Enbridge Northern Gateway Pipeline Is Unnecessary


petros
#31
Ever heard of heavy crude that is extracted conventionally from wells?


I don't want to live in the American desert where the solar power is. You can only send electricity so far down transmission wires before resistance makes it too weak to use.
 
Ron in Regina
+1
#32
Quote: Originally Posted by OmicronView Post

It's tar, and it's blended with sand. What else could it be called?

Oilsands?
 
petros
#33
Quote: Originally Posted by Omicron
It's tar, and it's blended with sand. What else could it be called?

Quote: Originally Posted by Ron in ReginaView Post

Oilsands?

Asphalt or bitumen work too.
 
Omicron
#34
Quote: Originally Posted by Ron in ReginaView Post

Oilsands?

Yeah, but it's not really oil-sands. It's been on the surface, so the light volatiles have evaporated, leaving the heavy stuff, aka tar.

And my issue is not that we are dealing with tar. My issue is that the leaders of the operation either can't see how to crack heavy hydrocarbons into more usable forms, or they have been seduced by Lucifer into doing everything the wrong way in order to accelerate Armagedon, because the faster that happens, the fewer souls get incorporated into God's brain.
 
petros
#35
Light vs Heavy Crude Oil

Light Crude oil is liquid petroleum that has low density and that flows freely at room temperature. It has low viscosity, low specific gravity and high API gravity due to the presence of a high proportion of light hydrocarbon fractions. It generally has a low wax content as well. On the other hand, heavy crude oil or extra heavy crude oil is any type of crude oil which does not flow easily. It is referred to as “heavy” because its density or specific gravity is higher than that of light crude oil. Heavy crude oil has been defined as any liquid petroleum with an API gravity less than 20°. Extra heavy oil is defined with API gravity below 10.0 °API (API gravity, is a measure of how heavy or light a petroleum liquid is compared to water. If its API gravity is greater than 10, it is lighter and floats on water; if less than 10, it is heavier and sinks. )

Light crude oil receives a higher price than heavy crude oil on commodity markets because it produces a higher percentage of gasoline and diesel fuel when converted into products by an oil refinery. Heavy crude oil has more negative impact on the environment than its light counterpart since its refinement requires the use of more advanced techniques an the use of contaminants.
The sweet light crude oil Western Texas Intermediate (WTI) is used as a benchmark in oil pricing.

More...

Canadian heavy oil production is centered in the greater Lloyminster region covering both sides of the Alberta-Saskatchewan border where companies enjoy year round access. Heavy oil is extracted from multiple-zone formations at shallow drill depth of 400-700 meters. To date, only 6.5% has been recovered from the 32 billion barrels of initial petroleum in place.


(external - login to view)Oil produced from the greater Lloydminster fields falls in the heavy oil category as it has API gravity between 10° and 22°. It’s called heavy because it does not flow easily; it’s a gooey type of crude. The API gravity measures how heavy or light petroleum liquid is compared to water. Anywhere above 10° floats on water and vice versa. Heavy oil producers suffer from a price differential of about 20% to WTI (West Texas Intermediate) prices because it results in less higher end products when refined (refining costs are thus higher). Producers believe the price differential should narrow with increased refining capacity and pipeline takeaway.


Even though heavy oil production lacks the “sex appeal” of tight oil extracted from shale, it remains a low risk high reward operation as the shallow drill depth translates into lower drilling costs and completion costs since mostly conventional vertical wells are drilled.

Sand free!
 
Omicron
#36
Quote:

Even though heavy oil production lacks the “sex appeal” of tight oil extracted from shale, it remains a low risk high reward operation

In other words... something good for lazy Capitalists.
Quote:

as the shallow drill depth translates into lower drilling costs and completion costs since mostly conventional vertical wells are drilled.

Petro, you're a great guy, but are you seriously telling me this is cheaper than collecting solar energy and hydrolyzing water?
 
petros
+1
#37
Quote: Originally Posted by OmicronView Post

In other words... something good for lazy Capitalists.

Petro, you're a great guy, but are you seriously telling me this is cheaper than collecting solar energy and hydrolyzing water?

Yup. Nothing gives more bang for the buck than oil. One drop vapourized can blow you to bits, Sunburn is far slower and more painful.

Capitalism makes people more ambitious not lazy.
 
Omicron
#38
Quote: Originally Posted by petrosView Post

Yup. Nothing gives more bang for the buck than oil. One drop vapourized can blow you to bits, Sunburn is far slower and more painful.

I don't believe it. I was able to fry ants with a sun-glass way more than fry them with matches.
Quote:

Capitalism makes people more ambitious not lazy.

No it doesn't. If it did, then why would they go for tar instead of sunlight. It's just a way for making it cheap to be lazy.

Capitalism is a handy way for making neanderthals feel like they have a job, but sometimes we need things done.
 
petros
#39
Quote: Originally Posted by OmicronView Post

I don't believe it. I was able to fry ants with a sun-glass way more than fry them with matches.
No it doesn't. If it did, then why would they go for tar instead of sunlight. It's just a way for making it cheap to be lazy.

Capitalism is a handy way for making neanderthals feel like they have a job, but sometimes we need things done.

Sunlight is unreliable and you have to live near a source of solar electricty, it stil takes oil to make solar electric panels and solar heat collectors, still takes oil to transport and maintain them, still takes huge amounts of oil to make and maintain the transmission equipment and most import it's takes oil to feed the planet.
 
mentalfloss
#40
Good stuff.

We'll live without it.
 
petros
+2
#41
Gilligan's Island...keep in mind the professor could make a bamboo lie detector but couldn't build a ****ing raft.
 
taxslave
+2
#42
Quote: Originally Posted by Ron in ReginaView Post

Can't sell Canadian oil to the American market for any more
than it's sold to the Canadian market. That's burried in the
NAFTA Argeement, I believe.

Also can't sell for less than in the domestic market. Thats called "dumping" Or at least thats what the US timber barons claim when ever our lumber is cheaper than they like.

The gist of the OP is that some in the US are concerned that Canada may find alternative markets for oil. That would leave them in the dark perhaps litterly and making less money. Canada OTH will win big time with more access to world markets and less dependence on the often fickle US market.
 
Kakato
#43
It's called bitumen and I highly doubt the stuff going through these lines will be the same stuff going through the lines at the oilsands to the plants,its very very abrasive as the sand is pure silica and pipe doesnt last longer then a few years before it's worn out.
Thats stuff so abrasive you will wear out a whole dozer undercarriage in about 1200 hours instead of the usual 12,000 or higher.
The oilsands arent slowing down on development and they cant handle what they have now so they will be building lines,money talks.
 
Dixie Cup
#44
Quote: Originally Posted by petrosView Post

Sunlight is unreliable and you have to live near a source of solar electricty, it stil takes oil to make solar electric panels and solar heat collectors, still takes oil to transport and maintain them, still takes huge amounts of oil to make and maintain the transmission equipment and most import it's takes oil to feed the planet.

The world will need oil for many years to come, that's for sure. As for tailing ponds, eventually they won't be required at all. New technology has made them a lot smaller in recent years and the goal is to not have them at all.
 
Kakato
#45
Quote: Originally Posted by Dixie CupView Post

The world will need oil for many years to come, that's for sure. As for tailing ponds, eventually they won't be required at all. New technology has made them a lot smaller in recent years and the goal is to not have them at all.

I worked a year on the TRO(Tailings reduction operation) and the company I was working for were experts at the new technology where the tailings are pumped out and mixed with a poly flocculent and then spread out over the beach part of the dry part of the pond.
When mixed with the poly it lets the MFT(mature fine tailings) release the water and this is spread out,farmed and aerated and in 18 days its dry and you can pump more MFT on it and repeat the cycle.
The reason the ponds have been there so long is the MFT wont release the water and evaporate,so without Poly injection it would take 30 years to reclaim a pond,now it can be done in 3 years.

Heres a few pics from me sunk out on pond 6 Suncor with a bulldozer and sinking fast.

tailings pond 6 | Facebook (external - login to view)
 
Highball
#46
I don't care what you call it the Canadian Oil Industry does have the capacity to refine this oil material. I too wonder why the need for a Pipeline? My only conclusion is those who are the majority investors have the financial ability to call the shots and do whatever it is (like build this Pipeline) and never even look back. I see it as a greed motivated project and the consideration to employ Canadian labor is not even a consideration. That is a move that I think will later come back to haunt those who are making the decisions.
 
Kakato
#47
Quote: Originally Posted by HighballView Post

I don't care what you call it the Canadian Oil Industry does have the capacity to refine this oil material. I too wonder why the need for a Pipeline? My only conclusion is those who are the majority investors have the financial ability to call the shots and do whatever it is (like build this Pipeline) and never even look back. I see it as a greed motivated project and the consideration to employ Canadian labor is not even a consideration. That is a move that I think will later come back to haunt those who are making the decisions.

When a refinery goes down at Suncor all the other operations run out of fuel to run the oilsands,shortages are very common when a plant goes down.I think Albertas maxxed out right now and cant build refinerys fast enough.
The investors in the oilsands include's most people who have mutual funds and many European oil companies who are building huge oilsands Extraction mines.
Total comes to mind,you can bet this will be exported.
 
petros
#48
Quote: Originally Posted by HighballView Post

I don't care what you call it the Canadian Oil Industry does have the capacity to refine this oil material. I too wonder why the need for a Pipeline? My only conclusion is those who are the majority investors have the financial ability to call the shots and do whatever it is (like build this Pipeline) and never even look back. I see it as a greed motivated project and the consideration to employ Canadian labor is not even a consideration. That is a move that I think will later come back to haunt those who are making the decisions.

Who are the big investors? You are. I am. All Canadians are.
 
Kakato
#49
Quote: Originally Posted by petrosView Post

Who are the big investors? You are. I am. All Canadians are.

Unless someones portfolio is strictly green funds chances are they are a shareholder in the oilsands. It's a delicious Irony I like to point out once in a while.
Never mind all the jobs the easterners are getting,better pay then the old days before the Cod got fished out.
 
petros
#50
Quote: Originally Posted by KakatoView Post

Unless someones portfolio is strictly green funds chances are they are a shareholder in the oilsands. It's a delicious Irony I like to point out once in a while.

Where our CPP money is invested. http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/da...0317_13fhr.txt
 
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