Why no exit date; Iraq

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Said1

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Das Kapital
Late Night Rambling
Posted by Stephen Green · 19 June 2005
Had lunch on Friday with Ashley Kindergan, a young reporter for Colorado Springs' own Gazette. It's a pretty damn good paper, with a libertarian-leaning editorial page – or at least it leaned that way six years ago, the last time I subscribed. Anyway, Ashley was assigned a story on local bloggers, which led to a really fun 90-minute sitdown with yours truly.

There was no drinking involved. We were on Ashley's dime, and she's a young reporter in a smallish city. I didn't know if her pockets are as deep as my liver, and it wouldn't have been gentlemanly to find out.

Naturally, Iraq was one of the topics we discussed. Poor thing. She asked one little question – and I went off on an iced-tea fueled rant. I didn't mean to rant, but this one has been a long time coming. Ashley just happened to be in the way when the pressure valve finally let loose. The subject was exit dates.

Last week, there was some hubbub in Congress demanding President Bush announce a firm date for pulling out of Iraq. Announcing an exit date would be dumber than using a taffy puller to epilate your scrotum.

Granted, an exit date would have one positive effect: There would be an immediate and sustained reduction in terror attacks. Right up until the day we left. Let me explain.
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Read the rest here: http://vodkapundit.com/archives/007899.php

I think the topic is rather self-explainatory, but people still keep at it.
 
Ocean Breeze

Ocean Breeze

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Rumsfeld, Meyers in Congress over Iraq
US Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and top military officers have appeared before a Congressional hearing over the American military strategy in Iraq. Both Rumsfeld and the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General Richard Meyers, said they were on the right track and that leaving Iraq now would be catastrophic. But neither of them would indicate when US troops would be pulled out of Iraq. Surveys in the US show that 59 percent of Americans want at least a partial withdrawal of the 135,000 US troops currently stationed in Iraq.
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from: DW-World


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/4123808.stm

Rumsey refuses to set timetable for troop withdrawl.

(no surprise)
 
Ocean Breeze

Ocean Breeze

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Re: RE: Why no exit date; Iraq

jimmoyer said:
To no1important, and Ocean Breeze.

Please list me for the pros and cons of an exit date.
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Not sure about any "cons"......

but some pros.

Setting even a tentative exit timeline would assist the Iraqis in knowing the direction the US is going. ...and when they might look forward to gaining their country back.

The ambiguity , evasiveness of the USG is frustrating to the world at large......and the Iraqis themselves. Their theme is .....they do NOT want to continue to be "occupied" and who can blame them??

Some target date.......even tentative would clarify the USG position on this too. Until the USG indicates some time line .....most are going to assume that the US is there to stay.

IF the US is there to stay.........SAY SO....and define how and for what purpose.

It is the vagueness of all this that is frustrating. And frustration breeds anger......anger breeds more insurgency. etc.And the cycle of violence continues.

The Focus now should be STABILIZATION......and this should be made clear by the USG. All the USG does is spin a lot of evasive garbage and no one knows where things stand, or where things are going. Simplistic, evasive crap from the idiot(s) in the whitehouse is not leadership. It is a game. that has self interest in mind.


(just some immediate thoughts on this one)
 
Ocean Breeze

Ocean Breeze

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Re: RE: Why no exit date; Iraq

jimmoyer said:
You assume that an exit date will let the average Iraqi know when he or she will have their country back?

Will they get their country back if we leave, you assume?

Will the bullies, the clowns take over then?
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NOT if this is handled PROPERLY. But given the record so far.....that probability of that is zilch and none.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/06/23/iraq.rumsfeld/index.html?section=cnn_latest


Now , what Rumsey says is nothing more than propaganda. He does not define HOW it will "encourage" terrorists. Same theme,(song) different day. :roll:
 
Ocean Breeze

Ocean Breeze

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Re: RE: Why no exit date; Iraq

Ocean Breeze said:
jimmoyer said:
You assume that an exit date will let the average Iraqi know when he or she will have their country back?

Will they get their country back if we leave, you assume?

Will the bullies, the clowns take over then?
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NOT if this is handled PROPERLY. But given the record so far.....that probability of that is zilch and none.

One cannot "assume" anything in this convoluted situation. all theories are up for grabs........until we have some honesty from the bush cabal.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/06/23/iraq.rumsfeld/index.html?section=cnn_latest


Now , what Rumsey says is nothing more than propaganda. He does not define HOW it will "encourage" terrorists. Same theme,(song) different day. :roll:
Click to expand...
 
Ocean Breeze

Ocean Breeze

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Re: RE: Why no exit date; Iraq

jimmoyer said:
Handled properly ?

Your ideas on "handling properly" ?
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the whole "tone" from Washington would have to change. Less pompous arrogance, less denial, and definitely LESS LIES.

an outline of some plan , any plan is better than leaving things in such an evasive state.
Can the stupid platitudes and deal with reality.

Admit to the mistakes made. -openly and honestly. It might shock the whole world.......but it would be a positive "shock".....and might restore some credibilty.

ASK POLITELY for help. ( a little humility might go a long way . ) Diplomacy and tact, Not the continued aggressive bully like posturing. ( something along the lines of a major attitude adjustment)
 
jimmoyer

jimmoyer

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Ask politely ?

You already gave your answer. Remember?

You said there's no way anyone would want to help now.

Even if America leaves, do you think one nation or any nation will send in troops?

They'd have to, because the insurgent clowns mean to make a play for power.
 
D

dave s

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Jun 22, 2005
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Because they are not done yet.

Do you jump off the bus before it comes to a complete stop. No

Well they are not leaving till all the bad guys are dead.
 
Ocean Breeze

Ocean Breeze

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Re: RE: Why no exit date; Iraq

jimmoyer said:
Ask politely ?

You already gave your answer. Remember?

You said there's no way anyone would want to help now.

Even if America leaves, do you think one nation or any nation will send in troops?

They'd have to, because the insurgent clowns mean to make a play for power.
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as things STAND now , with the current US attitude.....that would seem to be the case.(not be too willing to help) If the USG softened its approach some, it could change the whole tone of things. It is the nuance that matters.

btw: The UN is calling for assistance in Iraq now. Nations have verbalized willingness to assist.... and make it one of the priorities.

we just have to see how much of an obstructionist bush will be with the UN making this plea.
 
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