Steven Hawking's Tutor
Posts: 5,930 
April 20th, 2008, 12:18 PM
Many people in other countries have remarked how the British just don't seem to like children. A recent article in Time magazine about the treatments of children in Britain also mentions this.
And it seems that these suspicions are right.
Centuries ago, the British used to make cocks, or dogs, or bears fight each other for entertainments. But with all those things now illegal, instead it seems the British are now making CHILDREN fight each other for "sport."
Many public arenas around the country now have young children, often in tears, made to fight each other against their will whilst a crowd looks on....
Shocking pictures which show tearful five-year-olds forced to fight in kickboxing contests
By BETH HALE
20th April 2008
Daily Mail
A blonde-haired girl with her hands strapped into boxing gloves sobs at the side of the ring.
In another image her twin brother takes a direct hit to the face from a sparring partner.
Miah and Kian Flanagan are just five years old.
But already they are seasoned fighters, taking part in an alarmingly fast-growing 'sport' that pits children against other children in the terrifying public arena of the boxing ring.
Five-year-old Miah's face crumples in tears as she fights in the ring
The opponents - some of them barely old enough to be at school - kick and punch in chilling scenes, while parents shout impassioned advice from the sidelines.
Incredibly parental 'advice' includes encouragement to "come on Princess, go forward, kick 'em, kick 'em."
Welcome to the world of child Thai boxing, one of the fastest growing martial arts in the UK with now over 500 registered clubs teaching this sport.
Children as young as four or five are becoming the latest recruits to organised fighting, where some people's attitude is: "If you're good enough to fight, you're old enough".
The chilling snapshot into a pastime that is legal is laid bare on a Cutting Edge documentary to be shown on Channel 4 later this week.
'Just enjoy yourself, baby' shouts her father as little Miah sobs
In the strictly governed world of conventional boxing youngsters must be at least 11 to compete.
But in MuayThai boxing there is no such limit. There is also no requirement for protective headgear, despite regular blows to the skull.
Parents have to sign a disclaimer before a fight, relieving promoters of any blame should their children be injured as they compete - sometimes in front of paying adult audiences.
Miah and Kian Flanagan live with their father Darren, a quantity surveyor, and mother Lisa, a nail technician, in Wigan.
The twins were enrolled in boxing lessons at their local gym seven months ago. Mr Flanagan is so passionate about the sport that he has converted the spare room into a gym so he can give the twins extra tuition.
Mr Flanagan believes that the training will help his daughter take care of herself.
"If someone grabs Miah when she's 15 what do you think is going to happen? She knows all the defence moves," he said.
"If I'd never taught my kids Thai boxing how guilty would I feel. Anyway Miah loves it - she's like a ballet dancer with boxing gloves at the moment," he told the the News of the World.
But footage from the programme shows that Miah often cries before going into the ring and her Dad instructing "Come on baby just enjoy yourself" before later ordering her "stop this now".
"Every time she goes in that ring, there is always a worry she will start crying," said Mr Flanagan, who says he has told his daughter she can give up if she does not enjoy it.
Children as young as five are forced to fight each other in the ring as their parents look on
Such is his determination for his children to succeed that he even alters her diet to 'bulk' her up if she faces an older opponent.
Meanwhile his wife coats her daughter with glittery make-up and hairspray before she enters the rings.
Another child featured is Thai Barlow, already a veteran fighter at 10 and named after his parents burning passion for Thai boxing.
His dad Mark is his trainer who runs his own gym and mother Maxine was herself a successful fighter. Both Thai and his 14-year-old sister, a double world champion, have followed their parents' love of the sport.
On top of school and homework, a normal week for Thai consists of running over 15 km, doing 400 sit ups, and at least 10 hours on the bags and sparring.
Mr Barlow will travel anywhere in the world, forking out thousands of pounds to get his son fight experience.
"My dream and his mum's dream is for him to win a stadium title," he said. "I don't know what his dream is… probably to play with his soldiers."
On March 28 Thai took part in his first cage brawl, fighting inside a 23ft metal cage in front of a huge crowd paying 335 a ticket.
His opponent was nine-year-old Connor Butler, from East London. Both were shouted on by their parents, but Thai eventually lost for only the third time in 59 fights.
Despite his youth, his victories apparently include two knockouts.
Today Conservative shadow minister for Sport and the Olympics Hugh Robertson, said he was alarmed by the fight scenes described.
"If children are so upset by the prospect of doing any sport that they burst into tears before they do it then I don't think they should be forced to take part.
"While I support martial arts and boxing as sport I don't think they are sports for children below the age of seven."
Cutting Edge: Strictly Baby Fight Club is on Channel 4 on Thursday at 9pm
dailymail.co.uk
Many people in other countries have remarked how the British just don't seem to like children. A recent article in Time magazine about the treatments of children in Britain also mentions this.
And it seems that these suspicions are right.
Centuries ago, the British used to make cocks, or dogs, or bears fight each other for entertainments. But with all those things now illegal, instead it seems the British are now making CHILDREN fight each other for "sport."
Many public arenas around the country now have young children, often in tears, made to fight each other against their will whilst a crowd looks on....
Shocking pictures which show tearful five-year-olds forced to fight in kickboxing contests
By BETH HALE
20th April 2008
Daily Mail
A blonde-haired girl with her hands strapped into boxing gloves sobs at the side of the ring.
In another image her twin brother takes a direct hit to the face from a sparring partner.
Miah and Kian Flanagan are just five years old.
But already they are seasoned fighters, taking part in an alarmingly fast-growing 'sport' that pits children against other children in the terrifying public arena of the boxing ring.
Five-year-old Miah's face crumples in tears as she fights in the ring
The opponents - some of them barely old enough to be at school - kick and punch in chilling scenes, while parents shout impassioned advice from the sidelines.
Incredibly parental 'advice' includes encouragement to "come on Princess, go forward, kick 'em, kick 'em."
Welcome to the world of child Thai boxing, one of the fastest growing martial arts in the UK with now over 500 registered clubs teaching this sport.
Children as young as four or five are becoming the latest recruits to organised fighting, where some people's attitude is: "If you're good enough to fight, you're old enough".
The chilling snapshot into a pastime that is legal is laid bare on a Cutting Edge documentary to be shown on Channel 4 later this week.
'Just enjoy yourself, baby' shouts her father as little Miah sobs
In the strictly governed world of conventional boxing youngsters must be at least 11 to compete.
But in MuayThai boxing there is no such limit. There is also no requirement for protective headgear, despite regular blows to the skull.
Parents have to sign a disclaimer before a fight, relieving promoters of any blame should their children be injured as they compete - sometimes in front of paying adult audiences.
Miah and Kian Flanagan live with their father Darren, a quantity surveyor, and mother Lisa, a nail technician, in Wigan.
The twins were enrolled in boxing lessons at their local gym seven months ago. Mr Flanagan is so passionate about the sport that he has converted the spare room into a gym so he can give the twins extra tuition.
Mr Flanagan believes that the training will help his daughter take care of herself.
"If someone grabs Miah when she's 15 what do you think is going to happen? She knows all the defence moves," he said.
"If I'd never taught my kids Thai boxing how guilty would I feel. Anyway Miah loves it - she's like a ballet dancer with boxing gloves at the moment," he told the the News of the World.
But footage from the programme shows that Miah often cries before going into the ring and her Dad instructing "Come on baby just enjoy yourself" before later ordering her "stop this now".
"Every time she goes in that ring, there is always a worry she will start crying," said Mr Flanagan, who says he has told his daughter she can give up if she does not enjoy it.
Children as young as five are forced to fight each other in the ring as their parents look on
Such is his determination for his children to succeed that he even alters her diet to 'bulk' her up if she faces an older opponent.
Meanwhile his wife coats her daughter with glittery make-up and hairspray before she enters the rings.
Another child featured is Thai Barlow, already a veteran fighter at 10 and named after his parents burning passion for Thai boxing.
His dad Mark is his trainer who runs his own gym and mother Maxine was herself a successful fighter. Both Thai and his 14-year-old sister, a double world champion, have followed their parents' love of the sport.
On top of school and homework, a normal week for Thai consists of running over 15 km, doing 400 sit ups, and at least 10 hours on the bags and sparring.
Mr Barlow will travel anywhere in the world, forking out thousands of pounds to get his son fight experience.
"My dream and his mum's dream is for him to win a stadium title," he said. "I don't know what his dream is… probably to play with his soldiers."
On March 28 Thai took part in his first cage brawl, fighting inside a 23ft metal cage in front of a huge crowd paying 335 a ticket.
His opponent was nine-year-old Connor Butler, from East London. Both were shouted on by their parents, but Thai eventually lost for only the third time in 59 fights.
Despite his youth, his victories apparently include two knockouts.
Today Conservative shadow minister for Sport and the Olympics Hugh Robertson, said he was alarmed by the fight scenes described.
"If children are so upset by the prospect of doing any sport that they burst into tears before they do it then I don't think they should be forced to take part.
"While I support martial arts and boxing as sport I don't think they are sports for children below the age of seven."
Cutting Edge: Strictly Baby Fight Club is on Channel 4 on Thursday at 9pm
dailymail.co.uk
April 20th, 2008, 12:49 PM
Quoting shadowshiv
It's not a far cry from some of the hockey parents I've seen, or the injuries that can result from being pushed into hockey.
If this is a legit article, then the parents need to have their heads examined. There is no reason at all for a five year old to be in a fight like that.
Dark Overlord
Posts: 2,595
April 20th, 2008, 01:01 PM
While I do agree with you that often the youngsters have no choice but to play as the parents want to relive their lost youth through their kids, I do think that this "fight club" is far worse in the long run. There needs to be a minimum age before one is allowed to fight, and five is definately too young.
Quoting karrie
Yes, but the general nature of hockey by itself is not to go out and injure "the opponent". I think there is a big difference between youngers playing hockey and this "sport".
It's not a far cry from some of the hockey parents I've seen, or the injuries that can result from being pushed into hockey.
While I do agree with you that often the youngsters have no choice but to play as the parents want to relive their lost youth through their kids, I do think that this "fight club" is far worse in the long run. There needs to be a minimum age before one is allowed to fight, and five is definately too young.
Knows No Bounds
Posts: 2,836
April 20th, 2008, 11:38 PM
Personally I see this being thrown into an intentionally bad light, the journalism seems pretty heavily biased from the get go.
That doesn't mean its not bad, but the journalistic style means all integrity is lost from the get go.
Hopefully the special is better done.
If you report something in a fair and balanced way, and its a bad thing..it will appear that way on its own. When you go out of your way to demonize it, you lose all credibility to make a claim, and lets face it..did you really need to go out of your way to demonize five year olds punching each other for money?
Im no fan of making kids pacifists..but thats a sport that takes skill and I don't think five years olds are , as a sweeping generalization, intelligent enough to handle the risk. I wouldn't let them be involved in Skeet shooting or Nascar racing either.
Personally I see this being thrown into an intentionally bad light, the journalism seems pretty heavily biased from the get go.
That doesn't mean its not bad, but the journalistic style means all integrity is lost from the get go.
Hopefully the special is better done.
If you report something in a fair and balanced way, and its a bad thing..it will appear that way on its own. When you go out of your way to demonize it, you lose all credibility to make a claim, and lets face it..did you really need to go out of your way to demonize five year olds punching each other for money?
Im no fan of making kids pacifists..but thats a sport that takes skill and I don't think five years olds are , as a sweeping generalization, intelligent enough to handle the risk. I wouldn't let them be involved in Skeet shooting or Nascar racing either.
April 21st, 2008, 08:26 AM
Quoting Zzarchov
What struck me is there is only one kid pictured in tears, and I've seen the same thing happen in gymnastics, band, hockey, choir, school plays, and any other event that suddenly puts kids up in front of a room full of strangers. Is it because she was scared of figthing? Or because she was freaked out by the crowd come to watch? I didn't see any balance in the story in that respect either.
Personally I see this being thrown into an intentionally bad light, the journalism seems pretty heavily biased from the get go.
Jerk Extraordinaire
Posts: 2,950
Location: Atlantic Canada
Location: Atlantic Canada
April 21st, 2008, 09:26 AM
I've seen kids around the same age playing around in Karate, boxing and the sort, along with the parents that come with the sport... nothing new. It can be football, hockey, kick boxing, or anything else.... anytime the kid is fearful of getting hurt, they're gonna cry. What about kids who cry when a baseball is coming at them? Nobody's trying to hurt them on purpose, yet they still cry.
I imagine if I ever got a shot of a kid getting hit by a baseball and crying the whole time, I can make baseball parents look evil too.
Seeing a parent freak out on their kid at a sporting event was common practice when I was growing up, now we see another alternative of this kind of sports attitude and now we're all crying foul. Where does one draw the line?
Apparently at Kick boxing.
I've seen kids around the same age playing around in Karate, boxing and the sort, along with the parents that come with the sport... nothing new. It can be football, hockey, kick boxing, or anything else.... anytime the kid is fearful of getting hurt, they're gonna cry. What about kids who cry when a baseball is coming at them? Nobody's trying to hurt them on purpose, yet they still cry.
I imagine if I ever got a shot of a kid getting hit by a baseball and crying the whole time, I can make baseball parents look evil too.
Seeing a parent freak out on their kid at a sporting event was common practice when I was growing up, now we see another alternative of this kind of sports attitude and now we're all crying foul. Where does one draw the line?
Apparently at Kick boxing.
Dark Overlord
Posts: 2,595
April 21st, 2008, 03:21 PM
Quoting Praxius
For sure, when the child is only five years old. They should just be allowed to be kids at that age, as they seem to grow up too fast as it is.
Where does one draw the line?
Apparently at Kick boxing.
Apparently at Kick boxing.
Super Genius
Posts: 1,055
Location: BC
Location: BC
April 21st, 2008, 03:59 PM
What a freakin' hysterical post!
Seriously, it made me ROFL!!
I have seen a lot of spin before but this takes the real prize. Imagine what they could do with pictures of "princess" crying because she doesn't want to go to ballet or "junior" crying because he doesn't like trumpet lessons.
The whole purpose of parenting is to teach children the skills they will need to survive in the world. Certainly athleticism and self-defense are such skills. These children aren't being hurt they are learning self confidence and how to defend themselves!
Codling and wrapping children in bubble wrap isn't what made any of our countries great.
I suppose to Canadians and our safety square- Hitler no smoking society, any bit of reality can look shocking LMAO...
My only solace in all this is that our perverse culture can't continue much longer. Eventually the barbarians will force our walls to crumble and at the rate we're going it can't be soon enough!
I don't want nor want my child living in a nation of pantie wastes!!!!
Unbelievable! We should just pack every child in Styrofoam and sit them on a shelf.
What a freakin' hysterical post!
Seriously, it made me ROFL!!I have seen a lot of spin before but this takes the real prize. Imagine what they could do with pictures of "princess" crying because she doesn't want to go to ballet or "junior" crying because he doesn't like trumpet lessons.
The whole purpose of parenting is to teach children the skills they will need to survive in the world. Certainly athleticism and self-defense are such skills. These children aren't being hurt they are learning self confidence and how to defend themselves!
Codling and wrapping children in bubble wrap isn't what made any of our countries great.
I suppose to Canadians and our safety square- Hitler no smoking society, any bit of reality can look shocking LMAO...
My only solace in all this is that our perverse culture can't continue much longer. Eventually the barbarians will force our walls to crumble and at the rate we're going it can't be soon enough!
I don't want nor want my child living in a nation of pantie wastes!!!!
Unbelievable! We should just pack every child in Styrofoam and sit them on a shelf.
Steven Hawking's Tutor
Posts: 4,981
Location: Saint John, N.B.
Location: Saint John, N.B.
April 21st, 2008, 04:03 PM
I sure never packed my kids in styrofoam, and would gladly have sent them to martial arts lessons if they had wanted to go.
In fact, I personally trained them in the ancient and honourable American
martial art of shu-ting.
This is something quite different.....parents treating their kids as if they were fighting cocks....outrageous!
Quoting Scott Free
What a freakin' hysterical post! Seriously, it made me ROFL!!
I have seen a lot of spin before but this takes the real prize. Imagine what they could do with pictures of "princess" crying because she doesn't want to go to ballet or "junior" crying because he doesn't like trumpet lessons.
The whole purpose of parenting is to teach children the skills they will need to survive in the world. Certainly athleticism and self-defense are such skills. These children aren't being hurt they are learning self confidence and how to defend themselves!
Codling and wrapping children in bubble wrap isn't what made any of our countries great.
I suppose to Canadians and our safety square- Hitler no smoking society, any bit of reality can look shocking LMAO...
My only solace in all this is that our perverse culture can't continue much longer. Eventually the barbarians will force our walls to crumble and at the rate we're going it can't be soon enough!
I don't want nor want my child living in a nation of pantie wastes!!!!
Unbelievable! We should just pack every child in Styrofoam and sit them on a shelf.
Seriously, it made me ROFL!!I have seen a lot of spin before but this takes the real prize. Imagine what they could do with pictures of "princess" crying because she doesn't want to go to ballet or "junior" crying because he doesn't like trumpet lessons.
The whole purpose of parenting is to teach children the skills they will need to survive in the world. Certainly athleticism and self-defense are such skills. These children aren't being hurt they are learning self confidence and how to defend themselves!
Codling and wrapping children in bubble wrap isn't what made any of our countries great.
I suppose to Canadians and our safety square- Hitler no smoking society, any bit of reality can look shocking LMAO...
My only solace in all this is that our perverse culture can't continue much longer. Eventually the barbarians will force our walls to crumble and at the rate we're going it can't be soon enough!
I don't want nor want my child living in a nation of pantie wastes!!!!
Unbelievable! We should just pack every child in Styrofoam and sit them on a shelf.
I sure never packed my kids in styrofoam, and would gladly have sent them to martial arts lessons if they had wanted to go.
In fact, I personally trained them in the ancient and honourable American
martial art of shu-ting.
This is something quite different.....parents treating their kids as if they were fighting cocks....outrageous!
Super Genius
Posts: 1,055
Location: BC
Location: BC
April 21st, 2008, 04:04 PM
Children where gloves and helmets
Quoting Colpy
That is because dogs fight to the death...
If these kids were dogs, all Great Britain would be in an uproar, and people would go to jail for a long time.........and dogs WANT to fight.
'nuff said.
'nuff said.
Children where gloves and helmets
Super Genius
Posts: 1,055
Location: BC
Location: BC
April 21st, 2008, 04:07 PM
Obviously there are some twisted f**k's out there but there is nothing wrong with letting children spar. That's the real issue... why are people watching this?
Quoting Colpy
I think it's outrageous that people want to watch. I agree wholeheartedly.
I sure never packed my kids in styrofoam, and would gladly have sent them to martial arts lessons if they had wanted to go.
In fact, I personally trained them in the ancient and honourable American
martial art of shu-ting.
This is something quite different.....parents treating their kids as if they were fighting cocks....outrageous!
In fact, I personally trained them in the ancient and honourable American
martial art of shu-ting.
This is something quite different.....parents treating their kids as if they were fighting cocks....outrageous!
Obviously there are some twisted f**k's out there but there is nothing wrong with letting children spar. That's the real issue... why are people watching this?
April 21st, 2008, 04:51 PM
Quoting Scott Free
" Despite [Thai's] youth, his victories apparently include two knockouts. "
These children aren't being hurt they are learning self confidence and how to defend themselves!
Super Genius
Posts: 1,055
Location: BC
Location: BC
April 21st, 2008, 05:15 PM
We're back to bubble wrap then huh?
I wonder how many kids a year get knocked out by baseballs or by other sports?
Quoting karrie
And we all know in a real fight, just like in real life, no one ever gets hurt
" Despite [Thai's] youth, his victories apparently include two knockouts. "
We're back to bubble wrap then huh?
I wonder how many kids a year get knocked out by baseballs or by other sports?
April 21st, 2008, 05:33 PM
Quoting Scott Free
have you read my posts in the subject before bothering to respond to just one?
And we all know in a real fight, just like in real life, no one ever gets hurt
We're back to bubble wrap then huh?
We're back to bubble wrap then huh?
