WHA claims homeless man had no rights because he died

[karrie]

Global Winnipeg | Winnipeg health authority wants bulk of lawsuit dismissed in ER death

WINNIPEG - A Manitoba health authority wants the court to dismiss much of a lawsuit filed by relatives of a homeless man who died in an emergency room.
Lawyers for the Winnipeg Regional Health Authority say a double-amputee who died during a 34-hour wait in an emergency room no longer has rights under the Charter of Rights and Freedoms now that he is dead.
In court documents, the authority says Brian Sinclair's charter rights ended with his death so his family cannot sue on those grounds.
The lawyers are also asking the court to dismiss allegations that Sinclair's privacy rights were violated because they say those rights also don't apply after his death.
A Sinclair family lawyer says that argument is -- quote -- "absurd, intolerable and cruelly ironic."
Lawyers for both sides are expected to make their case before a judge Nov. 8.

Read it on Global News: Global Winnipeg | Winnipeg health authority wants bulk of lawsuit dismissed in ER death
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[lone wolf]

Oh great! Another circus.

Why did the homeless person die - and where were these relatives while he was on the street?

 

[karrie]

Oh great! Another circus.

Why did the homeless person die - and where were these relatives while he was on the street?

The homeless person died of a bladder infection while sitting in an ER waiting for help.

As for where the relatives were while he was on the street, lots of homeless people are paranoid personalities for a plethora of reasons, who can't/won't/don't want to live around their families. That doesn't make them bad families, doesn't mean they don't love them, care about them, etc. Just take a look at the families of the Pickton victims, read their stories of trying to reach their loved ones, find them, get them home. It's a poignant example of what the families of runaways, of drug users, or prostitutes, of the homeless in general, go through.

 

[petros]

Was he diabetic?

Mrsa?

Hep?

 

[lone wolf]

The homeless person died of a bladder infection while sitting in an ER waiting for help.

As for where the relatives were while he was on the street, lots of homeless people are paranoid personalities for a plethora of reasons, who can't/won't/don't want to live around their families. That doesn't make them bad families, doesn't mean they don't love them, care about them, etc. Just take a look at the families of the Pickton victims, read their stories of trying to reach their loved ones, find them, get them home. It's a poignant example of what the families of runaways, of drug users, or prostitutes, of the homeless in general, go through.

I remember. The wait was crazy and I believe the hospital was negligent. Homelessness? I've heard a whole encyclopedia of reasons why people are out on the streets while distributing sleeping bags, winter boots and coats among them. It seems just as wrong for the relatives to be attempting to cash in on tragedy. Maybe if any settlement were to be used for a homeless shelter or soup at the Kitchen I wouldn't smell greed mingled with the indifference.

 

[IdRatherBeSkiing]

Knowing how ERs work, I find it difficult to believe that he would have been treated any different had he not been homeless. The only difference would be the added layer of buracracy since he would not have a health card. But he did not have chest pain or a broken arm so would have likely been priority 5 meaning he would never be seen. I have seen the delays at 3 or 4 to know that 5 is pointless.

He probably would have been better served by going to a walk in clinic although actually fixing our ERs would also help.

ETA: the defence that he is dead is ridiculous but you never know when you will get a crackpot judge.

 

[karrie]

I remember. The wait was crazy and I believe the hospital was negligent. Homelessness? I've heard a whole encyclopedia of reasons why people are out on the streets while distributing sleeping bags, winter boots and coats among them. It seems just as wrong for the relatives to be attempting to cash in on tragedy. Maybe if any settlement were to be used for a homeless shelter or soup at the Kitchen I wouldn't smell greed mingled with the indifference.

If they don't try to 'cash in' how do they make sure the WHA changes anything? They can't press criminal charges.

 

[Retired_Can_Soldier]

Oh great! Another circus.

Why did the homeless person die - and where were these relatives while he was on the street?

In all fairness to the family, most homeless people are either mentally ill or suffer from addiction issues.

 

[karrie]

ETA: the defence that he is dead is ridiculous but you never know when you will get a crackpot judge.

That's the thing that's really killing me about this article... their claim that you don't have rights once you die. It would be a completely INSANE legal precedent to set.

 

[Goober]

That's the thing that's really killing me about this article... their claim that you don't have rights once you die. It would be a completely INSANE legal precedent to set.

From what I recall some lawsuits do end with the persons death. I cannot be 100 % sure on that but it rings a bell in the old memory banks.

 

[#juan]

In all fairness to the family, most homeless people are either mentally ill or suffer from addiction issues.

Most homeless people got that way because of drug or booze problems. In a lot of cases the families have
worn themselves out trying to help people who probably can't be helped. The man who died because he
couldn't get treatment is owed something because everyone has a right to health care. To say that death
ends all responsibility is ridiculous. Why not just let them all die.......It would be a lot cheaper...:roll:

 

[TenPenny]

Because the incident happened before his death, he had Charter rights at that time, so the legal argument would last about 30 seconds in front of anyone with any legal knowledge.

 

[petros]

per·son (pûr

s

n)
n.1. A living human. Often used in combination: chairperson; spokesperson; salesperson.
2. An individual of specified character: a person of importance.
3. The composite of characteristics that make up an individual personality; the self.
4. The living body of a human: searched the prisoner's person.


Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms

Read the hi-lighted words.

 

[captain morgan]

The man who died because he
couldn't get treatment is owed something because everyone has a right to health care.

You are mistaken... There is no formal 'Right to Healthcare'

 

[karrie]

The Health of Canadians: The Federal Role - Final Report

For more on what captain morgan has pointed out, see the above link.

However, keep in mind that the Medical Care Act says that in return for federal moneys given to the provinces, its persons should receive reasonable access to medical care, which this man obviously did not get.

 

[captain morgan]

However, keep in mind that the Medical Care Act says that in return for federal moneys given to the provinces, its persons should receive reasonable access to medical care, which this man obviously did not get.

To play devil's advocate here:

Define 'reasonable access'?

 

[petros]

The Health of Canadians: The Federal Role - Final Report

For more on what captain morgan has pointed out, see the above link.

However, keep in mind that the Medical Care Act says that in return for federal moneys given to the provinces, its persons should receive reasonable access to medical care, which this man obviously did not get.

You've gotta sober (if he was abusing) somebody up before you can treat them with antibiotics.

 

[karrie]

To play devil's advocate here:

Define 'reasonable access'?

It's hard to define of course... but I think we can all agree that dying of infection after a 34 hour wait is perhaps outside of the realms of reasonable access. No matter what you're in for, the only reason that you would wait 34 hours in an Emergency Department waiting room, is that the staff had decided you were not worth their time.

You've gotta sober (if he was abusing) somebody up before you can treat them with antibiotics.

Why would you need to sober someone up before treating with antibiotics? Do your research. And I'm quite certain that 34 hrs is an unnecessarily long time to sober someone up. It sounds like he was never seen, period.

 

[petros]

Google

 

[karrie]

lol... which medication is that exactly? I've just finished a round of anti-b's, and specifically asked if alcohol was an issue. I was told by the pharmacist, very plainly, that alcohol only seriously interacts with ONE anti-biotic (not the one used for bladder infections, btw), and the only reason not to drink and take most anti-b's, is if you plan on drinking to the point of puking and not keeping down your meds. Simply having alcohol in your system is NOT a reason to not start treating someone for a bladder infection, it is NOT a reason to let them die of infection in an emergency room untreated. But nice try.