Conrad Black blasts Mulcair over British criminal ‘cheap shot’

B00Mer

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Unrepentant and unbowed, former media baron and convicted felon Conrad Black insists he never asked the Harper government for help in returning to Canada and accuses the NDP’s newest leader of “demagogic rabblerousing” for alleging otherwise.

Lord Black, who gave up his Canadian citizenship years ago to obtain a British peerage, became a target for NDP Leader Thomas Mulcair after he secured a one-year temporary-resident permit from Ottawa even while still residing in a Florida jail.

The former newspaper magnate entered Canada May 4 after being released from a Florida prison where he had been serving a 42-month sentence for fraud and obstruction of justice.

In an interview with CBC’s The National, Lord Black maintains that he was unjustly convicted – “I was shafted.” – and says he’s working to try to overturn the convictions. “Keep in mind, I won 99 per cent of this case.”

He said after Mr. Mulcair attacked the temporary-resident permit in the Commons as special treatment for “Conservative cronies,” he had worried the Harper government might rescind it.

“I deliberately had absolutely no contact direct or indirect with anyone,” Lord Black said of Mr. Harper’s cabinet. “Yes, at times in the past, I’ve known the Prime Minister and the minister of immigration and a number of other prominent members of the government,” he said.

“[But] I said we will make no overture to them at all.”

He challenged Mr. Mulcair to step outside the Commons – where MPs enjoy parliamentary immunity for their comments – and accuse him of improper attempts to influence public figures.

“It would certainly be my pleasure to sue him for defamation.”

He said his lawyer, who dealt with Citizenship and Immigration, spoke to 30 officials and “every single one said ‘Yes, this man should be admitted.’ ”

The NDP Leader, who holds a French passport in addition to his Canadian one, has derisively referred to Lord Black as a “British criminal.”

Lord Black said he could call Mr. Mulcair “a French defamer” if he chose, “and with more justice.”

He said the NDP Leader’s “cheap shot” was unbecoming. “I remember Tommy Douglas and Dave Lewis and Ed Broadbent and Audrey McLaughlin. They never would have done anything like that.”

Lord Black, 67, said he would like to move beyond his conviction rather than being “stigmatized for life … like a medieval leper, with bells on my head to warn the unsuspecting of the approach of moral taint and turpitude.”

He said it’s “un-Canadian” to repeatedly bring up the conviction, calling it a “constant sadistic reference to my alleged status according to the trumped-up system of the palace of corruption and hypocrisy of a courthouse in Chicago.”

Lord Black said he would like to apply to regain his Canadian citizenship after the controversy has settled – “when it is clear that I don’t have cloven feet and horns” – but said he won’t do so if it prompted a major backlash.

“I [have] reached the age where I’m tired of being oppressed and I’m tired of being defamed and I am not going to do anything that is going to lead to gratuitously antagonistic people making apparently plausible claims that I am morally unsuited to be a citizen of this country.”

Lord Black, who did two stints in Florida prisons, said the toughest part of his second stay was just after he arrived. “The worst was when I just watched Barbara’s car drive away and thought to myself ... ‘Here I am back in one of these ghastly, stupid, banal American prisons for another eight months for things I didn’t do. I’m in my 60s and what the hell am I doing here?’ ”

Lord Black declined to revisit past criticism of the Harper government’s anti-crime agenda, saying that “since I am not technically a citizen, it’s not my place to come in here on a temporary resident permit and get up on a soap box and harangue the government.”

He rejected the notion that the misfortune of recent years represents a tragedy, suggesting those who hold that view are “not very good tragedians,” because “a tragedy is somebody who dies in a plane crash at the age of 28 or has a splendid career and completely destroys [it].”

Lord Black said he doesn’t plan to retire but was coy on what he’ll pursue beyond writing. “There’s some interesting prospects. But since they’re not public companies I don’t talk about them.”

Lord Black said people have repeatedly written him off only to have been proved wrong.

“There have been plenty of people prepared to announce that I was a flash in the pan or self-destructed or was finished or something. But I always disappoint them. I’ll go on doing that for a while.”

While he declined to attack the Conservative government’s crackdown on crime, Lord Black said he believes locking up non-violent offenders is wrong.

“It’s done because it’s always been done but it is nonsense. It is not the way to treat them. It’s horribly expensive. It’s tokenistic, fetishistic – and a matrix for the magnification of abuse and the exacerbation of sociopathic problems.”

He didn’t rule out returning to the U.S. one day, but said it wouldn’t be imminent.

“I would never say never and I assume that I will and time heals most wounds. But I have no ambition to go back anytime soon.”

Lord Black said he hungered for silence after the constant hubbub of prison life.

“When you’ve been even eight months, as I was, with constant noise, it’s amazing what a longing develops for such silence, pristine silence,” he said.

He said he intended to keep writing but couldn’t imagine using Twitter, the popular Internet-based messaging system, to tweet his thoughts. “The idea of twittering is bothersome to me.”

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Mulcair calls Conrad "British criminal", Conrad fires back calling Mulcair a "French defamer" ...

NDP's Mulcair will keep French citizenship | Canada | News | Toronto Sun
 

Praxius

Mass'Debater
Dec 18, 2007
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#1 - Who gives a rats ass what he says or thinks of our politicians? He's no longer a Canadian.... and

#2 - "He said after Mr. Mulcair attacked the temporary-resident permit in the Commons as special treatment for “Conservative cronies,” he had worried the Harper government might rescind it."

^ He kind of screwed his whole argument right there. If the Conservatives had nothing to do with granting him special treatment or the temp-residency, why would he be worried that the Harper Government might rescind it if they never granted it to him in the first place & had nothing to do with it?

“It would certainly be my pleasure to sue him for defamation.”

^ Of course he would.... anyway to make a quick buck and get his face in the media once again.

The NDP Leader, who holds a French passport in addition to his Canadian one, has derisively referred to Lord Black as a “British criminal.”

Lord Black said he could call Mr. Mulcair “a French defamer” if he chose, “and with more justice.”

Really? He holds dual-citizenship..... and is still a Canadian Citizen. Black is not. Oh but I suppose because Black tossed away his Canadian Citizenship to be a British Lord, then came crawling back to Canada to protect his arse from the consequences of his actions in the US, that makes him better?

He said it’s “un-Canadian” to repeatedly bring up the conviction, calling it a “constant sadistic reference to my alleged status according to the trumped-up system of the palace of corruption and hypocrisy of a courthouse in Chicago.”

FFS, he's spent way too much time in the US.... "Un-Canadian" cripes almighty was a cop out statement. "Un-American" and even here in Australia some politicians will say "Un-Australian"

WTF does that even mean?

Un-Canadian??? I didn't know there was one specific identity of what a Canadian is or should be..... Un-Canadian?

What would he know about it? He's not a Canadian and hasn't been one for quite some time.

And geez, he uses more big words and long winded statements than I do.

Lord Black declined to revisit past criticism of the Harper government’s anti-crime agenda, saying that “since I am not technically a citizen, it’s not my place to come in here on a temporary resident permit and get up on a soap box and harangue the government.”

Yet he has no problem targeting specific members of the government and telling us all what's "Un-Canadian"

While he declined to attack the Conservative government’s crackdown on crime, Lord Black said he believes locking up non-violent offenders is wrong.

“It’s done because it’s always been done but it is nonsense. It is not the way to treat them. It’s horribly expensive. It’s tokenistic, fetishistic – and a matrix for the magnification of abuse and the exacerbation of sociopathic problems.”

^ Well that didn't take long.

Anyways, I'm done reading that report.... just a load of hot air, over-use of fancy words to try and sound sophisticated and him contradicting himself.

Added:

By the way, Mulcair didn't say anything that wasn't true.... Black isn't Canadian, he's now British.... he's a convicted criminal, so "British Criminal" fits quite nicely, regardless if Black thinks he isn't one or not. He could try and sue, but sue for what? Defamation of Character?

His character is already screwed up by his own actions, Mulcair was just stating the obvious.
 
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damngrumpy

Executive Branch Member
Mar 16, 2005
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Why Harper would let this individual come back here is beyond me. We do not
have to take him back. He renounced his Canadian Citizenship for personal
gain. He is a foreigner now, with a record courtesy of the US Court system.
I don't think it was worth Mulcairs time to say anything about him either, it just
adds fuel to the fire. Harper and his Immigration Minister go to great lengths
to make it clear criminal elements are not welcome in Canada. Why would
we let in a person with a criminal record for the actions he conducted, and he
turned his back on Canada itself. Harper and Mulcair should get their act
together and work out a common approach to a response to this excuse for
a human being.. No I don't think Mulcair did the right thing, and I won't
condone Harper making an excuse to let him come back to Canada.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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Hard to say which is the worst of those two reprobates! :lol:

Why Harper would let this individual come back here is beyond me. We do not
have to take him back. He renounced his Canadian Citizenship for personal
gain. He is a foreigner now, with a record courtesy of the US Court system.
I don't think it was worth Mulcairs time to say anything about him either, it just
adds fuel to the fire. Harper and his Immigration Minister go to great lengths
to make it clear criminal elements are not welcome in Canada. Why would
we let in a person with a criminal record for the actions he conducted, and he
turned his back on Canada itself. Harper and Mulcair should get their act
together and work out a common approach to a response to this excuse for
a human being.. No I don't think Mulcair did the right thing, and I won't
condone Harper making an excuse to let him come back to Canada.

Methinks it has more to do with his money than him! :lol:
 

Machjo

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 19, 2004
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An interesting point to make here is that Conrad Black is denying his guilt in what he was charged for. Now while no justice system has ever been perfect and none ever will, and there will for ever be wrongful convictions (so there is not much we can do about that), it would seem that a more humble approach might be in order towards convicted criminals, whereby we acknowledge this potential flaw of the system so that once a person has served his sentence he not continue to be punished. Except in cases where there is a legitimate risk to society posed, should the immigration system not consider a sentence served to be the final price paid, possibly even for a wrongful conviction, or should society continue to punish the person?

Same with convicted rapists for instance. I remember one case of one man in Quebec who was wrongfully convicted of rape and who got a hard time from guards and inmates until the final overturn of his conviction. It was so bad the inmates who picked on him were remorseful enough to voluntarily apologize to him for what they'd done. As for the guards, I hope they got fired and maybe even charged if approapriate.

One would think that the sentence is the sentence and vigilantism ought not to be tolerated. If we think the law is not tough enough, then let's make it tougher, but it's not up to us, and especially not the immigration system, to be judge, jury and executioner.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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I watched the interview with Peter Mansbridge and while not able to draw any definite conclusions, I think my opinion of Mr. Black improved by 5%. Of course about a lot of things he said I have no idea whether he is telling the truth or lying. One thing for sure he was convicted of two crimes in the U.S. and served his sentence in the U.S. He says it was all bogus, which does correspond to other peoples' opinion of the U.S. justice system (Ya can't suck and blow at the same time) He owns substantial real estate in Canada on which he presumably pays a fair amount of tax. I'm sure he's not sucking on the public tit while he's here and presumably helps the local economy. I don't see him as a hazard to the public (as long as they don't give him money to invest for them) LOL. I think Mulcair should have "bigger fish to fry" to earn his tax supported keep and until he's fried those fish should perhaps keep his big trap shut. Black may well be an arrogant, supercillious S.O.B. but THAT isn't against the law.
 

TenPenny

Hall of Fame Member
Jun 9, 2004
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Why Harper would let this individual come back here is beyond me. We do not
have to take him back. .

Why should Harper make any decisions about this guy?

Do what they did - make sure that it's handled exactly by procedure, by all the sniverl servants, and make sure that no politicians are involved in any way.

No politician would get involved in this case, it's way too touchy. The best thing to do is stay far away, and let the rules be rules.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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Why should Harper make any decisions about this guy?

Do what they did - make sure that it's handled exactly by procedure, by all the sniverl servants, and make sure that no politicians are involved in any way.

No politician would get involved in this case, it's way too touchy. The best thing to do is stay far away, and let the rules be rules.

Yeah, I'm not sure what Black has done to Grumpy except possibly help to lighten his tax bill. LOL (Ya don't want to cut your nose off to spite your face)
 

#juan

Hall of Fame Member
Aug 30, 2005
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Why Harper would let this individual come back here is beyond me. We do not
have to take him back. He renounced his Canadian Citizenship for personal
gain. He is a foreigner now, with a record courtesy of the US Court system.
I don't think it was worth Mulcairs time to say anything about him either, it just
adds fuel to the fire. Harper and his Immigration Minister go to great lengths
to make it clear criminal elements are not welcome in Canada. Why would
we let in a person with a criminal record for the actions he conducted, and he
turned his back on Canada itself. Harper and Mulcair should get their act
together and work out a common approach to a response to this excuse for
a human being.. No I don't think Mulcair did the right thing, and I won't
condone Harper making an excuse to let him come back to Canada.

For God's sake, Conrad Black is a member of the Canadian Privy Council. He
is a member of the Order of Canada. Cretien forced Black to give up his Canadian
citizenship in order to accept a Peerage from the Queen. Black is still fighting
criminal charges he claims are wrong.......I think we can give him the benifit
of the doubt until the charges are settled.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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For God's sake, Conrad Black is a member of the Canadian Privy Council. He
is a member of the Order of Canada. Cretien forced Black to give up his Canadian
citizenship in order to accept a Peerage from the Queen. Black is still fighting
criminal charges he claims are wrong.......I think we can give him the benifit
of the doubt until the charges are settled.

I'm kind of with you on this one, #Juan. As detestable and unsavory as he might appear to some we have to be careful about ad hominum opinions. :smile:
 

coldstream

on dbl secret probation
Oct 19, 2005
5,160
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Chillliwack, BC
I watched a bit on this of CBC. What bugged me was the whole temper of the interview. With Peter Mansbridge at his fawning, patronizing best... making a pilgimage to Black's palatial digs in Toronto.. as one would visit an elder statesman, too lofty to demand he show up to the studio for an interview.

I mean.. come on.. this is a convicted felon, a failure at everything he's done in his life.. whose victimized thousands of Canadian workers through incompetence, ambition and greed. He forsook Canadian citizenship for the lure of the filthy lucre of a British Title.

He struck me as the bloated old windbag he is.. blustering and pontificating with his threadbare, self absorbed logic.. and filled with indignance of the 'injustice' that's been inflicted on him. A pudgy rich kid whose lived his life in the lap of luxury, and has never grown up to responsible citizenship.

Good grief, Conrad.. they let you back in the country... why don't you just shut up now. :roll:
 
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JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
75,301
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Vernon, B.C.
I watched a bit on this of CBC. What bugged me was the whole temper of the interview. With Peter Mansbridge at his fawning, patronizing best... making a pilgimage to Black's palatial digs in Toronto.. as one would visit an elder statesman, too lofty to demand he show up to the studio for an interview.

I mean.. come on.. this is a convicted felon, a failure at everything he's done in his life.. whose victimized thousands of Canadian workers through incompetence, ambition and greed. He forsook Canadian citizenship for the lure of the filthy lucre of a British Title.

He struck me as the bloated old windbag he is.. blustering and pontificating with his threadbare, self absorbed logic.. and filled with indignance of the 'injustice' that's been inflicted on him. Good grief, Conrad.. they let you back in the country... why don't you just shut up now. :roll:

What crimes was he convicted of in Canada? He holds the Order of Canada, he owns real estate here he no doubt pays taxes on. Perhaps you could provide a link to the Canadian workers he victimized. Does he really deserve being denied access to Canada, as arrogant and objectionable as he may seem?
 

Machjo

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 19, 2004
17,878
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Ottawa, ON
I watched a bit on this of CBC. What bugged me was the whole temper of the interview. With Peter Mansbridge at his fawning, patronizing best... making a pilgimage to Black's palatial digs in Toronto.. as one would visit an elder statesman, too lofty to demand he show up to the studio for an interview.

I mean.. come on.. this is a convicted felon, a failure at everything he's done in his life.. whose victimized thousands of Canadian workers through incompetence, ambition and greed. He forsook Canadian citizenship for the lure of the filthy lucre of a title.

He struck me as the bloated old windbag he is.. blustering and pontificating with his threadbare, self absorbed logic.. and filled with indignance of the 'injustice' that's been inflicted on him. Good grief, Conrad.. they let you back in the country... why don't you just shut up now. :roll:

That's what the legal system is for. He paid the price for crimes he may or may not have committed. Even if he did commit them, he was convicted and has paid the legal price. Certainly he's allowed to stay in the country of his birth, and who are we to be judge, jury and executioner for his crimes?
 

coldstream

on dbl secret probation
Oct 19, 2005
5,160
27
48
Chillliwack, BC
What crimes was he convicted of in Canada? He holds the Order of Canada, he owns real estate here he no doubt pays taxes on. Perhaps you could provide a link to the Canadian workers he victimized. Does he really deserve being denied access to Canada, as arrogant and objectionable as he may seem?


The Order of Canada has been a joke for a long time. It's given to mass murderers like Henry Morgentaler.. or imcompetent nitwits like Jean Chretien. It's a political payoff.. or an attempt to give legitimacy to a political agenda.

Black ran Massey Ferguson into the ground, Dominion Stores the same thing after he failed in his attempt to loot their pension fund. He came out of Argus Corporation, under Bud McDougall one of the great parasitic pirate enterprises that took over viable Canadian companies, like Canadian Breweries and drained them of their lifeblood by drawing out their operating funds while investing nothing back in research, equipment or expansion. It's from this that his wealth originates.. but it still wasn't enough for his ego.

With Radler he took over community papers.. fired their staffs.. detroyed their local character to make them outlets for pontification on global issues. The only thing he attempted to start, the National Post, to broadcast his politics, ended up in bankruptcy and other ownership within a few years.

I don't care if he stays here. I just object to the CBC treating like a visiting Royal.
 
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JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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The Order of Canada has been a joke for a long time. It's given to mass murderers like Henry Morgentaler.. or imcompetent nitwits like Jean Chretien. It's a political payoff.. or an attempt to give legitimacy to a political agenda.

Black ran Massey Ferguson into the ground, Dominion Stores the same thing after he failed in his attempt to loot their pension fund. He came out of Argus Corporation, under Bud McDougall one of the great parasitic pirate enterprises that took over viable Canadian companies, like Canadian Breweries and drained them of their lifeblood by drawing out their operating funds while investing nothing back in research, equipment or expansion. It's from this that his wealth originates.. but it still wasn't enough for his ego.

With Radler he took over community papers.. fired their staffs.. detroyed their local character to make them outlets for pontification on global issues. The only thing he attempted to start, the National Post, to broadcast his politics, ended up in bankruptcy and other ownership within a few years.

I don't care if he stays here. I just object to the CBC treating like a visiting Royal.

As for Morgantaler, I agree with you. I happen to think Chretien (unlike Trudeau) is a great Canadian. But anyway before any more Orders of Canada are handed out maybe the powers that be should check with you first. Where do I look on line for all the money he stole from the companies you list?
 

TenPenny

Hall of Fame Member
Jun 9, 2004
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Given that the CBC is considered a left wing Conservative hating horrible place, how come they were 'fawning' all over Conrad Black?

Has the CBC been taken over by Conservative minions?
 

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
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He kind of screwed his whole argument right there. If the Conservatives had nothing to do with granting him special treatment or the temp-residency, why would he be worried that the Harper Government might rescind it if they never granted it to him in the first place & had nothing to do with it?
Because the Minister in charge can override the simple servants.
 

#juan

Hall of Fame Member
Aug 30, 2005
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Because the Minister in charge can override the simple servants.

Right. If you're in a country as a guest, you should probably try not to piss off the government of that country.