2nd Canadian teen may face beheading in Saudi Arabia


Praxius
#1
http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2008/0...ohail0813.html

Quote:

The case of two Canadian brothers charged in connection with a schoolyard fatality in Saudi Arabia has taken a dramatic turn.

Sultan Kohail, whose case had been before a youth court in that country, has been told that he will be tried as an adult, opening up the possibility he could be executed, if convicted.

His brother, Mohamed Kohail, has already been tried and sentenced to death by beheading, but the case is under appeal.

Liberal MP Dan McTeague, who has been following the plight of the two Montreal brothers, is calling on the Conservative government to make sure the pair receive due process.

The Canadian government has asked for clemency, but it is unclear what steps are being taken to persuade the Saudis to spare Sultan Kohail's life.

Not the best way to go, that's for sure. Although it's a bit of a tossup between beheading or stoned to death as which one's worse.
 
Kreskin
#2
We should evict the so-called ambassador of those Neanderthals and I wouldn't give a rats *** what they thought. Cut off all ties with bozos like this.
 
lone wolf
#3
They have oil ... must kiss butt....
 
wallyj
#4
Where is the outrage!!!!! Oh yeah,Saudi is an islamic country so the usual suspects that want sweet little Omar back will be mute on this.If they can't call down the Americans or Harper over this,it just ain't important to the leftards. So sad.
 
#juan
#5
For God's sake. These two so-called "Canadians" went to another country and involved themselves in a fight at a schoolyard that ended in the death of another student. What should happen to these two? Should they be spanked and sent to bed? What penalty would you want if you were the parent of the boy that was killed?
 
karrie
#6
Quote: Originally Posted by #juanView Post

For God's sake. These two so-called "Canadians" went to another country and involved themselves in a fight at a schoolyard that ended in the death of another student. What should happen to these two? Should they be spanked and sent to bed? What penalty would you want if you were the parent of the boy that was killed?


They never 'went', they were taken there. They're children for crying out loud. They went with their parents. And no... people shouldn't be executed for a fight gone bad. We're not talking serial killers here. We're talking a typical street fight, like those that happen all across Canada and the US every day. It's not worthy of the death penalty.
 
lone wolf
#7
Quote: Originally Posted by karrieView Post

They never 'went', they were taken there. They're children for crying out loud. They went with their parents. And no... people shouldn't be executed for a fight gone bad. We're not talking serial killers here. We're talking a typical street fight, like those that happen all across Canada and the US every day. It's not worthy of the death penalty.

Different part of the world. Different values. Different set of rules. We don't get to treat our woman worse than our camels here....
Last edited by lone wolf; Aug 14th, 2008 at 05:23 PM..
 
Avro
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by PraxiusView Post

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2008/0...ohail0813.html



Not the best way to go, that's for sure. Although it's a bit of a tossup between beheading or stoned to death as which one's worse.


That depends....

I don't think they do it the way the insurgents were doing it to hostages in Iraq, so in that case I'd take the beheading, one quick slice and your gone.

However if done like the following I'd take the stoning but it would be a hard choice.


Moderator's note: Please be aware that the following link is extremely graphic and disturbing.



www.warriorsfortruth.com/behe...armstrong.html (external - login to view)

Sick fanatical cowards.
Last edited by Zan; Aug 14th, 2008 at 08:26 PM..
 
L Gilbert
#9
We have our own oil, some 200 billion barrels of proven resources in NorthAm. They don't like our kids, we don't like their business.The kids should be reprimanded some way but not by death.
Show the Saudis the same kind of intolerance as they do everyone else.
 
#juan
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by karrieView Post

They never 'went', they were taken there. They're children for crying out loud. They went with their parents. And no... people shouldn't be executed for a fight gone bad. We're not talking serial killers here. We're talking a typical street fight, like those that happen all across Canada and the US every day. It's not worthy of the death penalty.

For crying out loud......The two brothers are now eighteen and twenty three years old respectively. They were both two years younger when the fatal fight happened. They are hardly children. I'm not pushing for their execution but in a country like Saudi, this sort of thing is fairly common. They behead a dozen people a month in that country. I expect a blood debt to be paid and the sentence commuted.
 
wallyj
#11
Juan,I agree with you.Hopefully the people of Canada will make a fuss about this as loud as they do over sweet Omar.
 
Kreskin
#12
To hell with their oil. We have our own. It's about time those stone-age morons got a grip. If they kill either one we should boot the whole lot of them out of this country, cut off all trade, and ask them to phone back when they've developed some brain cells. I'm getting tired of these sharia dorks.
 
L Gilbert
#13
Quote: Originally Posted by #juanView Post

For crying out loud......The two brothers are now eighteen and twenty three years old respectively. They were both two years younger when the fatal fight happened. They are hardly children. I'm not pushing for their execution but in a country like Saudi, this sort of thing is fairly common. They behead a dozen people a month in that country.

Yeah. They stone to death teens for having bfs of a different sect of Islam, too.
Quote:

I expect a blood debt to be paid and the sentence commuted.

Yup, it's to be expected. One can say the same of a child who is a product of a broken and dysfunctional marriage to be broken and dysfunctional.
 
Just the Facts
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

They have oil ... must kiss butt....

We have oil.
 
lone wolf
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by Just the FactsView Post

We have oil.

I thought it was brownies....
 
earth_as_one
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by wallyjView Post

Hopefully the people of Canada will make a fuss about this as loud as they do over sweet Omar.

As far as I know these two have been treated more humanely than Omar Khadr so far. But that's not saying much since Khadr was shot in the back and then subjected to years of torture.

Here are details of who these two are and what happened
Quote:

The Kohail family is Palestinian. The children were born in Saudi Arabia, but never acquired Saudi citizenship, The Canadian Press reports. The family spent several years in Montreal, and in 2005 the children gained Canadian citizenship. They recently returned to Saudi Arabia for a wedding.

According to the brothers' account, they were involved in a schoolyard fight that broke out after a girl's male cousin accused Sultan of insulting her. Sultan said he called Mohamed for help when he was confronted by several boys.

Some of the attackers were reportedly armed with clubs and knives. One of the attackers, Munzer Haraki, was punched, fell to the ground and died.

http://www.thestar.com/News/Canada/article/309491

Clearly these two were involved in the death, but if this incident happened in Canada, the death might have been ruled self defence or manslaughter.

Even though Saudi law is harsher than Canadian law, it's possible they may still escape the death penalty. Saudi law allows the victim's family to accept blood money in compensation for the death. But its not cheap.

Quote:

July 27, 2008; Page A14


MECCA, Saudi Arabia -- Badr al-Hasnani was 18 when he got into a fight with a soccer rival and fatally stabbed him. He confessed and was sentenced to death by beheading, as prescribed by sharia, or Islamic law.

For more than two years, Hasnani has been in a juvenile detention center awaiting execution while his family has tried to save him.

The parents of the victim, Majid al-Mahmoudi, have three options under sharia: to demand punishment, to spare Hasnani's life to receive blessings from God, or to grant clemency in exchange for diyah, or blood money.

The Mahmoudis agreed to accept diyah, setting the sum at $2 million in cash, much more than Hasnani's family can afford.

Hasnani's case highlights the growing trend of exorbitant blood-money demands, which many say are fueled by greed and tribal rivalries.

www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...072601785.html (external - login to view)



These two should have to face the consequences for their actions, but Canada as a rule should intervene whenever Canadians face cruel and unusual punishment abroad as in this case.

Canadians should also be aware of the conservative government's position regarding the Canadians facing the death penalty in foreign countries.
Quote:

November 07, 2007
Human Rights Watch, a leading international advocacy group based in the United States, has denounced the Conservative government's new policy to stop seeking clemency for Canadians on death row in the U.S.
The New York-based rights watchdog - which joins Amnesty International, all three federal opposition parties and a chorus of critics across Canada in condemning the government's sudden reversal on the issue - released a statement Wednesday urging Canada to return to resisting "an inherently cruel and unusual form of punishment and a violation of fundamental human rights."
"Canada decided long ago that the death penalty has no place in a civilized society," said David Fathi, director of the U.S. branch of Human Rights Watch. "The Canadian government shouldn't abandon its longtime policy aimed at preventing the execution of its citizens in the United States."...
...Last week, Prime Minister Stephen Harper said: "The reality of this particular case is that were we to intervene it would very quickly become a question of whether we are prepared to repatriate a double-murderer to Canada. In light of this government's strong initiatives on tackling violent crime I think that would send the wrong signal to the Canadian population."...

Quote has been trimmed
 
wallyj
#17
Sweet little Omar was shot in the back,while running away,after throwing a grenade that killed one of the soldiers. He has admitted that. The soldiers did the only logical thing in that situation. They were not going to let him escape or find another grenade,common sense. They were not going to ask him if he was a canadian first. They were not going to ask him for I.D. before shooting.Do you live in the same fantasy world as Quandary? Omar has not been tortured for 6 years. His lawyers could only come up with him crying the blues when he found out that CSIS was not going to save his terrorist behind like Chretien did with his dear old daddy,and the ten minutes or so that was broadcast was the worst from 7 hours of videotape! He had his sleep interrupted for a week before his interrogation,something like living with a new-born. Unpleasant,but not torture.The case you cite about Harper's attitude towards the death penalty,I am very familiar with. Ron Smith,scumbag,marched two young natives who had picked him up hitch-hiking ,and shot them in the head. He did this so he could feel how it is to kill someone. They should have hung him years ago when he wanted to be put to death. You want to bring this scum back to Canada and let him go out on parole,I don't. Join the real world,some people do not deserve to live in it.
 
quandary121
#18
Quote: Originally Posted by wallyjView Post

Sweet little Omar was shot in the back,while running away,after throwing a grenade that killed one of the soldiers. He has admitted that. The soldiers did the only logical thing in that situation. They were not going to let him escape or find another grenade,common sense. They were not going to ask him if he was a canadian first. They were not going to ask him for I.D. before shooting.Do you live in the same fantasy world as Quandary? Omar has not been tortured for 6 years. His lawyers could only come up with him crying the blues when he found out that CSIS was not going to save his terrorist behind like Chretien did with his dear old daddy,and the ten minutes or so that was broadcast was the worst from 7 hours of videotape! He had his sleep interrupted for a week before his interrogation,something like living with a new-born. Unpleasant,but not torture.The case you cite about Harper's attitude towards the death penalty,I am very familiar with. Ron Smith,scumbag,marched two young natives who had picked him up hitch-hiking ,and shot them in the head. He did this so he could feel how it is to kill someone. They should have hung him years ago when he wanted to be put to death. You want to bring this scum back to Canada and let him go out on parole,I don't. Join the real world,some people do not deserve to live in it.

Quote has been trimmed, See full post: View Post
Do you enjoy using my name, to protest a point about your pessimistic view points..!!! "On life".
wallyj ,don't try to drag me into your quarrels.. .
 
Praxius
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by KreskinView Post

To hell with their oil. We have our own. It's about time those stone-age morons got a grip. If they kill either one we should boot the whole lot of them out of this country, cut off all trade, and ask them to phone back when they've developed some brain cells. I'm getting tired of these sharia dorks.

We have no right to deport people from their country who are living peacefully here in our country and abiding by our rules and laws. These sorts of punishments might be the reason why many came here in the first place.

I see no problems with cutting ties from the country though.

And for those complaining about Canadians defending Omar, it's not even remotely the same situation.

These kids commited a crime within their country, broke their laws, and now must face punishment for their actions.

Omar was in a totally different country, the US was in a totally different country, where their laws and rules do not apply.... Afghanistan's laws do. It is known and accepted that these guys killed someone in a fight, it is currectly questionable whether or not Omar tossed a grenade and killed a US medic, during combat on forign soil where Canadian nor US laws should apply.

If Omar commited a crime within the US borders, then I wouldn't give a crap what occured to him, but that didn't happen, and now the US is throwing him through a farce witch-hunt to find him guilty of killing a US soldier due to their own stupidity and incompetence.
 
Praxius
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by wallyjView Post

Sweet little Omar was shot in the back,while running away,after throwing a grenade that killed one of the soldiers. He has admitted that. The soldiers did the only logical thing in that situation. They were not going to let him escape or find another grenade,common sense. They were not going to ask him if he was a canadian first. They were not going to ask him for I.D. before shooting.Do you live in the same fantasy world as Quandary?

Perhaps you are stuck in your own little fantasy yourself, because I don't remember hearing him admit he tossed the grenade and ran.

The official reports I have read, stated that #1 - He was shot twice in the back as he curled up in the corner of the compound like most kids in the middle of bullet fire would..... #2 - US troops reported and recorded that they shot and killed another man after the grenade was tossed, prior to them shooting and capturing Omar, then they re-wrote the reports stating he was the only one left alive after the grenade was tossed, in order to suit their case. #3 - Omar and the US troops were on forign soil in the middle of a military conflict and thus, should have been treated as a POW (Prisoner of War) #4 - He was a minor during this incident and thus, should be treated as a child soldier.

By all means, show me your wonderful pile of facts stating the above that he admitted to tossing the grenade, then running away and being shot in the back.... twice.

Regardless, based already on the information provided thus far, and the reports I have been continually been submitting here in the forums and elsewhere, there is more then enough reasonble doubt in this case to throw it out the window and set him free..... but then again, he is in the middle of a corrupt-illegal court system, and our own government refuses to listen to the Canadian public.... which put them in office and responsible for them getting their fancy paycheques in the first place.... and are not doing their job.

Quote:

Omar has not been tortured for 6 years. His lawyers could only come up with him crying the blues when he found out that CSIS was not going to save his terrorist behind like Chretien did with his dear old daddy,and the ten minutes or so that was broadcast was the worst from 7 hours of videotape!

That was the only available video footage that was released, thanks to our own courts forcing CSIS to release the footage. I am more then sure more was done to him, based on other accounts of prisoners from Git. who were later released after they figured out they wern't a threat or innocent of their crimes.....

... What about Arar? I suppose he wasn't tortured either..... get a fk'n clue will you.

Quote:

He had his sleep interrupted for a week before his interrogation,something like living with a new-born. Unpleasant,but not torture.

Wrong, it has been labeled a form of torture..... the CSIS agents knew and were told this was happening, and they did nothing.... that's the first clear step in violation, and that's why the video was such a big deal.... not because he was crying.

If you don't know anything about what's going on, then don't open your ignorant mouth.

Quote:

The case you cite about Harper's attitude towards the death penalty,I am very familiar with. Ron Smith,scumbag,marched two young natives who had picked him up hitch-hiking ,and shot them in the head. He did this so he could feel how it is to kill someone. They should have hung him years ago when he wanted to be put to death. You want to bring this scum back to Canada and let him go out on parole,I don't. Join the real world,some people do not deserve to live in it.

Indeed, some people don't deserve to live in it..... after it's been proven they shouldn't. You're examples are piss poor, slack in accurate information, and is filled with racial hatred and ignorance..... do a better job next time.
 
missile
#21
If Canada was feared and respected anywhere in the world, this beheading would never happen. But,you can't get respect or fear when there is not even one weapon of mass destruction in our poor arsenal.
 
lone wolf
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by missileView Post

If Canada was feared and respected anywhere in the world, this beheading would never happen. But,you can't get respect or fear when there is not even one weapon of mass destruction in our poor arsenal.

Ahhh ... but we have something even better than that: Endless repetitions of.....

Beneath this snowy mantle cold and clean
The unborn grass lies waiting for its coat to turn to green
The snowbird sings the song he always sings
And speaks to me of flowers that will bloom again in spring

When I was young my heart was young then, too
Anything that it would tell me, that's the thing that I would do
But now I feel such emptiness within
For the thing that I want most in life's the thing that I can't win

CHORUS
Spread your tiny wings and fly away
And take the snow back with you
Where it came from on that day
The one I love forever is untrue
And if I could you know that I would
Fly away with you

The breeze along the river seems to say
That he'll only break my heart again should I decide to stay
So, little snowbird, take me with you when you go
To that land of gentle breezes where the peaceful waters flow

CHORUS

Yeah, if I could I know that I would fl-y-y-y-y away with you

Gene MacLellan
Last edited by lone wolf; Aug 25th, 2008 at 02:03 PM..
 
missile
#23
We used to have the 'dreaded yellow snow" until the blasted climate change.
 
wallyj
#24
Praxius,pray tell where the racial hatred is? I do not like the death cult.Islam is not a race. You people throw the race card out every time you feel threatened. Grow up.
 
lone wolf
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by wallyjView Post

Praxius,pray tell where the racial hatred is? I do not like the death cult.Islam is not a race. You people throw the race card out every time you feel threatened. Grow up.

"You people...."

Isn't that kind of an "I'm-gonna-stereotype-you-but-it's-alright-because-it's-me" intro for a statement? What people?
 
Northboy
#26
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

They have oil ... must kiss butt....

Not necessarily,

Deny them copper or make it hard to get by making pay through the nose.

Without copper, no electrification, no electrification no economic development.

We can have a lot more say than one might think.
 
earth_as_one
#27
Quote: Originally Posted by wallyjView Post

Sweet little Omar was shot in the back,while running away,after throwing a grenade that killed one of the soldiers. He has admitted that. The soldiers did the only logical thing in that situation. They were not going to let him escape or find another grenade,common sense. They were not going to ask him if he was a canadian first. They were not going to ask him for I.D. before shooting.Do you live in the same fantasy world as Quandary? Omar has not been tortured for 6 years. His lawyers could only come up with him crying the blues when he found out that CSIS was not going to save his terrorist behind like Chretien did with his dear old daddy,and the ten minutes or so that was broadcast was the worst from 7 hours of videotape! He had his sleep interrupted for a week before his interrogation,something like living with a new-born. Unpleasant,but not torture.The case you cite about Harper's attitude towards the death penalty,I am very familiar with. Ron Smith,scumbag,marched two young natives who had picked him up hitch-hiking ,and shot them in the head. He did this so he could feel how it is to kill someone. They should have hung him years ago when he wanted to be put to death. You want to bring this scum back to Canada and let him go out on parole,I don't. Join the real world,some people do not deserve to live in it.

Quote has been trimmed, See full post: View Post
Lets assume Khadr is a war criminal because he killed an American soldier during a battle when the compound where he was living was attacked. How many other soldiers are also war criminals?

Now that its official US policy to torture its adversaries, how likely is it that America's adversaries will fight to the death rather than surrender? Also what kind of treatment can our soldiers expect if they are captured?

I disagree with the death penalty. Its a form of cruel and unusual punnishment. Its more cruel and unusual than just whipping people or chopping off their hands. Also once this barbaric punishment has been carried out, you can't undo it if the person is later exonerated by new evidence, like DNA. Likely many innocent people have been executed by the US and the Saudis and other countries which practice capital punishment as tacitly approved by the Harper government.

Praxius pretty much summed up the case against Khadr. There isn't one... given the falsified evidence/testimony and confessions extracted by torture. This new American judicial system is about as humane and fair as "The Inquisition".

Khadr's case really is quite different that the Kohails. What happened is more or less known in their case. Confessions weren't extracted through torture. Even though they've been treated more humanely and fairly than Khadr, that's not saying much. Its pretty bad when the US can't even meet the low standard of humaneness and fairness set by the Saudis.
Last edited by earth_as_one; Aug 15th, 2008 at 07:34 PM..
 
wallyj
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

"You people...."

Isn't that kind of an "I'm-gonna-stereotype-you-but-it's-alright-because-it's-me" intro for a statement? What people?

OK,I stand corrected. I should have said the defenders of Islam,the religion of peace,instead of 'you people'. There,feel better now.This issue of denigrating people by calling them racist when you disagree is wrong and immature. I read many posts that blame the Israeli/Jews for most of the problems in the Middle East. I have yet to see anyone call these posters racists because they are against Judaism. Can you see the parallel? ....As for Omar's confession,I have done a quick search and have found many accounts of him recanting his original confession,but the original one may only come out at his trial.Which,BTW,his lawyers are doing everything in the book to avoid. I wonder why?
 
lone wolf
#29
Saying racist is easier on the ego than saying hmm, you have a point and I may have to evaluate my position. I want to put in for a dime for every time I've been tagged for just walking that path somewhere through the middle....
 
DurkaDurka
#30
Let me put this forth. Should he be treated different then Khadr?

In my view, if Khard is found guilty of war crimes he should face the same punishment as this 'Canadian". Beheading for all?
 
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