Regressive Antidote: Getting past "Oh"

hermite

Not so newbie now
Nov 21, 2007
467
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950 Snowupthearse Rd. Can
[Source: http://www.regressiveantidote.net/Articles/Getting_Past_Oh.html ]

"Why Americans Misunderestimate the Depravity of the President They Hate

Most Americans have long ago now reached two conclusions about their government. First, that George W. Bush is an incompetent president with, additionally, a temperament ill-suited to the job. And second, that his grand project – the invasion of Iraq – was a major mistake.
Both these conclusions are absolutely incorrect. But only by omission. They are, in fact, quite accurate as far as they go – it’s just that they don’t go nearly far enough.
Bush is incompetent and Iraq is likely the greatest foreign policy blunder in two-plus centuries of American history. But to say that – and particularly to say that alone – does not truly do justice to either disaster, Bush or his war. The truth about this president and his motives for war are far, far uglier than the words ‘incompetence’ or ‘mistake’ imply.
But getting to that requires of American citizens several attributes which have been, shall we say, in something less than great abundance of late. It requires historical background, factual knowledge, a motivation to understand, and the wisdom that results from the combination of all of these. And it requires a substantial degree of courage to go where the facts lead.
Most Americans lack a large degree of each of these, let alone the requisite combination of all of them. As such, this much reviled president is perceived as ‘merely’ incompetent and error-prone. Would that he and his actions were actually so benign. It would be a much better world. In fact, they are far more deeply pernicious than Americans are willing to let themselves understand. One way to appreciate the extent of American ‘ostriching’ is by doing a bit of comparative analysis.
It is a curious and telling fact that Europeans figured out Bush far before his own constituents did. There are two reasons for that. One is that they were less frightened than we were. Not that they’re necessarily braver than Americans in general, but they’ve had more experience of terrorism in the past, and we were just hit badly – they weren’t. Americans were therefore a fearful people in 2002 and 2003, looking for leadership and reassurance. But looking, as it would turn out, in all the wrong places.
The other thing is that Europeans have a more mature politics than Americans do – let’s just come right out and say it. You can see it in their attitudes toward sexuality, drugs and crime. You can see it in their wholesale rejection of nationalism and religion, humanity’s worst mythologies and twin curses, wherever they arise. You can see it in their rejection of the juvenile selfishness that characterizes the American style of raw capitalism and obsessive consumption. And you can see it, especially, in their foreign policies and attitudes toward war. In large part because they so heavily and repeatedly paid the consequences of their own prior immaturity about war, their understanding and approach to it today are far more advanced than that of Americans.
It is not that Europeans are cowards or unreliable allies, as American neoconservatives love to paint them whenever the folks on the other side of the Pond get in the way of the raw exercise of American imperial power. They are neither. What they are, rather, is sober. They understand that war is sometimes a necessary resort, but that it must always be the very last resort, and only ever contemplated when the alternative is considerably more horrible (which is to say, given the horror of war, very rarely indeed). They know this all to well, because they spent centuries living it up close and personal. As someone once remarked, “Europeans know that anything could happen there, because everything has happened there”. They have learned through the hard experiences of Flanders and Stalingrad and Normandy and Dresden and Dachau the stakes involved when the public is cavalier or even less than vigilant about holding back the dogs of war. Americans have some sense of this after the twin disasters of Vietnam and Iraq, but both of these were fought elsewhere. And, however ugly they were, by far and away the vast majority of the dying was done by brown people living on other shores. Not pleasant, to be sure, but not catastrophic at home. We have never experienced Berlin, 1945.
snip.....

And so it is that Americans continue through their day, oblivious – by self design – to the magnitude of the evil that has been visited upon them. But, ironically, this is not remedy at all. Obliviousness to victimization by government is no excuse, especially in a democracy, and especially when other innocent people are much greater victims, to the tune of about a million in number.
To a very large extent, those who would ignore the crimes committed in their name – crimes they have the power to stop – become criminals themselves."
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
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Canadians have the same ignorance, not to the same degree. Public education and a strangle hold on media by the bankers has controled the thought processess of generations.We scramble through life chasing the big lottery win in a vain attempt to join those on the hill in the big houses.
It's a suckers bet though, we find out to late in life how it all works, if at all. We will never see change unless we remove the elite from power once and for all. They live beyond democracy and beyond the law, beyond the commons in ivory towers insulated from thier acts immune and secure beyond moral considerations and they have for hundreds of years feeding on the blood and misery of humanity.
 

Praxius

Mass'Debater
Dec 18, 2007
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Halifax, NS & Melbourne, VIC
I knew Bush was going to screw us all the moment after I heard he won the election... sorry, rigged. I could tell just by looking at his beedy evil little grimlin face. Once he invaded Afghanistan, I knew that within a year he'd invade Iraq... At first I was joking... then to know he actually did and the crap he started, plus the BS with Iran.... I don't think Canadians are anywhere near the same level as citizens of the US when it comes to knowlege and understanding of the world around us.

Our media is controlled by the banks? I switch between US, Canadian and British new daily and neither are as biased and distorted as US news and media. I haven't bought a lottery ticket in my life, nor do I have any visions of winning a lottery, and most of the people I know don't fall under the above simplicities.... perhaps you are living in the wrong neck of the country :p
 

MikeyDB

House Member
Jun 9, 2006
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Hey Curio ....hope yer well and had a happy festive season...

You've done your best to support the nation of your choice and despite the lies and hypocrisy continue to cement your alegiances to the people of your choice. Don't ever let the truth impact your sense of justice.
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
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I knew Bush was going to screw us all the moment after I heard he won the election... sorry, rigged. I could tell just by looking at his beedy evil little grimlin face. Once he invaded Afghanistan, I knew that within a year he'd invade Iraq... At first I was joking... then to know he actually did and the crap he started, plus the BS with Iran.... I don't think Canadians are anywhere near the same level as citizens of the US when it comes to knowlege and understanding of the world around us.

Our media is controlled by the banks? I switch between US, Canadian and British new daily and neither are as biased and distorted as US news and media. I haven't bought a lottery ticket in my life, nor do I have any visions of winning a lottery, and most of the people I know don't fall under the above simplicities.... perhaps you are living in the wrong neck of the country :p

I know exactly what you're saying P because for many years I lived with the same comforting thoughts. But look where we are with respact to Afghanistan or Hati and where our money is invested through the mecahanism of the stock markets and the push to complete NAU and the SPP agreements. Granted what you say is true but it's is not enough to hold on to our soveringty. We will be a harder sell for sure, but only by a slim margin of points. If what you believe is in fact true how is it we have elected what in reality is a fascist party, how is it that we are self declared best friends and staunch allies of the great Satan and how can we disconnect from that military and capitlist regime without suffering the same fate as all those who have dared try before. Our elite have sold us down the river over two decades ago. The only difference between thier delivered wisdom and ours is sophistication.We are a slightly different symtom of the same disease.
 

gerryh

Time Out
Nov 21, 2004
25,756
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Hermite

How fitting your avatar - a peapod - who could have guessed?

You will fit in here beautifully.


Can't dispute the article though I see. Nothing new, just more empty rhetoric, veiled and not so veiled insults, the hallmark of a ditzy post.
 

hermite

Not so newbie now
Nov 21, 2007
467
13
18
950 Snowupthearse Rd. Can
Thanks guys, Curious and DB :3some:

Prax, I live very much in the right neck of the woods (well, it's left really) but I feel deep concerns for those who live south of me. I know there are good people down there and I feel great sorrow for what will become of them. So I always enjoy finding good articles, like the one I posted, that keep trying to wake people up to what's going on, fruitless though it may be.

I'm curious about your name. I frequent another forum wherein dwells a Mr. Prax. Just a coincidence?

And now Curious, I am curious. Did you come to Canada from somewhere else?

Happy and hopeful 2008 to all.
 
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MikeyDB

House Member
Jun 9, 2006
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The embrace of a willing self-delusion...

The politics of belief.


Jews and perhaps others require special ministrations take place to assure them that their food meets the requirements of their beliefs….and everyone pays.

Moslems move to nations to enjoy the “freedoms” they didn’t have in their own nations and then “require” that Canadians abandon their traditions when it comes to the uniform of their federal police…demand (and receive) special consideration that allows their children to carry “ceremonial” knives…demand (and receive) money to further the interests of their particular community….

Americans boldly emblazon “In God we Trust” on their currency and particular factions of “christians” manipulate government and the judiciary to further the agenda of the “god-belief” and then have the temerity to whine about separation of church and state while con-men Evangelists harvest the lucre of the weak-minded millions who “believe” they can buy their way into “heaven”…..Evangelists who like the Saudi and various other Islamic religious sects enjoy the sins of liquor women and drugs despite the tenets of their “belief”….

The “dumber than posts” greater majority of Canadians and Americans get all goose-pimply and fuzzy warm believing that their self-delusion of “democracy and “freedom” actually means anything to the “god-folk” who rip them off and manipulate their governments and judiciary having convinced these morons that religious tolerance and “freedom” really means handing over the rights of the many to the pleasure of the few….

The common theme throughout this noise is of course a concentration on “money” and wealth for these few while native North Americans live in a desperation and enjoy a quality of life similar in all major aspects to that enjoyed by the worlds poorest third world nations….

Now everyone make sure you pray for each other tonight and don’t forget to praise the faith of the Romans that has already cost you millions in settling claims for everything from reservation schools and hiding pedophiles in your communities to providing the prejudice of homosexuality to factionalize communities and nations.

Baaa Baaa Baaa

As it’s always been, the wealthy use religion and prejudice based on religion to divide the world and amass fortunes that will be spent on mind control and generating divisiveness. It’s not about Heaven or “The Golden Rule” or “Salvation” or any of the fluff that passes for excuses why one should “believe” it’s about the money…. Always has been and always will be…
 

Curiosity

Senate Member
Jul 30, 2005
7,326
138
63
California
Not to worry Hermite as others have warned you about my sarcasm...

Peapod was a former moderator who banned me twice - needless to say I reacted to your avatar...

Hopefully you are a new more refreshing pod....welcome...
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
201
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We must pray; Oh dog please give me more money so I can live like the beautiful people on the hill, and dog let me share my good fortune with my household staff and gardeners and dog please teach my children the beautiful wholesome way of St Friedman and St Rockerfeller
and dog please help mummy and daddy recover from thier cosmetic surgery tight and right
ehmen
 

Praxius

Mass'Debater
Dec 18, 2007
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Halifax, NS & Melbourne, VIC
If what you believe is in fact true how is it we have elected what in reality is a fascist party, how is it that we are self declared best friends and staunch allies of the great Satan and how can we disconnect from that military and capitlist regime without suffering the same fate as all those who have dared try before. Our elite have sold us down the river over two decades ago. The only difference between thier delivered wisdom and ours is sophistication.We are a slightly different symtom of the same disease.

We've become acustomed to dealing with the US, from the Avro Arrow incident and ever since, we've been cutting back our military our country, and putting it all into the hands of the US.

Now just recently we're begining to pick back up to being the country we perhaps once were back after WWI... but basically, it's not Canada who needs the US, but the US who needs Canada now.

We have the most fresh water in the world, we're the #1 uranium exporters of the world, 2nd largest oil rich country next to Saudi Arabia, our military exports have apparently sky rocketed over the last year or so..... cut a good % of oil and uranium to the US and that not only cripples their own country and economy, but also cripples their military might.

Quite honestly, I wouldn't be suprised if the US attempted to invade Canada eventually.... everything they need for their country... to feed their selfish hunger and greed, is just north of them.

Hell, I'd be like Harper too and start building up our military as he is..... the US doesn't have allies or friends in the world, they deal with countries which benifit them at the time and nothing more..... pure capitalism and personal greed right to the core.

The difference between the US and Canada, is that most Canadians still understand what principles are.... we didn't just jump into a war expecting to be heros to people who never wanted us there to begin with.... we're not the ones who decided to invade two countries which were not directly involved in their attacks on 9/11...... We joined in Afghanistan at the time, because there was some level of justification and as Jean mentioned, if we didn't join in with NATO, then we'd be currently stuck in Iraq as we speak.... you know, cuz of our principles and not abandoning our "Allies" even though we'd never get the same respect in return if the roles were reversed.

Our countries are in some aspects similar to each other.... but one thing I notice in Canada compared to the US, is that we have a bit more control over our poloticians, where we can pressure the minorities to call for an election and try and make them jump hoops for us.... they screw up, then we go for another election.

What happens in the US? Similar to here in Canada, where they vote in the guy who will cut them the best deal.... but in the US, once they're elected, if they screw up or lie, or do something they promised they wouldn't do, what can be done? Apparently nothing, since this crap has been going on for 8 years almost now. The mentality in the US is "Well you guys elected him in, so now we gotta trust in what he does and follow along." ~ And then they all bitch and moan about how things have gotten so crappy and wait until the next election, hoping for change and hoping for the best.

Oh and don't forget their mentality of being an image of unity and standing together.... if they openly called for an impeachment of Bush while he was still in power during wartime, that'd be a show of weakness and they can't have that.... they'd rather not look like they were wrong at all, rather to admit to a mistake, show some humanity and express that the have enough brains to learn from past mistakes. But no... It's never Bush's fault, it's someone else's.... it's not the people's fault, it's Bush's fault.... it's never anybody's fault except someone else's.... not one damn person these days know how to accept responsibility and learn from their actions and mistakes.... it's just always easier to pass the buck and never learn anything.... the True American Way.

Yet wern't the last two elections rigged anyways? So how can they still hope for change in something that doesn't work?? Yeah those electronic voting system things wern't obviously rigged and flawed from day one.

You know what's really funny? Bush illegally and against their own constitution, invaded two sovrign nations. Bush lies to the public, lies to his allies, lies to the entire world and when proven wrong.... oh well it wasn't his fault, and we gotta stay the course, and fight the evil doers, blah blah blah..... then he goes through all of 2007 shooting his mouth off about Iran and nukes, and starting WWIII.... then he's proven wrong again, yet he's not wrong, nor will he ever fathom to change his stance..... STAY THE COURSE don't forget.

..... Oh, but Clinton gets a blow job and get's impeached?

WTF? I don't understand the mentality down in the US as a whole, and I can't see any major relations to their culture compared to our own.
 
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Praxius

Mass'Debater
Dec 18, 2007
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Prax, I live very much in the right neck of the woods (well, it's left really) but I feel deep concerns for those who live south of me. I know there are good people down there and I feel great sorrow for what will become of them. So I always enjoy finding good articles, like the one I posted, that keep trying to wake people up to what's going on, fruitless though it may be.

See I used to as well, but no matter how many times you tell them it's in their constitutional right to revolt, impeach this jerk and set their country straight, they ain't got the gusto anymore.... it's nobody else's fault but their own that they are in the position they are currently in, much as it would be our own if we were in the same situation..... and if we were, I'd have revolted years ago.

I'm curious about your name. I frequent another forum wherein dwells a Mr. Prax. Just a coincidence?

Um.... I mainly just use Praxius wherever I go. if it's not Praxius, then it's Cpt-Praxius for online gaming :p

And now Curious, I am curious. Did you come to Canada from somewhere else?

Nope, just Canada, born and raised, and the mouth to go with it as well :p
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
201
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Americans have been victimized from day one, two hundred years of national abuse produced
cold hearted insensitive ignorant offspring, the problem as I see it is we have to save them first, they have the buttons. That flag has to go though, it belongs with the swastika, nobody will believe our good intentions standing under it and delivering sermons about values and morals. And my flag, well it's just a colourful rag, burn it to. The Bronze Beaver will someday fly over our nations capital, where ever we decide to build it.
 

MikeyDB

House Member
Jun 9, 2006
4,612
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Darkbeaver

Yeah long live the "mouth".......?

The same 'mouth' that spreads hatred for Jews and Blacks? The same 'mouth' that practices prejudice and promulgates lies and misdirection in the name of "political agenda" and "political correctness"...?

How long is it before the words of a skinhead or a racist become the straw that breaks the camels back and is turned into action?

I'm sure lot's of folk reading my comments have reached the conclusion that I'm an anti-Semite or an "Anti-American", and what gives them this erroneous conclusion is the words I use to represent my thinking on various issues....

In fact, the vast majority of what I contribute here at CC is simply a reflection of the dynamics that are taking place around me in the world. Americans have demonstrated they aren't in control of their government, their religious beliefs or much of anything else that doesn't involve a gun or war and bloodshed... If you think that's being Anti-American then perhaps you're right, but what comes first the chicken or the egg? When a Yank thumbs his nose at the rest of the world and trashes their previously "noble" sentiments regarding freedom democracy and their "constitution", is it the observer who has responsibility or is it the people involved in shovelling hypocrisy and bull all over the scene?

When I list the practices of "religious belief" that promulgate hatred and divisiveness is it me who owes the world an explanation or is it simply the unvarnished truth about the sentiments of those who'd take what isn't theirs and attempt to control and manipulate the rest of us...?

What's been missing in every discussion here at CC for the past year is acknowledgement of the truth by the many people who hold such firm beliefs...perhaps even convictions about their perspectives on everything from the mafia practices of every government in North America to the platform for hatred and prejudice that is the foundation of "beliefs" that are behind what's left of the world after the wealthy elitists have raped the world for their exclusive benefit.

Sorry Beave, it's just the truth and it's really amazing to me how fragile the psyche of many of these people appear to be when confronted with the truth of their own perversity.
 

Praxius

Mass'Debater
Dec 18, 2007
10,609
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Halifax, NS & Melbourne, VIC
Americans have been victimized from day one, two hundred years of national abuse produced cold hearted insensitive ignorant offspring,
So you're saying they victimized themselves?

.....the problem as I see it is we have to save them first, they have the buttons.

Something like how the US "Saved Iraq?"

The problem is the majority, if not all, will want to be "Saved" ~ But at the same time, we all know what occurs when one country decides to step in and change another country to what they see fit.

And trying to do this to the US, with a crazy president like Bush in power, would be about as logical as attempting to invade Pakistan to go get those taliban who are hiding.... unless there is a very effective way of disabling nuclear weapons prior to impact or detonation, this would be more or less a suicide mission, regardless if they'd face a nuclear fallout from attacking north.

That flag has to go though, it belongs with the swastika, nobody will believe our good intentions standing under it and delivering sermons about values and morals. And my flag, well it's just a colourful rag, burn it to. The Bronze Beaver will someday fly over our nations capital, where ever we decide to build it.

Naw, if we wanted to deliver messages, values, morals and expressing a new way forward for everybody, we need to use this flag: