Expand burka ban, says Muslim group


Goober
#31
Quote: Originally Posted by dumpthemonarchyView Post

You are one of those people who think, "If he does/says this, it means that." And only that. There is no alternative. You people get such a reflexive reaction to a policy that is supposed to generate glorious praise and are confused when someone reacts differently to the norm. I'm guessing you break out into a cold sweat quite a bit recently.

Our immigration policy has been foolish for 20 years, yet it is exalted as multicultural piety to make up for past sins of colonialsim and racism. And now we're taking in immigrants from durka countries like Afghanistan were women are traded for sheep. Canada is going durka brained.

I was born here, one parent was an immigrant, but I am not.

Immigration is on Harpers agenda for reform. We all know there are problems with the system, but lowering immigration when we are facing a demographic change of taxpayers to people who draw govt pensions is ludicrous.
 
Spade
#32
We could help make more children, Goober?
 
dumpthemonarchy
#33
Quote: Originally Posted by GooberView Post

Immigration is on Harpers agenda for reform. We all know there are problems with the system, but lowering immigration when we are facing a demographic change of taxpayers to people who draw govt pensions is ludicrous.

It's a fallacy that we need immigration to keep us young, it won't work. We have won the race by getting rich before we get old. Here's an item I posted a while back.

We need to drastically cut the number of immigrants who are seniors because they are getting pensions and they haven't paid into them for decades. We have to worry about Canadians first, not Asia or Africa.




forums.canadiancontent.net/ne...opulation.html (external - login to view)


Not only is there no longer an economic argument for immigration, but immigration will not reverse population aging, what are called dependency ratios. Meaning more young people to pay for older people's pensions etc.


Mythbuster: The aging population (external - login to view)



Mythbuster: The aging population






By Sam Cooper, The Province October 16, 2011




The confidential federal government report “Canada’s Changing Demographics: The Impacts of Population Aging” listed several myths that need to be shot down in order to understand the changes that have just started to be unleashed in Canada and across the world.




Myth: Population aging is just about people getting older.

Fact: It is a change in population age structure, so that the share of older persons grows while the share of younger persons shrinks. Longer lifespans contribute, but lower fertility is the main driver.


Myth: In Canada, aging will end with the passing of the baby boom.

Fact: While the baby boom will contribute to the rapid speed of population aging over the next 20 years, population aging is likely to continue. In 2061, when the youngest surviving boomers will be 95, Canada will still have 25 per cent seniors, compared to 14 per cent in 2009.


Myth: Canada can reverse population aging through immigration.

Fact: Immigration rates would need to more than double and potentially quintuple to maintain current age-population “dependency ratios.”


Myth: Aging is just a trend in developed countries.

Fact: By 2050, populations in developing countries will be aging so rapidly they are likely to have the same proportion of seniors as developed countries do today. These trends will impact geopolitics, the global economy and trade, and immigration, meaning a race will be on for countries to “get rich before getting old.”

© Copyright (c) The Province
 
Goober
#34
Quote: Originally Posted by SpadeView Post

We could help make more children, Goober?

Yes I saw a few younger ladies today that I would volunteer my services.
 
Spade
#35
Just came back from a walk; too tuckered.
 
Goober
#36
Quote: Originally Posted by SpadeView Post

Just came back from a walk; too tuckered.

Plan ahead, shorter walk.
 
SLM
+3
#37
Personally I believe the burka is completely cultural and not religious in nature. I do think it is a tool of oppression and is used to subjugate women.

Having said that I fail to see how telling a woman what she cannot wear is any better than telling her what she has to wear. Banning it for those reasons is just as oppressive, imo. To say nothing of the fact that I would resent the hell out of Jason Kenney or any government official telling me what I can or cannot wear on my body.
 
lone wolf
+3
#38
Careful....

Bear's on. He'll be offerin' to be undergarmets....
 
Durry
#39
Quote: Originally Posted by SLMView Post

t I would resent the hell out of Jason Kenney or any government official telling me what I can or cannot wear on my body.

Well you are already being told what you have to wear, you can't walk around in the nude. It's against the law!! Try walking into a bank with a bag over your head!!!
You ever see those signs,,,must have shoes and a shirt to enter!!!

Wake up, the world is full of rules and laws inspire of your dream world ideology!!!
 
oleoleolanda
#40
I go back and forth on whether burkas and niqabs should be banned from publically funded places (I don't think there can be an alright ban). On the one hand, I don't think the gov't should be passing laws that dictate what people can or cannot wear. On the other hand the burka is a cloth prison, a symbol of Islamism in many ways, and it is related to horrible inhumanity and human rights abuses against women in countries where women are killed and oppressed. And I think it can be a safety issue, although in most cases it won't be. I find it a very difficult issue to make up my mind on. I'd like to see the end of the burka and niqab worldwide but I think education and exposure to freedom and women's rights is what will ultimately bring that about rather than legislation.

Quote: Originally Posted by DurryView Post

Well you are already being told what you have to wear, you can't walk around in the nude. It's against the law!! Try walking into a bank with a bag over your head!!!
You ever see those signs,,,must have shoes and a shirt to enter!!!

Wake up, the world is full of rules and laws inspire of your dream world ideology!!!

This is true too! It's a good point. Argh... my internal debate on this continues...
 
Durry
#41
Quote: Originally Posted by oleoleolandaView Post

I'd like to see the end of the burka and niqab worldwide but I think education and exposure to freedom and women's rights is what will ultimately bring that about rather than legislation.

Don't count on education and freedom to have any influence on these people. We're talking about a religious issue,,,,for them.... Look at the Sikhs, have you seen any changes here???
People need to be told and given an option...full stop !!!!

The test should always be, is it in the public good and interest. Then just go ahead and make the laws/changes. !!!
 
gerryh
#42
Quote: Originally Posted by DurryView Post

Don't count on education and freedom to have any influence on these people. We're talking about a religious issue,,,,for them.... Look at the Sikhs, have you seen any changes here???
People need to be told and given an option...full stop !!!!


What about the Sikhs?
 
damngrumpy
#43
In this case let us look at the concept of the burka and religion. The burka is not
part of the religious dress, it is part of traditions and customs therefore in this case,
it is not hateful and the Islamic community supports getting rid of the burka in Canada.
While I think there is more important issues for Canada it could be part of a discussion
without being considered hateful. The Islamic Community seems to want this one
debated. I have heard other conversations on radio with regard to this. It is too bad
that even mentioning such a thing brings out the worst in some people.
 
Durry
#44
Quote: Originally Posted by damngrumpyView Post

that even mentioning such a thing brings out the worst in some people.

It also provides an opportunity to bring out the best in some people.... !!!
 
SLM
#45
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

Careful....

Bear's on. He'll be offerin' to be undergarmets....

Lol.

Quote: Originally Posted by DurryView Post

Well you are already being told what you have to wear, you can't walk around in the nude. It's against the law!!

Not entirely true. I can go topless if I choose to.

Quote:

Try walking into a bank with a bag over your head!!!
You ever see those signs,,,must have shoes and a shirt to enter!!!

Wake up, the world is full of rules and laws inspire of your dream world ideology!!!

I wish I could wake up as you're quite the nightmare.

Quote: Originally Posted by oleoleolandaView Post

I go back and forth on whether burkas and niqabs should be banned from publically funded places (I don't think there can be an alright ban). On the one hand, I don't think the gov't should be passing laws that dictate what people can or cannot wear. On the other hand the burka is a cloth prison, a symbol of Islamism in many ways, and it is related to horrible inhumanity and human rights abuses against women in countries where women are killed and oppressed. And I think it can be a safety issue, although in most cases it won't be. I find it a very difficult issue to make up my mind on. I'd like to see the end of the burka and niqab worldwide but I think education and exposure to freedom and women's rights is what will ultimately bring that about rather than legislation.

I don't disagree that's it's symbolic (from my point of view) of human rights abuses against women, but I still fail to see how forcing a woman not to wear it is any better than forcing her to wear it. As far as passing laws dictating what people can or cannot wear, it just seems like way too slippery of a slope to me. What is or could be next? Slogans on tee-shirts? Tattoos and piercings? Where does the line sit with regards to individual expression vs the collective "public good"?
 
petros
#46
Ban toques in summer.
 
SLM
#47
Quote: Originally Posted by petrosView Post

Ban toques in summer.

And flip flops in winter.
 
Spade
#48
Quote: Originally Posted by petrosView Post

Ban toques in summer.

Good point!

On the same theme, I don't believe anyone over the age of fifty should be permitted to wear spandex. There ought to be a law. Yes, I know some will argue that this is a matter of religious freedom, that this is a Christian country, and that those who disapprove of spandex on the elderly should go back where they came from. But really! It's is offensive enough to see spandex on a younger cyclist, but a senior jogger, really!

Those immigrating to this peaceable kingdom must be told that if they want to enjoy the benefits of Canadian citizenship, no spandex on the overly mature. Certainly, it should not be allowed even as Sunday-go-to-meeting attire, at citizen-swearing-in ceremonies, schools, airports, or government offices.

Really it's not that I am bigotted, but if we were visiting their country, would we be allowed to wear stripes and polkadots? What's good for the duck, is good for the drake!

Please, Mr. Baird, open a Freedom-from-Spandex Office.
 
petros
#49
If a black long robe is hiding hideous cottage cheese, then what's the problem?
 
earth_as_one
+1
#50
Quote: Originally Posted by dumpthemonarchyView Post

Good idea. But a simpler one is to take in far fewer immigrants for a few decades. Then we will have fewer issues like this to worry about . Or issues like the Toronto 18, honour killings, or a growing imbalance in males over females in urban areas in the country due to growing ethnic enclaves.



Expand burka ban, says Muslim group | Canada | News | Toronto Sun...

How many of the Toronto 18 wore Burkas? I don't think any did. So what you are really getting at is that Canada should be hostile towards Muslims in general, and you think a good place to start is by needlessly harassing Muslim women.

I support the right of Canadians to freely choose what they want to wear or not wear without state interference, provided their choice doesn't affect anyone else or create a safety hazard,
 
petros
#51
Quote: Originally Posted by earth_as_oneView Post

I support the right of Canadians to freely choose what they want to wear or not wear without state interference, provided their choice doesn't affect anyone else or create a safety hazard,

I really really really don't want or need to see a gunt.

Do you?
 
earth_as_one
#52
Not particularly, but we don't need the fashion police. Live and let live. I am against criminalizing items of clothing.

BTW, it sounds like you support some women wearing a burka even if they aren't Muslim, depending on how fat and ugly they are.
 
petros
#53
Quote: Originally Posted by earth_as_oneView Post

Not particularly, but we don't need the fashion police. Live and let live. I am against criminalizing items of clothing.

BTW, it sounds like you support some women wearing a burka even if they aren't Muslim, depending on how fat and ugly they are.

We already have fashion police and you can spend time in the hoosegow for wearing certain clothing.. You never knew that?
 
Durry
#54
Quote: Originally Posted by SLMView Post


Not entirely true. I can go topless if I choose to.
od"?

No you can't, only men can go topless. Women can't even tan on a beach topless.
As usual, women have to be controlled !!! LOL !!

Quote: Originally Posted by petrosView Post

We already have fashion police and you can spend time in the hoosegow for wearing certain clothing.. You never knew that?

No, I didn't know that, what kind of clothing??
 
petros
#55
Quote: Originally Posted by DurryView Post

No, I didn't know that, what kind of clothing??

Everything from track suits to denim.
 
SLM
#56
Quote: Originally Posted by DurryView Post

No you can't

Not true, there have been a number of successful court cases.

Quote:

only men can go topless.

Many of whom have larger mammary glands too.

Quote:

As usual, women have to be controlled !!! LOL !!

As usual, a paragon of enlightenment.
 
Durry
#57
Quote: Originally Posted by SLMView Post

Not true, there have been a number of successful court cases.
url]

They only applied to specific cases. It's not law!!
Can't bear your boobs on public !!! It's still against the law!! *sigh*, the things we men have to address to maintain a civil society !!!

Errr clarification ,,,,,"reasonable men" !!
 
Just the Facts
#58
Yes in Ontario at least, women can be topless in public as long as it is not in a sexual context. So you can't be spinning around topless on a stripper pole, but you can shed your top on a hot day.

As for Burkas I thought they always were illegal, there was a law called "wearing a disguise" that applied to covering your face or hiding your identity. The only exceptions in the law were halloween and thespians....so a street performer or a clown could dress up, but that's about it.

Maybe they did away with that law. I'd be interested if anyone else had heard of this.
 
SLM
+3
#59
Quote: Originally Posted by DurryView Post

They only applied to specific cases. It's not law!!

What effect do you think court decisions have on written law?

Quote:

Can't bear your boobs on public !!! It's still against the law!! *sigh*,

Once again, no it isn't.

And it isn't about 'bearing boobs' (unless your twelve) it's about freedom of choice. Not unlike the choice of what to wear.

Quote:

the things we men have to address to maintain a civil society !!!

Errr clarification ,,,,,"reasonable men" !!

A sentiment echoed by many members of the taliban no doubt.
 
Durry
#60
Quote: Originally Posted by SLMView Post


And it isn't about 'bearing boobs' (unless your twelve) it's about freedom of choice. Not unlike the choice of what to wear.
bt.

Ok, so can I walk around with my tools hanging out?? Where's my freedom of choice ???
 

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