day long, but don't expect the same rights as a MARRIED couple as it was intended...a MAN and a WOMAN!!
Who are you to decide what a person does with their own body?
Are you?
Do you support a person's ability to take antibiotics to fight an infection? A fetus is nothing more than a parasite until it is born.
Strawman.I guess the next move is AFTER you have the child and get fed up in about five years, it will be ok to shoot or stab the child to death because you "don't" want them anymore??
Hypocrite.Imagine if YOUR parents decided to MURDER you..may have been a good thing in some of your cases....
Do you have anything to add that is substansive instead of this empty rhetoric?
FIrst of all, get your facts STRAIGHT..a FETUS has a beating heart, fully functioning organs, fingers, toes, and a brain, probably bigger than yours, so therefore, they are HUMANS, not "parasites"
Just because you can't see and hold it doesn't mean that it is any less human, BOY I hope for our sake you don't have children or "parasites" as you call them. If you don't, PLEASE KEEP IT THAT WAY. We don't need anymore screwed up, immoral people in the world! ANd there is no "empty Rhetoric" coming from me buddy, just plan facts based on the Creator. GOd's word is what it is regarding homosexuality and MURDER, take or leave it but don't try to change it to suit your own selfish and pathetic needs. ANd why am I a hypocrite....duh dummy, do you not read??? I AM NOT GAY, and I would never kill a CHILD that is growing inside of me to suit my own selfishness. Ahhhh..but you are right, people do have CHOICES....the choice to believe God exists or not and the choice to lay down and have sex or not. And when you do, you must deal with the consequences OF IT!!We cringe when we hear stories of sick perverts raping and killing children and want to stone them to death, why should it be any different when someone has a LIVING fetus SNATCHED out of their body, sounds like two different types of murder to me....If one form of murder is illegal, so should the other one be.... I say that anyone who has an abortion be PERMANENTLY STERILIZED by law so they never have to worry about it again.........Making excuses to kill a baby...whew!! That's just plain sickening and you should be ashamed of yourself.....
Is it able to survive without the direct intervention of its mother's body? No. Parasite.FIrst of all, get your facts STRAIGHT..a FETUS has a beating heart, fully functioning organs, fingers, toes, and a brain, probably bigger than yours, so therefore, they are HUMANS, not "parasites"
What compassion. Didn't your god teach you not to judge people?BOY I hope for our sake you don't have children or "parasites" as you call them. If you don't, PLEASE KEEP IT THAT WAY. We don't need anymore screwed up, immoral people in the world!
They are the words that you believe your god said. They aren't the words of any god I know.ANd there is no "empty Rhetoric" coming from me buddy, just plan facts based on the Creator. GOd's word is what it is regarding homosexuality and MURDER, take or leave it but don't try to change it to suit your own selfish and pathetic needs.
No, but you seem to have no problem wishing ill will upon those whom you deem to be less than adequate. Doesn't sound like you are following the teachings of your god very well.
And I am completely willing to deal with it. Are you willing to deal with the consequences if you chose the wrong god? There are, after all, thousands of them. Many who take a less favourable view of disbelief than the Abrahamic deity.
The woman is simply denying the embryo/fetus a place in her body. If you choose to see that as murder, that is your decision. I for one don't feel comfortable dictating what people can and can't do with their own bodies. Down that road lies forced sterilization (which you don't seem to have any problem with), the government choosing sexual partners, government informing people what is and isn't appropriate activities, etc. No thanks.
You'll have to forgive me if I don't agree. Do you have anything that isn't a simple appeal to emotions? Or perhaps some comments not chalk full of personal insults? You are an adult, right? You can have a mature discussion without behaving like a four year old?
FIrst of all, get your facts STRAIGHT..a FETUS has a beating heart, fully functioning organs, fingers, toes, and a brain, probably bigger than yours, so therefore, they are HUMANS, not "parasites"
Trust me, a fetus does not have fully functionning organs, including their brains. If they did, I wouldn't have a job (I work neonatal ICU). That's the main reason a fetus can't survive outside of the womb before about 24 weeks, and even then they require a lot of external support and are not guaranteed a good outcome. Really, I don't see how that matters anyways. An adult with organ failure doesn't stop being a person because their organs don't work.
Catholics have not always had the same views on abortion and there is nothing in the Bible that directly forbids abortion or says a fetus is the same as a person. Ensoulment was once believed to occur at 6weeks of pregnancy for a male and 3 months for a female. I am perfectly content leaving it to individuals to form their own opinions on abortion.
And that's all most of us ask. There are too many people trying to dictate how they think everyone else should behave. Which would be okay if they didn't try and make laws about it. Stay out of my life and I'll stay out of yours.
I agree with that completely. I've always said if you're against abortion, don't have one. End of discussion as far as I'm concerned. I've participated in second and third trimestre terminations and still feel extremely protective of those families. None of them were doing it because they just decided they didn't want to be pregnant at 7 months gestation, so it upsets me when people judge women who have had abortions. You really don't know what you'd do in their situation and what is right for one family isn't necessarily the right thing for another.
Well there it is in a nutshell....you're a godless person so anything goes with you and your kind....not surprising at all
.....I just would love to be there on Judgement Day to see you say all of these wonderful things to the Creator and try to pathetically argue these same hairball ideas with HIm and tell Him that it is my "right" to have an "opinion" .....right?? Maybe I don't understand Christianity well, but I thought it was kind of un-Christian to take pleasure in others' suffering regardless of how vehemently you disagree with their opinions.
Do u have a calendar date on that ?I just would love to be there on Judgement Day to see you say all of these wonderful things to the Creator and try to pathetically argue these same hairball ideas with HIm and tell Him that it is my "right" to have an "opinion" .....right??
No. Thats not it at all. The difference between me and you, aside from your mean spirited attitude, is that I don't think that I have any right to tell someone what they do with their body. You obviously feel that everyone should behave in a manner suited to your belief system. Lucky for you that you live in a country that grants you the freedom to feel that way.Well there it is in a nutshell....you're a godless person so anything goes with you and your kind....not surprising at all
Unfortunately its people like you that are causing that freedom to fall apart.
I, on the other hand, wish you goodwill. And hope that your god doesn't reject your love for her because of the petty way you treat people with views differing from your's.I just would love to be there on Judgement Day to see you say all of these wonderful things to the Creator and try to pathetically argue these same hairball ideas with HIm and tell Him that it is my "right" to have an "opinion" .....right??
This is the unfortunate side effect of the echo chamber that is organized religion.*
* I don't think that there is anything inherently wrong with faith or belief in god(s), just organized religion.
Religion at least saves some
I'll be the first to recognize the importance religion plays in the life of the west despite my own pitiful record in attendance and contribution. Without religion, an already crude and ruthless society would be moreso. I'm aware of the failings of faith. But I'm also aware they're miniscule compared to what would happen if faith weren't there. So it pays to give some respect to what church leaders think and do.
Myself? If I was in a position of power and I was confident God did not exist and that religion was a sham, I would be the worst tyrant possible. Why not? I'd realize that life belongs to those bold enough to take it. That you have one lifetime and a few decades in it to leave your mark. I'd depopulate the globe lickety-split. That's what it needs. That's what it would get. And I'd do it ruthlessly and without the bomb.
I always get a kick out of those who insist religion isn't important. That we could create a great society without it. I guess they don't figure on people like me. There are a lot of us out there. Religion despite its faults keeps more folks safe than any other measure on the planet.
The burden of respect and civility. Of being human. Keeps you alive for another day.
I'll be the first to recognize the importance religion plays in the life of the west despite my own pitiful record in attendance and contribution. Without religion, an already crude and ruthless society would be moreso. I'm aware of the failings of faith. But I'm also aware they're miniscule compared to what would happen if faith weren't there. So it pays to give some respect to what church leaders think and do.
Myself? If I was in a position of power and I was confident God did not exist and that religion was a sham, I would be the worst tyrant possible. Why not? I'd realize that life belongs to those bold enough to take it. That you have one lifetime and a few decades in it to leave your mark. I'd depopulate the globe lickety-split. That's what it needs. That's what it would get. And I'd do it ruthlessly and without the bomb.
I always get a kick out of those who insist religion isn't important. That we could create a great society without it. I guess they don't figure on people like me. There are a lot of us out there. Religion despite its faults keeps more folks safe than any other measure on the planet.
The burden of respect and civility. Of being human. Keeps you alive for another day.
Interesting... Of course, there are people who murder because of religion too, so I don't know if that's the best measure of the value of religion.
Tamarin,
Your justification for religion is that if it weren't there people would have nothing to fear and would be complete pricks to everyone around them? Is that why you don't steal? Because you'd go to jail? Oh, did you forget about that part? The justice system, that secular entity that stops people like yourself from taking advantage of peoples' otherwise good nature.
I think that you forget, there are plenty of evil religious people that do all kinds of evil things. Has Goodwin's Law been modified to include references to 9/11 yet?
Your justification for religion is that if it weren't there people would have nothing to fear and would be complete pricks to everyone around them? Is that why you don't steal? Because you'd go to jail? Oh, did you forget about that part? The justice system, that secular entity that stops people like yourself from taking advantage of peoples' otherwise good nature.
I think that you forget, there are plenty of evil religious people that do all kinds of evil things. Has Goodwin's Law been modified to include references to 9/11 yet?
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