Trade ministers pledge to harness Commonwealth advantage at historic meeting - See mo


White_Unifier
#1
Trade ministers pledge to harness Commonwealth advantage at historic meeting | The Commonwealth (external - login to view)

Good news!
 
Blackleaf
+1
#2  Top Rated Post
Britain can build closer ties with the vibrant Commonwealth once out of the decrepit EU.
 
mentalfloss
#3
It's like the EU but with different countries.
 
Blackleaf
#4
Quote: Originally Posted by mentalflossView Post

It's like the EU but with different countries.

It's nothing like the EU.
 
Curious Cdn
+1
#5
Quote: Originally Posted by BlackleafView Post

Britain can build closer ties with the vibrant Commonwealth once out of the decrepit EU.

The vibrant Commonwealth countries are fierce competitors against each other in almost every commodity that we export.

The larger, richer ones (India, Canada, Australia in that order) are poised to pass the UK economy over he next few decades, too and the British dream of reconstituting their old Empah is merely British dreaming of the good old days.
 
White_Unifier
#6
Quote: Originally Posted by Curious CdnView Post

The vibrant Commonwealth countries are fierce competitors against each other in almost every commodity that we export.

The larger, richer ones (India, Canada, Australia in that order) are poised to pass the UK economy over he next few decades, too and the British dream of reconstituting their old Empah is merely British dreaming of the good old days.

Little Englanders would take their ball and leave as soon as they realise that they're just one of many players in the Commonwealth.
 
Curious Cdn
#7
Quote: Originally Posted by White_UnifierView Post

Little Englanders would take their ball and leave as soon as they realise that they're just one of many players in the Commonwealth.

... a much diminished one, at that. There is no way that they will view themselves as equal partners even though they have a little to offer us, beyond being a customer for some of our resources.
 
Bar Sinister
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by Curious CdnView Post


The larger, richer ones (India, Canada, Australia in that order) are poised to pass the UK economy over he next few decades

That is probably correct so far as the UK is concerned. The country is no longer that manufacturing giant that it once was. What is keeping it high in terms of GNP is the investment sector which was well established during the days of empire, the days of Britain leading the world are long over.
 
Curious Cdn
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by Bar SinisterView Post

That is probably correct so far as the UK is concerned. The country is no longer that manufacturing giant that it once was. What is keeping it high in terms of GNP is the investment sector which was well established during the days of empire, the days of Britain leading the world are long over.

We'll see just how much of that investment was using the UK as a portal to the European Community.
 
Blackleaf
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by Curious CdnView Post

The vibrant Commonwealth countries are fierce competitors against each other in almost every commodity that we export.

The larger, richer ones (India, Canada, Australia in that order) are poised to pass the UK economy over he next few decades, too and the British dream of reconstituting their old Empah is merely British dreaming of the good old days.

India is richer than the UK, is it? Where did you get that idea from?

As for much smaller Canada and Australia overtaking Britain: in 2050, Britain is predicted to have the world's sixth largest economy (it's currently the fifth) whereas Canada will no longer be in the Top 10 economies and Australia still won't be in the Top 10.
 
mentalfloss
#11
Quote: Originally Posted by BlackleafView Post

It's nothing like the E U.

Yes, of course.

Britain is fully independent lol
 
Blackleaf
#12
Quote: Originally Posted by Bar SinisterView Post

That is probably correct so far as the UK is concerned. The country is no longer that manufacturing giant that it once was. What is keeping it high in terms of GNP is the investment sector which was well established during the days of empire, the days of Britain leading the world are long over.

The United Kingdom is the largest manufacturing country in the Commonwealth:



Quote: Originally Posted by mentalflossView Post

Yes, of course.

Britain is fully independent lol

Comparing the EU - a political union of non-sovereign states with its own flag, national anthem, currency, capital city, parliament and all the other trappings of statehood - with the Commonwealth - a loose confederation of sovereignj states (bar the UK until its gains its independence and sovereignty from the EU) - is just bonkers.
 
White_Unifier
#13
I don't think anyone is denying that the UK economy is wealthy. But the my-way-or-the highway attitude that the UK has exhibited in recent years could change that over the next few decades if it doesn't change. No country is an island (metaphorically of course), and that applies to the UK as much as to any other country including Canada.
 
Blackleaf
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by White_UnifierView Post

But the my-way-or-the highway attitude that the UK has exhibited in recent years

Give me an example of this attitude.
 
White_Unifier
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by BlackleafView Post

Give me an example of this attitude.

We'll leave the EU and put an end to free movement and the EU shall allow the UK free access to its markets.

And when the EU refuses both, forcing one choice or the other, the UK refuses to choose, delays launching talks, and just whines and complains that it can't have it both ways.
 
Blackleaf
+1
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by White_UnifierView Post

We'll leave the EU and put an end to free movement and the EU shall allow the UK free access to its markets.

Canada has access to the EU markets yet doesn't accept the EU's free movement of people.
 
White_Unifier
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by BlackleafView Post

Canada has access to the EU markets yet doesn't accept the EU's free movement of people.

Canada:

1. enjoys far less access than the UK presently does.

2. depends far more on the US than the EU for trade.

If Canada's trade agreements with the US were as limited as those with the EU, our economy would be devastated.
 
Blackleaf
#18
Quote: Originally Posted by White_UnifierView Post

Canada:

1. enjoys far less access than the UK presently does.

2. depends far more on the US than the EU for trade.

In fact, there are many countries round the world able to trade freely with the EU and get on fine and dandily and prosper outside the EU yet don't have to accept unlimited amounts of Romanian pickpockets and Latvian murderers.

Britain trades with the United States but doesn't have to abide by US laws.
 
White_Unifier
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by BlackleafView Post

In fact, there are many countries round the world able to trade freely with the EU and get on fine and dandily and prosper outside the EU yet don't have to accept unlimited amounts of Romanian pickpockets and Latvian murderers.

Britain trades with the United States but doesn't have to abide by US laws.

You don't depend on US trade as much as Canada does. Other countries in Asia and South America don't rely as much on EU trade as the UK does.

And both Canada and the US sacrifice at least a certain degree of sovereignty to trade with one another. Our trade with one another is far freer than that between the UK and the US. If you want access to US markets to the same degree Canada does, you will need to sacrifice a certain degree of sovereignty. It's the way of the world. If you want to see a nearly totally sovereign state, look at North Korea, and even it depends on China to a degree.

At the end of the day it's always a trade off. How much sovereignty are you willing to trade in exchange for market access?
 
Blackleaf
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by White_UnifierView Post

You don't depend on US trade as much as Canada does. Other countries in Asia and South America don't rely as much on EU trade as the UK does.

And both Canada and the US sacrifice at least a certain degree of sovereignty to trade with one another. Our trade with one another is far freer than that between the UK and the US. If you want access to US markets to the same degree Canada does, you will need to sacrifice a certain degree of sovereignty. It's the way of the world. If you want to see a nearly totally sovereign state, look at North Korea, and even it depends on China to a degree.

At the end of the day it's always a trade off. How much sovereignty are you willing to trade in exchange for market access?

What is the reality of the UK's "reliance" on the EU for trade? The reality is that that, each year that passes, the UK does less trade with the EU. As recently as the late 1990s, 60% of UK exports went to the EU. That has now dwindled to 45% and is still getting smaller. In fact, it's predicted that UK exports to the EU will shrink to just 37% by 2035 and 30% by 2050. The EU is becoming less important for the UK for trade each passing year. The EU is also the only part of the world with which the UK has a trade deficit. The UK has a trade surplus with the rest of the world.
 
White_Unifier
#21
I'd rather trade with a country with which we have a trade deficit. That means they actually produce stuff we need and with no tariffs and other barriers, we can therefore access what we need more efficiently.

And 45% with the EU is no small number.

But yes, get Brexit over with and start looking for other markets. You've crossed the Rubicon, so make the best of it. CANZUK and Commonwealth trade are the next best thing for you.
 
Blackleaf
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by White_UnifierView Post

I'd rather trade with a country with which we have a trade deficit. That means they actually produce stuff we need and with no tariffs and other barriers, we can therefore access what we need more efficiently.

And 45% with the EU is no small number.

But yes, get Brexit over with and start looking for other markets. You've crossed the Rubicon, so make the best of it. CANZUK and Commonwealth trade are the next best thing for you.

Trade with the Commonwealth is better than trade with the EU. For a start, the Commonwealth is booming, and overtook the Eurozone in economic size in 2013. Also, Britain can do trade deals with Commonwealth and other countries very quickly whereas. As Canada has found out, it takes many years to forge a trade deal with the slow, cumbersome EU.
 
Curious Cdn
#23
Quote: Originally Posted by BlackleafView Post

India is richer than the UK, is it? Where did you get that idea from?

As for much smaller Canada and Australia overtaking Britain: in 2050, Britain is predicted to have the world's sixth largest economy (it's currently the fifth) whereas Canada will no longer be in the Top 10 economies and Australia still won't be in the Top 10.

India is clearly a future superpower and Britain is a future Spain. Wave "bye-bye" as India zooms past you, forever. Canada, Australia .... the future belongs to them. Britain is a spent, once-upon-a-time global power.

Anyway, you've proven my point.Ths British would never approach a negotiation like this as an agreement of equals but more as a relationship between the ruler and the ruled. Who the hell needs that? Who benefits from a relationship like that, other than Britain? Why don't you get into a trading relationship with your next-door-neighbours? Oh, I forgot. The British public are too whiny and racist to get along with their neighbours.

By the way, it is still in the distant future but Canada has an abundance of THE ultimate resource,one which is becoming increasingly scarce and that is absolutely necessary for the continuation of civilization. That is fresh water.
Last edited by Curious Cdn; 1 week ago at 06:51 AM..
 
White_Unifier
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by BlackleafView Post

Trade with the Commonwealth is better than trade with the EU. For a start, the Commonwealth is booming, and overtook the Eurozone in economic size in 2013. Also, Britain can do trade deals with Commonwealth and other countries very quickly whereas. As Canada has found out, it takes many years to forge a trade deal with the slow, cumbersome EU.

But for the UK, the EU enjoys the advantage of low transportation costs compared to Canada, India, and especially Australia and New Zealand. Canada will always depend more on the US, Australia and New Zealand on Indonesia, and India on China for example. You can't ignore your geographic advantages.

Quote: Originally Posted by Curious CdnView Post

India is clearly a future superpower and Britain is a future Spain. Wave "bye-bye" as India zooms past you, forever. Canada, Australia .... the future belongs to them. Britain is a spent, once-upon-a-time global power.

Anyway, you've proven my point.Ths British would never approach a negotiation like this as an agreement of equals but more as a relationship between the ruler and the ruler. Who the hell needs that? Who benefits from a relationship like that, other than Britain? Why don't you get into a trading relationship with your next-door-neighbours? Oh, I forgot. The British public are too whiny and racist to get along with their neighbours.

By the way, it is still in the distant future but Canada has an abundance of THE ultimate resource,one which is becoming increasingly scarce and that is absolutely necessary for the continuation of civilization. That is fresh water.

The only reason Canada is doing well is a recognition that sovereignty is not there to sit on a pedestal as it does in North Korea. Sovereignty is there to be traded to our advantage. That's what gave us the FTA, NAFTA, CETA, etc.

Unfortunately with Leitch, Canada risks going the way of the UK and the US, sadly.
 
Curious Cdn
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by White_UnifierView Post

But for the UK, the EU enjoys the advantage of low transportation costs compared to Canada, India, and especially Australia and New Zealand. Canada will always depend more on the US, Australia and New Zealand on Indonesia, and India on China for example. You can't ignore your geographic advantages.



The only reason Canada is doing well is a recognition that sovereignty is not there to sit on a pedestal as it does in North Korea. Sovereignty is there to be traded to our advantage. That's what gave us the FTA, NAFTA, CETA, etc.

Unfortunately with Leitch, Canada risks going the way of the UK and the US, sadly.

Leitch is merely a passing fad, popular with the extreme right wing 10-15% fringe of Canadians.
 
Blackleaf
#26
Quote: Originally Posted by Curious CdnView Post

India is clearly a future superpower and Britain is a future Spain. Wave "bye-bye" as India zooms past you, forever. Canada, Australia .... the future belongs to them. Britain is a spent, once-upon-a-time global power.



Quote:

Anyway, you've proven my point.Ths British would never approach a negotiation like this as an agreement of equals but more as a relationship between the ruler and the ruled.

Britain holds most of the cards in the upcoming negotiations. Remember they need us - with our booming economy and London and our military - more than we need them.

Quote:

The British public are too whiny and racist to get along with their neighbours.

Neighbours. Is that our same neighbours who, when they aren't trying to invade us, are sending their fishing fleets into what used to be British waters so they can steal all our fish and decimate our once-mighty fishing fleet whilst demanding we pay them billions of pounds every year to fund their inefficient farmers and to plant olive groves?

Quote:

By the way, it is still in the distant future but Canada has an abundance of THE ultimate resource,one which is becoming increasingly scarce and that is absolutely necessary for the continuation of civilization. That is fresh water.

Antarctica has 70% of the world's fresh water, but I'm not expexting that to become an economic behemoth anytime soon.

Quote: Originally Posted by White_UnifierView Post

But for the UK, the EU enjoys the advantage of low transportation costs compared to Canada, India, and especially Australia and New Zealand. Canada will always depend more on the US, Australia and New Zealand on Indonesia, and India on China for example. You can't ignore your geographic advantages.

Britain has traditionally been an outward-looking, global nation, partaking in global trade, unlike our more inward-looking neighbours.
 
Curious Cdn
#27
Britain holds most of the cards in the upcoming negotiations.

If that is true, no one will bother to negotiate with you for anything. Keep rowing your island away from Europe. Maybe, you will manage to find favourable trade deals in Sub-Saharan Africa or Micronesia.
 
Blackleaf
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by Curious CdnView Post

Britain holds most of the cards in the upcoming negotiations.

If that is true, no one will bother to negotiate with you for anything. Keep rowing your island away from Europe. Maybe, you will manage to find favourable trade deals in Sub-Saharan Africa or Micronesia.

We don't have to negotiate anything. Theresa May could have got us out of the EU by now. Instead of going through the rigmarole of triggering Article 50 and then going through a two year negotiations process before we leave, there's nothing to stop her sending a letter or email to Drunker Juncker simply stating: "We're out of the EU now. See ya!"

Britain holds the aces in Brexit talks

The euro crisis, Labourís failure and Trumpís victory give Theresa May a winning hand

https://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/11/...-brexit-talks/ (external - login to view)
 
Curious Cdn
#29
Quote: Originally Posted by BlackleafView Post

We don't have to negotiate anything. Theresa May could have got us out of the EU by now. Instead of going through the rigmarole of triggering Article 50 and then going through a two year negotiations process before we leave, there's nothing to stop her sending a letter or email to Drunker Juncker simply stating: "We're out of the EU now. See ya!"

Britain holds the aces in Brexit talks

The euro crisis, Labour’s failure and Trump’s victory give Theresa May a winning hand

https://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/11/...-brexit-talks/ (external - login to view)

You will be all alone, afterward. Why should any of us beat a path to your door to trade with you? What is in it for us?
 
Blackleaf
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by Curious CdnView Post

You will be all alone, afterward. Why should any of us beat a path to your door to trade with you? What is in it for us?

Well why WOULDN'T you want to trade with us? Or, to be more precise, why would you stop trading with us? Canada already trades with the UK. The United Kingdom is Canada's third-biggest trading partner. In fact, the United Kingdom is BY FAR Canada's biggest European trading partner. You export around six times more to the UK than you do to your next biggest European trading partner Germany. Are you going to suddenly decide that you don't want to export to your lucrative UK market anymore? Total trade between Canada and UK is $25.2 billion annually. Between Canada and Germany it's just £18.8 billion annually.
 
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