Crowd urges boy to jump to his death

[Blackleaf]

A crowd urged a suicidal teenager to jump to his death in Derby, Derbyshire.

Shaun Dykes, aged 17, had been suffering from depression for months. Whilst threatening to jump from the roof of a multi-story car park, the watching crowd below urged to jump, and shouted things such as: "How far can you bounce?"

After he jumped, the crowd even broke through police cordons to take photographs of his body.

This group of people didn't just comprise of kids - there were middle-aged adults, too.

So what does this despicable tale tell us about the mentality of British people?


Derby's 'public execution'

BBC
Saturday, 4 October 2008

Trained police negotiators spent three hours talking to Shaun Dykes


Seventeen-year-old Shaun Dykes killed himself by leaping from a multi-story car park in Derby city centre.

Tragically, teenage suicides are not unusual, but what made the case of Shaun Dykes so shocking was that he was allegedly heckled and even goaded by members of a crowd gathered at the scene during the three-hour ordeal on Saturday, 27 September.

The crowd comprised a wide range of ages.

Today Programme reporter Andrew Hosken visited Derby to try and piece together events which led to Shaun's death.

'Public execution'

Alasdair Kay, director of the Derby City Mission, witnessed much of what happened that day and told Today: "I was shopping with my family and couldn't work out why it was taking so long to get out of the car park... (but) as soon as I came out I saw a young lad at the top of the parapet at the shopping centre."

He likened the scene to that of a "public execution".

"People were filming… we could hear people shouting "jump you…" followed by a stream of expletives.

They weren't all just young people, some were middle-aged. To be honest with you I was sickened."

Also in the multi-story car park was Haley Mackay and her team of valets washing cars. She said: "I saw him up there but didn't see him fall."

Asked whether she heard the goading she said yes and called it "disgusting" and "wrong". But she also said the police must take some of the responsibility for what happened that day. She said they "could have cordoned it off further up the road, so that the crowd would not be there."

It has since been claimed onlookers took photographs of Shaun's body after he had thrown himself off the building.


Mysterious motive

But who was Shaun Dykes, the vulnerable young lad who faced such goading?

He was raised in a village not far from Derby, his parents had long separated and his mother had recently split from her boyfriend.

After dropping out of a recent business course he had returned to school to study his AS levels and dreamt of becoming an accountant or a pilot.

He also worked part-time at his local pub in his home village of Kilburn.

On the night before he died he did his usual shift alongside Craig Doxey, a fellow waiter and his best friend.

Craig found time during another shift to speak about his friend. "He was always smiling and laughing about stuff. I think if it wasn't for the crowd, Shaun would have got down and got some help from all his mates, work colleagues and the police."

One of Shaun's school friends, Rebkha Minkley, added: "He was the best person anyone could have asked to meet. He always came in, in the morning with a smile on his face."

Not only can Rebkha not come to terms with the death of her friend, but she does not understand how people could have got a thrill over watching him die.

"To be up there in the state he was in, and then for people to tell him to jump, it made me feel sick... I can't cope with it."

Suicide note

Shaun went to school at Heanor Gate Science College, eight miles from Derby, situated in a largely white, working-class area. He was openly gay and considered to be a "breath of fresh air", despite a troubled home life.

Rob Howard, the school's head teacher, said: "I feel very angry that there are people out there who are so desensitised to life that they just see it as a film or a soap opera. I don't think they realise what the consequences of their actions are going to be, but it is clearly disturbing."

Apparently Shaun Dykes left a suicide note.

It is likely that he was badly affected by the breakdown of an important relationship. But perhaps the reasons for his death are less important than what it revealed about the nature of a handful of ordinary men and women on a bright Saturday afternoon in England.

news.bbc.co.uk

 

[karrie]

truly sad.

 

[Scott Free]

So what does this despicable tale tell us about the mentality of British people?

They watch too much TV.

 

[Praxius]

Sorry, but if the kid has been up there with police trying to talk him down for three hours, either get it the hell over with and jump or come down.

After about 3 hours I would suspect most in the crowd figured he wasn't going to jump and just wanted attention, so the heckling starts to finish the damn thing..... you either do it or get the hell off the ledge and come down.

Taking pictures and video of the incident? Most probably would, no matter what country you live in..... take this for example:

^ I think just about everybody has seen this shot before at one time or another..... one of the US's worst times in history..... and there's footage, film, everything about this day.

So because some people were heckling the kid, are we to assume everybody in that crowd was just there to hope and see the kid kill himself?

I highly doubt it.... but just about everybody has cells with cameras in them.... I imagine there were reporters who were there too. It's instinct to record a situation you rarely encounter..... some for profit.... some for personal reasons.... some just out of spite.

This isn't the first situation where I have heard of onlookers heckling someone who was gonna kill themselves/jump off a building.... this happens everywhere eventually.

And the kid himself? Typical kid.... typical life.... typical issues.... some can handle it, some can't.

Clearly he couldn't...... oh well.... no need to cry over spilt milk.

Insensitive jerk I am?

Perhaps..... but it's not like I don't express my comments with a little bit of first hand experience as a teenager contemplating suicide....... plenty go through thinking about suicide.... some do it, some don't..... some move on.

As it says in the report above, if they were worried about the kid killing himself and worried about people heckling.... the police should have done a better job with crowd control and positioned them farther away. The police by their lack of control over the entire situation created a show for all to see.

Nothing special.

 

[Risus]

Absolutely disgusting.

 

[mt_pockets1000]

And the kid himself? Typical kid.... typical life.... typical issues.... some can handle it, some can't.

Clearly he couldn't...... oh well.... no need to cry over spilt milk.

Speaking from the perspective of a father who watched his teenage daughter go through suicidal tendencies from the age of 13 to 16, I can tell you it was a harrowing experience. If she had carried out her intentions at the time I would certainly have "cried over spilt milk". She's 19 years old now and a beautiful young lady full of zest for life.

 

[Zzarchov]

At the same time though, suicide really isn't that sad to an outsider.

When someone chooses to end their life, what wrong are we supposed to be shocked by? What injustice?

They wanted to die and they got their wish. There are things about Suicide I do truly feel bad about like "How did your life come to the situation where death was the best option?", and if such a situation exists (and it wasn't a plea for attention gone wrong, as does happen) then I feel bad about the person being put in that situation, but the actual death itself? No, I cant' find myself feeling bad about the actual suicide.

I can feel bad about the conditions that lead to it, about the impact it has on others, but not the actual act of someone willfully choosing how and when to end their own life.

 

[karrie]

I can feel bad about the conditions that lead to it, about the impact it has on others, but not the actual act of someone willfully choosing how and when to end their own life.

I don't view it as willful in most teenage kids. I view it as imbalance and mental illness in most teens. There may be a tiny handful that reach the decision rationally, but, I know enough people who've tried to kill themselves to know that in the end it was an irrational, emotion driven decision that they regretted the instant they pulled the trigger, tightened the rope, or downed the pills.

edited to clarify what I said... I know enough people who tried to kill themselves 'as teens'. In stable adults it's a completely different issue.

 

[earth_as_one]

P, what I think is sad is that people had so little empathy. If the young person died of cancer rather a mental illness, would that be different. For me it would be juust as sad.

 

[scratch]

Absolutely disgusting.

I agree with you totally.

Some of our stats...horrible.

In 2003 total number of suicides: 3765
In 2003 total number of traffic deaths: 2766

 

[shadowshiv]

I don't view it as willful in most teenage kids. I view it as imbalance and mental illness in most teens. There may be a tiny handful that reach the decision rationally, but, I know enough people who've tried to kill themselves to know that in the end it was an irrational, emotion driven decision that they regretted the instant they pulled the trigger, tightened the rope, or downed the pills.

edited to clarify what I said... I know enough people who tried to kill themselves 'as teens'. In stable adults it's a completely different issue.

But what about the other factors that can play into this? What if that boy was constantly bullied? Beat up every day? Molested? I don't think it is willful on their part(even for adults, as anyone can have a breaking point) at all. Sometimes they feel that there is nowhere else to turn.

I find it reprehensible that people would encourage another person to end their lives. I hope that at least some of those people that did so feel bad for the rest of their lives, as they deserve that feeling completely.

 

[tracy]

Those people are disgusting. No amount of rationalizing their actions will change that.

 

[Praxius]

Speaking from the perspective of a father who watched his teenage daughter go through suicidal tendencies from the age of 13 to 16, I can tell you it was a harrowing experience. If she had carried out her intentions at the time I would certainly have "cried over spilt milk". She's 19 years old now and a beautiful young lady full of zest for life.

Well I'm not here to split hairs on this subject, but I went through them from grades 5 to 7..... It would probably be pretty serious for any parent, my own included..... but this is the decision of the individual and if they feel they have nobody around to talk to to deal with these thoughts and issues, such as this kid, then there's not much to talk about and probably says something about his own upbringing and surrounding friends and family.

I had nobody to talk to and I had to deal with things on my own...... it sounds like your daughter did and good for her, but you may or may not be suprised to find out just how many kids actually think about suicide and at what ages.

I am no longer suicidal, and I now have the mind frame that I'm not going out without a fight..... many who go through these times as a child and make the decision of life, usually come out more determined and more stronger then ever before.

But I said spilt milk because this happens everyday, around the world, just like murders, wars, rapes, and every other evil thing out there.... some make it through, some don't..... natural selction unfortunatly for some.

 

[Praxius]

At the same time though, suicide really isn't that sad to an outsider.

When someone chooses to end their life, what wrong are we supposed to be shocked by? What injustice?

They wanted to die and they got their wish. There are things about Suicide I do truly feel bad about like "How did your life come to the situation where death was the best option?", and if such a situation exists (and it wasn't a plea for attention gone wrong, as does happen) then I feel bad about the person being put in that situation, but the actual death itself? No, I cant' find myself feeling bad about the actual suicide.

I can feel bad about the conditions that lead to it, about the impact it has on others, but not the actual act of someone willfully choosing how and when to end their own life.

Agreed..... going back and reflecting on my own mind set, it was my decision to make or not, and mine alone.... If I killed myself, I sure as hell wouldn't want people sobbing over my sorry ass and making a big deal out of it..... nobody made a big deal when I was alive... why tf should they when I'm dead?

Dump my corpse somewhere and go on with your lives.... if anything, I was ridding people of a burden, and not just a burden to myself.

And I imagine many others are the same way when they go through that process of thinking. I was detached from the people around me when I was alive (be that by their choice or my own) I'd want it to be the same way afterwards.

But it is their decision to make..... if pepople truly wanted them to continue living, then perhaps they should have been more involved in their lives then they were and the whole situation wouldn't have occured in the first place. If they were more involved, they may feel they had some worth in being on this planet, you may see the signs that something is/was wrong and prevent it from progressing.

But if they kill themselves.... there's not much one can do about it now.

Look for answers and solutions to prevent this from happening to others in the future?

The answers are already out in the open, simple and clear...... people just need to take the time to apply those answers.

 

[Praxius]

I don't view it as willful in most teenage kids. I view it as imbalance and mental illness in most teens. There may be a tiny handful that reach the decision rationally, but, I know enough people who've tried to kill themselves to know that in the end it was an irrational, emotion driven decision that they regretted the instant they pulled the trigger, tightened the rope, or downed the pills.

edited to clarify what I said... I know enough people who tried to kill themselves 'as teens'. In stable adults it's a completely different issue.

I have heard a lot about the differences expressed between teenagers and adults and to me they're garbage.

If a kid is thinking about killing themselves, it has to be a mental illness or imbalance of some kind..... no.... it could never be that their lives are actually full of non-stop sh*t, people treating them like scum.... being the lowest form of life in the school where everybody get's to take their shots on you.....

No.... it's never about their lives, their surroundings and the people around them.... it's always their fault mentally..... solution?

Drug them up... Then they're loaded with anti-depressants and now those people around them that make their lives miserable now find out they're on drugs because of how good a job they're doing in screwing with their lives for their own entertainment and then they step it up even more.....

then the kid's life usually gets even worse, the drugs make them feel like they're no longer who they really are, therefore not working, so they stop.... then the side effects come crashing down on them and they hit the wall and end it all.

Then people wonder what went wrong..... how could they miss the signals, blah blah blah.....

That's what pisses me off the most.

And yet..... you say it's a completly different issue for adults.... because their hormones are no longer screwing with them? That they usually kill themselves out of sound mind/rational thinking?

Chances are, the reason why these kids regret their attempts on suicide after the fact is usually because they see all these people trying to keep them alive and finally showing that there are some who care. This can happen to anybody, anywhere, at any age..... hormones or not.

I see no difference between an adult who blows his brains out after a divorce, losing their kids, losing their job, bills piling up, collections at the door, health issues adding up, and no way out...... compared to a kid where most of their life is spent in the world of high school, with jerks treating them like scum, failing in their marks, no girls or guys like them, they feel ugly, etc. etc.....

 

[Praxius]

P, what I think is sad is that people had so little empathy. If the young person died of cancer rather a mental illness, would that be different. For me it would be juust as sad.

It's all the same to me... except that the suicide situation was by their own decision, where Cancer isn't really an option for someone.

If I died tomorrow by either my own hands or by getting smacked by a bullet train, or by some terminal illness, so be it..... Death is death, we all reach it eventually..... when I die.... well... that's the end of that chapter.

For myself personally, I made the decision that one of those options of death in my life won't be by my own hands.

You mentioned Cancer and Suicide...... well an interesting head scratcher would be someone who was dying from Cancer who kills themselves to avoid the suffering.

And that to me is the link..... Suicide is a reaction to some form of suffering in one's life in which they can not live with anymore.

If this kid killed himself due to some form of suffering in his life.... then I hope he now has the peace he was seeking all this time.

But other then that, that's where it ends for me.

 

[Praxius]

But what about the other factors that can play into this? What if that boy was constantly bullied? Beat up every day? Molested? I don't think it is willful on their part(even for adults, as anyone can have a breaking point) at all. Sometimes they feel that there is nowhere else to turn.

I find it reprehensible that people would encourage another person to end their lives. I hope that at least some of those people that did so feel bad for the rest of their lives, as they deserve that feeling completely.

I know as an answer for myself, if I was there in person, I wouldn't be heckling the kid to kill himself, because as it was for me, it is his decision.... I do not promote their actions on influencing his decision in such a situation, but it doesn't suprise me based on everything I know so far about our humanity.

If I had the opportunity to chat with the fellow before he jumped, I'd probably share a bit on what I went through..... but it would be his decision in the end.