Iraq war explained - Saudi Iran proxy war

[Karlin]

The Iraq Study Group [ISG] has a strong Saudi connection, through Dick Cheney, Baker, and even the Democrats in the ISG. Baker Botts, the law firm Baker founded, became a wealthy powerhouse by representing Saudi Arabia. The Democrats in the ISG , including Vernon Jordan of the law firm of Akin Gump represents Saudi royals. So it is a bi-partisan group, but they are all on the side of the Saudis, and therefore the Sunnis.

So it is obvious that the Iraq Study Group is friendly with the Saudis, who support the Sunnis, and so the plan now is genocide for the Shia of Iraq.

Iraq's so-called "civil war" is actually a proxy war between Iran and Saudi Arabia to control Iraq oil for OPEC ; it is a "remote control proxy war" between Iran and Saudi Arabia over the Kingdom of Oil.

There, have I said it clearly and enough times?

Is it any different than my initial hunch in 2003 that the Iraq war was ALL ABOUT OIL ?

We didn't know the details in 2003 ; I had a hard time proving it 3 years ago, but this pretty well lays it out clearly - clearly enough that even those "patriotic" supporters of Bush can now see it too. All those who were frightened by the color-coded threat alerts should be able to lift their heads above the sand long enough to see the oily truth.

Saudis control Bush and Cheney, because they and their corporate links depend on the Sauds to supply them with oil to sell to Americans. The price of oil and gasoline went way up, the weapons makers and contractors in Iraq got huge amounts of money, and AT EVERY TURN BUSH AND CHENEY GOT RICHER.

Gees, this should just ourage everyone with a bone of morality in them - the incredible suffering of the Iraqis and Afghans who have the misfortune to live where America's oil and pipeline interests are, plus the mis-use of the USA army with all those willing young men and women losing life and limb in this Elite Wealthy game of oil in the middle east.

It also relates the the biggest "Crime of the Century" of global warming - all those denials and the resistance to alternative fuels, and even fuel efficiency, were done at the behest of the Bush Cheney Oil Cartel. We were tricked, we were fooled, and if we are not yet outraged it can only be because we have our heads in the sand.

http://www.gnn.tv/articles/2789/The_Baker_Boys_Stay_Half_the_Course

"Iranians [are] subsidizing the Mahdi Army and other Shia cut-throats"
"the Saudis acting as a piggy bank for the other side, the Sunni berserkers." (The House of Saud follows Wahabi Islam, a harsh, fundamentalist sect of Sunnism.)

 

[Karlin]

All the talk on Sunday Morning news programs out of the USA neglected on major factor in the Iraq war... Saudi Arabia and their Sunni support.

Who would deny that this is central to figuring out what to do with Iraq , now that it is set to explode into "civil war" between Sunnis and Shias?

How could any discussion lead to understanding the situation without mentioning IRAN , and their support of Shia insurgents in Iraq? These Iran-backed armies are out to kill off Sunnis, as many as possible, so that the Sunni population will not have control of Iraq oil eventually. This is the backbone of the violence in Iraq now.

No doubt there are complications, like Syria and its Sunni-Shia populations, and Israel's wish that both Sunnis and Shias would just kill each other off - maybe that is a big part of the Bush agenda in Iraq - I bet Mel Gibson would agree...

 

[L Gilbert]

........How could any discussion lead to understanding the situation without mentioning IRAN , and their support of Shia insurgents in Iraq? These Iran-backed armies are out to kill off Sunnis, as many as possible, so that the Sunni population will not have control of Iraq oil eventually. This is the backbone of the violence in Iraq now........

Quite. I was just reading a bit about Gerald Bull and bumped into a comment that almost the entire pile of crap in the ME could be narrowed down to when Iraq attacked Iran.

 

[MikeyDB]

So are we saying that Reagan and North were duped by those clever Iranians into supplying both Iran and Iraq with WMD???

Where's Curiosity when I need her!

Isn't the United States a nation in it's own right...with the ability to determine for itself what it will and will not participate...in....

Oh sorry forgot about General Motors, Ford, Chrysler...the backbone of western commerce...

It's all expendable in the name of automobile freedom....or is that at some deeper level just plain greed?

 

[L Gilbert]

They'd be scrapping over there whether they had any contact with NorthAm or not. All the USA as a nation is, is a huge version of JR Ewing (tv show "Dallas", 1978 to 1991). link

 

[Sassylassie]

Oh joy oh bliss another anti-American bigot, how nice of you to drop in. Yep blame the Americans for all that's wrong with the world, leave China and it's evil on the door step merci. Word of advice, read why the Shihite and Sunni are enemies? It's called slavory, and it isn't the US using the Shihite as slaves. Irag, Iran, Africa visa vie the Sudan (another wanna be Arab nation), Middle East, Arabs, the list is very long but blaming the US for the oppressed muslims problems well is mon enfant. Oh did I mention that Saudi Arabia is afraid the Shihites might get some pay back against the Sunnis. So who's the Saudi's funding, sing along the, Sunni's

 

[northstar]

All the talk on Sunday Morning news programs out of the USA neglected on major factor in the Iraq war... Saudi Arabia and their Sunni support.

--karlin

You said it! And why? Because your little report is more false moronic propaganda funded by the opium smuggling cartel terror organizations who are trying to mis-lead the western public with such propaganda.

And SURPRISE nitwhits everywhere who don't want to do anything but think negatively about there own countries efforts in the war on terrorism, believe such nonsence.

Here is the truth, first the oil and what the American Study Group has come up with for what it is worth-

A group of Iraqi politicians and ministers is close to finishing a draft of a national oil law that, if enacted, would be the most significant legislation passed by the government so far and help narrow some of the country's major political schisms, Iraqi and American officials say.
The officials said the authors have reached agreement on one of the most divisive issues in Iraq: How revenues from the oil industry should be distributed. The working draft calls for the central government in Baghdad to collect oil revenues and distribute them to provinces or regions based on population, the officials say. The measure could calm some Sunni Arabs who oppose regional autonomy because of fears that Sunnis would be excluded from a fair share of oil wealth, which is concentrated in Shiite and Kurdish regions.
The law could also encourage foreign investment in the oil industry, although security would remain a major concern for companies operating outside the relatively safe region of Iraqi Kurdistan.
The national oil law lies at the heart of debates about the future of Iraq, particularly the issue of having a strong central government or robust regional governments. The question of oil has also exacerbated sectarian tensions, because of the worries of Sunni Arabs, who are leading the insurgency, over the potentially lopsided distribution of oil wealth.

so this is an issue that has been the core issue of all the fighting before the U.S. came anywhere near the middle east. The Kurds and the Sunnis were being pushed out by the terrorist organizations who were funding their acts of war with money from both oil and opium....the autrocities commited in the name of ALLAH are the actions of violent criminals and all for greed.

The Kurds, who already have an autonomous region in the north, had put up a fight to have regional governments collect and redistribute oil revenues, particularly ones from oil fields yet to be exploited. They had also proposed that revenues be shared among the regions based on both population and crimes committed against people under Saddam Hussein's rule. That would give the Kurds and Shiites a share of the oil wealth larger than the proportions of their populations.
But the Kurds on the drafting committee have shelved those demands, said Barham Salih, a deputy prime minister who is a Kurd and chairman of the committee.
"Revenue sharing is an accepted principle by all the constituent elements of the Iraqi government, including the Kurds, and that is the unifying element that we're all hoping for in the oil law," Salih said in an interview.

SO our troops and the rest of NATO are helping these players in the middle east find peace. Because the Taliban was dismantled and the Hamas and Hezzbollah are hopefully being dis-armed the new governments will allow an in-flow of humantarian aid.

This war was about the threat of hate filled Islamist Iraqi's who had WMD hidden and had been quietly planning to attack Western Nations, the Al Queda just beat them to it, so war was inevitable, because it was declared by the Baby Killing Islamic Jihad Fanatics on NATO countries.

Once again l have dispelled the myths the terrorist supporters keep pushing, even while anyone with a grain of smarts can see is lacking in intelligence and fact.

 

[gopher]

Here's Another View

http://www.regressiveantidote.net./Articles/Baker_Cooks_Up_Another_Foul_Dish.html

So. The James (Baker) Gang have finally come down from the mountain to deliver to us their long-awaited recipe for salvation from the Mess in Mesopotamia.
Can you say “bold”?
No, actually, you can’t. And neither can Baker. Unless, of course, he’s making sure that George W. Bush becomes president of the United States after losing an election. Or maybe when he’s defending the House of Saud against lawsuits filed by American victims of 9/11.
That was as bold as it gets. Not to mention contemptuous.
Unfortunately, the Baker report on Iraq is only one of those two things, and if you need to guess which, here’s a hint – it doesn’t start with a ‘b’.
True, it is a measure of the extent of Bush’s wreckage how little Baker and his people could have done, even had boldness been a part of their vocabulary. There are simply no good answers to the question, “What the hell should we do now?” In fact, there probably haven’t been any for about two years now, but the situation goes on deteriorating considerably with every passing month, such that maintaining the present disastrous course surely cannot be the best choice.
Remember how cute it once was to have a tough guy in the White House, governing by his gut, rather than by the concerns of pesky State Department bureaucrats who’ve spent a lifetime learning about the Middle East? Not any more. This is what happens when the greatest military and economic power ever to exist on the planet is put in the hands of an emotional cripple, whose agenda is driven by a palpable need to show the world that he’s not a screw-up (despite a lifetime of evidence to the contrary), and that he can outdo his daddy, after all. This is why we don’t let thirteen year-olds drive cars, folks, and why we cringe when we do hand over the keys at sixteen. Imagine an immature ten year-old piloting a fleet of oil tankers, and thinking, “I wonder what would happen if I rammed them all together”. If, like that kid, you’re also wondering what the result might look like, take a glance at the Mid-East.
Now, almost four years later, there will be no democracy in Iraq. There will be no American victory in Iraq. There will be no great blow struck against evildoers in Iraq. And – very likely – there will ultimately be no Iraq in Iraq either. The very best the country and the region and the world can hope for at this point would be precisely the status quo ante. That is, a pacified Iraq, united under the autocratic and repressive leadership of some brutal dictator. Nearly 3,000 American deaths later, with perhaps two-thirds of a million Iraqis similarly dispatched, and wide-scale destruction of the country’s physical and social infrastructure – all that, and the best we can hope for is Saddam, Version 2.0.
And that’s the best-case scenario. Let’s not kid ourselves about how bad this can get.


more ...

 

[northstar]

I can always count on you for bringing the best out in me Gopher, so thank you for the comedy...now back to what this war is about...

Isn't it interesting how Iran and Syria are giving the U.S. a nice little smile and a wave as they appear to be bending towards supporting the peace talks...

In the meantime, they have both publically stated they hate the U.S. AND ZIONIST and of course anyone in between...so in otherwords if you are a non-Muslim supporting NATO and the [corrupt] U.N. well, we will smile to your face and stab you in the back at the first opportunity.

And they are preparing for the moment when they can attack, as Syria is stockpiling and purchasing weapons with a fury the equals a Parent shopping for Christmas...the only difference is the steady stream of money, profits from oil, opium and terrorist supporters, which of course include some SAUDIS, as well as German and Russia and China.

On the other hand, the Iranians, who l spoke about in an earlier post, are busy as bees building the new-wge FRANKENSTINE, their shining new terrorist baby--a nuclear bom. And who is supplying the necessary ingrediants for this baby...China.

So all this bussle leaves time for prayer, and they are devoted Fanatical Islamists, the teachings of Muhammad being followed to the Jihad letter.

here is some insight-

Regarding Iraq, here's the nitty-gritty that needs to be underscored: Syria and Iran have been working hand-in-glove all along to stoke the fires of sectarian violence in Iraq.

Syria has been aiding and abetting al-Qaeda and the Sunni Ba'athists, while Iran has been funneling tremendous assistance to al-Sadr's Mahdi Army and other Shia factions...

Syria and Iran have been playing both sides against the middle.

They're squeezing Iraq in a vise. Why? Because they have no desire to see a stable government – a democracy no less – emerge in the Middle East.

The originally envisioned "new Iraq" (as conceptualized by Bush et al.) would have created a wave of democratization, a synergy so-to-speak, in the region that would have directly challenged Islamo-fascism and the further development of terror groups.

So the motives of Syria and Iran to thwart the new government in Iraq are twisted, but quite understandable.

As to resolving the profound violence that continues in Iraq, we essentially have a regional problem on our hands. Ultimately, troublemakers Syria and Iran must be stifled.

The Iraq Study Group's floated a total of 79 recommendations, described by some as "underwhelming" and "impractical", which includes an emphasis on a new diplomatic offensive with Syria and Iran for the purpose of stabilizing Iraq and ridding it of violence.

Please note that we tried back-channel efforts with Iran in recent times – to determine if we could lay the ground work for talks – which proved unsuccessful.

Let me see; we're now asking the perpetrators of violence in Iraq to help us calm the situation there.

Well, what would constitute incentives for Syria and Iran? Iran certainly has a stake in Iraq; Iran wants a big chuck of it.

That being said, Iran just might "help us out the door" in Iraq, so that it can turn around and grab the southern portion of Iraq for itself.

And Syria wants to return to the occupation of Lebanon so that it can soak it of its wealth, in addition to getting back the Golan Heights (which it lost in the Six Day War) from Israel.

Silly me, now we have the incentives and the basis of negotiations with these thugs!

Remember, when you negotiate with lawless regimes, they're the ones that fundamentally benefit.

At the very least, they're being provided with a legitimate forum and a certain level of cachet so that they can lie and manipulate with impunity, blame the US and sway world opinion.

source- http://www.enterstageright.com/archive/articles/1206/1206isgenemies.htm

So while others on this thread are not fully grasping the situation, it is completely understandable, since the media is , as usually trying to sell all kinds of stories that lead the reader here and there with no understanding of the overall picture and the overall players.

Some of the players have a way of pulling out new statements that completely contridict the death threats or the lawless acts of vengence that they have been found guilty of.

But the key players are Iran and Syria, the funding is oil and opium, and the suckers are those who think these criminal baby killing terrorists that follow a religion that is full of evil verse [handy for chanting during beheadings] of hatred against our society can be in the least bit trusted...

I wish it was as simple as an oil conspiracy, but you are fooling yourself by buying this simple stupidity.

it is about Nuclear weapondry being put in the hands of fanatical Hate-Mongering Terrorist Regimes, and to promote such error in thinking is to point the world towards the lies and evil that will fuel massive nuclear destruction.

 

[jimmoyer]

Good posts, North Star.

Many in the Iraq Study Group ISG are recommending the Alaska Plan whereby
all citizens get a check in the mail from oil revenues.

You don't hear the Sunni or the Shia responding to that idea yet.

And the Kurds, they're doing fine in their de facto autonomy, albeit with queasy neighbors.

 

[northstar]

Jimmoyer, thanks, I really appreciate your comments because it underlines the democracy that is being brought into the middle-east. People need to take a good look at the oil money and who it has been going to. These people who have lived and breathed war for centuries need to see their inheritance, and they need to see good things happen it their country, rather than a few greedy warlords that manipulate them with religion whilst lining their pockets with opium and oil revenues...

So thanks for bringing up this valid point.

 

[darkbeaver]

The report was crap. The illinformed believe that civil war will prevail in Iraq, indeed these same people hope for and inflame violence to this end, the only way uncle sam can prevail in thier occupation is to insight civil war. Most Iraqi,s are secular to the core and will remain that way. The enemy is overwhelmingly identified by Iraqi,s as the US. Many people still stubbornly discount oil as the reason for invasion and occupation and continue to believe the democracy and freedom horse**** trilogy.
Terrorism is not the tool of the poor or marginalized ,it is the hammer of the rich and powerful.
Down with Uncle Sam
Down with religion
Down with capitalism
Down with lite beer

 

[jimmoyer]

LOL !!!

Good boy Darkbeaver. Pavlov lives !!!

Here's a Bush buscuit !!! It has tasty ingredients like Impeachment Guacamole, George-a-licious Orange
(like you can eat George?) and Iraqiloser sin-a-min.

You'll get another treat, if you rise viciously out of your swamp hole on command.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Northstar, everyone is obviously more interested in United States failing because of its hubris
than wishing Iraq to have a new chance.

 

[northstar]

Oops Posted Twice...

 

[northstar]

LOL! hee-hee-hee love it! Well l don't mind if a few nit-whits don't like what l post, and just stay focused on anything against the US and democracy and sanity...they are simply fuel for the fire, because the world needs to understand the truth.

So in the midst of a world were the most important part of the day is whether you can drink a latte, listen to your MP3 and talk on the phone while dictating a letter to a minion...the terrorists are refering to their holy scriptures for inspiration on how to kill more infidels and stock pile weapons...her is a sample of what the reality is all about...

'QUAKAN 92:8"We will make smooth for him the path to misery."

:evil3:

THIS GIVES THEM INSPIRATION TO OPEN THE DOORS TO PEACE TALKS AND HELP THE TROOPS LEAVE.

Qur'an 5:41"Whomever Allah wants to deceive you cannot help. Allah does not want them to know the truth because he intends to disgrace them and then torture them."

:evil3:

THIS IS THE INSPIRATION FOR THEM TO LIE AND DECIEVE EVERYONE IN THE PEACE TALKS, AND ALL THE WHILE STOCKPILE WEAPONS AND WORK VERY VERY HARD TO GET THE 17 NUCLEAR WEAPONS BUILD, READY AND AIMED FOR JUST THE RIGHT MOMENT....

Qur'an 8:58"If you apprehend treachery from a people with whom you have a treaty, retaliate by breaking off relations with them."

:evil3:

AND THIS IS THE INSPIRATION TO JUST BOMB THE HELL OUT OF ANYONE WHO IS DEEMED AN ENEMY, KILLING BABIES IN THEIR BEDS....[/quote]

I AM GLAD THAT BUSH AND BLAIR ARE RECOGNIZING THE FUTILITY OF PEACE...