"3rd Party" booted out of Attawapiskat


Liberalman
#121
This is another example of the Conservative governments contempt for aboriginal rights in Canada.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/ottawa-notebook/without-saying-who-pays-ottawa-sends-modular-homes-to-attawapiskat/article2265827/

This government showed all Canadians that visible minorities, which for some reason include the aboriginals just, would not be tolerated when they have troubles.

The Canadian evacuation in the Middle East where they made Canadian citizens sign a paper that the rescued will pay back the money for the rescue.

They are doing the same to the aboriginals where they have to buy for government services like modular homes in a time of emergency.

This is a shameful way for a government to act.
 
Dixie Cup
#122
Quote: Originally Posted by IdRatherBeSkiingView Post

Still doesn't explain the discrepency between the chief's home and the rest. Presumably the same contractor?

Hmmm, good point - I would assume so but I don't know. This was about oh, 45 years ago or so. I was still pretty young. However, I assume his home was in better shape because he was the chief and because they literally didn't live upstairs - there was even a "fuzzy" rope across the door to the living room so that no one could go in. While they slept in the bedrooms upstairs, they lived downstairs - had a second kitchen and living area down there. The kitchen and livingroom upstairs was "spotless". The rug in the living room I remember was white and had a mauve-coloured sectional sofa - it was gorgeous!

I just thought it was really interesting.

JMO
 
Cannuck
#123
Attawapiskat stalling payments, government says - Politics - CBC News

Quote:

The federal government is firing back at the leadership of Attawapiskat, saying the third-party manager assigned to the remote northern Ontario community can't pay teachers until the chief and council provide more information.....


..."The third-party manager is ready to issue payroll cheques for essential services, such as teachers’ salaries, and will do so as soon as he is provided with the necessary information from the chief and council," Duncan said.

 
#juan
+2
#124
No matter what the feds do in Attawapiskat, it will fail. Whether we like it or not Canada runs on commerce. We
build things to sell, we grow stuff to sell, or we dig stuff out of the ground to sell. We can't indefinitely, have this
many of people getting a free ride without the possibility to better themselves. More correctly, we can't afford it.
Attawapiskat is just one of many such dumps that we throw money at with no hope that it will get better.
 
dumpthemonarchy
#125
I saw a similar story in BC, the chief of a BC Indian band on Vancouvere Island and showed similar horrors. He was asked if he lived on the reserve, he said no. Course not.

I read Chief Theresa Spence of the Attawapiskat does not live on her reserve either. Let's get serious here folks, she's no dummy, she won't live in squalor if she can help it.

Quote: Originally Posted by JLMView Post

These are fellow Canadians including seniors and children, lets systematically get the problem fixed once and for all and sort out the money later. As horrendous as the money management seems is it any worse than the Governor General with her huge entourage a few years ago tear assing over to Finland and half of the rest of world squandering $millions?

Those cultural trips are important, they are not a waste of money. Countries need to have cultural exchanges for artists and writers.
 
gerryh
#126
Quote: Originally Posted by dumpthemonarchyView Post


I read Chief Theresa Spence of the Attawapiskat does not live on her reserve either. Let's get serious here folks, she's no dummy, she won't live in squalor if she can help it.


More lies from the brainless bigot.
 
mentalfloss
#127
Attawapiskat warns it could miss payroll under third-party manager

First nations in the James Bay region of Northern Ontario say their housing crisis is deepening despite the federal government's recent response to Attawapiskat.

In a statement issued Thursday, the troubled Attawapiskat First Nation said it won't be able to make its January payroll unless the federal government shows more flexibility.

Many families are still living in tents and substandard shelters there. And now, essential services such as education are at risk because the $1.5-million earmarked for them has been placed in the hands of a government-appointed third party, according to a statement from the regional Mushkegowuk Council.

Neighboring Cree communities along James Bay are crying out for emergency help as well.

“With temperatures now in the minus 30s and 40s, the chiefs are now calling on the federal and provincial governments to take immediate action on the housing crisis in Fort Albany and Kashechewan as well,” the statement said.

The federal government contests almost every point in the council's statement.

Aboriginal Affairs Minister John Duncan said the third-party manager appointed by Ottawa to run Attawapiskat's finances will make sure all essential services are running smoothly and the bills are paid – as soon as the band starts co-operating with him and giving him the information he needs.

“As was addressed in a letter on January 4, 2012 to Chief [Theresa] Spence, the third-party manager is ready to issue payroll cheques for essential services, such as teachers, and will do so as soon as he is provided with the necessary information from the chief and council,” Mr. Duncan said in an emailed statement.

He said families no longer need to live in tents because the local healing lodge has been renovated. It now has running water, bathrooms and heat, and is ready to accept families who feel they need better shelter.

“We urge families that haven't done so to move into the vacant living space in the healing lodge as soon as possible,” Mr. Duncan said.

In other words, if they're still living in tents, it's their choice.

The new modular housing is on its way, with four of the 22 units already waiting in Moosonee, Ont., and another four due there by Friday, government officials said. They will be sent to Attawapiskat as soon as the winter road between Moosonee and the reserve is frozen solid.

Plus, work is underway to improve conditions at a large construction trailer that houses about 100 people, they added.

As for Fort Albany and Kashechewan, Mr. Duncan said he has been in contact with the chiefs and has extended $3.25 million for housing to Kashechewan in response to recent pleas.

The conflict between the government and the First Nations has degenerated and is probably in need of a mediator, said Charlie Angus, the NDP MP whose riding includes the James Bay reserves and who has advocated tirelessly for more federal services.

“Obviously there's a stand-off,” he said in an interview. “I think you need someone to come in to do some mediation.”

He said local Cree leaders are considering that option right now.

Some families are reluctant to move into the retrofitted healing centre because it has heating problems and because it is six kilometres outside of town, Angus explained.

The bigger issue behind the clash is the role of the third-party manager. Band leaders were led to believe that Ottawa only wanted him to take care of financing for housing, and would not take over all the band's financing, Angus said.

But the federal government contends that has never been the case, and that the third-party manager has a broader mandate to run the band's finances until the health and safety of the community are on the right track.

Spence has taken the dispute to court, asking for removal of the third-party manager. But the two sides are also trying to figure out how to move forward in a way that would allow the band at least some control over its finances.

The dispute, and conditions in the reserves, are being closely studied by the United Nations' special rapporteur on the rights of indigenous people, James Anaya.

On Thursday, Liberal aboriginal affairs critic Carolyn Bennett asked Mr. Anaya to pay specific attention to the numerous reports from the federal auditor general, as well as internal government audits and evaluations, that raise the alarm about First Nations housing.

“These reports confirm that the emergency situation in Attawapiskat is not an isolated incident, but rather the product of systemic failures of government policies and programs,” Ms. Bennett wrote to Mr. Anaya.

Ms. Bennett also noted that audits and evaluations have discredited the third-party intervention system as ineffective and not cost efficient.

Attawapiskat warns it could miss payroll under third-party manager - The Globe and Mail
 
#juan
#128
Quote: Originally Posted by gerryhView Post

More lies from the brainless bigot.


Hold on a bit here. The problems of the Attawapiskat are for the most part, self administered. To start with, we have Chief
Spence, her commonlaw husband, ( another chief)and the old chief. There are also another 16 of chief Spence's friends
who are also employed at the band office. The chief can afford all these extra employees as well as a hockey rink with a Zamboni,
but some of the people have to live in dreadful sheds patched up with cardboad boxes. I would have thought that any useful
chief would have sorted out the housing problems long before building a hockey rink and buying a Zamboni.....
 
gerryh
#129
Quote: Originally Posted by #juanView Post


Hold on a bit here. The problems of the Attawapiskat are for the most part, self administered. To start with, we have Chief
Spence, her commonlaw husband, ( another chief)and the old chief. There are also another 16 of chief Spence's friends
who are also employed at the band office. The chief can afford all these extra employees as well as a hockey rink with a Zamboni,
but some of the people have to live in dreadful sheds patched up with cardboad boxes. I would have thought that any useful
chief would have sorted out the housing problems long before building a hockey rink and buying a Zamboni.....


Juan, what lie did I call dumpy on? Are you saying that it wasn't a lie? Can YOU back up his accusation? Obviously he can't since he has ignored it.
 
#juan
#130
Quote: Originally Posted by gerryhView Post

Juan, what lie did I call dumpy on? Are you saying that it wasn't a lie? Can YOU back up his accusation? Obviously he can't since he has ignored it.

Jerry I wasn't getting at anyone in particular. i'm just getting fed up with this tiny town of what? 1800 people with three chiefs and another
16 people on the payroll and a budget of God knows how many million dollars a year to produce nothing. Just another complaining taxpayer..
 
gerryh
#131
Quote: Originally Posted by #juanView Post

Jerry I wasn't getting at anyone in particular. i'm just getting fed up with this tiny town of what? 1800 people with three chiefs and another
16 people on the payroll and a budget of God knows how many million dollars a year to produce nothing. Just another complaining taxpayer..


I agree there are problems and we need to get to the bottom of them. Morons like dumpy though, shovel lie after lie after lie, when there really is no need for it.

Concerning the "Zamboni"

www.attawapiskat.org/wp-conte...tawapiskat.pdf (external - login to view)
 
Cannuck
#132
Yup, $85,000 on a Zamboni while people are living in sheds....disgraceful. I can't understand how some folks can defend these people.
 
damngrumpy
#133
It is fine to go through the process of protesting a third party its the Canadian way
however in the end the Federal Government does have a responsibility not only
to the people without on the Reserve, they have a responsibility to Canadians in
general. There are a number of issues that appear to be swept under the rug and
they want it to stay that way.
What I think should happen is the Federal Government should freeze any more
Federal dollars to the reserve until they meet the criteria set out by the Government.
The time has come for the Feds to take action. That means, both from imposing its
financial will and at the same time to begin to assess the situation on the reserve
and what can be done to alleviate the problems for the people.
 
CDNBear
#134
Quote: Originally Posted by gerryhView Post

Morons like dumpy though, shovel lie after lie after lie, when there really is no need for it.

Especially in this case, where the reality is bad enough.
 
Kakato
#135
Quote: Originally Posted by CannuckView Post

Yup, $85,000 on a Zamboni while people are living in sheds....disgraceful. I can't understand how some folks can defend these people.

I'm pretty sure if you asked the residents if they would rather have a zamboni or food and shelter they would pick the latter,it's not their fault the way funding comes through.Funny how lots seem to focus on the zamboni and not a fix for the problem or a solution.

Maybe about 5% of the people commenting on this topic are offering solutions and the rest are trying to lay blame.
We tried to turn the natives into white men a long time ago and it didnt work,were still trying and it still is not working!
When some folks learn and understand their culture only then will we be able to understand them and why native relations just go downhill all the time.
.
 
Cannuck
#136
Quote: Originally Posted by KakatoView Post

We tried to turn the natives into white men a long time ago and it didnt work,

My my, what a racist thing to say.
 
Kakato
+2
#137
Quote: Originally Posted by CannuckView Post

My my, what a racist thing to say.

Sorry but it's the truth and if you got something to refute it with then by all means fill your boots.Your insult just shows how petty you are and also that you have nothing but an insult for a counter.
 
CDNBear
+2
#138
Quote: Originally Posted by KakatoView Post

Sorry but it's the truth and if you got something to refute it with then by all means fill your boots.Your insult just shows how petty you are and also that you have nothing but an insult for a counter.

Bingo.

I look forward to the ensuing cannuck dance, deflection and usual predictable BS.
 
JLM
+1
#139
Quote: Originally Posted by CDNBearView Post

Bingo.

I look forward to the ensuing cannuck dance, deflection and usual predictable BS.

Well, we know it's coming! No brains!
 
#juan
#140
Quote:

I'm pretty sure if you asked the residents if they would rather have a zamboni or food and shelter they would pick the latter,it's not their fault the way funding comes through.Funny how lots seem to focus on the zamboni and not a fix for the problem or a solution

It is not just one problem. As far as I can see the natives of Attawapiskat are their own biggest problem. They depend on permanent government handouts just to live. This is no way for anyone to live and Attawapiskat is one of the worst places to do it. It looks like all the northern native communities are in various stages of the same affliction.
 
Cannuck
#141
Quote: Originally Posted by KakatoView Post

Sorry but it's the truth and if you got something to refute it with then by all means fill your boots.

I don't have to refute it. It is what it is.
 
CDNBear
#142
I wish I could predict the lotto numbers as easily and with as much accuracy.
 
gerryh
+2
#143
Quote: Originally Posted by #juanView Post

It is not just one problem. As far as I can see the natives of Attawapiskat are their own biggest problem. They depend on permanent government handouts just to live. This is no way for anyone to live and Attawapiskat is one of the worst places to do it. It looks like all the northern native communities are in various stages of the same affliction.


They live on government treaty payments, not on handouts. Even if there was work up there for every single member, the payments would still have to be made.
 
JLM
+2
#144
There's two issues here- 1. Human beings living in deplorable conditions. 2. Questionable spending/accounting by those financially responsible.

YA FIX the first one A.S.A.P. and then over the course of a few months you get to the bottom of the second one and take whatever action is necessary (if there is) to fix that. BUT YOU DON'T HOLD UP ONE BECAUSE OF THE OTHER!
 
SLM
+2
#145
Quote: Originally Posted by gerryhView Post

They live on government treaty payments, not on handouts. Even if there was work up there for every single member, the payments would still have to be made.

That's the part that, for some unfathomable reason, seems to trip everybody up.

It's their money that they're being paid, not ours. Absolutely no reasonable discussion can be had, imo, until folks get that part through their thick skulls.
 
captain morgan
#146
Quote: Originally Posted by SLMView Post

That's the part that, for some unfathomable reason, seems to trip everybody up.

It's their money that they're being paid, not ours. Absolutely no reasonable discussion can be had, imo, until folks get that part through their thick skulls.


From a strictly accounting/finance point of view, the question still must be asked.

The situation that states that 'the money is theirs' is all well and good, however, the moment that they community requires financial input from the public purse, the opportunity arises to analyze exactly why that money is needed.
 
gerryh
+1
#147
Quote: Originally Posted by captain morganView Post

From a strictly accounting/finance point of view, the question still must be asked.

The situation that states that 'the money is theirs' is all well and good, however, the moment that they community requires financial input from the public purse, the opportunity arises to analyze exactly why that money is needed.



I'm curious, public service (government) employees are paid from the "public purse", are you at all concerned about "how" they spend the money they receive? Do you require an "accounting"?
 
captain morgan
+2
#148
Quote: Originally Posted by gerryhView Post

I'm curious, public service (government) employees are paid from the "public purse", are you at all concerned about "how" they spend the money they receive? Do you require an "accounting"?

No, that's their business, no different from the folks in Attawapiskat.

However, when that group (Attawapiskat or an 'employee') then relies on society to deal with (literally) a life or death situation due to the mismanagement of their personal finances, the existing system does require an accounting.
 
SLM
+1
#149
Quote: Originally Posted by captain morganView Post

From a strictly accounting/finance point of view, the question still must be asked.

The situation that states that 'the money is theirs' is all well and good, however, the moment that they community requires financial input from the public purse, the opportunity arises to analyze exactly why that money is needed.

I'm not saying it isn't a pertinent question. But that's a far cry from the very prevalent attitude that it's entirely some kind of welfare payment. That would be the attitude that needs to change, because that puts blinders on people. A lot of people.

It's like trying to discuss the province of Ontario with certain members of this forum that fund all the wild parties we welfare bums have here. Simply can't be done in a rational and grown up manner.
 
captain morgan
+1
#150
Quote: Originally Posted by SLMView Post

I'm not saying it isn't a pertinent question. But that's a far cry from the very prevalent attitude that it's entirely some kind of welfare payment. That would be the attitude that needs to change, because that puts blinders on people. A lot of people.

The only point I raise has to do with the dissemination of public funds to 'solve' a/any problem.

The community of Attawapiskat receives monies based on whatever deal that they made with the Feds.. That's their business and how they decide to spend it is also their business... That said, if level of funding is not sufficient, then there has to be an analysis to determine this and (hopefully) an appropriate level of funding can be negotiated.

On the other hand, if the funding level is appropriate, but the spending decisions were poor, then simply writing blank chaeues is not the solution or fair to the tax payer.

No matter how you cut it, it is (in my opinion that is) is Attawapiskat's best interests to have a 3rd party audit done to get a handle on the reality of the situation.

Quote: Originally Posted by SLMView Post

It's like trying to discuss the province of Ontario with certain members of this forum that fund all the wild parties we welfare bums have here. Simply can't be done in a rational and grown up manner.

... I'm still waiting for my invite. Do you have the right address for me?
 

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