Native girl punished for speaking her language


DaSleeper
+1
#31
Quote: Originally Posted by WLDBView Post

Ha! No. It was weird though at the time. There was an english and french school in one building. We were pretty segregated for some reason. Made absolutely no sense to me then and now.

We also had a separate school(Catholic) I went to from grade 5 to 8 that had an English wing and a French wing and I don't know if they actualy encouraged us to mix, but the only reprimand I ever got by a teacher at recess, since that was where I learned English, was to be corrected when I would pronounce a word wrong, such as "De" instead of "The"

Pity I didn't learn English earlier, because I still have a heavy French accent, while my daughter who started learning at three, has no accent at all.
 
Machjo
#32
Quote: Originally Posted by IdRatherBeSkiingView Post

Wow. Just wow.

I wonder how many people are repremanded for speaking Spanish in the USA?

And if you are going to be stupid, at least have the balls to stand behind it. Benching her for unknown reasons is just lame and cowardly.

Even that would have been bad enough. But here we're talking about the local indigenous language, probably even an endangered language. Any language language is to be given any precedence, the local indigenous language ought to rate pretty high up there.

First off, this girl made the effort to learn English to communicate with her teachers and classmates, who did not reciprocate in the least. And then she's reprimanded for teaching them some of her language in return!

I'm still trying hard to censor myself here, but I'm just flabbergasted at the imperialist mindset here. Reminds me of Kipling's poem:


Take up the White Man’s burden—
Send forth the best ye breed—
Go send your sons to exile
To serve your captives' need
To wait in heavy harness
On fluttered folk and wild—
Your new-caught, sullen peoples,
Half devil and half child
Take up the White Man’s burden
In patience to abide
To veil the threat of terror
And check the show of pride;
By open speech and simple
An hundred times made plain
To seek another’s profit
And work another’s gain
Take up the White Man’s burden—
And reap his old reward:
The blame of those ye better
The hate of those ye guard—
The cry of hosts ye humour
(Ah slowly) to the light:
"Why brought ye us from bondage,
“Our loved Egyptian night?”
Take up the White Man’s burden-
Have done with childish days-
The lightly proffered laurel,
The easy, ungrudged praise.
Comes now, to search your manhood
Through all the thankless years,
Cold-edged with dear-bought wisdom, The judgment of your peers!

Or maybe this gem of Kipling's:

God of our fathers, known of old -- Lord of our far-flung battle line --Beneath whose awful hand we hold Dominion over palm and pine --Lord God of Hosts, be with us yet,Lest we forget -- lest we forget!The tumult and the shouting dies -- The Captains and the Kings depart --Still stands Thine ancient sacrifice, An humble and a contrite heart.Lord God of Hosts, be with us yet,Lest we forget -- lest we forget!Far-called our navies melt away -- On dune and headland sinks the fire --Lo, all our pomp of yesterday Is one with Nineveh and Tyre!Judge of the Nations, spare us yet,Lest we forget -- lest we forget!If, drunk with sight of power, we loose Wild tongues that have not Thee in awe --Such boastings as the Gentiles use, Or lesser breeds without the Law --Lord God of Hosts, be with us yet,Lest we forget -- lest we forget!For heathen heart that puts her trust In reeking tube and iron shard --All valiant dust that builds on dust, And guarding calls not Thee to guard.For frantic boast and foolish word,Thy Mercy on Thy People, Lord! Amen.

While Kipling might be worth reading to give us a better understanding of the imperialist mindset, he's not appropriate reading for the purpose of adopting said mindset. Seems these Kipling fans didn't understand this.
 
petros
#33
Quote: Originally Posted by TenPennyView Post

Is that germane to the issue? Did she get reprimanded for talking in class, or for speaking another language?

Good question. Can you answer it?
 
DaSleeper
#34
Quote: Originally Posted by petrosView Post

Good question. Can you answer it?

Quoting the article the teacher's question was "How would you like it if I spoke Polish and you didn’t understand?"

That should answer the question.. non?

Edit: While, beeing francophone, I have meet many "Anglos" who were rather obtuse about language.....I have met just as many "Francophones" who were just as obtuse, equating language with religion
 
petros
#35
Was it math class? History class or was it Menominee class?
 
TenPenny
#36
Quote: Originally Posted by petrosView Post

Good question. Can you answer it?

Can you read?
 
petros
#37
Sure thing Mr Dupeck but big chunks of the "story" are missing.
 
karrie
+2
#38
I personally really wouldn't be calling for anyone's heads without having witnessed the tone of the exchanges with the teacher, and future discussions. All kids have a great ability to explain to parents that they were 'just' doing one thing, while leaving out surrounding details that change the tone of a story immensely.

Using French phrases back and forth with one another during an English speaking class would have gotten me into just as much trouble in school with my teachers, especially if we were making a show (which I know, teenage girls never do, right?), of having our own exchange going on behind a teacher's back.
 
taxslave
#39
When my son was in elementary school in Pt.Hardy in the mid 80s thy were taught the local native language by one of the elders. Is the US THAT far behind us in education?
 
karrie
#40
Quote: Originally Posted by taxslaveView Post

When my son was in elementary school in Pt.Hardy in the mid 80s thy were taught the local native language by one of the elders. Is the US THAT far behind us in education?

I grew up in a town where at least 1/4 of the school were from the reserve... we had native culture segments in almost all of our classes (social studies, art, music, dance in phys. ed) but we never touched on language.
 
wulfie68
#41
Quote: Originally Posted by karrieView Post

I personally really wouldn't be calling for anyone's heads without having witnessed the tone of the exchanges with the teacher, and future discussions. All kids have a great ability to explain to parents that they were 'just' doing one thing, while leaving out surrounding details that change the tone of a story immensely.

Using French phrases back and forth with one another during an English speaking class would have gotten me into just as much trouble in school with my teachers, especially if we were making a show (which I know, teenage girls never do, right?), of having our own exchange going on behind a teacher's back.

This is the way I feel too. I grew up in an area with a large Cree population and some of the kids (white and aboriginal both)would use Cree insults/profanity, with the thought that they would get away with it because they wouldn't be understood, especially when dealing with new teachers, fresh out of university. Its the double-edged part of dealing with kids in multi-lingual situations. Now the girl and her family claim her actions were all innocent but how is the teacher supposed to know what is being said? I'm willing to bet teachers fluent in the native dialect aren't so common as to make it a reasonable job requirement for that area...
 
petros
#42
Quote: Originally Posted by karrieView Post

I grew up in a town where at least 1/4 of the school were from the reserve... we had native culture segments in almost all of our classes (social studies, art, music, dance in phys. ed) but we never touched on language.

There are language progams out the **** for kids in SK . Everything from Dene to Hindi but it doesn't interrupt math class.
 
IdRatherBeSkiing
#43
Quote: Originally Posted by karrieView Post

I personally really wouldn't be calling for anyone's heads without having witnessed the tone of the exchanges with the teacher, and future discussions. All kids have a great ability to explain to parents that they were 'just' doing one thing, while leaving out surrounding details that change the tone of a story immensely.

I don't think they have asked for her head just an apology (from what I have read).
 
karrie
+1
#44
Quote: Originally Posted by IdRatherBeSkiingView Post

I don't think they have asked for her head just an apology (from what I have read).

I read more than one comment in here calling for the firing of assorted people. Which just seems heavy handed considering it's a 'she said she said' case.
 
petros
#45
"My little "princess" would never cause a ruckus in class. She's an "angel"....I'm going to make sure they stop picking on her..."
 
EagleSmack
#46
Quote: Originally Posted by damngrumpyView Post

In Canada we embrace multiculturalism and the more languages you can speak the more you
can fit into the world.

Unless like WLDB pointed out he got in trouble speaking English in a French School up there. Selective multiculturalism?
 
TenPenny
+2
#47
Ah.

 
EagleSmack
+1
#48
Quote: Originally Posted by damngrumpyView Post

This is a classic example of why America
has strayed from being a nation of opportunity and hope to a nation of fear and narrow mindedness
.

Canada News: Quebec language agency to go after companies with English names - thestar.com

Oh preach to us Grumpy...show us the way!

Quote: Originally Posted by TenPennyView Post

Ah.

I LOVE it!

LOVE IT!
 
#juan
#49
Quote: Originally Posted by machjoView Post

i'm really trying hard to censor myself right now!

Cultural and linguistic imperialism is still very much alive and well in north america i see. Not surprised in the least, but infuriated nonetheless.



Especially when they have doctorate degrees.

wtf??????????????????????????????????????
 
Machjo
#50
Quote: Originally Posted by #juanView Post

wtf??????????????????????????????????????

?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ????????????
 
skookumchuck
#51
I thought for a while that i was totally surrounded by PC bots, glad this thread had some thoughtful input.
 
earth_as_one
+1
#52
The US is a cultural melting pot, where you will be assimilated. Resistance is futile. Everyone will speak and act American.

Canada is multicultural. Which means we respect and preserve languages and cultures. (In theory)

I see First Nation language and Culture along the lines of unique family heirlooms passed on from generation to generation. If we loose native languages and cultures, we'll loose them forever and all Canadians and humanity will be poorer as a result. If the Americans don't want to keep First Nation cultures and languages alive, that's their loss and humanity's loss. IMO, irresponsible and short sighted.

Quote: Originally Posted by TenPennyView Post

Ah.

I interpret this as:

I'm proudly ignorant and want to stay ignorant. If I teach your children, they will become just as ignorant as I am or they will be punished.

I teach for a living and I expect that some students will know about certain topics than I do. If I'm wrong, I want them to challenge me and correct my ignorance. Over time, I become a better teacher.
 
EagleSmack
#53
Quote: Originally Posted by earth_as_oneView Post


Canada is multicultural. Which means we respect and preserve languages and cultures. (In theory)


In theory... but not in practice...

Montreal schools to make playgrounds and hallways French-speaking only zones | Mail Online
 
lone wolf
+1
#54
"I love you", "Hello" and "Thank-you"....

Even in another language, that's fightin' talk to some....
 
EagleSmack
#55
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

"I love you", "Hello" and "Thank-you"....

Even in another language, that's fightin' talk to some....

Reminds me of that Steve Martin movie where he is a mobster in the witness protection program...

"Have a nice day!"

"Hey F*** You!"
 
lone wolf
+1
#56
I've smiled and said "F*** you very much" ... and left folk wondering....
 
Cannuck
-1
#57
Quote: Originally Posted by DaSleeperView Post

Edit: While, beeing francophone...

That sure explains alot.
 
Machjo
#58
Quote: Originally Posted by earth_as_oneView Post

The US is a cultural melting pot, where you will be assimilated. Resistance is futile. Everyone will speak and act American.

Canada is multicultural. Which means we respect and preserve languages and cultures. (In theory)

I see First Nation language and Culture along the lines of unique family heirlooms passed on from generation to generation. If we loose native languages and cultures, we'll loose them forever and all Canadians and humanity will be poorer as a result. If the Americans don't want to keep First Nation cultures and languages alive, that's their loss and humanity's loss. IMO, irresponsible and short sighted.

Canada is just as assimilationist but just does it with a friendly smile. Most of Canada's indigenous languages are at high risk of extinction as is, with official bilingualism simply being a double burden on them, which essentially is even worse than the US' single burden of English.
 
DaSleeper
+4
#59
Quote: Originally Posted by CannuckView Post

That sure explains alot.

A rhetorical question in plain englais ......just for you....

"Are you always such an arsehole Jim"?
 
EagleSmack
#60
Quote: Originally Posted by MachjoView Post

Canada is just as assimilationist but just does it with a friendly smile. Most of Canada's indigenous languages are at high risk of extinction as is, with official bilingualism simply being a double burden on them, which essentially is even worse than the US' single burden of English.

Shhhhhh Machjo... not so loudly. You'll ruin their self righteousness feelings about themselves.
 

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