Mosque near Ground Zero

Mosque near Ground Zero

darkbeaver

Republican

#241

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Just the Facts

You can say what you will but America is still one of, if not THE, most tolerant societies in the world.

That statement of yours is entirely incorrect and the millions of dead untolerated killed in American sponsered wars and the millions more murdered by economic actions attest to the lunacy of your written word.

captain morgan

Bloc Québécois

#242

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonington

It's a free country. If they want to purchase the property they can do just that. Kinda sorta exactly like this group did.

Not that easy... Kinda sorta the same way that you can buy a piece of property beside a children's school but not be able to open up a strip club.

It's kinda sorta not appropriate

Avro

No Party Affiliation

#243

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Just the Facts

Dude, seriously, stop being so obtuse, it's really getting boring. What I'm saying is what I wrote. Stop making **** up and adding "so are you saying" to it. You wanna know what I'm saying, read what I said. It's really quite elementary, I'm not trying to explain quantum physics here.

McVeigh is dead. Where's Bin Laden?

More obtuse stupidity.

Here's some real facts for you:

Table 1 - Hate Crime Statistics, 2006

and here it is conveniently graphed and charted:
--

Michelle Malkin?

Wow, real creditable.

Just the Facts

Free Thinker

#244

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Avro

Michelle Malkin?

Wow, real creditable.

Ummm...no....FBI Dept. of Justice. Duh. lol

Curiosity

#245

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

I have no logical explanation and would not attempt to discuss it except for the original site which sits unfinished....

The hole left by the WTC Towers - why can't that area be cleared and built and finished to give resolution to the memory of the lost and then what comes after
will take its place in a normal fashion to create a more beautiful site than what
exists now.

The rebuilding or whatever is planned for the actual site should be worked on first before any other buildings take precedence.

Ooops I should have Google'd first....--
I hope this is still going on.

Are any of the other sites finished as Memorials?

Just the Facts

Free Thinker

#246

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Avro

Trying to get fact boy to make a comment on the hole left by the terroists....he slunk away from it.

lol you talking about your rant about how the twin towers haven't been replaced yet....I'm still trying to stop laughing about that, and now that it seems you're serious I'm laughing even harder.

I gave it exactly the attention it deserved, and now, considerably more than it deserved. lol still laughing....towers haven't been replaced....oh, the relevance....lol.

Avro

No Party Affiliation

#247

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Just the Facts

lol you talking about your rant about how the twin towers haven't been replaced yet....I'm still trying to stop laughing about that, and now that it seems you're serious I'm laughing even harder.

I gave it exactly the attention it deserved, and now, considerably more than it deserved. lol still laughing....towers haven't been replaced....oh, the relevance....lol.

Why haven't they?

Simple question.

Further more why is a little mosque more important than an empty hole?

Last edited by Ron in Regina; May 30th, 2010 at 10:34 PM..Reason: Trolling edited out

Avro

No Party Affiliation

#248

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Curiosity

I have no logical explanation and would not attempt to discuss it except for the original site which sits unfinished....

The hole left by the WTC Towers - why can't that area be cleared and built and finished to give resolution to the memory of the lost and then what comes after
will take its place in a normal fashion to create a more beautiful site than what
exists now.

The rebuilding or whatever is planned for the actual site should be worked on first before any other buildings take precedence.

Ooops I should have Google'd first....--
I hope this is still going on.

Are any of the other sites finished as Memorials?

Perhaps 20 years form now something will be done, the Muslims in Dubai built something magnificent in 6 years.

Instead bigots are worried about a little old mosque.

....and we still allow Catholics to run schools.

captain morgan

Bloc Québécois

#249

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Avro

Not even close to the same thing.

Perhaps you can explain why a mosque a few blocks away is more important than building a new trade center.

I have no idea what you're going on about.

Last edited by Ron in Regina; May 30th, 2010 at 10:35 PM..Reason: Trolling edited out of Quote

Tonington

#250

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by captain morgan

Not that easy... Kinda sorta the same way that you can buy a piece of property beside a children's school but not be able to open up a strip club.

It's kinda sorta not appropriate

So you're comparing a place of worship and a community center to a strip club.

Last edited by Ron in Regina; May 30th, 2010 at 10:35 PM..Reason: Trolling edited out.

captain morgan

Bloc Québécois

#251

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonington

So you're comparing a place of worship and a community center to a strip club.

...

No. I'm kinda sorta saying that providing an insultingly oversimplified ideal akin to "it's a free country - I can do what ever I want" is as useless as a whistle on a plow.

Last edited by Ron in Regina; May 30th, 2010 at 10:36 PM..Reason: Trolling edited out of Quote.

Avro

No Party Affiliation

#252

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by captain morgan

No. I'm kinda sorta saying that providing an insultingly oversimplified ideal akin to "it's a free country - I can do what ever I want" is as useless as a whistle on a plow.

So should Catholics be running schools or building churches near schools considering they are mostly pedophiles?

Tonington

#253

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by captain morgan

No. I'm kinda sorta saying that providing an insultingly oversimplified ideal akin to "it's a free country - I can do what ever I want" is as useless as a whistle on a plow.

If a group wants to commemorate the tragedy, and build bridges as this group has done and they wish to do so by building a community center including a place of worship, then they can attempt to purchase some land to do so.

It is a free country. There is no issue with the zoning in that area.

Your comment about a strip club is moronic, because it's completely irrelevant to what is going on here.

Last edited by Ron in Regina; May 30th, 2010 at 10:37 PM..Reason: Trolling edited out

captain morgan

Bloc Québécois

#254

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Avro

So should Catholics be running schools or building churches near schools considering they are mostly pedophiles?

Got a link to your facts?

Avro

No Party Affiliation

#255

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by captain morgan

Got a link to your facts?

Well most Muslims are terroists aren't they?

So given that, if a mosque can't be built near a giant hole why should churches be near schools and why let Catholics run them?

Same thing right?

captain morgan

Bloc Québécois

#256

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonington

If a group wants to commemorate the tragedy, and build bridges as this group has done and they wish to do so by building a community center including a place of worship, then they can attempt to purchase some land to do so.

So what... This is about appropriateness... Think it's a good idea for the German government to open a museum of political achievement across from the Holocaust Museum in the name of peace and understanding?

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonington

It is a free country.

Free except for the laws, bylaws, zoning and referendums.

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonington

Your comment about a strip club is moronic, because it's completely irrelevant to what is going on here.

Yeah, it's entirely irrelevant - I suppose that explains why your only rebuttal is a wishy-washy comment about "it's a free country". If you had a clue you'd know otherwise, but ofcourse, it's easier to go into attack mode rather than actually understand.

Last edited by Ron in Regina; May 30th, 2010 at 10:39 PM..Reason: Quote of Trolling & reciprocal Trolling edited out.

captain morgan

Bloc Québécois

#257

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Avro

Well most Muslims are terroists aren't they?

I never said anything remotely close to that... I generally leave that style of ignorance to bigots like yourself.

Avro

No Party Affiliation

#258

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by captain morgan

I never said anything remotely close to that... I generally leave that style of ignorance to bigots like yourself.

I was being facetious.

Okay, so is it appropriate to have Catholics run schools and build churches near schools?

Tonington

#259

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by captain morgan

So what... This is about appropriateness... Think it's a good idea for the German government to open a museum of political achievement across from the Holocaust Museum in the name of peace and understanding?

I have no problem with Muslims building a community center a few blocks away from the site of the World Trade center. What's your problem anyways?

Quote:

Free except for the laws, bylaws, zoning and referendums.

So which ones is this Mosque in contradiction of?

None? Oh that's right. You have no point.

Quote:

Yeah, it's entirely irrelevant - I suppose that explains why your only rebuttal is a wishy-washy comment about "it's a free country". If you had a clue you'd know otherwise, but ofcourse, it's easier to go into attack mode rather than actually understand.

Oh I understand completely. You're a bigot, and you're grasping at straws for why some group shouldn't be allowed to build a community center, because it offends your sensibilities.

I'm of the opinion that sweeping issues aside because they are painful doesn't resolve anything. Maybe you're not interested in resolving differences.

Carry on.

Last edited by Ron in Regina; May 30th, 2010 at 11:09 PM..Reason: Quote of Trolling & reciprocal Trolling edited out.

Machjo

#260

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Here's how I see it (and it would seem a few specific persons in this thread continue to avoid answering the question directly):

1. Why would anyone be offended at an Islamic centre being built near Ground Zero unless he blamed all Muslims for the acts of certain individual persons which Muslims would generally consider to be contrary to Islamic laws?

2. Considering that the only reason to be offended at the proposal is anti-Muslim prejudice, then why ought the local NYC Muslim community which itself lost members on 911 care about the opinions of the prejudiced?

These two fundamental questions have been asked again and again in this thread with never a direct, clear, and unambiguous answer on the part of a few specific posters here.

Until they answer these specific question straightforwardly, the discussion will continue to go round and round and round.

gerryh

#261

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

bigots prefer obfuscation to direct answers.

captain morgan

Bloc Québécois

#262

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Avro

I was being facetious.

Okay, so is it appropriate to have Catholics run schools and build churches near schools?

The determination of appropriateness should be the decision of those in the community where it is proposed... If it's in my community, then I would contribute my opinion.

gerryh

#263

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by captain morgan

The determination of appropriateness should be the decision of those in the community where it is proposed... If it's in my community, then I would contribute my opinion.

ahhhhhhh...so since you don't live in Manhaten, your opinion does not matter. Plus since the majority of New Yorkers, including the city council, have no problem with it then this whole thread is moot.

Machjo

#264

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

^
|
Ditto.

Machjo

#265

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Moot from the first post. City Council had already overwhelmingly approved of the construction of the centre, not to mention that the request for permission was more of a formality and expression of respect for City Council and the community seeing that bylaws already permitted them to build the mosque without City Council's approval to begin with.

So essentially, the first post of the thread was already expressing offense at something that was really none of his business to begin with.

Tonington

#266

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Definitely moot from the first post. I'd say founding the basis of algebra ranks higher as a muslim achievement. I'm sure Jack the flapper would love us to believe that Muslims rank this as a great achievement, and some probably do. But not the ones building the community center. They're working against ignorance such as Jack's. That's a big battle. They have their work cut out for them.

captain morgan

Bloc Québécois

#267

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonington

Your analogies suck. They go from stupid to worse than stupid.

Awww... Did my analogy not fit in with your preconceived view point?.. Did it offer a bit of a conundrum similar to what the mosque is about?

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonington

I have no problem with Muslims building a community center a few blocks away from the site of the World Trade center. What's your problem anyways?

Personally, I could care less, then again, unlike yourself, I haven't internalized this specific issue to the point of hurling insults to any that disagree.

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonington

So which ones is this Mosque in contradiction of?

Don't know and don't care. The comment I made illustrates that the idealistic rebuttal of "it's a free country" is meaningless.

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonington

Oh I understand completely. You're a bigot, and you're grasping at straws for why some group shouldn't be allowed to build a community center, because it offends your sensibilities.

Yeah, that must be it.... There couldn't possibly be another perspective, certainly not if YOU say so.

Quote: Originally Posted by Tonington

I'm of the opinion that sweeping issues aside because they are painful doesn't resolve anything. Maybe you're not interested in resolving differences.

That question should be put to New Yorkers first and Americans second... What you and I think is way down the list.

Quote: Originally Posted by gerryh

ahhhhhhh...so since you don't live in Manhaten, your opinion does not matter. Plus since the majority of New Yorkers, including the city council, have no problem with it then this whole thread is moot.

Agreed.. Who can we speak to in deleting this thread?

Last edited by Ron in Regina; May 30th, 2010 at 10:44 PM..Reason: Edited for the same reasons the above posts where edited.

Ron in Regina

Free Thinker

#268

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

I've been trying to wade through this Thread, when not pulled away to
deal with other things, or swimming through the reciprocal Trolling, &
I think this Thread comes down to two basic camps of thought.

1) Those that see this Mosque as a place of worship and a memorial
for a segment of those that were lost in the 911 attack.

2) Those that see this Mosque as a political statement to be able to
claim that there is now a Mosque built on the rubble of the Twin Towers.

Am I up to speed so far? Is this where the last 14 pages has arrived at
when the Trolling is removed and the debate it left standing on its own?

The above points assume the Mosque will be built...am I correct so far?

Machjo

#269

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

Quote: Originally Posted by Ron in Regina

I've been trying to wade through this Thread, when not pulled away to
deal with other things, or swimming through the reciprocal Trolling, &
I think this Thread comes down to two basic camps of thought.

1) Those that see this Mosque as a place of worship and a memorial
for a segment of those that were lost in the 911 attack.

2) Those that see this Mosque as a political statement to be able to
claim that there is not a Mosque built on the rubble of the Twin Towers.

Am I up to speed so far? Is this where the last 14 pages has arrived at
when the Trolling is removed and the debate it left standing on its own?

Pretty much.

Ron in Regina

Free Thinker

#270

Re: Mosque near Ground Zero

May 30th, 2010

OK...I just wanted to make sure I had a grasp on things here. Now there
have been well over a hundred posts made in this Thread alone in less
than the last 24hrs. If I had to wade through them, & just remove the posts
that included personal attacks (& quotes of the same), & Trolling (& quotes
of the same), and off-topic shyte (& quotes of the same), there wouldn't be
a whole lot left in this Thread.

Do I close this & edited out the above, so that I can stay ahead of things?
Or will folks just chill out and go forward from this point without intervention?

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