They Need A Roundabout On Baffin Island, Not A Traffic Light

dumpthemonarchy

House Member
Jan 18, 2005
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Are these people totally nuts? They don't need an expensive traffic light, they need a roundabout. You know, a traffic circle, and you have to yield to oncoming traffic. Is it April Fools already?

This place has 700 taxpayers. Most of them I'm sure govt supported. The cost? $400,000. Somebody shoot me. They might get a second hand one though. Just torture me.


High drama in the Arctic: to install or not to install a traffic light

High drama in the Arctic: to install or not to install a traffic light


By Randy Boswell, Canwest News ServiceSeptember 30, 2009

Baffin Island traffic jams — a once unimaginable phenomenon — are sparking serious debate in Iqaluit, the fast-growing capital of Nunavut.


A key outpost on Canada's northern frontier, Iqaluit is already the flashpoint for a host of big-ticket issues, ranging from Arctic sovereignty and climate change to aboriginal rights and intergovernmental relations.


But the city's 7,000 residents are currently wrestling with that most parochial of political issues, one familiar to communities everywhere across southern Canada: whether to combat downtown traffic backups by installing a stoplight — the first ever in Nunavut — at Iqaluit's busiest intersection.


If municipal councillors approve the controversial, $400,000 proposal to replace the English-Inuktitut stop signs at the "Four Corners" — the principal cross-street in the territorial hub — the only set of traffic lights in a jurisdiction twice the size of Ontario could be operational by early next year.


"We have a 15-minute rush hour, and unfortunately for some, it's too much now," Iqaluit mayor Elisapee Sheutiapik told Canwest News Service, lamenting how traffic congestion — at morning, lunchtime and 5 p.m. — has become an unwelcome sign of prosperous times. "What used to take two minutes to get from point A to point B, because of congestion in that area, is now taking five-plus."


Sheutiapik, who also runs the Grind & Brew, says the problem is clear when she walks from her coffee shop to City Hall near the Four Corners, the intersection of Queen Elizabeth II Way and Niaqunngusiaq Road: "I can pass a bunch of vehicles while they're there waiting."


Currently in the midst of a re-election campaign ahead of an Oct. 19 vote, Sheutiapik says the final decision on the stoplight will be made after a transportation planning report is finalized this fall.


"When you look at the cost associated with it . . . Is it worth it?" she asks. "You know, we're a city of 7,000 but we might have, maybe, 700 taxpayers. So we have to weigh all of those things."


Michele Bertol, Iqaluit's director of planning and lands, said a preliminary study by an Ontario-based consultant concluded that a stoplight was the best solution.


"The traffic count reveals that when they plug in the formula for how you calculate whether traffic lights are warranted, the numbers demonstrate that yes — we meet the test," says Bertol. "They said they also looked at another option — a roundabout — but the footprint of the roundabout doesn't fit within our existing road right-of-way. The urban fabric in that area is too tight."


But the stoplight option is proving a hard sell. One Iqaluit councillor, Glenn Williams, questioned the cost at a recent public meeting: "Is it right for us," he was reported asking, "to spend a half a million dollars so I can get home three or four minutes earlier?"


Sheutiapik shares the concern, but says the traffic problem will only intensify as Iqaluit grows to its projected population of 13,000 within 15 or 20 years.
"Since 1999, we've doubled in population," she says. "I remember a few years ago when there were 300 vehicles that came off our giant cargo ships. So that (population) growth has meant a lot of growth in vehicles, as well. And over the past few years, we've paved our roads."


She said critics have proposed a cheaper way to ease the flow of cars through the Four Corners.


"There's some people who think we should have somebody standing there directing traffic instead of a $400,000 traffic light. On the other hand, what are you going to do when it's minus 67 with the windchill factor? Who wants to stand out there directing traffic at minus 67?"


Sheutiapik, only half-joking, suggests another alternative: "There might be a community out there with an old traffic light sitting somewhere that they might want to donate to us."

© Copyright (c) Canwest News Service
 

dumpthemonarchy

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Jan 18, 2005
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For the record, I think roundabouts are a far superior traffic mechanism.

Obviously, even in Vancouver they would be better than many of the traffic lights that change so frequently they are just like stop signs. Try to make three lights in a row in Vancouver at any time of the day. Actually Burnaby could give Baffin Island a few dozen traffic lights.
 

Ron in Regina

"Voice of the West" Party
Apr 9, 2008
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"When you look at the cost associated with it . . . Is it worth it?" she asks.
"You know, we're a city of 7,000 but we might have, maybe, 700 taxpayers.
So we have to weigh all of those things."

"Is it right for us," he was reported asking, "to spend a half a million dollars
so I can get home three or four minutes earlier?"

That's over $700/head for the 1/10 people that pay taxes up there? How about
the 90% of the residents of Nunavut that don't pay taxes organize themselves
into six four hour shifts of four people each with hand-held stop signs to perform
the function of the traffic lights....and each non-tax-payer would rotate through the
schedule once every nine months or so for their four hour shift???

I don't know what four handheld STOP signs will cost out at, but it should come in
substantially less than 1/2 a million dollars I'd suspect.

Currently that intersection has a 4-way STOP sign set up, & a Roundabout won't fit.
 

Tonington

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 27, 2006
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Is the Onion writing for global now? A 2 minute commute is now 5! Get out the traffic light! Holy icalooeet.
 

AnnaG

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Jul 5, 2009
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Dumb. Get one light and then some idiot will want to import the New-York-minute. That's bad news.
 

SirJosephPorter

Time Out
Nov 7, 2008
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A 4 way stop would do the trick,much more efficient and cheaper then a stoplight.

The problem with four way stop is that it slows down the traffic excessively. At a four way stop, you have to stop even if there is no traffic. At a round about you stop only if there is oncoming traffic.
 

SirJosephPorter

Time Out
Nov 7, 2008
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For the record, I think roundabouts are a far superior traffic mechanism.


Having driven in Britain (where round abouts are very common), I have some experience in the matter.

Round abouts have advantages and disadvantages. The advantage of course is that it is cheaper. Also, round about mixes several streams of traffic quite efficiently. Thus one arm of the round about may be normal city road, another arm may start a motor way (or a free way), a third arm may be just a country lane, a fourth may enter a shopping mall etc. Another advantage is that you can easily make a U turn at a round about, it is perfectly legal. You cannot do that at a traffic light.

The major disadvantage is that it can lead to traffic pile ups. The way round abouts operate in Britain (and presumably here as well) is that the traffic inside the round about has right of way (in Europe, the traffic entering the round about has the right of way). So if there is a steady stream of traffic coming from the road to your right (as there may well be during rush hour), you are screwed, it will be very difficult to enter the round about, there will be traffic pile up.

In Britain, in some paces they have actually installed traffic lights inside the round about to get around that problem. You enter the round about and then you may have to stop in the circle for red signal. That defeats the purpose of the round about.

So round abouts are cheaper, but they can cause traffic jams.
 

AnnaG

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Jul 5, 2009
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The problem with four way stop is that it slows down the traffic excessively. At a four way stop, you have to stop even if there is no traffic. At a round about you stop only if there is oncoming traffic.
:roll: We aren't talking downtown Toronto here. It's Iqaluit, population under 7000 and they aren't all at the same intersection at the same time. lmao Downtown Summerland (about 12,000 in Summerland) doesn't have ANY lights.
 

dumpthemonarchy

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Jan 18, 2005
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SJP you're talking about pros and cons about cities with some population, in this instance, in the middle of nowhere, we're not. It's another example of bureaucrats playing fast and loose with taxpayers money. They have already spent money on a consultant! thousands of dollars have been wasted already.

This is no longer funny. Supposedly this part of the world has serious social problems to deal with such as alcoholism and kids sleeping outside.
 

taxslave

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 25, 2008
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Why would they need either for three trucks and five skidoos?
QUalicum Beach just put in a traffic circle on the entrance to town as a traffic calming measure. It does that allright. A lowbed cannot make it around the circle that was designed for a single bicycle without running up on the center. But they got stimulus money to pay for it. One of the poorest engineering marvels that I have ever seen. Te engineer must have never been to Europe where they run multiple lanes and actually make traffic flow efficiently.
 

Kakato

Time Out
Jun 10, 2009
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Why would they need either for three trucks and five skidoos?
QUalicum Beach just put in a traffic circle on the entrance to town as a traffic calming measure. It does that allright. A lowbed cannot make it around the circle that was designed for a single bicycle without running up on the center. But they got stimulus money to pay for it. One of the poorest engineering marvels that I have ever seen. Te engineer must have never been to Europe where they run multiple lanes and actually make traffic flow efficiently.

Sounds like someone got a sweetheart deal.

I've only been in the airport and seen Iqaluit from the air but like most northern places,they all have a vehicle to go to the northern store,the dump,and the airport and there aint no other roads period untill it freezes and you can hit the lakes which is allmost all of Nunavut.
Most European engineers would be totally lost dealing with building on permafrost,major fail there.;-)
 

Ron in Regina

"Voice of the West" Party
Apr 9, 2008
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This is from the Opening Post:

"They said they also looked at another option — a roundabout — but the footprint of the roundabout doesn't fit within our existing road right-of-way. The urban fabric in that area is too tight."



"When you look at the cost associated with it . . . Is it worth it?" she asks.
"You know, we're a city of 7,000 but we might have, maybe, 700 taxpayers.
So we have to weigh all of those things."

"Is it right for us," he was reported asking, "to spend a half a million dollars
so I can get home three or four minutes earlier?"

That's over $700/head for the 1/10 people that pay taxes up there? How about
the 90% of the residents of Nunavut that don't pay taxes organize themselves
into six four hour shifts of four people each with hand-held stop signs to perform
the function of the traffic lights....and each non-tax-payer would rotate through the
schedule once every nine months or so for their four hour shift???

I don't know what four handheld STOP signs will cost out at, but it should come in
substantially less than 1/2 a million dollars I'd suspect.

Currently that intersection has a 4-way STOP sign set up, & a Roundabout won't fit.
 

dumpthemonarchy

House Member
Jan 18, 2005
4,235
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Vancouver
www.cynicsunlimited.com
The urban fabric is too tight to suit a roundabout. Sounds like whining. Show me some pictures of said intersection and let's see some dimensions. I checked google earth and it seems to me they have space to put a roundabout in. Might be plan to indulge in some urban planning before they start building expensive big city technology in a burgh.

This is theatre of the absurd. An example of how Canada is poorly governed and overgoverned. Give them five more senate seats.