Why Does Federal Govt Resist Free Trade For Consumers?

dumpthemonarchy

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Jan 18, 2005
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Why is it only corporations that get the direct benefit of free trade? Why can't consumers buy what they want in the USA without duties added on? Free trade for the little people. A good chance to reduce the federal bureacracy and lower the deficit.

Both countries would benefit, and border guards could actually worry about security and catching bad guys, rather than act like contract employees of Canadian business.



Canada should match U.S. exemptions for cross-border travellers - The Globe and Mail



Canada should match U.S. exemptions for cross-border travellers

KEITH HEAD and AMBARISH CHANDRA

We have learned this month that the Canadian government is resisting efforts by the United States to increase exemptions for cross-border travellers in both countries. We believe this is a mistake. Canada’s interests are generally better served by lower trade barriers with the United States. This is particularly true on the issue of barriers to cross-border shopping, a subject of our ongoing research.

Cross-border travellers must pay HST, and when applicable, duties, on purchases above their personal exemptions. Recent legislation in the United States would raise the exemption for its residents returning from a same-day trip abroad to $1,000 from the current $200. The current exemption for Canadians is zero. U.S. legislators would like to see exemptions raised for Canadians too. This no doubt serves the interest of U.S. businesses that sell to Canadians. But the primary beneficiaries of such an approach would be Canadian residents, as well as our beleaguered Canadian Border Services Agency.

The CBSA’s mandate includes determining the admissibility of travellers to Canada, enforcing border security, regulating the import of commercial goods and vehicles and collecting taxes and duties on imported goods. In a world of limited resources, requiring the CBSA to monitor and collect tariffs on small-scale purchases diverts its attention away from more vital functions; something that the CBSA admitted to the Senate in 2005.

Ottawa worries that higher personal exemptions would hurt domestic firms and reduce tax revenues. This is unsound reasoning on many levels. First, under NAFTA, most products manufactured in the United States or Mexico are not subject to Canadian duties. Therefore, the duties collected are on the small fraction of goods manufactured overseas. Indeed, a 2007 Senate report noted that customs revenues amounted to just $95-million annually – just 0.04 per cent of federal revenues.

Second, Canadians making purchases in the United States must still pay sales taxes at the point of purchase. While this tax revenue goes to U.S. governments rather than Canadian ones, it is not the case that Canadian retailers are at a huge disadvantage due to tax differences. Cross-border purchases pressure Canadian retailers to be more competitive and provide better, cheaper services to Canadian shoppers.

Third, and perhaps most importantly, we must recognize that public policy should be designed to benefit all Canadians, rather than a few large retailers. The currencies of resource exporters such as Australia, Canada and Brazil have appreciated sharply in recent years. We should all enjoy the higher standard of living the strong dollar entails, rather than allowing retailers to monopolize these benefits.

We recently studied the patterns of cross-border travel by Canadians over the past 40 years. We found that Canadian residents respond strongly to economic incentives created by fluctuating exchange rates. Despite zero exemptions for same-day trips, we find that Canadians travel much more to the United States when the dollar is strong. The scale of their reported purchases is small, but we find evidence that they purchase a wider range of products as the currency strengthens.

We have a clear choice: Treat Canadians as petty criminals for small-scale undeclared purchases of household products, and thereby increase the pressure on the CBSA; or relax exemptions and encourage Canadians and Americans to travel and trade more with each other.

In the decade since 9/11, American desire to secure its borders has transformed the nearly 9,000 km U.S.-Canada land border. This has created delays of commercial shipments, increased bureaucracy and paperwork including the requirement for passports, harassment of travellers, and confusion regarding cross-border travel regulations. For years, Ottawa has bemoaned this “thickening” of the U.S.-Canada border.

We find it disappointing, then, that Ottawa would resist the small but welcome effort by the United States to facilitate cross-border travel and trade. If common sense ever returns to the regulations governing the border, it will be due to economic forces. Therefore, we must embrace, rather than reject, the economic forces that drive the new U.S. thinking on this issue. Matching the $1,000 exemption would help Canadians realize greater gains from trade, while allowing CBSA to focus on its core mission.

Keith Head and Ambarish Chandra teach at the University of British Columbia’s Sauder School of Business.
 
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PoliticalNick

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Mar 8, 2011
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Why would anyone take hours of their life waiting in border line-ups and chance being picked for some random groping and searches to save a dollar or two. I would rather support my local economy and cross-border shopping doesn't do that.

I do agree though that free-trade should be more for the people than the corporations.
 

Unforgiven

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May 28, 2007
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I think most people do support their local economies for the most part and though I've only ventured across the border a few times lately, I do shop for things online in the US that is difficult to get here. Specific electronics for example. One place I ordered from not only beat local prices for the few things that were available here, they over all saved me hundreds, made it a one stop hassle free shopping experience and provided very accurate tracking and to my door delivery. Customs and delivery all included in one price at the check out.

Granted a limited and anecdotal offering but valid for what it is. I wouldn't want to spend the time traveling south to shop for that, but shopping online in the US has been a rewarding experience for me. Having some provision of what and how things can go wrong saves a lot of trouble later.
 

PoliticalNick

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I think most people do support their local economies for the most part and though I've only ventured across the border a few times lately, I do shop for things online in the US that is difficult to get here. Specific electronics for example. One place I ordered from not only beat local prices for the few things that were available here, they over all saved me hundreds, made it a one stop hassle free shopping experience and provided very accurate tracking and to my door delivery. Customs and delivery all included in one price at the check out.

Granted a limited and anecdotal offering but valid for what it is. I wouldn't want to spend the time traveling south to shop for that, but shopping online in the US has been a rewarding experience for me. Having some provision of what and how things can go wrong saves a lot of trouble later.
I can definitely understand your point. For me though I don't mind paying a little more for those things available locally. I shop at the locally owned hardware store instead of home depot, I shop at the locally owned grocery store instead of wal-mart or superstore, I buy parts from the local auto shop instead of NAPA, we use local butchers and farm markets. Does it cost me an extra few hundred bucks a year? Sure, but I feel like I contribute more to my community that way and it is worth the added cost.
 

dumpthemonarchy

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Sure, some retailers are going to lose, but not that many. It's just another form of tourism-and who's in favour of stopping that?

Economic globalization, sounds like it's for everyone who has money. Doesn't seem to be called corporate globalization. I like retail globalization.
 

damngrumpy

Executive Branch Member
Mar 16, 2005
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Why would people want to support another countries economy at the expense of their own?
Sure if you are visiting anyway and you buy some things fine, but to wait in line at a boarder
crossing to go save a bit on stuff you can buy here in Canada. The other thing that bothers
me is we complain there is not enough money for medicare and other programs. Well if we
support our own industries and we pay our sales taxes there would be more money for the
programs we are so fond of, in addition we support the Canadian way instead of supporting
jobs in another country I hope our government holds firm to the status quo
 

TenPenny

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Why should Canada match US regulations?

Consumers aren't treated any differently than corporations, in fact, Corporations don't get the tax-free import benefit that consumers get after a 48 hr visit to the US.

You're seriously suggesting that consumers should be able to go to the US, and bring back up to $1000, tax free, on a same-day trip? Pay no GST, HST, or PST? That would pretty much gut the sales tax revenue of most Canadian Provinces, with the exception of NS, PEI, and NL, which are too far from the border to make same-day trips an issue.
 

Unforgiven

Force majeure
May 28, 2007
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Why would people want to support another countries economy at the expense of their own?
Sure if you are visiting anyway and you buy some things fine, but to wait in line at a boarder
crossing to go save a bit on stuff you can buy here in Canada. The other thing that bothers
me is we complain there is not enough money for medicare and other programs. Well if we
support our own industries and we pay our sales taxes there would be more money for the
programs we are so fond of, in addition we support the Canadian way instead of supporting
jobs in another country I hope our government holds firm to the status quo

Sums it up for me.

Kenwood DNX7140 (DNX-7140) Double DIN w/ DVD Player, Bluetooth, Navigation and 6.95" Monitor

Kenwood 6.95" In-Dash Double-Din Car Video (DNX7160) : Double DIN - Best Buy Canada

Compare the two and the price.
 

TenPenny

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I've ordered stuff from the US and from HongKong, but I have no problem paying the taxes when the stuff comes in.

I don't see why consumers should be able to go to the US, spend $1000, come back the same day, and pay no taxes. I don't care where you buy your stuff, but you should have to pay the tax.
 

PoliticalNick

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Mar 8, 2011
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First you are comparing 2 different items DNX-7160 & DNX-7140 but lets just for a minute say they are the same.

By going down south you are now taking away support from a local store who employs local people. In other words you are creating work and employment outside Canada. If everyone who did their shopping on the web from the states shopped up here we could create more jobs. These extra employees contribute to our economy by adding to the tax revenues and spending their money and of course not collecting welfare or using other tax-funded resources. Will you still save a few Bucks for yourself? Most likely yes, but at the cost of Canadian jobs and the Canadian economy.

The way I see it you spend what you save on extra taxes to fund those who can't find work because you are sending their job to another country.
 

dumpthemonarchy

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Jan 18, 2005
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Why should Canada match US regulations?

Consumers aren't treated any differently than corporations, in fact, Corporations don't get the tax-free import benefit that consumers get after a 48 hr visit to the US.

You're seriously suggesting that consumers should be able to go to the US, and bring back up to $1000, tax free, on a same-day trip? Pay no GST, HST, or PST? That would pretty much gut the sales tax revenue of most Canadian Provinces, with the exception of NS, PEI, and NL, which are too far from the border to make same-day trips an issue.

People will spend a ton on gas to buy groceries in the USA? Doubt it. If it would help dismantle food marketing boards, I support it.

Here is an example of dental free trade. You can arrange a dental holiday in Mexico and save money. Let's ban travel to Mexico. I met a Chinese woman who traveled to Taiwan to get cheaper dental work, she is saving over $10,000. Our professional associations in Canada know how to keep themselves flush.
Canadians flock to Mexico for tooth care
 

TenPenny

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People will spend a ton on gas to buy groceries in the USA? Doubt it.


You might want to join the real world, then. I know of several families who travel over an hour (one way), at least once a month, to buy groceries in the US.

You might not want to believe it, but it happens all the time around here.

As far as dental travel, what does that have to do with your desire to have $1000 same-day trip allowances on purchases in the US?
 

Unforgiven

Force majeure
May 28, 2007
6,770
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First you are comparing 2 different items DNX-7160 & DNX-7140 but lets just for a minute say they are the same.

By going down south you are now taking away support from a local store who employs local people. In other words you are creating work and employment outside Canada. If everyone who did their shopping on the web from the states shopped up here we could create more jobs. These extra employees contribute to our economy by adding to the tax revenues and spending their money and of course not collecting welfare or using other tax-funded resources. Will you still save a few Bucks for yourself? Most likely yes, but at the cost of Canadian jobs and the Canadian economy.

The way I see it you spend what you save on extra taxes to fund those who can't find work because you are sending their job to another country.

My mistake, the difference between the two is that the screen tilts to adjust to the driver's level of sight a little.

The price difference is $600. Being that they are both American companies the money goes south anyway.
I don't travel anywhere, I sit at home on my computer, order it and it is delivered to my home.
I do believe in shopping local, but really buying a Chinese made product from an American store located near my place isn't really shopping local at all. If we had one less big box store in Toronto, no one would even notice.

The local jobs that don't pick up the small amount of the purchase price that instead goes south is I submit insignificant. The savings from the amount of purchases it would take to reduce one job would, I submit, be enough to cover the tax burden until that person found a local job.

So I don't agree that the impact would be as dire as you seem to think mate.
 

dumpthemonarchy

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Jan 18, 2005
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You might want to join the real world, then. I know of several families who travel over an hour (one way), at least once a month, to buy groceries in the US.

You might not want to believe it, but it happens all the time around here.

As far as dental travel, what does that have to do with your desire to have $1000 same-day trip allowances on purchases in the US?

They do a simple cost benefit analysis and find it worth their while to travel to the USA to shop. Sure, lots do it, no argument here. I've done it for gas. Free trade means economic borders are diminished.

Dental holidays mean dentists charge too much here for many. Technology allows Canadians to bypass professional rules in Canada. Americans have been going to Mexico for cheaper medical service for decades.
 

TenPenny

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Jun 9, 2004
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Dental holidays mean dentists charge too much here for many. Technology allows Canadians to bypass professional rules in Canada. Americans have been going to Mexico for cheaper medical service for decades.

And what's your point?

Because dentists charge too much, we should change our laws on how much chicken we can bring back from the US?
 

Machjo

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Oct 19, 2004
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Yeah, i just wrote my MPP to raise trade restrictions between Ontario and its neighbours. After all, we need to protect the local economy, right?
 

PoliticalNick

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Mar 8, 2011
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Edson, AB
My mistake, the difference between the two is that the screen tilts to adjust to the driver's level of sight a little.

The price difference is $600. Being that they are both American companies the money goes south anyway.
I don't travel anywhere, I sit at home on my computer, order it and it is delivered to my home.
I do believe in shopping local, but really buying a Chinese made product from an American store located near my place isn't really shopping local at all. If we had one less big box store in Toronto, no one would even notice.

The local jobs that don't pick up the small amount of the purchase price that instead goes south is I submit insignificant. The savings from the amount of purchases it would take to reduce one job would, I submit, be enough to cover the tax burden until that person found a local job.

So I don't agree that the impact would be as dire as you seem to think mate.
It is when you add it up across the country and then toss in $6 billion in corporate welfare to those american owned big-box stores.
 

TenPenny

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Well, here's a lesson, it's all about the money all the time in this part of the world. Dentists and chickens relate to money. No?


Oh, I get it. Because dentists charge too much, Canada should change the law to allow $1000 same-day trips to the US. Because the US does it. So that must mean that US dentists charge less than Canadian dentists.