American killed in Halifax Bar fight


Tonington
#1
This is very sad, I hope it wasn't a result of some stupid America vs. Canada argument. Very unfortunate.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2006/...or-killed.html
 
Curiosity
#2
Ah but Tonington



Think of the Joy - the Shadenfreude - it gave the CBC News Room!!!

Those Cheesy 'Mericans
 
the caracal kid
#3
thanks curiosity...

now I can imagine a group of people dancing around singing "we got one, we got one, we got one...."

or is it...

"300 million americans to go, 300 million americans. take one out, and stab it about. 299 999 999 americans to go"
 
Johnny Utah
#4
Quote: Originally Posted by the caracal kidView Post

thanks curiosity...

now I can imagine a group of people dancing around singing "we got one, we got one, we got one...."

or is it...

"300 million americans to go, 300 million americans. take one out, and stab it about. 299 999 999 americans to go"

I can see a little #$@! like you doing something just like that..
 
the caracal kid
#5
can you now, johnnyboy?

then you have gleaned any understanding of me from my posts.
 
tracy
#6
People often don't pick up on sarcasm on this board. I can't imagine anyone being happy this happened.
 
catman
#7
My guess is that it had nothing to do with politics and more to do with some serviceman hitting on some guys girlfriend. Military bucks getting into fights in clubs is nothing new. This one just happened to take a fatal turn.
 
Walrus
#8
You know, the unfortunate thing is that the chances of something like this happening make it inevitable. I'm in the Canadian Navy and have been in many foreign ports where something like this could have happened. Fortunately, I've never been in the situation. Many fellow sailors have been robbed and beaten but none have been killed that I have been aware of. When you put several hundred, and in some cases thousands, of young men together where they have the opportunity to release their emotions without the restraint they are subjected to on board a ship, the situation arises where something catastrophic can happen. Is it more likely to happen to American sailors because of anti-American animosity? I doubt it - Candian sailors posted to Stadacona in Halifax are subjected to the same risks. The biggest difference is that our boys are aware of the dangers and most avoid the risks. A good number still get robbed and beaten by the local thugs. If you know Halifax like I know that city, you know what to avoid and take the proper precautions. Foreign sailors do not have the same advantages and will not avoid confrontations as easily as our boys would simply because of familiarity. Don't be lulled into a sense that it can't happen because this is Canada and we don't do that sort of thing. People get killed in Canada just as easily as in any other country and if they are in the wrong place at the wrong time the odds get even higher. This is just a very unfortunate event and the people who are responsible should face the full weight of the law. Hopefully we are not embarrassed by a failure of our system of justice allowing the people responsible for his death to get off without punishment - that would be a greater problem than the actual killing in the first place.
 
Curiosity
#9
My husband was in the U.S. Navy as a career man - he visited hundreds of ports of call and had many Canadian Navy friendships too which made me kinda proud.....

He learned from his mentors when he was coming up through the service: Unless you are on a U.S. property - two beer limit - and go home.

He never had trouble except sometimes not liking the beer but drinking it down anyway - made some friendships - enjoyed meeting people from other places - even though they would be into their "cups" after a while. He came home with a ton of stories to tell us.

Generally there is comraderie among service people -
 
Kreskin
#10
Did the patron (person charged) bring a knife to the bar? If so it says something about his character.
 
CDNBear
#11
In all fairness, I have met 100's of US servicemen and women. From time to time, some can be quite ummmm, well, ummm...Arrogant. I'm not saying that this seaman deserved it. I have not got all the facts as of yet. But sometimes they take things to an extreme, thus creating situations like bar brawls and such.

Been there done that, got blood on my BDU's.
 
LittleRunningGag
#12
Quote: Originally Posted by CuriosityView Post

Think of the Joy - the Shadenfreude - it gave the CBC News Room!!!


You have got to be kidding. Regardless of bias, you can't actually think that members of the CBC news teams would be cheering the death of anyone. Can you?
 
Curiosity
#13
Gag

Yes it would not surprise me.
 
ottawabill
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by LittleRunningGagView Post

You have got to be kidding. Regardless of bias, you can't actually think that members of the CBC news teams would be cheering the death of anyone. Can you?

YES!! Ok not right out loud but they constantely show their resentful bias towards the U.S. From openly asking if the U.S. deserved 9/11 (like those office workers or their families deserved anything besides a paycheck for being there.) To Rick Mercier's "Talking to Americans" (bet if you ask arround Toronto your get the same dumb *** answers from Canadians)

I'd love to see the Canadian reaction if we heard the same from them....

This is tragic that some young men are hurt and killed because they want to have a bit of fun....but that's as far as it goes...It continually happens but the attention is paid to it since this case can be used for another cause....If this were 2 Indian's in Winnipeg, you would not even have heard about it out side of the local broadcast!!
 
#juan
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by CuriosityView Post

Ah but Tonington



Think of the Joy - the Shadenfreude - it gave the CBC News Room!!!

Those Cheesy 'Mericans

That is completely over the top. Nobody would be happy over the death of a soldier. It is particularly sad when it completely unnecessary. The biggest single factor in this unfortunate incident is probably booze.
 
Curiosity
#16
Careful Juan - you don't want to write a personal attack.
 
Curiosity
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by ottawabillView Post

YES!! Ok not right out loud but they constantely show their resentful bias towards the U.S. From openly asking if the U.S. deserved 9/11 (like those office workers or their families deserved anything besides a paycheck for being there.) To Rick Mercier's "Talking to Americans" (bet if you ask arround Toronto your get the same dumb *** answers from Canadians)

I'd love to see the Canadian reaction if we heard the same from them....

This is tragic that some young men are hurt and killed because they want to have a bit of fun....but that's as far as it goes...It continually happens but the attention is paid to it since this case can be used for another cause....If this were 2 Indian's in Winnipeg, you would not even have heard about it out side of the local broadcast!!

OttawaBill

Thank you for "getting" the sarcasm of my post....there is a fine line between an all-out ideological war between the two nations. I read these forums and what people write and wonder where we are all going with this stuff.

Sailors are famous for fighting when they are drunk.... but killing each other? There's more to the report than national pride...
 
ottawabill
#18
On the Nation front..I've alway found it odd that the closest in common nations have the most problems with each other..Ireland/England/Scotland..Pakistan/India Canada/U.S., Maybe it's because we can understand the differences so well??? Funny most of the world sees no great difference between us and them..calling us north Americans period!!

On the other end....What is wrong with us all, that weapons are constantly brought to bars and nightclubs. There has alway been fights, it's the nature of too many people getting drunk in a hyped enviroment..but brings a knive or gun before you have touched a drop??

Crazy!! Hmm...ok lets go to the club....styled my hair... put on my sexy shirt..so the chic's notice, spray on some Axe to drive them wild ok..set..no wait..forgot my gun..don't waana be doing that...
 
Curiosity
#19
OttawaBill

That makes much sense - if people are hoping to hook up - they don't want to be embarrassed by an insult and if they have crossed the line into "boozedom" their resistance to fighting is low - right at the surface.

I think some guys after having a bad day go to a bar purposely to argue - and yes fight with words - but this business of going up against an armed man (unless he is a bouncer).... is inviting trouble.

Two things against my commenting here: I'm not a guy and have yet to understand them anyway.... and
I am basically a coward when I am near physical violence of any kind.... I'm the first one out the door.

It's a damn shame whatever - a guy cut down for a stupid reason - and I wonder if the fella who killed him even remembers what it was about.
 
I think not
#20
It's Bush's fault.
 
ottawabill
#21
Well Curio,

I am a guy but have no real understanding of what could make someone so mad..here and now to kill someone, unless as you say there is a built up anger beforehand and you just want to vent it somewhere..

This use to be a big city thing but it now happens in Halifax, Ottawa, Edmonton etc...

Why excatly are they all so angry I ask myself? Is it because we removed religon? Parents alway working? Kids getting whatever they want, then frustrated when it stops?? dunno
 
Sassylassie
#22
I heard on the Radio a few minutes ago an Official Police Press Release about the murder, it appears that the American Sailor was a good samaritan who wasn't involved in the fight he tried to break up two waring fractions and got stabbed in the meelee. A male 23 years of age has been charged with First Degree Murder, which no doubt will be reduced to "Manslaughter".

The fact that this gentleman carried a knife on his person tells me he wasn't exactly a choir boy. Nova Scotia has never had a problem with Americans or American Service Men, the US is usually our training partners in Military Exercises and there is a fair amount of good natured ribbing and teasing but in 20 years I never once saw an episode of violence amoungs our members. The British yes but not the yanks.
 
EastSideScotian
#23
Quote: Originally Posted by SassylassieView Post

I heard on the Radio a few minutes ago an Official Police Press Release about the murder, it appears that the American Sailor was a good samaritan who wasn't involved in the fight he tried to break up two waring fractions and got stabbed in the meelee. A male 23 years of age has been charged with First Degree Murder, which no doubt will be reduced to "Manslaughter".

The fact that this gentleman carried a knife on his person tells me he wasn't exactly a choir boy. Nova Scotia has never had a problem with Americans or American Service Men, the US is usually our training partners in Military Exercises and there is a fair amount of good natured ribbing and teasing but in 20 years I never once saw an episode of violence amoungs our members. The British yes but not the yanks.

Yep.... Thats the real story.

A French Medical ship came to dock one time, and all the saliors came to the clubs, here were a few fights that night. I even had to haul a friend out of one.

But as for this recent killing, the American was actting as a good person. Halifax is a Navy Town lets not forget and Saliors love Halifax, Iam sure they didnt want to start any troubble.
 
Sassylassie
#24
The man arrested for the murder has a history of stabbings. Two years ago he was sentenced in NS to 67 months in jail for stabbing a man outside a barbershop 14 times he also attacked this man's girl friend and stabbed her. At the time of sentencing he was granted double credit for time served so he did 41 months. Today he was let out of jail on bail for first degree murder, what a justice system we have.
 
CDNBear
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by SassylassieView Post

The man arrested for the murder has a history of stabbings. Two years ago he was sentenced in NS to 67 months in jail for stabbing a man outside a barbershop 14 times he also attacked this man's girl friend and stabbed her. At the time of sentencing he was granted double credit for time served so he did 41 months. Today he was let out of jail on bail for first degree murder, what a justice system we have.

You gotta love Canadian Justice, stab someone 14 times get 67 months. Two twisted kids skin a live cat, and they gety two years.

I hope the family of the Seaman sue the *** into oblivion. Then sue the judge that let him out.
 
Tonington
#26
Serious, when will people learn that these types of criminals should remain labelled "dangerous" offenders. It's a totally different story for crimes of passion where the accused has no history of this behaviour. This guy obviously does. Normal deterence for crimes is only effective if the person is rational. Someone like this obviously is not.
 
ottawabill
#27
I can't believe how many times I have heard of someone being arrested for some crime, then they tell you of his previous crimes...He's arrested Oct. 2006 and he raped someone in 2004..what is he doing out to commit the next crime...You also have to figure, our courst system is not fast. If he commited the crime in 2004 it would have taken so time to arrest him and put him on trial.

Whatever the hell this 3 for one time is while awaiting trail is complete and utter crap....If he is gulity the time should be at best one for one!!

Maybe 3 for 1 in payment if he is inocent!!
 
Tonington
#28
Or perhaps three strikes and you're out, like California.
 
Sassylassie
#29
The latest Crime update: Well this little ****e head "When arrested Mr X was on full parole aftr serving 17 months of his 41-month sentence he received in February 2004 for a drunken, vicious knife attack against a Halifax barber and the man's girlfriend in April 2002."

He didn't know the barber or his girl friend he attacked without provacation and stabbed the barber from behind, he only stopped stabbing the victim when a stranger hauled his asst off the man and the article goes on to say he was a model prisoner. So he only serves 17 months for attacking and maiming a man for life (he has permanant nerve damage) and he's on parole and he stabs and kills someone. Nice, just ducky and the parole board is stepping all over themselves saying how could we know cause he was a model prisoner. He took anger management after all, and prolly basket weaving and pottery.
 
ottawabill
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by ToningtonView Post

Or perhaps three strikes and you're out, like California.

Harper is trying to get that passed but ALL the other parties are blocking it. The california law goes to far, it's basically ANY 3 strikes, if two have been for violent crime and the 3rd for stealing bread..your out.

The one Harper wants is 3 violent offences and your out..what ever the problem wuth that is I surely don't know??
 
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