Contrary to popular belief

[Ron in Regina]

In a nutshell I interpret the thread to be about people not needing guns of capabilities beyond which they are being used? (No need for a gatling gun to kill rats) -

I'm on the outside of this one, as I do not, have not, & as of this point don't desire
to own a firearm. What you're saying though, is that for varmint control or deer
hunting....someone would need the firearm above in the picture below, and not
the one below in the picture then?

 

[L Gilbert]

I'm on the outside of this one, as I do not, have not, & as of this point don't desire
to own a firearm. What you're saying though, is that for varmint control or deer
hunting....someone would need the firearm above in the picture below, and not
the one below in the picture then?

Either would do. My personal preference for varmints is the Rem. M700 SPS in .22-250.
A friend has a Win. M70 in .243 for deer. I use a L-E in .303. Wifey uses a Win. M94 in 30-30.
That black thing is just plain fugly. Wouldn't have anything like that in my house.

 

[DaSleeper]

Don't need them big capacity magazines, you shouldn't need more than one shot.
Once, when I was young, and my Dad had bagged a moose, I asked him how many shots he took to get the moose.... His answer was "There was only one moose":icon_smile:

 

[L Gilbert]

Don't need them big capacity magazines, you shouldn't need more than one shot.
Once, when I was young, and my Dad had bagged a moose, I asked him how many shots he took to get the moose.... His answer was "There was only one moose":icon_smile:

Head shot. Probabilities are you completely miss or the critter drops like a rock. I like 3 rounds in the mag.

 

[bobnoorduyn]

I'm on the outside of this one, as I do not, have not, & as of this point don't desire
to own a firearm. What you're saying though, is that for varmint control or deer
hunting....someone would need the firearm above in the picture below, and not
the one below in the picture then?

They are both functionally identical, without closer inspection I can only deduce that the top one is a Ruger Mini 14 like the one used in the Montreal shooting, and the lower one is one of many AR15 variants. The lower one is restricted while the top one isn't, that is the lunacy of restricting particular firearms. They both shoot the same ammunition at the same rate, but is just a matter of aesthetics, "looks bad, is bad".

Either would do. My personal preference for varmints is the Rem. M700 SPS in .22-250.
A friend has a Win. M70 in .243 for deer. I use a L-E in .303. Wifey uses a Win. M94 in 30-30.
That black thing is just plain fugly. Wouldn't have anything like that in my house.

So you obviously know that your 22-250 is a far deadlier round than the much maligned 223 Rem. For those who don't know, in ascending order of maximum muzzle velocity for .224 cal 40 gr. bullets; 218 Bee - 2799fps, 22 Hornet - 2845fps, 221 Fireball - 3033fps, 222 Rem - 3488fps, 223 Rem - 3685fps, 222 Rem Mag - 3818fps, 22-250 - 4091fps, 220 Swift - 4126fps. Yours isn't the mother of all 22's, but damn close.

All kidding aside, I understand that not all shots meet their target, but perhaps that can be met with .308 semi-auto with a magazine that holds 3 rounds as mentioned by James Bondo. The best solution of course is discussion and compromise.

I fully understand, but as I mentioned I am only an average shooter at best. I can change mags and keep on shooting at a fairly good rate regardless of the mag capacity. When you come up with restrictions like maximum mag capacities, and find that doesn't change anything, the the scale has been tipped, and you go for even more restrictions, which will not work either, and on and on it goes. This is the fear of the libertarians, I understand it because that is how we got to the rediculous regulations we have here. The FAC idea worked, but you can never predict who is going to go off the rails, no amount of regulation will change that. That is when we come up with total disarmament of the citizenry. But the criminals and loonies will still find ways to circumvent the law, and we are at their mercy, good luck.

 

[Retired_Can_Soldier]

They are both functionally identical, without closer inspection I can only deduce that the top one is a Ruger Mini 14 like the one used in the Montreal shooting, and the lower one is one of many AR15 variants. The lower one is restricted while the top one isn't, that is the lunacy of restricting particular firearms. They both shoot the same ammunition at the same rate, but is just a matter of aesthetics, "looks bad, is bad".

Beyond the aesthetics the pistol grip along with what looks like an adjustable stock would make the lower weapon far more effective in close quarter shooting. Especially when engaging multiple targets in a room to room assault. The weapon above would be more effective in a tower shooting such as that performed by Charles Whitman in 1966. Although I believe Whitman, a trained sniper, used a bolt action weapon.

I fully understand, but as I mentioned I am only an average shooter at best. I can change mags and keep on shooting at a fairly good rate regardless of the mag capacity. When you come up with restrictions like maximum mag capacities, and find that doesn't change anything, the the scale has been tipped, and you go for even more restrictions, which will not work either, and on and on it goes. This is the fear of the libertarians, I understand it because that is how we got to the rediculous regulations we have here. The FAC idea worked, but you can never predict who is going to go off the rails, no amount of regulation will change that. That is when we come up with total disarmament of the citizenry. But the criminals and loonies will still find ways to circumvent the law, and we are at their mercy, good luck.

No amount of regulation will stop some people from going off the rails, but making weapons readily available to them is also not the answer.

Somewhere in the middle is the answer and that is what we as a society should be striving for through debate and adult discussion.

 

[petros]

Let us say that you are right, and an armed population is what prevents nations from being so easily invaded. Now take a look at the armaments that civilians will need to stand up to a modern military: rocket launchers, machine guns, naval vessels, fighter jets, and nuclear bombs.

All of those weapons you mentioned need people to operate them and a whole heap of people to keep them supplied and maintained in areas they are unfamiliar with. Insurgents have ****ed up the day for many a military.

What is the biggest problem in A-Stan? IEDs and insurgents.

The Swiss for some odd reason doesn't have a shooting spree problem with their Govt issued household riflles.

How come?

 

[JamesBondo]

I am probably a below average shooter at a target range. However, when it comes to hunting I haven't missed a shot in 20 years. I would not have a problem exchanging my semi auto hunting rifle with a single fire, but I am getting the impression that it would just be another knee jerk reaction brought on by gun illiterate law makers. My rifle was never made for rapid fire, its barrel length adds extra kick back and with a standard sporting stock ( no pistol grip) you are not going to get an experience remotely close to an AR-15

 

[Goober]

All of those weapons you mentioned need people to operate them and a whole heap of people to keep them supplied and maintained in areas they are unfamiliar with. Insurgents have ****ed up the day for many a military.

What is the biggest problem in A-Stan? IEDs and insurgents.

The Swiss for some odd reason doesn't have a shooting spree problem with their Govt issued household riflles.

How come?

Social responsibility- Culture - Medical care - better then what we have- in Canada Mental health care is a provincial responsibility.

 

[taxslave]

Social responsibility- Culture - Medical care - better then what we have- in Canada Mental health care is a provincial responsibility.

I think all our politicians need mental health care.

 

[JLM]

I think all our politicians need mental health care.

Or it won't be long before they need physical health care.-

 

[Stretch]

Adam Lanza CONFIRMED to be on mind-altering medication for Asperger's, a form of Autism.

Autism is most commonly treated with SSRIs.

SSRIs have a long history of triggering irrational violence.

In 2008, a student in Finland on SSRIs killed ten other students and then took his own life, a chilling prelude to today's tragedy!

See Violent acts associated with fluvoxamine treatment

See Suicidality, violence and mania caused by selective serotonin reuptake inhibtors (SSRIs)

See The connection between violence, suicide, homicide, and antidepressants

See SSRI Stories: Violence, Murder, Suicide – Mothers & Antidepressants

See SSRI-Induced Akathisia's Link To Suicide and Violence

See Canadian judge rules SSRI antidepressants like Prozac can cause children to commit murder

See The Underlying Cause of Suicides and Homicides with SSRI Antidepressants:Is It the Drugs, the Doctors, or the Drug Companies?


Can Antidepressants Cause Violence? - YouTube


So what we have here is not a gun problem, but an out of control pharmaceutical industry that inflicts autism on children with excessive (and sometimes useless) vaccinations for profit, then instead of ceasing the vaccinations to stop autism, simply views autism as yet another opportunity for profit, and sells more medications to the kids, then covers up the fact that these autism medications, mostly SSRIs, are triggering otherwise inexplicable acts of extreme violence.
We know Adam Lanza was autistic and likely being treated with SSRIs. The next question is whether the "Dar Knight" shooter and the man at the Portland Shopping Mall were also on these types of drugs. And we must do it ourselves, because the agenda of the government is to blame guns and the agenda of the corporate media is not to anger pharmaceutical companies and risk losing those lucrative advertising contracts.
CALL TO ACTION: The only way Americans are going to halt this latest gun-grabber attack on the Bill of Rights is to force the issue of SSRI-caused violence into the public eye. You, yes YOU need to forward all these articles about SSRIs and violence, and the fact that the Connecticut shooter was on these medications, to all your local media, all your family and friends, every public forum you can find, and especially to flood the offices of members of Congress (who already had hearings into this very problem). Right now that fancy software the government bought to fake thousands of online identities is cranked up into rock-and-roll, full-tilt, afterburner overdrive. Unless We The People match them post for post, fact for myth, the gun-grabbers will win through attrition. The first side to quit loses. PLEASE SPREAD ALL THESE STORIES ABOUT SSRI-VIOLENCE, and demand to know if the Dark Knight Shooter and the shooter at the shopping mall in Portkand were also on these drugs.

 

[Stretch]

Sandy Hook massacre: Official story spins out of control


Sandy Hook massacre: Official story spins out of control | Veterans Today

 

[damngrumpy]

At the very beginning of this thread I agree with the comments made. The problem is
not really criminals with guns in most cases it is the mentally ill or potentially violent
people with guns. If we can devise a method of tracking them that is a first step in real
change. The other part of the equation is to determine what the level of risk is for a
society from a person who is at risk. For example we have a woman in Vancouver who
has stated she wants to be a serial killer. Is she bluffing? If you live near her do you
take her at her word, or do you just shrub it off?
This is another example of letting someone into the country without proper screening.
She came from a former eastern block country, what was the level of risk for her coming
here.
More importantly, guns in the hands of criminals actually see limited targeted use and
it centers around disputes with each other. Insane people are prone to some sort of
revenge for things real or imagined and those weapons are often used against society
at large.
Therefore if we target the mentally ill from getting easy access we would have more success.
Besides law abiding citizens know you don't go hunting squirrels with something akin to a
machine pistol.

 

[JLM]

Besides law abiding citizens know you don't go hunting squirrels with something akin to a
machine pistol.

I'm not sure there is a good reason for hunting squirrels in the first place- there's much bigger and far worse "rodents" than squirrels that can be more justifiably hunted. There was one in Kelowna in 2011........................oh wait, not a rodent, a hog!-

 

[Stretch]

At the very beginning of this thread I agree with the comments made. The problem is
not really criminals with guns in most cases it is the mentally ill or potentially violent
people with guns. If we can devise a method of tracking them that is a first step in real
change. The other part of the equation is to determine what the level of risk is for a
society from a person who is at risk. For example we have a woman in Vancouver who
has stated she wants to be a serial killer. Is she bluffing? If you live near her do you
take her at her word, or do you just shrub it off?
This is another example of letting someone into the country without proper screening.
She came from a former eastern block country, what was the level of risk for her coming
here.
More importantly, guns in the hands of criminals actually see limited targeted use and
it centers around disputes with each other. Insane people are prone to some sort of
revenge for things real or imagined and those weapons are often used against society
at large.
Therefore if we target the mentally ill from getting easy access we would have more success.
Besides law abiding citizens know you don't go hunting squirrels with something akin to a
machine pistol.

define mentally ill mate, because today, every human emotion has been classed as a mental illness. I work in the disability sector, mental health is becoming a huge issue, only because there are billions of $ to be made by big pharma, so everything little thing can now be diagnosed as a mental health issue. Does a Dr know what possible side effects could result from him prescribing whatever to someone s'posedly has a mental health issue? do they care? not while they're receiving kickbacks, ie: pay holidays over seas etc...and dont say it doesnt happen, I see it!

Psychiatry goes insane: Every human emotion now classified as a mental disorder in new psychiatric manual DSM-5

http://www.naturalnews.com/038322_DSM-5_psychiatry_false_diagnosis.html


right down to fear of tyranny
http://www.dogpile.com/info.dogpl/search/web?q=fear+of+tyranny+now+a+mental+illness

 

[Retired_Can_Soldier]

This is for THE OLD MEDIC who PM'd me a rather lengthy response in regard to this thread.

Good Grief. Yes I am well aware of the US Constitution.

As an ex military person I have handled numerous weapons, but have yet to hear a feasible argument why a civilian should have access to either an assault weapon or a semi automatic weapon that requires anything larger than a five round mag.

Beyond hunting weapons or a handgun for personal protection I am still waiting for that argument.

Just recently someone from what I consider the "WACKY GUN BUNCH or THE SCREWY MILITIA TYPES" made an argument as to how the present US Administration is comparable to The Third Reich. They did this on an open forum and surprisingly enough no one with Jack Boots kicked in their door for expressing that view.

People like this and those that quote the constitution as though it were written with the hand of god himself sound like the crazy Mullah's who talk about how Islam should be spread by the sword.

Please save your long winded responses for the forum. I served my country with pride and soldiers from my family have served in every war including Afghanistan, except Vietnam, so please spare me the mantra:

'And you, as a former mrilitary person, should know that there is no such thing as a "gun" among weapons.. As we learned in the Army, a "gun" is what hangs between the legs of a male human being! A "weapon" is what shoots bullets.'

In the Artillery we had Guns.

UBIQUE

 

[Stretch]

Sandy Hook Shooting: Active-Shooter Drill Confirmed by Law Enforcement Raises Suspicion of False Flag Operation :

 

[CDNBear]

Oh brother.

 

[gerryh]

Oh brother.

and that's putting it mildly.