The Padre
Posts: 4,558 
Location: Ontario
Location: Ontario
January 17th, 2007, 06:55 AM
From sitting up straight to passing things accross the table, there are some things people still don't know. Edward Fenner writes.
In Part I of this article, we learned a bit about table manners. Now we'll focus on the finer elements of civilized dining.
Table manners exist for a reason. Good manners show a civility and respect for your tablemates. While manners vary from culture to culture, good conduct is still the norm. Acting like a barnyard animal at the trough won’t take you very far, nor will it garner you much respect. Besides, gentlemen just don’t do that.
Dinner is Served
Once dinner is under way, remember that it’s not a race to the finish. Pace yourself. Likewise, if you are last and holding up the next course, or perhaps dessert, maybe you are talking too much. Be aware of the scene and how it’s unfolding.
In respect to posture, there are only three things to remember:
Children may be served first, something small to get them started and to keep them occupied, but nothing messy. Otherwise, senior guests at the table should be given first opportunity at whatever they like. This shows respect and deference. Follow their cues.
Condiments
Some people like ketchup. It goes great with fries, burgers, and hot dogs. However, few things will break a host’s heart like asking for ketchup when a special dinner is served – or worse, you then drown your meal in the red goop.
Mustards are often available. Standard yellow mustard is not the way to go (think ketchup, only yellow). Dijon mustard is a common dinner counterpart. Whole grain mustards come in a wide assortment. Try some.
Horseradish is a common addition to beef. Chutneys are sometimes served with chicken or pork.
Salt, pepper, and a few items like nutmeg, paprika, or parsley flakes are also commonly available. Salt and pepper should be moved together even if only the one is asked for and they should be put onto the table, not into someone’s hand. This prevents the opportunity for it to be mishandled and dropped. Pass the stuff along and ask the person next to pass it along.
If something you like is missing from the table, you may ask the host if they have what you are looking for available. Don’t ask for something unusual you may have at home, but may not be something your host would have. It suggests that you are not satisfied with the way the food tastes and could be interpreted as insulting. It may be deliberate on the host’s part to NOT have certain add-ons available so as not to change the intended flavoring.
Forks and Fingers
For most proper sit-down meals, tools are used. Forks, knives, and spoons are pretty much universal. If chopsticks are presented, use them if you know how. If you don’t, do give them a try. If you cannot manage them or are concerned about making a mess, it’s okay to ask for western cutlery.
Some foods are meant to be eaten with your fingers. Chicken fingers can be eaten either way. Regular chicken is borderline. Proper dining calls for tools – picnics call for fingers. Burgers, fries, dogs, ribs, subs, bread, sandwiches, cookies, hors d’ouveres, and stemmed fruits are all finger friendly. Sates and kebabs are okay to hold in your hand, but the items should be removed to your plate with your fork.
It’s not Lemon Soup
Finger bowls are coming back into style. They are common at restaurants where a lot of finger-foods are served (chicken, ribs, etc.), but are not very common at private dinners. More recently, these accessories are finding a place at the table again. Finger bowls usually contain a bit warm water and a small chunk of lemon. Dip your fingertips in the bowl, but don’t use the bowl as a mini sink. After dipping, clean off your fingers on your napkin.
Dinner Delay
It happens sometimes. Things don’t go according to plan and dinner will be late. Go with the flow. Good hosts already know what’s going on, so don’t ask. If the meal is going to be delayed more than 15 minutes, the host will likely put something small out to tide things over. If you have a particular dietary requirement to eat by a certain time, privately ask the host if there is something you can have. Good hosts will accommodate.
Delay or no delay, the host will give the go-ahead to eat. If people are slow to respond and you are alone at the table or buffet, do not go ahead. Wait for at least one other person. If nobody comes, invite someone to get the process started. Unless it is a cold buffet dinner, the host will not appreciate going through all the trouble of preparing a hot meal only to have it go cold and uneaten.
Gadgets and Gizmos
Cell phones, PDAs, Blackberries, iPods, and other toys and personal entertainment devices are not cool at dinner. Only a few professionals and laypersons really need to be available during dinner (doctors, etc.). If you must be available, keep your phone on vibrate and if it does go off, excuse yourself from the table.
_____________________________
dinner rules
The elements of fine table manners are subjective and should not be taken too literally. Just be kind and courteous – always remember that food is a social event and should be treated as such.
From sitting up straight to passing things accross the table, there are some things people still don't know. Edward Fenner writes.
In Part I of this article, we learned a bit about table manners. Now we'll focus on the finer elements of civilized dining.Table manners exist for a reason. Good manners show a civility and respect for your tablemates. While manners vary from culture to culture, good conduct is still the norm. Acting like a barnyard animal at the trough won’t take you very far, nor will it garner you much respect. Besides, gentlemen just don’t do that.
Dinner is Served
Once dinner is under way, remember that it’s not a race to the finish. Pace yourself. Likewise, if you are last and holding up the next course, or perhaps dessert, maybe you are talking too much. Be aware of the scene and how it’s unfolding.
In respect to posture, there are only three things to remember:
- Don’t slouch
- Keep your elbows off the table
- Keep your feet still and flat on the floor
Children may be served first, something small to get them started and to keep them occupied, but nothing messy. Otherwise, senior guests at the table should be given first opportunity at whatever they like. This shows respect and deference. Follow their cues.
Condiments
Some people like ketchup. It goes great with fries, burgers, and hot dogs. However, few things will break a host’s heart like asking for ketchup when a special dinner is served – or worse, you then drown your meal in the red goop.
Mustards are often available. Standard yellow mustard is not the way to go (think ketchup, only yellow). Dijon mustard is a common dinner counterpart. Whole grain mustards come in a wide assortment. Try some.
Horseradish is a common addition to beef. Chutneys are sometimes served with chicken or pork.
Salt, pepper, and a few items like nutmeg, paprika, or parsley flakes are also commonly available. Salt and pepper should be moved together even if only the one is asked for and they should be put onto the table, not into someone’s hand. This prevents the opportunity for it to be mishandled and dropped. Pass the stuff along and ask the person next to pass it along.
If something you like is missing from the table, you may ask the host if they have what you are looking for available. Don’t ask for something unusual you may have at home, but may not be something your host would have. It suggests that you are not satisfied with the way the food tastes and could be interpreted as insulting. It may be deliberate on the host’s part to NOT have certain add-ons available so as not to change the intended flavoring.
Forks and Fingers
For most proper sit-down meals, tools are used. Forks, knives, and spoons are pretty much universal. If chopsticks are presented, use them if you know how. If you don’t, do give them a try. If you cannot manage them or are concerned about making a mess, it’s okay to ask for western cutlery.
Some foods are meant to be eaten with your fingers. Chicken fingers can be eaten either way. Regular chicken is borderline. Proper dining calls for tools – picnics call for fingers. Burgers, fries, dogs, ribs, subs, bread, sandwiches, cookies, hors d’ouveres, and stemmed fruits are all finger friendly. Sates and kebabs are okay to hold in your hand, but the items should be removed to your plate with your fork.
It’s not Lemon Soup
Finger bowls are coming back into style. They are common at restaurants where a lot of finger-foods are served (chicken, ribs, etc.), but are not very common at private dinners. More recently, these accessories are finding a place at the table again. Finger bowls usually contain a bit warm water and a small chunk of lemon. Dip your fingertips in the bowl, but don’t use the bowl as a mini sink. After dipping, clean off your fingers on your napkin.
Dinner Delay
It happens sometimes. Things don’t go according to plan and dinner will be late. Go with the flow. Good hosts already know what’s going on, so don’t ask. If the meal is going to be delayed more than 15 minutes, the host will likely put something small out to tide things over. If you have a particular dietary requirement to eat by a certain time, privately ask the host if there is something you can have. Good hosts will accommodate.
Delay or no delay, the host will give the go-ahead to eat. If people are slow to respond and you are alone at the table or buffet, do not go ahead. Wait for at least one other person. If nobody comes, invite someone to get the process started. Unless it is a cold buffet dinner, the host will not appreciate going through all the trouble of preparing a hot meal only to have it go cold and uneaten.
Gadgets and Gizmos
Cell phones, PDAs, Blackberries, iPods, and other toys and personal entertainment devices are not cool at dinner. Only a few professionals and laypersons really need to be available during dinner (doctors, etc.). If you must be available, keep your phone on vibrate and if it does go off, excuse yourself from the table.
_____________________________
dinner rules
The elements of fine table manners are subjective and should not be taken too literally. Just be kind and courteous – always remember that food is a social event and should be treated as such.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Posts: 6,470
Videos: 5
Location: Newfoundland!
Videos: 5
Location: Newfoundland!
January 17th, 2007, 10:40 AM
this is rediculous. People can eat however they want, kids can have messy foods as long as the parents will clean it up, elbows can go on the table or in the saucer for all i care and yes it is disgusting when someone talks with their mouth open but if someone wants to do it they can.
By far the best way to eat is when everyone is relaxed. Enforcing a load of strict rules on where people should put their hands and how they should dress and which nostril they should breath through just ruins the atmos.
loosen up
this is rediculous. People can eat however they want, kids can have messy foods as long as the parents will clean it up, elbows can go on the table or in the saucer for all i care and yes it is disgusting when someone talks with their mouth open but if someone wants to do it they can.
By far the best way to eat is when everyone is relaxed. Enforcing a load of strict rules on where people should put their hands and how they should dress and which nostril they should breath through just ruins the atmos.
loosen up
Clever Clogs
Posts: 634
Location: Quebec
Location: Quebec
January 17th, 2007, 10:46 AM
I did not see you port for Part I, but an pleased to see your post. Table manners seem to have disappeared these last few years. One thing that really irks me is when I see men and boys eating with their caps. When we eat out with others if there is one who keeps his cap I ask him to remove it, you would be suprised how the blush at this request. My request has never been refused but I am expecting a day when someone will tell me to go to #%&@. Maybe I am too conservative for today but I feel manners show reflects self respect and respect of others. I admit that some never had the opportunity to learn matters at home, but with the opportunities at our fingertips today to improve oneself that is not an excuse. Maybe I am a little to "snob" on this point but I believe it is important. It is so nice to see someone with good table manners.
I did not see you port for Part I, but an pleased to see your post. Table manners seem to have disappeared these last few years. One thing that really irks me is when I see men and boys eating with their caps. When we eat out with others if there is one who keeps his cap I ask him to remove it, you would be suprised how the blush at this request. My request has never been refused but I am expecting a day when someone will tell me to go to #%&@. Maybe I am too conservative for today but I feel manners show reflects self respect and respect of others. I admit that some never had the opportunity to learn matters at home, but with the opportunities at our fingertips today to improve oneself that is not an excuse. Maybe I am a little to "snob" on this point but I believe it is important. It is so nice to see someone with good table manners.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Posts: 6,470
Videos: 5
Location: Newfoundland!
Videos: 5
Location: Newfoundland!
January 17th, 2007, 10:50 AM
I hve noticed that cap wearing is often a strong psychological barrier. almost like a security blanket. Some men are unconfident about their hair, others think they can only look cool with their cap on. Ive really noticed though that some people are extremely reluctant to remove their caps... to the point of it being a complex or something. Personally i wouldnt wear a hat indoors because a lot of people seem to think it rude, and i hate wearing hats of any kind.
plus my hair is wonderful
I hve noticed that cap wearing is often a strong psychological barrier. almost like a security blanket. Some men are unconfident about their hair, others think they can only look cool with their cap on. Ive really noticed though that some people are extremely reluctant to remove their caps... to the point of it being a complex or something. Personally i wouldnt wear a hat indoors because a lot of people seem to think it rude, and i hate wearing hats of any kind.
plus my hair is wonderful
Clever Clogs
Posts: 634
Location: Quebec
Location: Quebec
January 17th, 2007, 11:19 AM
I think humans are better than that!
Quoting hermanntrude
As far as kids being messy I have no problem. Anyone who serves messy food when children will be eating is responsible for the clean up and parents should not feel guilty or embarrased, the host should know better. However I object to people putting their elbows on the table especially when they are next to me. Have you ever eaten at a table with someone's elbow on you cutlery or almost in your dish?? No very pleasant. This is where respect of others comes in! Have you had anyone talk to you with their mouth full spitting food at you? They don't spit all their food at you but inadvertently tiny pieces. Also it is gross to see an open mouth with half chewed food in it, that is the way animals eat.
this is rediculous. People can eat however they want, kids can have messy foods as long as the parents will clean it up, elbows can go on the table or in the saucer for all i care and yes it is disgusting when someone talks with their mouth open but if someone wants to do it they can.
By far the best way to eat is when everyone is relaxed. Enforcing a load of strict rules on where people should put their hands and how they should dress and which nostril they should breath through just ruins the atmos.
loosen up
By far the best way to eat is when everyone is relaxed. Enforcing a load of strict rules on where people should put their hands and how they should dress and which nostril they should breath through just ruins the atmos.
loosen up
I think humans are better than that!
Genius
Posts: 864
Location: windsor,ontario
Location: windsor,ontario
January 17th, 2007, 11:21 AM
Quoting Sparrow
this is the thing for part one, i copied its title for you- The Gentleman's Handbook On Table Manners
I did not see you port for Part I, but an pleased to see your post. Table manners seem to have disappeared these last few years. One thing that really irks me is when I see men and boys eating with their caps. When we eat out with others if there is one who keeps his cap I ask him to remove it, you would be suprised how the blush at this request. My request has never been refused but I am expecting a day when someone will tell me to go to #%&@. Maybe I am too conservative for today but I feel manners show reflects self respect and respect of others. I admit that some never had the opportunity to learn matters at home, but with the opportunities at our fingertips today to improve oneself that is not an excuse. Maybe I am a little to "snob" on this point but I believe it is important. It is so nice to see someone with good table manners.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Posts: 6,470
Videos: 5
Location: Newfoundland!
Videos: 5
Location: Newfoundland!
January 17th, 2007, 11:23 AM
humans are apes. not better than animals. BUT i agree that being spat at and seeing chewed food is slightly revolting (although really not somethign to get your knickers in a twist about). What i object to is it being made into some kind of rulebook. People KNOW when they're being disgusting and shouldnt need people to tell them. If you find a particular person disgusting don't eat with them. dont hand them a gilt-clad rulebook and tell them they will be a real human being if they only partain to follow this code.
humans are apes. not better than animals. BUT i agree that being spat at and seeing chewed food is slightly revolting (although really not somethign to get your knickers in a twist about). What i object to is it being made into some kind of rulebook. People KNOW when they're being disgusting and shouldnt need people to tell them. If you find a particular person disgusting don't eat with them. dont hand them a gilt-clad rulebook and tell them they will be a real human being if they only partain to follow this code.
Chief Mogrifier
Posts: 8,885
January 17th, 2007, 11:29 AM
Quoting hermanntrude
Most good table manners are simply common sense and courtesy. I enjoy seeing good table manners and I don't enforce the "rules". I just don't invite slobs back a second time.
this is rediculous. People can eat however they want, kids can have messy foods as long as the parents will clean it up, elbows can go on the table or in the saucer for all i care and yes it is disgusting when someone talks with their mouth open but if someone wants to do it they can.
By far the best way to eat is when everyone is relaxed. Enforcing a load of strict rules on where people should put their hands and how they should dress and which nostril they should breath through just ruins the atmos.
loosen up
By far the best way to eat is when everyone is relaxed. Enforcing a load of strict rules on where people should put their hands and how they should dress and which nostril they should breath through just ruins the atmos.
loosen up
Knows No Bounds
Posts: 2,729
Location: Vancouver Island
Location: Vancouver Island
January 17th, 2007, 11:47 PM
[quote=hermanntrude;769147]this is rediculous. People can eat however they want, kids can have messy foods as long as the parents will clean it up, elbows can go on the table or in the saucer for all i care and yes it is disgusting when someone talks with their mouth open but if someone wants to do it they can.
By far the best way to eat is when everyone is relaxed. Enforcing a load of strict rules on where people should put their hands and how they should dress and which nostril they should breath through just ruins the atmos.
loosen up
If you think the above is "complicated", that is sad, everything that was explained is just
courtesy and good manners, and it's really quite simple, and separates us from the "animals."
[quote=hermanntrude;769147]this is rediculous. People can eat however they want, kids can have messy foods as long as the parents will clean it up, elbows can go on the table or in the saucer for all i care and yes it is disgusting when someone talks with their mouth open but if someone wants to do it they can.
By far the best way to eat is when everyone is relaxed. Enforcing a load of strict rules on where people should put their hands and how they should dress and which nostril they should breath through just ruins the atmos.
loosen up
If you think the above is "complicated", that is sad, everything that was explained is just
courtesy and good manners, and it's really quite simple, and separates us from the "animals."
