Experts Claim Official 9/11 Story is a Hoax


aeon
#1
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A group of distinguished experts and scholars, including Robert M. Bowman, James H. Fetzer, Wayne Madsen, John McMurtry, Morgan Reynolds, and Andreas von Buelow, have concluded that senior government officials have covered up crucial facts about what really happened on 9/11.

They have joined with others in common cause as members of "Scholars for 9/11 Truth" (S9/11T), because they are convinced, based on their own research, that the administration has been deceiving the nation about critical events in New York and Washington, D.C.

These experts suggest these events may have been orchestrated by elements within the administration to manipulate Americans into supporting policies at home and abroad they would never have condoned absent "another Pearl Harbor."

They believe that this White House is incapable of investigating itself and hope the possibility that Congress might hold an unaccountable administration accountable is not merely naive or wishful thinking.

They are encouraging news services around the world to secure scientific advice by taking advantage of university resources to verify or to falsify their discoveries. Extraordinary situations, they believe, require extraordinary measures.

If this were done, they contend, one of the great hoaxes of history would stand naked before the eyes of the world and its perpetrators would be clearly exposed, which may be the only hope for saving this nation from ever greater abuse.

They hope this might include The New York Times, which, in their opinion, has repeatedly failed to exercise the leadership expected from our nation's newspaper of record by a series of inexplicable lapses. It has failed to vigorously investigate tainted elections, lies leading to the war in Iraq, or illegal NSA spying on the American people, major unconstitutional events. In their view, The Times might compensate for its loss of stature by helping to reveal the truth about one of the great turning_point events of modern history.

Stunning as it may be to acknowledge, they observe, the government has brought but one indictment against anyone and, to the best of their knowledge, has not even reprimanded anyone for incompetence or dereliction of duty. The official conspiracy theory -- that nineteen Arab hijackers under control of one man in the wilds of Afghanistan brought this about -- is unsupportable by the evidential data, which they have studied. They even believe there are good reasons for suspecting that video tapes officially attributed to Osama bin Laden are not genuine.

They have found the government's own investigation to be severely flawed. The 9/11 Commission, designated to investigate the attack, was directed by Philip Zelikow, part of the Bush transition team in the NSA sector and the co_author of a book with Condoleezza Rice. A Bush supporter and director of national security affairs, he could hardly be expected to conduct an objective and impartial investigation.

They have discovered that The 9/11 Commission Report is replete with omissions, distortions, and factual errors, which David Ray Griffin has documented in his book, The 9/11 Commission Report: Omissions and Distortions. The official report, for example, entirely ignores the collapse of WTC7, a 47-story building, which was hit by no airplanes, was only damaged by a few small fires, and fell seven hours after the attack.

Here are some of the kinds of considerations that these experts and scholar find profoundly troubling:

* In the history of structural engineering, steel-frame high-rise buildings have never been brought down due to fires either before or since 9/11, so how can fires have brought down three in one day? How is this possible?

* The BBC has reported that at least five of the nineteen alleged "hijackers" have turned up alive and well living in Saudi Arabia, yet according to the FBI, they were among those killed in the attacks. How is this possible?

* Frank DeMartini, a project manager for the WTC, said the buildings were designed with load redistribution capabilities to withstand the impact of airliners, whose effects would be like "puncturing mosquito netting with a pencil." Yet they completely collapsed. How is this possible?

* Since the melting point of steel is about 2,700*F, the temperature of jet fuel fires does not exceed 1,800*F under optimal conditions, and UL certified the steel used to 2,000*F for six hours, the buildings cannot have collapsed due to heat from the fires. How is this possible?

* Flight 77, which allegedly hit the building, left the radar screen in the vicinity of the Ohio/Kentucky border, only to "reappear" in very close proximity to the Pentagon shortly before impact. How is this possible?

* Foreign "terrorists" who were clever enough to coordinate hijacking four commercial airliners seemingly did not know that the least damage to the Pentagon would be done by hitting its west wing. How is this possible?

* Secretary of Transportation Norman Mineta, in an underground bunker at the White House, watched Vice President Cheney castigate a young officer for asking, as the plane drew closer and closer to the Pentagon, "Do the orders still stand?" The order cannot have been to shoot it down, but must have been the opposite. How is this possible?

* A former Inspector General for the Air Force has observed that Flight 93, which allegedly crashed in Pennsylvania, should have left debris scattered over an area less than the size of a city block; but it is scattered over an area of about eight square miles. How is this possible?

* A tape recording of interviews with air traffic controllers on duty on 9/11 was deliberately crushed, cut into very small pieces, and distributed in assorted places to insure its total destruction. How is this possible?

* The Pentagon conducted a training exercise called "MASCAL" simulating the crash of a Boeing 757 into the building on 24 October 2000, and yet Condoleezza Rice, among others, has repeatedly asserted that "no one ever imagined" a domestic airplane could be used as a weapon. How is this possible?

Their own physics research has established that only controlled demolitions are consistent with the near-gravity speed of fall and virtually symmetrical collapse of all three of the WTC buildings. While turning concrete into very fine dust, they fell straight-down into their own footprints.

These experts and scholars have found themselves obliged to conclude that the 9/11 atrocity represents an instance of the approach -- which has been identified by Karl Rove, the President's closest adviser -- of "creating our own reality."
 
I think not
Avatar
#2
Quote: Originally Posted by aeon

* Since the melting point of steel is about 2,700*F, the temperature of jet fuel fires does not exceed 1,800*F under optimal conditions, and UL certified the steel used to 2,000*F for six hours, the buildings cannot have collapsed due to heat from the fires. How is this possible?

Steel loses 60% of its strength at 1022*F

I guess it's back to the conspiracy drawing board for them.
 
Toro
#3
Hahaha.

"Experts and scholars"

There were once "experts and scholars" in alchemy too.
 
Curiosity
#4
ITN

Maybe it's the melting point for tinfoil???
 
Toro
#5
Quote: Originally Posted by Wednesday's Child

ITN

Maybe it's the melting point for tinfoil???

 
I think not
#6
You're right WC, my mistake
 
thulin
#7
I study journalism and thereby how to analyze and handle sources. Now, even though there are some "standard procedures" that most historians and journalists use, one most often stands over all other; before wasting your time analyzing a huge material, ask yourself "is this a likely scenario"?

Of course, some things that are not "likely" to happen, sometimes do happen.

In this case I will just have to take my chanses wont I..?

Dismissed!
 
thulin
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by Toro

"Experts and scholars"

Är du dansk eller simulerar du bara? I have just written a paper on "the media demimond" and how fame is produced by media, and somehow turned into "expertise".

Frightening, absolutely - but still very interesting.
 
Curiosity
Avatar
#9
Thulin

Good points - a lot of work has been done by people in an attempt to do what this group is doing.

Your journalism background would give you the knowledge to search through things to assess them more fairly than I. But fairness doesn't belong in my heart to the 9/11 question. I have actually become a bigot over that date. But it isn't about me....

I only ask: What is their point?


Toro

Like that new avatar!

Did you see what Donuts did with some avatars on What Do You Like About Bush in the Lounge section?

He had me laughing so hard I almost stopped posting.... not quite!
 
Toro
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by thulin

I have just written a paper on "the media demimond" and how fame is produced by media,

For example

 
Toro
#11
Quote: Originally Posted by Wednesday's Child

Toro

Like that new avatar!

Did you see what Donuts did on What Do You Like About Bush???
He had me laughing so hard I almost stopped posting.... not quite!

I'll send the url to anyone who wants it.
 
I think not
Avatar
#12
Quote: Originally Posted by Toro

Quote: Originally Posted by Wednesday's Child

Toro

Like that new avatar!

Did you see what Donuts did on What Do You Like About Bush???
He had me laughing so hard I almost stopped posting.... not quite!

I'll send the url to anyone who wants it.

Ya, please send me
 
Curiosity
Avatar
#13
Toro

You could start a movement of sympathizers .... a mini protest against the cartoons .... as they don't represent Freedom in your eyes.

Wots' Ms. Hilton got to do with it?
 
Toro
Avatar
#14
Oh, I just caught the web address of the article in the first post.

Global Research is the fringe site to beat 'em all.

They were writing a year or so that Bush was about to overthrow the US government and establish a military dictatorship.

Here they are. Laugh away.

--
 
aeon
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by I think not


Steel loses 60% of its strength at 1022*F

I guess it's back to the conspiracy drawing board for them.


Steel loses 60% of its strength at 1022 F, but how do you explain , there is people that survived from that heat?? you can see people after the plane hit looking for help, i ll try to find those pictures.
 
Curiosity
Avatar
#16
Oh.... the media made it....

I have been here way too long. Break.

I know she is a ditz but she is really funny.....I don't know if she knows she is funny....that's the question.
 
Toro
Avatar
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by I think not

Quote: Originally Posted by Toro

Quote: Originally Posted by Wednesday's Child

Toro

Like that new avatar!

Did you see what Donuts did on What Do You Like About Bush???
He had me laughing so hard I almost stopped posting.... not quite!

I'll send the url to anyone who wants it.

Ya, please send me

Actually, this is easier. Its here.

--
 
I think not
Avatar
#18
Quote: Originally Posted by aeon

Quote: Originally Posted by I think not


Steel loses 60% of its strength at 1022*F

I guess it's back to the conspiracy drawing board for them.


Steel loses 60% of its strength at 1022 F, but how do you explain , there is people that survived from that heat?? you can see people after the plane hit looking for help, i ll try to find those pictures.

Please don't drag me into more questions, your article made an idiotic claim and I debunked it, as far as I'm concerned they are either lying or confused steel with tinfoil like WC suggested. Either way it's baloney.
 
Curiosity
Avatar
#19
ITN

Ya.... that's right!

I know my melting measurements! Tinfoil, steel girders, aircraft plating aluminum...conduit covers.....chocolate....ice cream... you name it! :P

Apparently so does Toro ahem..... His wife is very forgiving!!!
 
aeon
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by Toro

Oh, I just caught the web address of the article in the first post.

Global Research is the fringe site to beat 'em all.

They were writing a year or so that Bush was about to overthrow the US government and establish a military dictatorship.

Here they are. Laugh away.

--


you want other link??


--

--
 
I think not
Avatar
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by Toro

Oh, I just caught the web address of the article in the first post.

Global Research is the fringe site to beat 'em all.

They were writing a year or so that Bush was about to overthrow the US government and establish a military dictatorship.

Here they are. Laugh away.

--

Toro, where have you been? We've been a police state for over a year now.
 
Curiosity
Avatar
#22
Aeon

Your experts don't even mention that the WTC aircraft were fully loaded from takeoff when they hit the towers.

The jetfuel ignited and reduced the steel to dust.

The article also cites the New York Times as being an investigative leader.

They are still having trouble finding their way to the truth on many things. But give them time. Meanwhile they have a good New York Life Theater page.
 
aeon
#23
Quote: Originally Posted by I think not

Quote: Originally Posted by aeon

Quote: Originally Posted by I think not


Steel loses 60% of its strength at 1022*F

I guess it's back to the conspiracy drawing board for them.


Steel loses 60% of its strength at 1022 F, but how do you explain , there is people that survived from that heat?? you can see people after the plane hit looking for help, i ll try to find those pictures.

Please don't drag me into more questions, your article made an idiotic claim and I debunked it, as far as I'm concerned they are either lying or confused steel with tinfoil like WC suggested. Either way it's baloney.


Sorry my friend , but there is no proof at all that the tempature went at 1022 f, actually the people that survived proved the opposite.
 
I think not
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by Wednesday's Child

ITN

Ya.... that's right!

I know my melting measurements! Tinfoil, steel girders, aircraft plating aluminum...conduit covers.....chocolate....ice cream... you name it! :P

Apparently so does Toro ahem..... His wife is very forgiving!!!

 
Curiosity
#25
ITN

Police state? Where's our uniforms?
 
aeon
#26
Quote: Originally Posted by I think not

Quote: Originally Posted by Toro

Oh, I just caught the web address of the article in the first post.

Global Research is the fringe site to beat 'em all.

They were writing a year or so that Bush was about to overthrow the US government and establish a military dictatorship.

Here they are. Laugh away.

--

Toro, where have you been? We've been a police state for over a year now.



Well come to live in canada for a while, and you will see the difference,not incredibly big, but there is , i am not saying in the states it is really bad, but it got worst since september 11, and i ve never seen in canada, a police officer breaking the doors, just to see those who are drinking alcoohol are in the legal age to drink, it happend to a friend of mine in new jersey.
 
thulin
#27
Quote: Originally Posted by Wednesday's Child

I only ask: What is their point?

Yup, that´s it. Part of what makes it very unlikely is:

1) Who would benfit on the events, and results of, 9/11?

2) In what way? Why?

3) How big risks would they be willing to take to succeed?

Lets for a moment pretend 9/11 is just a big white house haox in order to increase the defence force budget; is it in any way possible to plan and go through with a hoax of that size? How many people would have been needed? How do you get them to shut up? Who were willing to sacrifice their life for George Bush and a increased defence budget (the were highjackers, right?)

I´m sorry, we probably will never know everything about what happened that day - but this is just to much...
 
I think not
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by Wednesday's Child

ITN

Police state? Where's our uniforms?

My g/f wears one now and then for me, does that count?
 
aeon
#29
Quote: Originally Posted by Wednesday's Child

Aeon

Your experts don't even mention that the WTC aircraft were fully loaded from takeoff when they hit the towers.

The jetfuel ignited and reduced the steel to dust.

I guess human body melting point is over 1022 f then.
 
thulin
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by Toro

Quote: Originally Posted by thulin

I have just written a paper on "the media demimond" and how fame is produced by media,

For example

Well, yes. But the interesting part is (for example) when fashion magazine asks ms Hilton about next years fashion. Is she, with little or no education in the area, "an expert" of fashion and clothing - or is it the fact that she is famous, and thereby influences and maybee even sets example, of next years fashion - that makes her "an expert"?

Well, without the proper education there are only one option - right? So, what we got is "media" coming to ms Hilton for "advice", just because of the fame media blessed ms Hilton with in the first place..?

"Demimond" comes from french and means something like "half world".
 
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