Gay Rights And The Bible


Liberalman
#1
LEVITICUS 20


13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an cabomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

Gay rights have come a long way since the bible days and since the majority of people donít go to church the bible has become meaningless which means law definitions are changing to satisfy society needs.

The bible just doesnít apply today because God is refusing to conform to society.

God believes that society must conform to the ways of the Bible because it is a recipe for peace and tranquility.

Over the years the bible has been translated to different languages and then it was modernized to reflect and answer todayís issues.

Through the modernization of the bible, meanings have changed, because of the change, gay rights have been able to flourish and with the destruction of the church gay rights will be the norm.

Today most people that live in poverty or are involved in a war where they might die soon seem to be the most religious.

People that live in rural areas are more religious because the church is usually the centre of the community and far away from the cities influences.

Once poverty and wars are eliminated and rural communities stop relying on the church then God will lose the ultimate power over society.

Since I believe in God and church I will be the last hold out and society will end up in chains and become slaves to their governments in the gay twenty-first century.
Last edited by Liberalman; Jul 7th, 2009 at 05:49 AM..Reason: ....
 
JLM
#2
Quote: Originally Posted by LiberalmanView Post

LEVITICUS 20


13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an cabomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

Gay rights have come a long way since the bible days and since the majority of people donít go to church the bible has become meaningless which means law definitions are changing to satisfy society needs.

The bible just doesnít apply today because God is refusing to conform to society.

God believes that society must conform to the ways of the Bible because it is a recipe for peace and tranquility.

Over the years the bible has been translated to different languages and then it was modernized to reflect and answer todayís issues.

Through the modernization of the bible, meanings have changed, because of the change, gay rights have been able to flourish and with the destruction of the church gay rights will be the norm.

Today most people that live in poverty or are involved in a war where they might die soon seem to be the most religious.

People that live in rural areas are more religious because the church is usually the centre of the community and far away from the cities influences.

Once poverty and wars are eliminated and rural communities stop relying on the church then God will lose the ultimate power over society.

Since I believe in God and church I will be the last hold out and society will end up in chains and become slaves to their governments in the gay twenty-first century.

One problem I see is there are contradictions in the Bible -"If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an cabomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them"- could be countered with "hate the sin but love the sinner"- also a passage from the Bible
 
Liberalman
#3
If you love the sinner then you accept the sin
 
JLM
#4
Quote: Originally Posted by LiberalmanView Post

If you love the sinner then you accept the sin

I disagree- We are probably all sinners to some degree- are we all to be rejected? Maybe the Bible should be regarded as a rule book for people in one area of the world at the time it was written. If you want to regard the Bible as, as valid today as it was two thousand years ago, that flies in complete contradiction of the natural law, that more of less states that we have to ADAPT to fit the environment (and I would take the environment to include physical, social, economic etc.)
 
TenPenny
#5
Perhaps the most ultra conservative right winger to worship Trudeau.
 
MHz
#6
Probably sinners????

When that Law was given many generations lived under it, along with the stated consequences. After the cross the death penalty was removed and replaced by forgiveness through repentance, thought and not deed was also more important in defining who was a sinner. That didn't mean 'that Law' was removed from being an unacceptable within the confines of a certain group. Israel alone was under those guidelines until the cross. Christians and the 12 Tribes are still forbidden some social behaviors.

The passage below is about one form of adultery and the resulting action that should be taken by the Church. This can be also meant to mean any Christian is bound to follow through on the recommendation given. If you allow full membership to those who are knowingly in sin you are also in sin. Any thought that they will be punished and you won't be is a false hope.

1Co:5:9: I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
1Co:5:10: Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.
1Co:5:11:
But now I have written unto you not to keep company,
if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator,
or covetous,
or an idolater,
or a railer,
or a drunkard,
or an extortioner;
with such an one no not to eat.
1Co:5:12:
For what have I to do to judge them also that are without?
do not ye judge them that are within?
1Co:5:13:
But them that are without God judgeth.
Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

Being forbidden to eat (socialize) with a sinner (in this case homesexuals) is not an overly harsh judgment. The previous 10 verses are also about the summary provided by these 3.

Those 'rules' are valid for as long as there is belief in the God of the Holy Bible, it does not matter when it was first made known.
 
Liberalman
#7
MHz

Are you saying that Jesus accepts the man that lies with mankind as with a woman and since man can to this and be saved through Jesus it is not considered a sin in the eyes of God?

So my post is valid
 
lone wolf
#8
The Bible is one of the greatest works of fiction to ever reach a bookstore. Consider, it was part gossip and part legend until parts of it were penned - in several different languages. Then it was translated and revised and modernized - then interpreted by the reader
 
MHz
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by LiberalmanView Post

MHz

Are you saying that Jesus accepts the man that lies with mankind as with a woman and since man can to this and be saved through Jesus it is not considered a sin in the eyes of God?

So my post is valid

If you had read the whole chapter you wouldn't have any questions. If the members of the Church are instructed to withold 'protection' then it is not acceptable behavior. That being said their sin is covered by their death of the flesh so they are not held back from entering into the Kingdom of Heaven. Their path is just a bit more unpleasant.

1Co:5:1:
It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you,
and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles,
that one should have his father's wife.
1Co:5:2:
And ye are puffed up,
and have not rather mourned,
that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you.
1Co:5:3:
For I verily,
as absent in body,
but present in spirit,
have judged already,
as though I were present,
concerning him that hath so done this deed,
1Co:5:4:
In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ,
when ye are gathered together,
and my spirit,
with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,
1Co:5:5:
To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh,
that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

The Bible is one of the greatest works of fiction to ever reach a bookstore. Consider, it was part gossip and part legend until parts of it were penned - in several different languages. Then it was translated and revised and modernized - then interpreted by the reader

I don't have any verses that say disbelief is any worse than adultery. Well that is unless you show disbelief after this is in your face. Rejection at this point would be quite foolish indeed.

Joh:6:39:
And this is the Father's will which hath sent me,
that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing,
but should raise it up again at the last day.
Joh:6:40:
And this is the will of him that sent me,
that every one which seeth the Son,
and believeth on him,
may have everlasting life:
and I will raise him up at the last day.
 
Cliffy
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

The Bible is one of the greatest works of fiction to ever reach a bookstore. Consider, it was part gossip and part legend until parts of it were penned - in several different languages. Then it was translated and revised and modernized - then interpreted by the reader

Notice that it says that the rules apply only to those who believe in the god of the bible. You and I brother are incapable of sin! Doesn't that just warm the cockles of your heart. I think I will just go out and get drunk and laid.
 
lone wolf
#11
Quote: Originally Posted by MHzView Post

I don't have any verses that say disbelief is any worse than adultery. Well that is unless you show disbelief after this is in your face. Rejection at this point would be quite foolish indeed.

Rejection of what? Why don't you tell us what your chosen prose means ... because I'm sure a hundred different people will interpret a hundred different messages....

Beliefs I have. One of them is to think my own thoughts.
 
Unforgiven
#12
Dude, it's only a guideline!
 
Cliffy
#13
Joh:6:40:
And this is the will of him that sent me,
that every one which seeth the Son,
and believeth on him,
may have everlasting life:

Show me a single person living today who "seeth the Son" with his own eyes. What has this got to do with any living person? It doesn't! The book is two thousand years old and was only relevant then. Today it is a bunch of meaningless drivel that the insecure cling to in desperation like drowning people clinging to life preservers.
 
JLM
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by CliffyView Post

Notice that it says that the rules apply only to those who believe in the god of the bible. You and I brother are incapable of sin! Doesn't that just warm the cockles of your heart. I think I will just go out and get drunk and laid.

Now there's a plan, Cliff..................
 
MHz
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

Rejection of what?

This.."The Bible is one of the greatest works of fiction to ever reach a bookstore."
I'm simply saying I hope for your sake that view is not carved in stone.
The how's and why's you arrived at this conclusion (as it stands today) are unimportant. If you die (and you know it) and somebody brings you back from that place (and you know it) I'm not sure holding onto the view you have today is the wisest path to take (at that time).
 
MHz
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by JLMView Post

Now there's a plan, Cliff..................

Not very original though. So is that a table for two in the 2/3's group? LOL

1Co:15:32:
If after the manner of men I have fought with beasts at Ephesus,
what advantageth it me,
if the dead rise not?
let us eat and drink;
for to morrow we die.

Isa:56:10:
His watchmen are blind:
they are all ignorant,
they are all dumb dogs,
they cannot bark;
sleeping,
lying down,
loving to slumber.
Isa:56:11:
Yea,
they are greedy dogs which can never have enough,
and they are shepherds that cannot understand:
they all look to their own way,
every one for his gain,
from his quarter.
Isa:56:12:
Come ye,
say they,
I will fetch wine,
and we will fill ourselves with strong drink;
and to morrow shall be as this day,
and much more abundant.
 
earth_as_one
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by TenPennyView Post

Perhaps the most ultra conservative right winger to worship Trudeau.

 
lone wolf
#18
Quote: Originally Posted by MHzView Post

This.."The Bible is one of the greatest works of fiction to ever reach a bookstore."
I'm simply saying I hope for your sake that view is not carved in stone.
The how's and why's you arrived at this conclusion (as it stands today) are unimportant. If you die (and you know it) and somebody brings you back from that place (and you know it) I'm not sure holding onto the view you have today is the wisest path to take (at that time).

Would that include my Code Blue ... Sudbury Memorial Hospital, Cardiac Care, March 4 2004 ... when I came back BEFORE they zapped me?

Same views then and I woke more calm and relaxed than ever before.
 
AnnaG
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by LiberalmanView Post

If you love the sinner then you accept the sin

Idiot. "Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?" Jesus replied: " 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.' This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.' All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments" (Matthew 22:36-40).- 10 Commandments (external - login to view)

 
Unforgiven
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by MHzView Post

This.."The Bible is one of the greatest works of fiction to ever reach a bookstore."
I'm simply saying I hope for your sake that view is not carved in stone.
The how's and why's you arrived at this conclusion (as it stands today) are unimportant. If you die (and you know it) and somebody brings you back from that place (and you know it) I'm not sure holding onto the view you have today is the wisest path to take (at that time).

God is going to gitcha Wolfy!
 
earth_as_one
#21
If someone believes in the bible that's their business. If someone believes in the Qu'ran or the Torah, that's their business too. But as soon as someone tries to impose their religious beliefs on someone else, that's everyone's business.

If you believe homosexuality is wrong then I suggest you don't engage in the behavior. That's your right to choose. Other people have the same right to choose as you and they've made different choices. That's life. Get over it.
 
AnnaG
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by LiberalmanView Post

MHz

Are you saying that Jesus accepts the man that lies with mankind as with a woman and since man can to this and be saved through Jesus it is not considered a sin in the eyes of God?

So my post is valid

Definitely it is valid ..... valid nonsense.
 
AnnaG
#23
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

The Bible is one of the greatest works of fiction to ever reach a bookstore. Consider, it was part gossip and part legend until parts of it were penned - in several different languages. Then it was translated and revised and modernized - then interpreted by the reader

I disagree. It is only the most popular, not the greatest. Poorly written and plum full of contradictions, equivocal comments, and just straight out crappy pseudo-science.
 
AnnaG
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by UnforgivenView Post

Dude, it's only a guideline!

And a poor one at that. At best the entire message of the Bible could be printed simply, lucidly, and unambiguously in a 2 page pamphlet.
 
AnnaG
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by MHzView Post

This.."The Bible is one of the greatest works of fiction to ever reach a bookstore."
I'm simply saying I hope for your sake that view is not carved in stone.
The how's and why's you arrived at this conclusion (as it stands today) are unimportant. If you die (and you know it) and somebody brings you back from that place (and you know it) I'm not sure holding onto the view you have today is the wisest path to take (at that time).

That's a gargantuan if, but I am sure that people who can actually reason would accept the new data and amend their thoughts accordingly rather than plant their feet and balk in the face of evidence.
 
AnnaG
#26
Quote: Originally Posted by earth_as_oneView Post

If someone believes in the bible that's their business. If someone believes in the Qu'ran or the Torah, that's their business too. But as soon as someone tries to impose their religious beliefs on someone else, that's everyone's business.

If you believe homosexuality is wrong then I suggest you don't engage in the behavior. That's your right to choose. Other people have the same right to choose as you and they've made different choices. That's life. Get over it.

Exactly. The "Golden Rule" beats the 10 commandments every which way to Sunday: treat others as you would have them treat you, AKA "live and let live", "what goes around comes around", and "what ye sow, so shall ye reap". Mr. Liberalman, EG, seems to spew contempt for people so it looks like that's what he gets back. The "Golden Rule" works.
 
MHz
#27
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

when I came back BEFORE they zapped me?

LOL, ever think that is why they zapped you??? Just kidding.
You don't believe in the Bible, so what? Even you must have some 'types of people' you don't hand around with after work. A serial killer would be considered a sinner in the Bible, does that mean you would go out of your way to make friends with them?

And no that was not the call back from the grave the verse mentions. You will see the grave in your future, when He calls you from there you never go back.

Quote: Originally Posted by UnforgivenView Post

God is going to gitcha Wolfy!

Actually it is something we will all go through at some point or another.

Ro:3:10:
As it is written,
There is none righteous,
no,
not one:


Heb:12:5:
And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son,
despise not thou the chastening of the Lord,
nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:
Heb:12:6:
For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth,
and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
Heb:12:7:
If ye endure chastening,
God dealeth with you as with sons;
for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
Heb:12:8:
But if ye be without chastisement,
whereof all are partakers,
then are ye bastards,
and not sons.
 
MHz
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by AnnaGView Post

Poorly written and plum full of contradictions, equivocal comments, and just straight out crappy pseudo-science.

Since not all would agree with that statement perhaps it is just your personal ability to understand the words in the given context.

Quote: Originally Posted by AnnaGView Post

Exactly. The "Golden Rule" beats the 10 commandments every which way to Sunday: treat others as you would have them treat you, AKA "live and let live", "what goes around comes around", and "what ye sow, so shall ye reap". Mr. Liberalman, EG, seems to spew contempt for people so it looks like that's what he gets back. The "Golden Rule" works.

They are one and the same.
Ro:13:9:
For this,
Thou shalt not commit adultery,
Thou shalt not kill,
Thou shalt not steal,
Thou shalt not bear false witness,
Thou shalt not covet;
and if there be any other commandment,
it is briefly comprehended in this saying,
namely,
Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
 
AnnaG
#29
Quote: Originally Posted by MHzView Post

Since not all would agree with that statement perhaps it is just your personal ability to understand the words in the given context.

I don't expect everyone to agree with it. I expect rather the reverse. There are always some people around who argue in the face of the evidence. If the Bible was so clear-cut, why have people taken a couple thousand years to date in studying it's meanings so hard and still can't agree? Are you some sort of authority on the contexts of the Bible or just have your own interpretation?
As I said, the message the Bible seems to have been intended to convey could be boiled down to a 2 page pamphlet if people had intended it to be clear.



Quote:

They are one and the same.
Ro:13:9:
For this,
Thou shalt not commit adultery,
Thou shalt not kill,
Thou shalt not steal,
Thou shalt not bear false witness,
Thou shalt not covet;
and if there be any other commandment,
it is briefly comprehended in this saying,
namely,
Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

What are one and the same?
 
Unforgiven
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by MHzView Post

Actually it is something we will all go through at some point or another.

Not me. I've already taken care of all of that. Your God, as real and wonderful and furious as he is, has been relegated to the mythical legends like all those other Gods before him. Sorry, but that is how it is. Don't let that slow you down though.
 

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