| View Poll Results: Should Quebec separate, what course should the Maritime provinces and NFLD & Lab follow? | |||
| Remain a part of Canada, geographically separate from the rest of the country. |    | 36 | 67.92% |
| Apply for statehood in the United States. |    | 7 | 13.21% |
| Form own independent and sovereign nation(s), either individually or collectively. |    | 10 | 18.87% |
| Voters: 53. You may not vote on this poll | |||
Member
Posts: 70 
Location: st.john's
Location: st.john's
November 3rd, 2005, 06:50 PM
The newfoundland refarrendum results were something like this Becomeing part of Canada 51% staying independant 44% and becomeing part of the US 5% i am not positive but i think that was the results the percentages might be off by a little bit
The newfoundland refarrendum results were something like this Becomeing part of Canada 51% staying independant 44% and becomeing part of the US 5% i am not positive but i think that was the results the percentages might be off by a little bit
Mighty Intellect
Posts: 1,986 
November 3rd, 2005, 06:53 PM
And then there's the issue that a large chunk of the population of Quebec is of Irish descent, which really messes things up.
And what about Labrador? Did Quebec ever officially accept the boundary line?
Quoting
Lets muddy the waters. The Acadiens of 1755 and of today are not the Quebecois, remember. If I recall correctly, les Acadiens not only refused to pledge allegiance to the Queen of England, but refused to pledge allegiance to anyone. It's not like they were swearing allegiance to France - they refused that, too. And even today, les Acadiens consider themselves as entirely separate from les Quebecois. Quoting
Gee, does 1755 ring a bell? Let's send'em to Louisiana to join their cousins.
Let em leave Canada, fine. Here's an idea...Let them actually leave Canada. 
No blood has to be shed, but Canada doesn't have to sign over their land. The choice would then be left to Quebec...
No blood has to be shed, but Canada doesn't have to sign over their land. The choice would then be left to Quebec...
And then there's the issue that a large chunk of the population of Quebec is of Irish descent, which really messes things up.
And what about Labrador? Did Quebec ever officially accept the boundary line?
We share a common heritage with the folks in louisiana,and nothing with Quebec[we Acadians,that is]
Member
Posts: 79
Location: Atlantic
Location: Atlantic
May 2nd, 2006, 02:08 PM
I LIKE ACADIANS! I like the French, I like anybody who doesn't have a problem with me, and if my existance is percieved as "A THREAT" to someone's culture, someone's in some sorry-assed need of TOLERANCE TRAINING, or perhaps even a military occupation.
Forget Canada. Separation would be the most self-destructive thing the Quebecoise could ever do to their "Distinct Society". The place would collapse in no time just in trying to keep up with welfare payments without assistance from Ottawa.
The problem needs to be addressed in Quebec that it is a part of Canada. The English and everyone else lumped into the Allophone and Anglophone categories must be recognized as "A Distinct Society WITHIN A DISTINCT SOCIETY" with the same rights as all Canadians, including THE FRENCH regardless of where they live.
If the rights of all Canadians are guaranteed, why is it permitted in a Western Democracy to treat ANYONE like a 3rd class citizen, in their own country?? Why if my passport says "CANADA" does the Canadian Bill of Rights NOT APPLY in one single Province of the nation? HELLOOOOOO!!!!!
Racist laws permitted by Ottawa to be passed in Quebec (please don't forget that Hitler was democratically elected too, but THAT wasn't right!)have hampered, no a better word is retarded - the economic development of the Province, effecting the entire Confederation. I can't tell you the number of foreigners I've known who blew off temporarily moving to Quebec to work on two to four year tours for corporations, just because of the moronic law which prevents them from putting their kids in an English school.
Don't get me started. Quebec's going no where, and times have changed. The situation as it exists is about the only positive byproduct of Globalization in Canada, as the French and English see a shrinking world, we have more in common with each other than not.
What should the Maritimes do? Start to make noise against racism in EVERY FORM because that's at the core of the problem. New Brunswick went officially bilingual, and Canada's officially bilingual. Europeans think in this world it's the stupidist thing to shutter yourself in like Albania and not learn the language of the world - English. It wasn't by design, it wasn't a conspiracy against the French, it was evolution.
I LIKE ACADIANS! I like the French, I like anybody who doesn't have a problem with me, and if my existance is percieved as "A THREAT" to someone's culture, someone's in some sorry-assed need of TOLERANCE TRAINING, or perhaps even a military occupation.
Forget Canada. Separation would be the most self-destructive thing the Quebecoise could ever do to their "Distinct Society". The place would collapse in no time just in trying to keep up with welfare payments without assistance from Ottawa.
The problem needs to be addressed in Quebec that it is a part of Canada. The English and everyone else lumped into the Allophone and Anglophone categories must be recognized as "A Distinct Society WITHIN A DISTINCT SOCIETY" with the same rights as all Canadians, including THE FRENCH regardless of where they live.
If the rights of all Canadians are guaranteed, why is it permitted in a Western Democracy to treat ANYONE like a 3rd class citizen, in their own country?? Why if my passport says "CANADA" does the Canadian Bill of Rights NOT APPLY in one single Province of the nation? HELLOOOOOO!!!!!
Racist laws permitted by Ottawa to be passed in Quebec (please don't forget that Hitler was democratically elected too, but THAT wasn't right!)have hampered, no a better word is retarded - the economic development of the Province, effecting the entire Confederation. I can't tell you the number of foreigners I've known who blew off temporarily moving to Quebec to work on two to four year tours for corporations, just because of the moronic law which prevents them from putting their kids in an English school.
Don't get me started. Quebec's going no where, and times have changed. The situation as it exists is about the only positive byproduct of Globalization in Canada, as the French and English see a shrinking world, we have more in common with each other than not.
What should the Maritimes do? Start to make noise against racism in EVERY FORM because that's at the core of the problem. New Brunswick went officially bilingual, and Canada's officially bilingual. Europeans think in this world it's the stupidist thing to shutter yourself in like Albania and not learn the language of the world - English. It wasn't by design, it wasn't a conspiracy against the French, it was evolution.
Newbie
Posts: 1
June 20th, 2007, 09:13 PM
Non ...I have no problem with Quebec. Je parle français tout à fait comme un québecois. AND I MARRIED ONE. I am just a loyal Maritimer.
You see if we get Quebec out of the equation ( almost 8 million voters) then Ontario would no longer control Canada... Central Canada with about 22 million votes does just that right now. Canada may not be a bad place for us Maritimers at that point. And with Newfoundland on board as well ... that'd give us close to ten percent of the total vote ..
32-8=24/2.4+/- = 10% and then if we could get a "triple E Senate" ... Now we are talking!
Sure it is true that 14 million still is a majority over 10 .... but it is a hard sell to the other ten that this represents a "fair shake." Frankly .... if Quebec decides to stay, then I think it is the Maritimes that should consider pulling out ... us and Nfld, that is.
We started going downhill very soon after confederation as the populous central Canada started the process of pulling all the blankets to the middle of the bed. And now they want to play with equalisation ... Mr. MCGuinty .... doesn't like it .. too bad Sir! See how you'll like it with no Eastern seabord and us back into manufacturing and making our own deals with Europe and the rest of the world.
There that's enough said to spark a response or two.
'Bye for now.
Non ...I have no problem with Quebec. Je parle français tout à fait comme un québecois. AND I MARRIED ONE. I am just a loyal Maritimer.
You see if we get Quebec out of the equation ( almost 8 million voters) then Ontario would no longer control Canada... Central Canada with about 22 million votes does just that right now. Canada may not be a bad place for us Maritimers at that point. And with Newfoundland on board as well ... that'd give us close to ten percent of the total vote ..
32-8=24/2.4+/- = 10% and then if we could get a "triple E Senate" ... Now we are talking!
Sure it is true that 14 million still is a majority over 10 .... but it is a hard sell to the other ten that this represents a "fair shake." Frankly .... if Quebec decides to stay, then I think it is the Maritimes that should consider pulling out ... us and Nfld, that is.
We started going downhill very soon after confederation as the populous central Canada started the process of pulling all the blankets to the middle of the bed. And now they want to play with equalisation ... Mr. MCGuinty .... doesn't like it .. too bad Sir! See how you'll like it with no Eastern seabord and us back into manufacturing and making our own deals with Europe and the rest of the world.
There that's enough said to spark a response or two.
'Bye for now.
Member
Posts: 80
Location: Chicoutimi, Québec
Location: Chicoutimi, Québec
June 20th, 2007, 10:07 PM
Screw all this hooplah! Quebec isn't going anywhere in the near future and neither are the Maritimes, and if Quebec did separate, the Maritimes would certainly not opt to join the US. People need to get over the idea that within every Canadian is a wannabe American. It's not true. The enitre foundation of this country is based on the idea of not wanting to be American. That was the idea behind Confederation, coming together for the protection of British North America from American envy of our natural resources.
Screw all this hooplah! Quebec isn't going anywhere in the near future and neither are the Maritimes, and if Quebec did separate, the Maritimes would certainly not opt to join the US. People need to get over the idea that within every Canadian is a wannabe American. It's not true. The enitre foundation of this country is based on the idea of not wanting to be American. That was the idea behind Confederation, coming together for the protection of British North America from American envy of our natural resources.
Newbie
Posts: 47
September 17th, 2007, 12:51 PM
Quoting Jay
I'm from NB and I can tell you that even the Acadians want nothing to do with Quebec. They consider them to be ignorant. Even though NB is called "Officially Bilingual" the fact is that less than 30% of NBer's read or speak French, and that statistic has remained virtually unchanged since Trudeau's time, when he was working on having Canada become bilingual. I believe nationally the figure for French speakers is only aroung 17%, and that too has remained unchanged for over 40 years.
The Maritimes should consider joining the new country of Quebec. There is enough French people there. Those in the Maritimes, who don't like Quebec, can find all sorts of places in NA to move too.
"Money reacts badly to political instability."
If Quebec separated, the instability would be gone. The fight would be over; we should see a stable environment from there on.
"Money reacts badly to political instability."
If Quebec separated, the instability would be gone. The fight would be over; we should see a stable environment from there on.
Chief Mogrifier
Posts: 8,885
September 17th, 2007, 01:42 PM
Just to add my two cents to this newly disinterred topic:
A one point a remedy was suggested by the pro-Canada side that sounded to me to be such a simple solution that it would be criminal not to use it. Let's face it, Montreal is not going to want to separate. Neither are the Eastern Townships. A Canadian corridor from the Ontario/Quebec border including Montreal and on to Quebec's eastern border with New Brunswick. Any separation would include these conditions. Sounds perfectly reasonable to me.
Just to add my two cents to this newly disinterred topic:
A one point a remedy was suggested by the pro-Canada side that sounded to me to be such a simple solution that it would be criminal not to use it. Let's face it, Montreal is not going to want to separate. Neither are the Eastern Townships. A Canadian corridor from the Ontario/Quebec border including Montreal and on to Quebec's eastern border with New Brunswick. Any separation would include these conditions. Sounds perfectly reasonable to me.
Ok, we can get divorced, but you can't live in my house, and I'm through paying your mortgage, got it!
Bright Spark
Posts: 476
Location: Zurich
Location: Zurich
December 27th, 2007, 09:06 AM
Why should the maritimes seperate because of Quebec? What is the justification for this co-incidence?
Why should Quebec seperate when Canada would cede any degree of sovereignty they desire, over time? The last 50 years have seen a revolution in Quebec, with scarce sign of violence, and the next 50 will be no more destructive, but less so whether Quebec 'seperates' or not. The event of moderate seperation will make Rene Lesveque look like a prophet because Sovereignty-Association has been arriving and has arrived in a non-disruptive form.
Unethical scare tactics won the last referendum. Will they work again? Threats won the last referendum. Will they work again? Is threatening ethically credible? What would be the effect of a bitterly contested and ill-received seperation, after phony contentions about currencies and seaways?
Harper's acceptance of the state of Quebec is unconditional, and for better or worse, and I don't think that he will blackmail Quebec with bitterness, though he must be seen as on the federalist side. Too many see it as his job. The next referendum will not be so scarey or bitter. There is the possibility of the 'birth of a nation', full grown, democratic, as large as all Europe and anxious to take a seat beside us as an ally at the U.N., possibly even in Nato. This idea of a nation created not by war or accident or revolutionary war or colonial consent, but by a century of peaceful determination and negotiation and referendum, without a single shot. A first for mankind. This is the worst case scenario. They'll be born into NAFTA by consent.
Threatening must be considered as out of Canadian character or it may backfire. If the referendum is as close as the last one was, the fact is that there is a 49% chance that the answer may be a 'Yes', and nobody will panic.
Why should the maritimes seperate because of Quebec? What is the justification for this co-incidence?
Why should Quebec seperate when Canada would cede any degree of sovereignty they desire, over time? The last 50 years have seen a revolution in Quebec, with scarce sign of violence, and the next 50 will be no more destructive, but less so whether Quebec 'seperates' or not. The event of moderate seperation will make Rene Lesveque look like a prophet because Sovereignty-Association has been arriving and has arrived in a non-disruptive form.
Unethical scare tactics won the last referendum. Will they work again? Threats won the last referendum. Will they work again? Is threatening ethically credible? What would be the effect of a bitterly contested and ill-received seperation, after phony contentions about currencies and seaways?
Harper's acceptance of the state of Quebec is unconditional, and for better or worse, and I don't think that he will blackmail Quebec with bitterness, though he must be seen as on the federalist side. Too many see it as his job. The next referendum will not be so scarey or bitter. There is the possibility of the 'birth of a nation', full grown, democratic, as large as all Europe and anxious to take a seat beside us as an ally at the U.N., possibly even in Nato. This idea of a nation created not by war or accident or revolutionary war or colonial consent, but by a century of peaceful determination and negotiation and referendum, without a single shot. A first for mankind. This is the worst case scenario. They'll be born into NAFTA by consent.
Threatening must be considered as out of Canadian character or it may backfire. If the referendum is as close as the last one was, the fact is that there is a 49% chance that the answer may be a 'Yes', and nobody will panic.
Newbie
Posts: 8
February 14th, 2008, 04:37 PM
As a Quebecker of Scottish ancestry, I would like to see the Maritimes join Quebec following independence. I understand this is highly improbable but I believe this option should be considered just as seriously. Both share a common Celtic heritage that is more and more foreign to the rest of Canada. Quebec has the merit of fighting for its heritage, while Canada is slowly drowning its own heritage in blind multiculturalism. No offence but statistics show that pretty soon being Canadian will mean being Pakistani or Chinese, indifferent to when or how this land was first setlled, by pioneering French, Irish and Scots. There are things that bond people stronger than language, common traditions, relation to the land, music, shared hardship, etc. An english-speaking New Brunswicker of Irish ancestry has a hundred times more in common with a french-speaking Quebecker than with another english-speaking Canadian from BC of Chinese or Indu descent. These things matter more than than people will admit to themselves, they're the glue that gives a country a common identity. People of Irish, Scottish or French descent (most of which came from Brittany) are Celtic brothers that can work together to defend what they hold in common. Maybe one day folks in the Maritimes will realize their heritage had more chance of lasting by staying with Quebec than staying with Canada.
As a Quebecker of Scottish ancestry, I would like to see the Maritimes join Quebec following independence. I understand this is highly improbable but I believe this option should be considered just as seriously. Both share a common Celtic heritage that is more and more foreign to the rest of Canada. Quebec has the merit of fighting for its heritage, while Canada is slowly drowning its own heritage in blind multiculturalism. No offence but statistics show that pretty soon being Canadian will mean being Pakistani or Chinese, indifferent to when or how this land was first setlled, by pioneering French, Irish and Scots. There are things that bond people stronger than language, common traditions, relation to the land, music, shared hardship, etc. An english-speaking New Brunswicker of Irish ancestry has a hundred times more in common with a french-speaking Quebecker than with another english-speaking Canadian from BC of Chinese or Indu descent. These things matter more than than people will admit to themselves, they're the glue that gives a country a common identity. People of Irish, Scottish or French descent (most of which came from Brittany) are Celtic brothers that can work together to defend what they hold in common. Maybe one day folks in the Maritimes will realize their heritage had more chance of lasting by staying with Quebec than staying with Canada.
