Subterfuge

Motar

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Jun 18, 2013
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There are probably some who would consider that applying these writings to future events is a form of deception or "subterfuge' if you like that word. Depends on your perspective of the historical aspect of these writings.

Futurist view, LL. Some combine this view with others envisioning multiple fulfillments leading to a final ultimate fulfillment in the closing events of history. As I am studying through the book of Revelation currently, I am appreciating multiple fulfillments.

There is also literal and symbolic language in the apocalypse to consider.
 

Ludlow

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Futurist view, LL. Some combine this view with others envisioning multiple fulfillments leading to a final ultimate fulfillment in the closing events of history. As I am studying through the book of Revelation currently, I am appreciating multiple fulfillments.

There is also literal and symbolic language in the apocalypse to consider.
what would you consider to be literal?
 

MHz

Time Out
Mar 16, 2007
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Futurist view, LL. Some combine this view with others envisioning multiple fulfillments leading to a final ultimate fulfillment in the closing events of history. As I am studying through the book of Revelation currently, I am appreciating multiple fulfillments.

There is also literal and symbolic language in the apocalypse to consider.
Then you have it wrong. The seals are prophecies just like the metal statue in Da:2, the trumps are the literal fulfillment of the same prophecies and the 7 vials is how God uses Christ to take back the whole earth from Satan and the other fallen angels that are the kings for the 5th and 6th trump.

The 'image' from Re:13 needs other terms that are used to describe it from the prophecies before we can determine that it is referencing the throne that Satan has to have on holy ground in Jerusalem before he can declare himself to be God.

Da:11:31:
And arms shall stand on his part,
and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength,
and shall take away the daily sacrifice,
and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.
 

Ludlow

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Then you have it wrong. The seals are prophecies just like the metal statue in Da:2, the trumps are the literal fulfillment of the same prophecies and the 7 vials is how God uses Christ to take back the whole earth from Satan and the other fallen angels that are the kings for the 5th and 6th trump.

The 'image' from Re:13 needs other terms that are used to describe it from the prophecies before we can determine that it is referencing the throne that Satan has to have on holy ground in Jerusalem before he can declare himself to be God.

Da:11:31:
And arms shall stand on his part,
and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength,
and shall take away the daily sacrifice,
and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.
Yes, just like all the other fanatics you feel as though you've got all the answers . As a self appointed scholar you've convinced yourself that there is in no way the possibility that anyone could know much as you are the barometer from which to go by. When I read your garbage it's all I can do to keep from laughing at your complete lunacy. Take your meds.
 

Motar

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Jun 18, 2013
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Then you have it wrong.

Not sure if your objection is an intellectual one, MHz, but I would like to recommend a book to you.

Albrecht, K. (2006). Social Intelligence: The New Science of Success. San Francisco, CA: Jossey-Bass.

The wisdom of this message based upon the Multiple Intelligences concept of Harvard professor Howard Gardner is apparent in the first few pages. Enjoy : )
 

MHz

Time Out
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We would make more headway if we looked at pages about the Brass and then the Iron kingdoms from Daniel:2 and where they fit into the historical records. That would leave us with a limited number of references which apply to events yet to happen.

Yes, just like all the other fanatics you feel as though you've got all the answers .
You certainly don't, if you can even come up with answer let alone any intelligent questions. Trust me when I say there isn't anything from the Bible that you could promote that would threaten my 'unique' view. The only thing that makes it that way is looking at the book as if it was written by God via 40 different writers. Put on your 21st century thinking cap and look at Genesis and you come away with a version that is different yet it is figurative as far as what it is covering. That you can't see it that way even after I walk you through most of the relevant verses leaves me thing you are a bit of a dunce as far as being able to read something and then give a summation of what you just read. You should be scared about me covering the minute details because you version would really start to look quite wrong from all angles. If I have any emotion about you it is sorrow.
I've also been reading and talking about the book with others (as a discussion rather than what trolls like you bring to the table) so what I promote today has been taken apart by others and the errors fixed) Feel free to show how the doctrine is in error, you don't even have a starting point so you do this sort of **** and pat yourself on the back as if you were the superior one when it comes to the Scriptures.

As a self appointed scholar you've convinced yourself that there is in no way the possibility that anyone could know much as you are the barometer from which to go by.
Like I mentioned before I have had some knowledgeable people take an in-depth look (above you pay grade btw) and it ended up I could find more errors in their version than they did in mine. You are clueless as far as knowledge goes, you should accept that there are others that know more about the Book than you do. Of course in my case with you that would turn out to be in more areas than just the Bible and suicide would be preferred to that happening. lol

When I read your garbage it's all I can do to keep from laughing at your complete lunacy.
At least I can write something on the topic, your best posts are a mirror of this one. Trolling at best, one of the worst examples of how to do it also. You can't dominate the topic so you try and show domination in another area and all you do is end up betting bitch slapped, . . . again. The change is going to be on your end rather than mine, I thought you should know that.

Take your meds.
I wake up being able to think, you try it all day long as fail miserably at each attempt to show you are a dominate person. You have to know what you are talking about first and clearly I know more than you about the God of the Bible. Get over it as it will never change in your lifetime. I've accepted it and until you start covering the Book that isn't about to change. Who's laughing hardest now??
 

Ludlow

Hall of Fame Member
Jun 7, 2014
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We would make more headway if we looked at pages about the Brass and then the Iron kingdoms from Daniel:2 and where they fit into the historical records. That would leave us with a limited number of references which apply to events yet to happen.


You certainly don't, if you can even come up with answer let alone any intelligent questions. Trust me when I say there isn't anything from the Bible that you could promote that would threaten my 'unique' view. The only thing that makes it that way is looking at the book as if it was written by God via 40 different writers. Put on your 21st century thinking cap and look at Genesis and you come away with a version that is different yet it is figurative as far as what it is covering. That you can't see it that way even after I walk you through most of the relevant verses leaves me thing you are a bit of a dunce as far as being able to read something and then give a summation of what you just read. You should be scared about me covering the minute details because you version would really start to look quite wrong from all angles. If I have any emotion about you it is sorrow.
I've also been reading and talking about the book with others (as a discussion rather than what trolls like you bring to the table) so what I promote today has been taken apart by others and the errors fixed) Feel free to show how the doctrine is in error, you don't even have a starting point so you do this sort of **** and pat yourself on the back as if you were the superior one when it comes to the Scriptures.


Like I mentioned before I have had some knowledgeable people take an in-depth look (above you pay grade btw) and it ended up I could find more errors in their version than they did in mine. You are clueless as far as knowledge goes, you should accept that there are others that know more about the Book than you do. Of course in my case with you that would turn out to be in more areas than just the Bible and suicide would be preferred to that happening. lol


At least I can write something on the topic, your best posts are a mirror of this one. Trolling at best, one of the worst examples of how to do it also. You can't dominate the topic so you try and show domination in another area and all you do is end up betting bitch slapped, . . . again. The change is going to be on your end rather than mine, I thought you should know that.


I wake up being able to think, you try it all day long as fail miserably at each attempt to show you are a dominate person. You have to know what you are talking about first and clearly I know more than you about the God of the Bible. Get over it as it will never change in your lifetime. I've accepted it and until you start covering the Book that isn't about to change. Who's laughing hardest now??
Naw your a newbie zealot. Parroting shyt you read from other nuts and passing those ideas off as your own. :). Sad thing is those fellers made money on the fairy tales they wrote. You copy and paste their shyt on a forum and then spend the rest of the time defending your lunacy to all the others who call your pathetic bluff. My suggestion ? An adjustment on the medication and possibly some bio feedback and a few Ernest P Worell movies.
 

Motar

Council Member
Jun 18, 2013
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You mean like the one who left her first love ?

The church in Ephesus was a literal congregation of believers, LL. Paul served as missionary and John served as their pastor.

We would make more headway if we looked at pages about the Brass and then the Iron kingdoms from Daniel:2 and where they fit into the historical records. That would leave us with a limited number of references which apply to events yet to happen.
You certainly don't, if you can even come up with answer let alone any intelligent questions.

There's more to understanding and intelligence than IQ, MHz. Give that book I recommended a look: "A simple definition of social intelligence is the ability to get along well with others and to get them to cooperate with you." Albrecht, K. Social Intelligence: The New Science of Success.
 
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Motar

Council Member
Jun 18, 2013
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I'm asking you Motar. Who is this first love that the church at Ephesus left? It may very well be something, instead of someone but like you, I'm not the expert so I'm asking your opinion .

Soul Mate

There is much to come between
An errant lady and her Lord.
But still remains an ardent dream
Of souls united and restored.

Oh the bliss of newborn love
Resting in his matchless grace,
Longing for a word, a touch
Staring spellbound at his face.

Has there ever been so fair
A prince of peace upon this soil?
Such a treasure, priceless rare
Is the lover of my soul.

Were I now to know him near
I would all contented be.
He dispels my every fear
And bears me to eternity.
 
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Ludlow

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Jun 7, 2014
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Soul Mate

There is much to come between
An errant lady and her Lord.
But still remains an ardent dream
Of souls united and restored.

Oh the bliss of newborn love
Resting in his matchless grace.
Longing for a word, a touch
Staring spellbound at his face.

Has there ever been so fair
A prince of peace upon this soil?
Such a treasure, priceless rare
Is the lover of my soul.

Were I now to know him near
I would all contented be.
He dispels my every fear
And bears me to eternity.
That' a beautiful Poem Motar. I won't push the question any further.
 

Ludlow

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Jun 7, 2014
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Composed a few years ago in a period of great personal crisis, LL. Inspired, I was. (I sound like Yoda : )
My best friend in life , my Aunt Frances was also a poet. She loved Jesus and we talked with each other and wrote each other letters for more than forty years until she passed away some years back.
 

Motar

Council Member
Jun 18, 2013
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My best friend in life , my Aunt Frances was also a poet. She loved Jesus and we talked with each other and wrote each other letters for more than forty years until she passed away some years back.

Beautiful testimony, LL. And you? How do you feel about Jesus?