Knows No Bounds
Posts: 2,733 
Location: Vancouver Island
Location: Vancouver Island
May 8th, 2008, 12:53 AM
a one way communication system, and that is OUT, and nothing IN, and they have certainly lost the skills needed to be HAPPY, which is one's own responsibility, but
those types think it belongs to others, to make them happy, so others are blamed for
everything that is wrong with 'them'.
Quoting karrie
People who rant, and complain constantly, have never listened to themselves, they have
I've been reading a lot on a few forums as of late, and a resounding message underlying many people's exasperated posts is one of anger, loathing, frustration, and disrespect toward humanity in general. Post filled with complaints and ranting, and in the end the declaration that humanity sucks.
And I can get being frustrated. I can get being upset by the atrocities and horrors that exist. But, reading many of these styles of posts, I can't help but think to myself that anyone sitting around ranting regularly about how much humanity sucks, has graduated to being a massive part of the problem.
And I can get being frustrated. I can get being upset by the atrocities and horrors that exist. But, reading many of these styles of posts, I can't help but think to myself that anyone sitting around ranting regularly about how much humanity sucks, has graduated to being a massive part of the problem.
a one way communication system, and that is OUT, and nothing IN, and they have certainly lost the skills needed to be HAPPY, which is one's own responsibility, but
those types think it belongs to others, to make them happy, so others are blamed for
everything that is wrong with 'them'.
Steven Hawking's Hero
Posts: 6,445
May 8th, 2008, 06:57 AM
I don't understand about the "rest of us" in your message. We are all getting through life together are we not? Investment in what others' believe to be true or hope to guide us into gives over our control to them when life is a journey we have to take on our own - equipped of course with what we are taught, but as you know often what we have been told and/or taught is through the eyes, mind and heart of another set of hopes - not always ours.
"You spent your time working with women in Mexico..." Are you referring to me? I have never been to Mexico -what I did for much of one school year until it was cut off with an accidental crop-spraying incident, was to work with farm laborers in California - women who became pregnant, giving them information as to prenatal medical care, child care and nutrition, and centers where they could receive further assistance. The alternative had been ( and may still be ) birthing a child in the fields with no assistance whatsoever.
I don't feel a victim at all Mikey - I honestly don't know where you are going with this. I do know that before the internet there was private gossip and word of mouth and inter-family opinion shared verbally or written - now we do the same with complete strangers - and perhaps more stridently because they are strangers and we don't necessarily 'own' what we write - but we rarely hold back some strong emotions if they present.
Is this a good thing or not? I have no idea - it is up to the individual to take what is there in our world these days - or to ignore the process rather than taking part.
The original theory posited is that the world seemed to be getting angrier. I stated it has always been so - humans have always had complaints and upsets.
Should I say personalities are more unforgiving these days? I believe (my opinion only) they have always been so but that the internet has exposed these issues more frequently in forums such as this. Alternatively there are some beautiful friendships which can be
found in the vast cyberworld if one is fortunate to share one.
I think you know well as do I - we can't win accolades from everyone for whatever we write, think or speak. Nor should we expect to. We can only take what is beneficial to our daily lives - and if we receive no benefit then consider forums as fun much like watching television and try to put them into a lesser category of import.
What is disappointing to me are those who never change and seem to be locked into a repetitive mantra saying the same things, having no eureka messages or ideas to share but only criticism of things we have little control over. I wonder what they 'get' out of it.
Quoting MikeyDB
Mikey - I hear you
Curio
What about the rest of us? What about those of us who embraced the values of our fathers and our social construct to find that they're predicated on lies and bigotry? What about those of us who contributed to a world that turned it's back on reason and instead opted for the mystical and the fantasy of unrealizeable dreams? What about those of us who invested in beliveing that our patriarchs and our "models" revealed "truth" to us when in fact they're nothing more than spokespersons for ulterior agendas? You spent your time working with women in Mexico who for a variety of reasons were placed in the position of victim to dynamics beyond their control.....to become a victim yourself!
What about your message and your right to hammer home that message to a people unwilling to listen and disassociated from the consequences?
What about the rest of us? What about those of us who embraced the values of our fathers and our social construct to find that they're predicated on lies and bigotry? What about those of us who contributed to a world that turned it's back on reason and instead opted for the mystical and the fantasy of unrealizeable dreams? What about those of us who invested in beliveing that our patriarchs and our "models" revealed "truth" to us when in fact they're nothing more than spokespersons for ulterior agendas? You spent your time working with women in Mexico who for a variety of reasons were placed in the position of victim to dynamics beyond their control.....to become a victim yourself!
What about your message and your right to hammer home that message to a people unwilling to listen and disassociated from the consequences?
I don't understand about the "rest of us" in your message. We are all getting through life together are we not? Investment in what others' believe to be true or hope to guide us into gives over our control to them when life is a journey we have to take on our own - equipped of course with what we are taught, but as you know often what we have been told and/or taught is through the eyes, mind and heart of another set of hopes - not always ours.
"You spent your time working with women in Mexico..." Are you referring to me? I have never been to Mexico -what I did for much of one school year until it was cut off with an accidental crop-spraying incident, was to work with farm laborers in California - women who became pregnant, giving them information as to prenatal medical care, child care and nutrition, and centers where they could receive further assistance. The alternative had been ( and may still be ) birthing a child in the fields with no assistance whatsoever.
I don't feel a victim at all Mikey - I honestly don't know where you are going with this. I do know that before the internet there was private gossip and word of mouth and inter-family opinion shared verbally or written - now we do the same with complete strangers - and perhaps more stridently because they are strangers and we don't necessarily 'own' what we write - but we rarely hold back some strong emotions if they present.
Is this a good thing or not? I have no idea - it is up to the individual to take what is there in our world these days - or to ignore the process rather than taking part.
The original theory posited is that the world seemed to be getting angrier. I stated it has always been so - humans have always had complaints and upsets.
Should I say personalities are more unforgiving these days? I believe (my opinion only) they have always been so but that the internet has exposed these issues more frequently in forums such as this. Alternatively there are some beautiful friendships which can be
found in the vast cyberworld if one is fortunate to share one.
I think you know well as do I - we can't win accolades from everyone for whatever we write, think or speak. Nor should we expect to. We can only take what is beneficial to our daily lives - and if we receive no benefit then consider forums as fun much like watching television and try to put them into a lesser category of import.
What is disappointing to me are those who never change and seem to be locked into a repetitive mantra saying the same things, having no eureka messages or ideas to share but only criticism of things we have little control over. I wonder what they 'get' out of it.
Steven Hawking's Hero
Posts: 6,445
May 8th, 2008, 06:58 AM
Words of wisdom beautiful written. Thank you.
Quoting talloola
Talloola People who rant, and complain constantly, have never listened to themselves, they have
a one way communication system, and that is OUT, and nothing IN, and they have certainly lost the skills needed to be HAPPY, which is one's own responsibility, but
those types think it belongs to others, to make them happy, so others are blamed for
everything that is wrong with 'them'.
a one way communication system, and that is OUT, and nothing IN, and they have certainly lost the skills needed to be HAPPY, which is one's own responsibility, but
those types think it belongs to others, to make them happy, so others are blamed for
everything that is wrong with 'them'.
Words of wisdom beautiful written. Thank you.
jimmoyer
Posts: 4,912
Location: Winchester Virginia
Location: Winchester Virginia
May 8th, 2008, 07:13 AM
Good posts above, Curiosity, Taloola.
Let's go for tone just for a moment instead of the linear logic.
We often react more to tone and sound than the subject matter.
As Marshall McLuhan said, The Medium is the Message.
We have all been betrayed. And we have let down others in our lives. Now what? Complain ? Sure. But pick up the pieces, hold your head high. And reprogram yourself : go for the positive. People respond.
Have we seen a child cry with finger accusing, "My parents lied to me."
Are we all that child ?
Good posts above, Curiosity, Taloola.
Let's go for tone just for a moment instead of the linear logic.
We often react more to tone and sound than the subject matter.
As Marshall McLuhan said, The Medium is the Message.
We have all been betrayed. And we have let down others in our lives. Now what? Complain ? Sure. But pick up the pieces, hold your head high. And reprogram yourself : go for the positive. People respond.
Have we seen a child cry with finger accusing, "My parents lied to me."
Are we all that child ?
Steven Hawking's Hero
Posts: 6,445
May 8th, 2008, 07:44 AM
Jim yes we are all that child and life has some tough lessons.
I went through that stage because I was a well nurtured (as best as anyone could do with the material given - ditzy me), and when I was trebuchetted into the world of work at a very early age I went through moods and depressions because bosses were not like parents, and co-workers were not like sisters and brothers but more akin to demanding teachers I had in school.
Trying to please rarely worked because I started to lose my own identity - so I rebelled - which got me exactly nothing. Then I discovered the art of studying others which finally led me to where I am now. There are degrees of give and take and cooperation which ultimately lead to a goal (hopefully a group goal) and reasonable success.
People are all books to read and digest if we have time - especially those who think along new pathways and have interesting lives to share or wonderful thoughts to express.
This does not always bring happiness or nirvana - if we expect it we are on a fool's errand - but what we can take positively is always being in touch with ourselves and what we can gain or compare or learn from others - even on a forum.
Or we can choose to exercise our given rights and argue, deny, and never absorb from the world around us while constantly viewing the dark side. "Wahhhh I am a nice girl please like me...." doesn't always cut it in cyber. Anyone can pretend nice but you are what you write and nobody is going to agree 100% on anything unless they are hoping too. I do enjoy being blown away by someone's thoughts and their style of writing - reaching out to others for their thoughts - the perks still outweigh my challenges.
So I am back to what I love about the internet - is what it has taught me about me. The lessons were bloody, filled with tears, heartache, reorganization of thought and doubt of sincerity, and a whole package of negatives with the exception of a very few who opened the doors to what could be if I sought from their perspectives - the positives - and from that point I will forever be grateful to them and will never forget them. I had to learn perfection is a nice goal but hardly realistic. One cannot base one's life on its attainment.
Some day I hope I will find them again - they were lost to me when a forum abrubtly shut its doors and I wasn't a sophisticated poster who knew to secure a contact address when such things happen. I still hope one day I'll read something which brings back a familiar
sound - if I am lucky.
Jim yes we are all that child and life has some tough lessons.
I went through that stage because I was a well nurtured (as best as anyone could do with the material given - ditzy me), and when I was trebuchetted into the world of work at a very early age I went through moods and depressions because bosses were not like parents, and co-workers were not like sisters and brothers but more akin to demanding teachers I had in school.
Trying to please rarely worked because I started to lose my own identity - so I rebelled - which got me exactly nothing. Then I discovered the art of studying others which finally led me to where I am now. There are degrees of give and take and cooperation which ultimately lead to a goal (hopefully a group goal) and reasonable success.
People are all books to read and digest if we have time - especially those who think along new pathways and have interesting lives to share or wonderful thoughts to express.
This does not always bring happiness or nirvana - if we expect it we are on a fool's errand - but what we can take positively is always being in touch with ourselves and what we can gain or compare or learn from others - even on a forum.
Or we can choose to exercise our given rights and argue, deny, and never absorb from the world around us while constantly viewing the dark side. "Wahhhh I am a nice girl please like me...." doesn't always cut it in cyber. Anyone can pretend nice but you are what you write and nobody is going to agree 100% on anything unless they are hoping too. I do enjoy being blown away by someone's thoughts and their style of writing - reaching out to others for their thoughts - the perks still outweigh my challenges.
So I am back to what I love about the internet - is what it has taught me about me. The lessons were bloody, filled with tears, heartache, reorganization of thought and doubt of sincerity, and a whole package of negatives with the exception of a very few who opened the doors to what could be if I sought from their perspectives - the positives - and from that point I will forever be grateful to them and will never forget them. I had to learn perfection is a nice goal but hardly realistic. One cannot base one's life on its attainment.
Some day I hope I will find them again - they were lost to me when a forum abrubtly shut its doors and I wasn't a sophisticated poster who knew to secure a contact address when such things happen. I still hope one day I'll read something which brings back a familiar
sound - if I am lucky.
jimmoyer
Posts: 4,912
Location: Winchester Virginia
Location: Winchester Virginia
May 8th, 2008, 08:02 AM
It's nice to see you back here, Curiosity.
I'm sorry the other forum shuttered its doors. A bar recently closed here in town where our amistad would meet and debate, and now we all float around like molecules bumping into each other occassionally on a corner. We call ourselves the Diaspora.
Every once in awhile we coagulate at some lesser bar. We haven't found a home yet.
Anyway, your instincts and experience on these subjects are right on the mark.
It's nice to see you back here, Curiosity.
I'm sorry the other forum shuttered its doors. A bar recently closed here in town where our amistad would meet and debate, and now we all float around like molecules bumping into each other occassionally on a corner. We call ourselves the Diaspora.
Every once in awhile we coagulate at some lesser bar. We haven't found a home yet.
Anyway, your instincts and experience on these subjects are right on the mark.
Steven Hawking's Tutor
Posts: 4,612
May 8th, 2008, 08:27 AM
I think Jim's contribution speaks to the tone of color of some people's perceptions that the world is an unjust violence ridden, calamitous misadventure when it comes to the human dynamic. However there have been "causes" undertaken by various segments of humanity since our ealiest up-right wanderings. But there's never been the facility to bring these messages of discontent and mis-justice to the immediate attention of everyone plugged into modern technology. We visit Burma through our TV and the Internet and watch horror struck as a people are devastated by a natural disaster and the plea goes out for aid and attention.... We watch as "issues" like the Virginia Tech shootings reverberate around cyberspace and media forums all over the world..... We re-visit the devastation of New Orleans and continue to hear that support that was "supposed" to come to help these people was late in arriving...if at all...and that the calamity in many respects continues to grow...... We're given images from Iraq and Afghanistan that are subtly and not-so-subtly massaged to influence perspectives and political opinion while the causal impetus behind this on-going tragedy is down-played and relegated to obscurity......
There are huge media campaigns telling us that the planetary ecosystem is in dire need of our attention and efforts to reduce our impact upon it.....Dire warnings on TV radio and throughout modern media telling us that the Chinese are poisoning our children through toys and goods that fail the "standards" established to protect us and yet "business" continues as "normal" with more money and greater flow of commerce and consumption increasing the complexity and raising the potential for even greater disasters through food-prices artificially inflated but blamed on corn-farmers growing ethanol to permit the love affair with the internal combustion engine to grow and thrive.....
There's a huge number of people preyed-upon by banks and mortgage companies, given sub-prime loans to purchase homes they couldn't afford based on incomes that are disappearing because business wants greater profits and sends work "off-shore" where the wealthy can increase their wealth and power on the backs ofpeople struggling to survive...
What's the common thread?
I think Jim's contribution speaks to the tone of color of some people's perceptions that the world is an unjust violence ridden, calamitous misadventure when it comes to the human dynamic. However there have been "causes" undertaken by various segments of humanity since our ealiest up-right wanderings. But there's never been the facility to bring these messages of discontent and mis-justice to the immediate attention of everyone plugged into modern technology. We visit Burma through our TV and the Internet and watch horror struck as a people are devastated by a natural disaster and the plea goes out for aid and attention.... We watch as "issues" like the Virginia Tech shootings reverberate around cyberspace and media forums all over the world..... We re-visit the devastation of New Orleans and continue to hear that support that was "supposed" to come to help these people was late in arriving...if at all...and that the calamity in many respects continues to grow...... We're given images from Iraq and Afghanistan that are subtly and not-so-subtly massaged to influence perspectives and political opinion while the causal impetus behind this on-going tragedy is down-played and relegated to obscurity......
There are huge media campaigns telling us that the planetary ecosystem is in dire need of our attention and efforts to reduce our impact upon it.....Dire warnings on TV radio and throughout modern media telling us that the Chinese are poisoning our children through toys and goods that fail the "standards" established to protect us and yet "business" continues as "normal" with more money and greater flow of commerce and consumption increasing the complexity and raising the potential for even greater disasters through food-prices artificially inflated but blamed on corn-farmers growing ethanol to permit the love affair with the internal combustion engine to grow and thrive.....
There's a huge number of people preyed-upon by banks and mortgage companies, given sub-prime loans to purchase homes they couldn't afford based on incomes that are disappearing because business wants greater profits and sends work "off-shore" where the wealthy can increase their wealth and power on the backs ofpeople struggling to survive...
What's the common thread?
jimmoyer
Posts: 4,912
Location: Winchester Virginia
Location: Winchester Virginia
May 8th, 2008, 09:28 AM
Curiosity ---- back at ya.
MikeyDB, we do need those who are fueled by outrage at injustice.
Psychologically, I wonder what it does to those who lead such a fight. It's never good. Fighting evil ironically gets you closer to evil perhaps even becoming that evil.
.
.
.
.
Curiosity ---- back at ya.
MikeyDB, we do need those who are fueled by outrage at injustice.
Psychologically, I wonder what it does to those who lead such a fight. It's never good. Fighting evil ironically gets you closer to evil perhaps even becoming that evil.
.
.
.
.
May 8th, 2008, 09:43 AM
Wow, I've absolutely loved all of the responses in here. What a good conversation. I'd like to clarify something though because I realize it might have sounded like I want people to shut up and not talk about anything negative.
My frustration with the issue is not that I want people to shut up and not discuss horrors and atrocities. It's not that I want people to only spout sunshine and rainbows.
But, I wanted to bring forward some awareness that anytime we decide to focus on such phrases as 'humanity sucks', 'people are evil', 'society is shyte', we're solving very little and instead climbing into the pit with what we hate and rolling around in the muck. And sometimes, dragging a few people in with us.
Because humanity as a whole is a malleable entity. Words like paradigm and zeitgeist speak to the transient nature of the focus of humanity as a whole. It's not always the same, it's capable of change. But, to change it, we need to actually change it. Not act it. Not wallow in it. Not become it. We need to speak out and change it.
We need to fight against that tendency to focus only on the bad, and instead focus on despising the actions but searching out the good in the people, searching out change.
Or, at the very least, we need to recognize ourselves as part of the problem if we want to wallow.
Wow, I've absolutely loved all of the responses in here. What a good conversation. I'd like to clarify something though because I realize it might have sounded like I want people to shut up and not talk about anything negative.
My frustration with the issue is not that I want people to shut up and not discuss horrors and atrocities. It's not that I want people to only spout sunshine and rainbows.
But, I wanted to bring forward some awareness that anytime we decide to focus on such phrases as 'humanity sucks', 'people are evil', 'society is shyte', we're solving very little and instead climbing into the pit with what we hate and rolling around in the muck. And sometimes, dragging a few people in with us.
Because humanity as a whole is a malleable entity. Words like paradigm and zeitgeist speak to the transient nature of the focus of humanity as a whole. It's not always the same, it's capable of change. But, to change it, we need to actually change it. Not act it. Not wallow in it. Not become it. We need to speak out and change it.
We need to fight against that tendency to focus only on the bad, and instead focus on despising the actions but searching out the good in the people, searching out change.
Or, at the very least, we need to recognize ourselves as part of the problem if we want to wallow.
Steven Hawking's Hero
Posts: 6,445
May 8th, 2008, 09:51 AM
Karrie I didn't see you giving orders as to how we should behave - I saw the introduction of a topic
A topic I enjoy taking part in because I have seen both sun and clouds on forums...
It often depends on how I am "seeing" too - not just what a person writes. Sometimes a break away can change my perception of someone's message - not that their message is different - but how I react is.
The internet is what we want to take from it or give to it. Nothing more and nothing less.
I think it is a wonderful thing for us on earth. It continues to morph into some amazing ways and I think we should appreciate and take all the benefits we can from it.
Karrie I didn't see you giving orders as to how we should behave - I saw the introduction of a topic
A topic I enjoy taking part in because I have seen both sun and clouds on forums...
It often depends on how I am "seeing" too - not just what a person writes. Sometimes a break away can change my perception of someone's message - not that their message is different - but how I react is.
The internet is what we want to take from it or give to it. Nothing more and nothing less.
I think it is a wonderful thing for us on earth. It continues to morph into some amazing ways and I think we should appreciate and take all the benefits we can from it.
May 8th, 2008, 09:59 AM
And if I do wallow some days, well, that's only human isn't it? But, to do so I need to recognize that I'm not helping. That I'm only dragging down people around me, people I come into contact with on this lovely internet. That I'm damaging myself, and fulfilling my view of humanity that day.
Quoting MikeyDB
I would try not to wallow. Try not to paint humanity in broad strokes of venom. I'd try to look for the solutions to the issue and seek out the ways that I can affect it from within my sphere of influence.
Karrie
And what would you do?
And what would you do?
And if I do wallow some days, well, that's only human isn't it? But, to do so I need to recognize that I'm not helping. That I'm only dragging down people around me, people I come into contact with on this lovely internet. That I'm damaging myself, and fulfilling my view of humanity that day.
May 8th, 2008, 10:01 AM
Quoting Curiosity
Thanks Curio. I'm glad you read my intent. Karrie I didn't see you giving orders as to how we should behave - I saw the introduction of a topic
A topic I enjoy taking part in because I have seen both sun and clouds on forums...
It often depends on how I am "seeing" too - not just what a person writes. Sometimes a break away can change my perception of someone's message - not that their message is different - but how I react is.
The internet is what we want to take from it or give to it. Nothing more and nothing less.
I think it is a wonderful thing for us on earth. It continues to morph into some amazing ways and I think we should appreciate and take all the benefits we can from it.
A topic I enjoy taking part in because I have seen both sun and clouds on forums...
It often depends on how I am "seeing" too - not just what a person writes. Sometimes a break away can change my perception of someone's message - not that their message is different - but how I react is.
The internet is what we want to take from it or give to it. Nothing more and nothing less.
I think it is a wonderful thing for us on earth. It continues to morph into some amazing ways and I think we should appreciate and take all the benefits we can from it.
Steven Hawking's Tutor
Posts: 4,612
May 8th, 2008, 10:12 AM
Karrie
Do you believe that there was an epiphany among the Y chromosome crowd that enlightened them to the injustice of disallowing women participation in the electoral process? Do you believe that a bolt from heaven struck the altruistic node of some Americans who toyed with the idea that a black-person wasn't truly human but only a few percentage points above that of apes...and reasoned out that perhaps slavery and murder of blacks wasn't a progressive and moraly astute behavior?
Our species has faced challenges from leaving the earths crust and fighting the shackles of gravity to developing a system of travel that's taken for granted....all over the world!
We've decided that there (well at least at one time...) should be special laws rules and provision for how one's nation conducts it's self-defense and recognizes that these difficult times required even more emphasis on the rights and protection of human beings than do those peaceful times when war isn't ravaging whole civilizations! We're now seing these principles thrown away and what was once percieved as morally dubious...now accepted as an expedient necessity....
Cycles perhaps....
Karrie
Do you believe that there was an epiphany among the Y chromosome crowd that enlightened them to the injustice of disallowing women participation in the electoral process? Do you believe that a bolt from heaven struck the altruistic node of some Americans who toyed with the idea that a black-person wasn't truly human but only a few percentage points above that of apes...and reasoned out that perhaps slavery and murder of blacks wasn't a progressive and moraly astute behavior?
Our species has faced challenges from leaving the earths crust and fighting the shackles of gravity to developing a system of travel that's taken for granted....all over the world!
We've decided that there (well at least at one time...) should be special laws rules and provision for how one's nation conducts it's self-defense and recognizes that these difficult times required even more emphasis on the rights and protection of human beings than do those peaceful times when war isn't ravaging whole civilizations! We're now seing these principles thrown away and what was once percieved as morally dubious...now accepted as an expedient necessity....
Cycles perhaps....
May 8th, 2008, 12:35 PM
Mikey,
I fail to see what the issues you bring up have to do with what I'm talking about. Are you implying that human rights, women's rights, were achieved by ranting about the suckishness of humanity? Because I was under the impression that they were achieved through action that stated that humanity was above, was better, than such oppressions. I don't recall anyone who's changed the world by declaring humanity devoid of good, not worth saving, or incapable of change. If you know someone whose wallowing made a big change, I'd love to see the example.
But perhaps I'm just misunderstanding the point you are trying to make?
Mikey,
I fail to see what the issues you bring up have to do with what I'm talking about. Are you implying that human rights, women's rights, were achieved by ranting about the suckishness of humanity? Because I was under the impression that they were achieved through action that stated that humanity was above, was better, than such oppressions. I don't recall anyone who's changed the world by declaring humanity devoid of good, not worth saving, or incapable of change. If you know someone whose wallowing made a big change, I'd love to see the example.
But perhaps I'm just misunderstanding the point you are trying to make?
jimmoyer
Posts: 4,912
Location: Winchester Virginia
Location: Winchester Virginia
May 9th, 2008, 10:38 AM
I don't recall anyone who's changed the world by declaring humanity devoid of good, not worth saving, or incapable of change. If you know someone whose wallowing made a big change, I'd love to see the example.
-----------------------------------------------------Karrie--------------------------------------------------
That's a damnastic good point.
The power of the positive. Rare. Interesting as to why it's rare.
I don't recall anyone who's changed the world by declaring humanity devoid of good, not worth saving, or incapable of change. If you know someone whose wallowing made a big change, I'd love to see the example.
-----------------------------------------------------Karrie--------------------------------------------------
That's a damnastic good point.
The power of the positive. Rare. Interesting as to why it's rare.
