Do we have too much Gov't. regulation in our lives? Could the employee and market place do a more effective job of establishing minimum wage? Does Gov't. regulation simply ensure parity between good and poor workers?
Should Gov't. be sticking it's nose into minimum wage regulation?
- Thread starter JLM
- Start date
Re: Government-imposed Minimum Wage
My concern with minimum wage regulation (in the specific context of British Columbia, given the recent discussions of the issue in this province) is that a bump to minimum wage, without corresponding adjustments for those who are making above minimum wage, seems to devalue the work of the latter employees in organisations that use periodic merit-based increases. Also, there's the issue of whether it's correct to force an organisation to increase the rates of pay of any employees, were this could compromise the capacity of the organisation to maintain the same workforce. Many retailers come to mind, where the non-management employees can earn anything between $8-$16 for their work, with most at the lower end of that scale; a bump to $10 for a majority of those employees could force an organisation to lay off as many as 20% of its employees to balance its payroll budget. An increase could have more negative consequences, than it does positive.
My concern with minimum wage regulation (in the specific context of British Columbia, given the recent discussions of the issue in this province) is that a bump to minimum wage, without corresponding adjustments for those who are making above minimum wage, seems to devalue the work of the latter employees in organisations that use periodic merit-based increases. Also, there's the issue of whether it's correct to force an organisation to increase the rates of pay of any employees, were this could compromise the capacity of the organisation to maintain the same workforce. Many retailers come to mind, where the non-management employees can earn anything between $8-$16 for their work, with most at the lower end of that scale; a bump to $10 for a majority of those employees could force an organisation to lay off as many as 20% of its employees to balance its payroll budget. An increase could have more negative consequences, than it does positive.
That's good if you don't mind a lot of people ripping you off to the tune of $40 grand a year.
I dunno..
maybe we don't need to base ourselves on money.
start from the top.. we all work and we get what we need to live.
nobody charges you money to buy anything..
nothing is ever priced.. you just make it.
maybe we don't need to base ourselves on money.
start from the top.. we all work and we get what we need to live.
nobody charges you money to buy anything..
nothing is ever priced.. you just make it.
Re: Government-imposed Minimum Wage
That is always a consideration. In most places prices have to go up accordingly to cover costs so does anyone win?
What tends to happen is that we get into the situation that BCFerries has where their union cafeteria staff earn a high wage with corresponding high prices for Rotten Ronnies quality food. Might not be a good example as they do have a captive market but I ride the scows regularly so I know what they have.
I often wondered why more low end job holders do not unionize, is it that they recognize their true worth or that they know their job will evaporate if higher wages equal higher prices?
That is always a consideration. In most places prices have to go up accordingly to cover costs so does anyone win?
What tends to happen is that we get into the situation that BCFerries has where their union cafeteria staff earn a high wage with corresponding high prices for Rotten Ronnies quality food. Might not be a good example as they do have a captive market but I ride the scows regularly so I know what they have.
I often wondered why more low end job holders do not unionize, is it that they recognize their true worth or that they know their job will evaporate if higher wages equal higher prices?
no, i'm saying that instead of using money to make our society work, we would be able to go and get what we want and that nobody needs to get paid or be paid in order to make something. start from the top, for example
Mercedes makes their car, gets all the parts and material, don't have to pay for any of it
then they make the car, all the employees work and they don't need to get paid to live.
then we get to buy a car , but no money needs to be exchanged.
..
Mercedes makes their car, gets all the parts and material, don't have to pay for any of it
then they make the car, all the employees work and they don't need to get paid to live.
then we get to buy a car , but no money needs to be exchanged.
..
well if you look at it?
in reality, nobody needs to have money.. if the entire world agreed that we just do what we do and that it's not money that is the point of it all.
cause once 1 level of society requests money for their services.. then everyone else has to do the same.
if you start from the very beginning, from the producer to the buyer to the seller to the consumer..
so the producer, grows the food. they give it to the buyer, who then puts it out to the consumer.
if nobody requests money for their items, then nobody needs to pay for the item
in reality, nobody needs to have money.. if the entire world agreed that we just do what we do and that it's not money that is the point of it all.
cause once 1 level of society requests money for their services.. then everyone else has to do the same.
if you start from the very beginning, from the producer to the buyer to the seller to the consumer..
so the producer, grows the food. they give it to the buyer, who then puts it out to the consumer.
if nobody requests money for their items, then nobody needs to pay for the item
The whole point of 'money' is a way to establish relationships in the value of goods. It's a way to say that one hour of my labour is worth $X, while a chicken breast is worth $y, so if I want a chicken breast, I need to exchange some of my labour for it. But the chicken farmer doesn't need my labour, so I'll sell my labour to someone who does, in return for money, which I can then exchange for a chicken breast.
Did you not take elementary economics? No wonder the country is in the shape it is.
Did you not take elementary economics? No wonder the country is in the shape it is.
I just don't see why that people who aren't as fortunate as others need to suffer for it.
sure the really rich guys will not like it, but people who just need to make an honest days wage would sure appreciate it.
sure the really rich guys will not like it, but people who just need to make an honest days wage would sure appreciate it.
And then everybody gets a Rolls Royce and a 50' yacht? For free. I can go for that. I'd park mine in the Caribbean one week and the Medeteranian the next. Why not, don't have to pay for gas and all the nice people will buid a big house for me too. In the south of France. Ya, that's it. Boy it sure is going to be nice to do nothing and live on a yacht.
Do people in here honestly think private businesses and the "Market Place" would actually regulate minimum wage properly and not take advantage of this situation to benefit themselves?
I see the same mentality take hold here as I see with the arguments supporting the HST..... oh the HST is a good idea because businesses will save money and pass those savings onto the consumer..... oh but they're not obligated to pass any savings onto their consumers and more often then not, pocket whatever benefits they'll get from it.
^ In the same breath, making the "Market" or businesses determine the minimum wage to pay to their employees and expecting them to be fair and balanced about it with nobody looking over their shoulder is a friggin pipe dream.
The Government regulates the minimum wage based on the average expenses every Canadian household faces and bases the minimum wage on covering that average expense factor....... but even that doesn't cover all the expenses one faces on a day to day basis...... otherwise we wouldn't have people working two jobs to make ends meet.
And for those worried about increases in minimum wage devaluing their own contributions of good work at a respectable pay..... if the minimum wage is getting so close to what you're making at your current job that you worked at for some time..... then perhaps maybe it's time you asked for a raise.
I don't see the logic in trying to get the government away from regulating minimum wage..... they're the only ones making sure every business out there pays their employees a set bare minimum wage they should be able to somewhat live off of...... if companies had their way, they'd cut the current minimum wage in half and tell their employees tough tittie.... if they're not making enough to live then they can go work a second job.
My faith in the private sector looking out for my best interests as an employee isn't Zero..... it's -38.
I see the same mentality take hold here as I see with the arguments supporting the HST..... oh the HST is a good idea because businesses will save money and pass those savings onto the consumer..... oh but they're not obligated to pass any savings onto their consumers and more often then not, pocket whatever benefits they'll get from it.
^ In the same breath, making the "Market" or businesses determine the minimum wage to pay to their employees and expecting them to be fair and balanced about it with nobody looking over their shoulder is a friggin pipe dream.
The Government regulates the minimum wage based on the average expenses every Canadian household faces and bases the minimum wage on covering that average expense factor....... but even that doesn't cover all the expenses one faces on a day to day basis...... otherwise we wouldn't have people working two jobs to make ends meet.
And for those worried about increases in minimum wage devaluing their own contributions of good work at a respectable pay..... if the minimum wage is getting so close to what you're making at your current job that you worked at for some time..... then perhaps maybe it's time you asked for a raise.
I don't see the logic in trying to get the government away from regulating minimum wage..... they're the only ones making sure every business out there pays their employees a set bare minimum wage they should be able to somewhat live off of...... if companies had their way, they'd cut the current minimum wage in half and tell their employees tough tittie.... if they're not making enough to live then they can go work a second job.
My faith in the private sector looking out for my best interests as an employee isn't Zero..... it's -38.
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I'm certainly not rich, I work 9-5 for a telcom company and I can tell you I would want nothing to do with any sort of socialism scheme.
I brought up my own proposals for similar ways of doing things, but very few in here seem to understand it and just dub it all as plain ol' Socialism..... OOOoooo Booga booga!
We've all seen just how well free-capitalism with very little regulation does for us all..... how this recession going by the way?
What started this global recession by the way?
Oh that's right..... very little regulation and private businesses making stupid calls and stupid decisions in order to fill their pockets as much as possible as quickly as possible..... then when the sh*t hit the fan, all these businesses were going bankrupt and crying about how they need help to fix up the screw ups they created...... they complained and cried about regulations and oversight on what they do.... they wanted a free market then fuct it all up.
So rather then going tits up for their mistakes as they should have, what happened?
These same businesses that wanted everything 100% private, with no oversight, very little for regulation and wanted a "free-market" that won and lost all on it's own...... turned around to the government and ask for fk'n bailouts at the tax payer's expense and required SOCIALISTIC methods to keep their sorry asses afloat and their businesses running, so they could continue with their wonderful "Free Market"
Yeah.... they want a free market so they can rape as much profit from everything they can get their grubby hands on at everybody else's expense through corruption and selfishness....... but when the chips are down and they face their own demise from their own stupidity..... suddenly those socialist methods don't seem like such a bad idea...... until they get back on their feet so they can repeat their stupidity again..... then Socialism is evil again...... until they need it to save their asses again. :roll:
All of the above can easily be done without the use of money/currency/bills, in fact I created my own system of government and way of life that details exactly how it would work while our quality of life would remain not just similar to what we deal with today, but it would also improve our quality of life a hell of a lot quicker too.
And you don't need "Elementary Economics" to understand how it works either.
why are people so afraid and so against Socialist ideals?
what you don't want to be able to buy stuff and not have to worry about whether or not you can afford it?
what you don't want to be able to buy stuff and not have to worry about whether or not you can afford it?
How about live within your means, it's fairly simple, quit being a mindless consumer.
