Revelation 13:11 - USA - Last World Empire


herald
#1
(Please read, "Daniel, Revelation & World History Reveal The Antichrist," first)

At about the same time the first beast (the Papacy) went into captivity (Rev 13:10) in 1798 under Napoleon, we read, "And I beheld another beast..." (Rev 13:11). The USA was recognized by France as a world power around 1798. It comes up out of the earth, a sparsely populated place and has two horns LIKE a LAMB (a young, christian nation), but speaks as a dragon. A nation/kingdom speaks through it's laws and military might. Two horns, without crowns - civil liberty (NO KING) and religious liberty (NO POPE). While, the USA arose out of a sparsely populated place, the first beast arose out of the sea (representing the Papacy's growth in the populated areas of Europe - please see Rev 17:15).

Early Americans made clear statements about the separation of church and state. GEORGE WASHINGTON in 1789 said, "Every man conducting himself as a good citizen and being accountable to God, alone, for his religious options, ought to be protected in worshipping the deity according to the dictates of his own conscience."

BENJAMIN FRANKLIN said this, "When religion is good, it will take care of itself. When it's not able to take care of itself, and God does not see fit to take care of it, so that it has to appeal to the civil power for support, it's evidence in my mind that the cause is a bad one." (Christian Coalition? Didn't Jesus say, "My kingdom is not of this world, else would my servants fight"?)

ULYSSES S. GRANT, in the 1800s said, "Leave the matter of religious teaching to the family altar, the church and the private school, supported, entirely, by private contributions. Keep the church and state forever separated."

Rev 13:12 says, "And he (Protestant America) exerciseth all the power of the first beast (Papal Rome) before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed." Protestant America (the "Harlot's" daughters, as seen in Rev 17:5 - Rome calls herself, the "Mother Church") will stretch it's hand across the ocean and unite with the Papacy (Haven't we, already, seen this, as when President Reagan united with the Pope to bring down communism in eastern Europe?)

Church, I never thought I'd see the day when Evangelicals would embrace the Roman church - men, I love and admire, such as Billy Graham, Pat Robertson, Chuck Colson, etc. It must be the love of the Truth - the Word of God that unites us (whether Catholic or Protestant) - doctrine DOES matter.

The Dragon (Satan) wanted to replace God, the first beast (the Papacy) seeks to replace our Lord Jesus Christ. "The leader of the Catholic church is defined by the faith as the Vicar of Jesus Christ (and accepted as such by believers). The Pope is considered the man on earth who TAKES THE PLACE of the Second Person of the omnipotent God of the Trinity." - POPE JOHN PAUL 11, Crossing the threshold of Hope, p.3, 1994. The final beast (Protestant America) will perform miracles and cause men (by force) to worship the first beast (the Papacy), seeking to replace the ministry of the Holy Spirit.

The Bible says, we are headed for a one-world religion (Ecumenical Movement) and a one-world government (New World Order). How is this going to come about? How does, "the greatest empire the world has ever known," spread it's influence?

DEMOCRACY...Wake up, sleeping church.
 
thecdn
#2
Wow , my head hurts now.

I like my fiction with spaceships and aliens....
 
SaintLucifer
#3
Quote: Originally Posted by herald

(Please read, "Daniel, Revelation & World History Reveal The Antichrist," first)
At about the same time the first beast (the Papacy) went into captivity (Rev 13:10) in 1798 under Napoleon, we read, "And I beheld another beast..." (Rev 13:11). The USA was recognized by France as a world power around 1798. It comes up out of the earth, a sparsely populated place and has two horns LIKE a LAMB (a young, christian nation), but speaks as a dragon. A nation/kingdom speaks through it's laws and military might. Two horns, without crowns - civil liberty (NO KING) and religious liberty (NO POPE). While, the USA arose out of a sparsely populated place, the first beast arose out of the sea (representing the Papacy's growth in the populated areas of Europe - please see Rev 17:15).
Early Americans made clear statements about the separation of church and state. GEORGE WASHINGTON in 1789 said, "Every man conducting himself as a good citizen and being accountable to God, alone, for his religious options, ought to be protected in worshipping the deity according to the dictates of his own conscience."
BENJAMIN FRANKLIN said this, "When religion is good, it will take care of itself. When it's not able to take care of itself, and God does not see fit to take care of it, so that it has to appeal to the civil power for support, it's evidence in my mind that the cause is a bad one." (Christian Coalition? Didn't Jesus say, "My kingdom is not of...

Quote has been trimmed
... and this my children is why religion should be destroyed. Crushed. Banned. Obliterated. Humanity is far too advanced both technologically and socially to put up with this crap.
 
Daz_Hockey
#4
and it's not the "greatest empire the world has ever known"...technically it's the smallest and most short-lived....jeeps, what arrogence...and France only recogneised you as a "tool" against Britain, thats all America ever was to them, even in Vietnam, they stitched you up
 
SaintLucifer
#5
Quote: Originally Posted by Daz_Hockey

and it's not the "greatest empire the world has ever known"...technically it's the smallest and most short-lived....jeeps, what arrogence...and France only recogneised you as a "tool" against Britain, thats all America ever was to them, even in Vietnam, they stitched you up

The British Empire was the greatest Empire the world has ever known. Without question. No one else even begins to approach them.
 
Finder
#6
riiiight, I really should spend more time on my bible history, if the bible history wasn't usually a complete waste of my time.

Anyhow you can make those sayins into anything, and you could easyly make it into the Soviet union or any power if you wanted to and had the imagination.
 
SaintLucifer
#7
Quote: Originally Posted by Finder

riiiight, I really should spend more time on my bible history, if the bible history wasn't usually a complete waste of my time.

Anyhow you can make those sayins into anything, and you could easyly make it into the Soviet union or any power if you wanted to and had the imagination.

The Bible? That is nothing more than a propaganda guide created by the Jews to hold sway over their own people. It took advantage of the fears Humanity had in those days. We are an advanced race today. It is time to burn the Bible as it no longer serves any purpose. We are no longer in the dark as we were 2000 years ago. Get a grip people. The Bible is nothing more than a collection of fables used to instill fear in your own fear of the unknown. It was used to garner your obedience, nothing more.
 
Finder
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by SaintLucifer

Quote: Originally Posted by Finder

riiiight, I really should spend more time on my bible history, if the bible history wasn't usually a complete waste of my time.

Anyhow you can make those sayins into anything, and you could easyly make it into the Soviet union or any power if you wanted to and had the imagination.

The Bible? That is nothing more than a propaganda guide created by the Jews to hold sway over their own people. It took advantage of the fears Humanity had in those days. We are an advanced race today. It is time to burn the Bible as it no longer serves any purpose. We are no longer in the dark as we were 2000 years ago. Get a grip people. The Bible is nothing more than a collection of fables used to instill fear in your own fear of the unknown. It was used to garner your obedience, nothing more.

riiiiight.
 
SaintLucifer
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by Finder

Quote: Originally Posted by SaintLucifer

Quote: Originally Posted by Finder

riiiight, I really should spend more time on my bible history, if the bible history wasn't usually a complete waste of my time.

Anyhow you can make those sayins into anything, and you could easyly make it into the Soviet union or any power if you wanted to and had the imagination.

The Bible? That is nothing more than a propaganda guide created by the Jews to hold sway over their own people. It took advantage of the fears Humanity had in those days. We are an advanced race today. It is time to burn the Bible as it no longer serves any purpose. We are no longer in the dark as we were 2000 years ago. Get a grip people. The Bible is nothing more than a collection of fables used to instill fear in your own fear of the unknown. It was used to garner your obedience, nothing more.

riiiiight.

What exactly do you think it was?
 
Finder
#10
definitely not that. As the bible was decided after the fact by Bishops around the Roman empire and not by jewish people. Also the Jewish people were and still are reclussive compaired European societies and religion.
 
SaintLucifer
#11
Quote: Originally Posted by Finder

definitely not that. As the bible was decided after the fact by Bishops around the Roman empire and not by jewish people. Also the Jewish people were and still are reclussive compaired European societies and religion.

You actually believe that ****? See? Propaganda works wonders!
 
Finder
#12
SaintLucifer, your a fascist as a big joke, right? If not I still find you funny. lol
 
SaintLucifer
#13
Quote: Originally Posted by Finder

SaintLucifer, your a fascist as a big joke, right? If not I still find you funny. lol

I am absolutely a fascist through and through.
 
Finder
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by SaintLucifer

Quote: Originally Posted by Finder

SaintLucifer, your a fascist as a big joke, right? If not I still find you funny. lol

I am absolutely a fascist through and through.


Sure you are, you are just yanking our chains. Fascism, is the most discredited system ever in the history of the world.
 
The Project Man
#15
Where do you people come up with this stuff?
The founding fathers of the USA, "The Two Horned Lamb, were Quakers. Running away from the suppression of christians.

Quaker:

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(Please read, "Daniel, Revelation & World History Reveal The Antichrist," first)
Posted here already!

Once again I am fortified in my disbelief in christians, their text, there prophecies and tales.
 
Hotshot
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by SaintLuciferView Post

The Bible? That is nothing more than a propaganda guide created by the Jews to hold sway over their own people. It took advantage of the fears Humanity had in those days. We are an advanced race today. It is time to burn the Bible as it no longer serves any purpose. We are no longer in the dark as we were 2000 years ago. Get a grip people. The Bible is nothing more than a collection of fables used to instill fear in your own fear of the unknown. It was used to garner your obedience, nothing more.

Its obvious you know nothing about the Bible...
 
GrosZ
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by FinderView Post

definitely not that. As the bible was decided after the fact by Bishops around the Roman empire and not by jewish people. Also the Jewish people were and still are reclussive compaired European societies and religion.

Isnt that just the new testiment that includes Jesus?
When really Jesus would have been brought up as a Jew, reading the old testiment where men ruled and women had to know their place... BEWSH... gotta love a wife beating jesus dont ya!
He probably smoked a lot of weed too... thats where he got all his good ideas from...
 
GrosZ
#18
Quote: Originally Posted by heraldView Post

(Please read, "Daniel, Revelation & World History Reveal The Antichrist," first)
At about the same time the first beast (the Papacy) went into captivity (Rev 13:10) in 1798 under Napoleon, we read, "And I beheld another beast..." (Rev 13:11). The USA was recognized by France as a world power around 1798. It comes up out of the earth, a sparsely populated place and has two horns LIKE a LAMB (a young, christian nation), but speaks as a dragon. A nation/kingdom speaks through it's laws and military might. Two horns, without crowns - civil liberty (NO KING) and religious liberty (NO POPE). While, the USA arose out of a sparsely populated place, the first beast arose out of the sea (representing the Papacy's growth in the populated areas of Europe - please see Rev 17:15).
Early Americans made clear statements about the separation of church and state. GEORGE WASHINGTON in 1789 said, "Every man conducting himself as a good citizen and being accountable to God, alone, for his religious options, ought to be protected in worshipping the deity according to the dictates of his own conscience."
BENJAMIN FRANKLIN said this, "When religion is good, it will take care of itself. When it's not able to take care of itself, and God does not see fit to take care of it, so that it has to appeal to the civil power for support, it's evidence in my mind that the cause is a bad one." (Christian Coalition? Didn't Jesus say, "My kingdom is not of...

Quote has been trimmed, See full post: View Post

Also. Is that the same democracy where say, one man gets voted into the presidency but the corruption of that nation sees fit to place an even more corrupt man in power instead of what the people actually voted? I dont quite class that as a democracy...
wake up sleeping churches?? so you say we get to vote for which church we like best or what?
coz i say when it comes to churches and the religious extreme... id have to vote for arson!
 
Northboy
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by SaintLuciferView Post

... and this my children is why religion should be destroyed. Crushed. Banned. Obliterated. Humanity is far too advanced both technologically and socially to put up with this crap.

Your comment makes no sense to me what so ever.....


But I'd love the opportunity to debate your position with someone with such an "inspired" name...
Last edited by Northboy; Apr 30th, 2007 at 11:59 AM..Reason: more thoughts came to Me.
 
El Barto
#20
I love threads like this ....it smokes out thr religous nuts......so I add to my ignore list hmmm ...darn more christains again? Darn this list is getting long
 
Northboy
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by El BartoView Post

I love threads like this ....it smokes out thr religous nuts......so I add to my ignore list hmmm ...darn more christains again? Darn this list is getting long

Good luck with that......
 
look3467
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by SaintLuciferView Post

The Bible? That is nothing more than a propaganda guide created by the Jews to hold sway over their own people. It took advantage of the fears Humanity had in those days. We are an advanced race today. It is time to burn the Bible as it no longer serves any purpose. We are no longer in the dark as we were 2000 years ago. Get a grip people. The Bible is nothing more than a collection of fables used to instill fear in your own fear of the unknown. It was used to garner your obedience, nothing more.

Tell me about Lucifer? Why a Saint? And what does he have to do with the bible? If you are going to stand by his name, then you must declare who he is in comparison to Jesus.

In order to argue against who the bible is all about (Jesus) then you must know all about it in order to give a good argument against it.

A verse: Rev 2:5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.

Peace>>>AJ

 
snfu73
#23
Quote: Originally Posted by look3467View Post

Tell me about Lucifer? Why a Saint? And what does he have to do with the bible? If you are going to stand by his name, then you must declare who he is in comparison to Jesus.

In order to argue against who the bible is all about (Jesus) then you must know all about it in order to give a good argument against it.

A verse: Rev 2:5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.

Peace>>>AJ

Although, I don't agree with Saint Lucifer and his particular way of putting things, I do think that bible is a book that should be open to criticism and debate. There are great number of...oddities...in the bible...and I can't say I know the bible all that well...but much of what I know I am very skeptical about.
 
sanctus
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by look3467View Post


In order to argue against who the bible is all about (Jesus) then you must know all about it in order to give a good argument against it.

What wonderful advice! I might suggest that you start doing so as soon as possibleThere are a number of very good and reliable Bible sites online I could give you the URL's for to start studying the Bible if you're interested!
 
AndyF
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by heraldView Post

.... the first beast (the Papacy),

..... civil liberty (NO KING) and religious liberty (NO POPE)

Can you substantiate these allegations?

Quote:

Early Americans made clear statements about the separation of church and state. GEORGE WASHINGTON in 1789 said, "Every man conducting himself as a good citizen and being accountable to God, alone, for his religious options, ought to be protected in worshipping the deity according to the dictates of his own conscience."

A tempered conscience only, formed this way by the Holy Spirit. That leaves many who's conscience needs work first, THEN, choosing an appropriate worship comes next. A properly formed conscience can only lead to the true Church. If one isn't there, it is an indicator his conscience needs work. This statement is too broad and all encompassing to be taken seriously.

Quote:

BENJAMIN FRANKLIN said this, "When religion is good, it will take care of itself. When it's not able to take care of itself, and God does not see fit to take care of it, so that it has to appeal to the civil power for support,...

This statement is really evidence that he assumes all churches are institutions established by men. A Church established by God, evidence one that would be Apostolic, would need no support from civil power, in fact the errors made by the civil power would be an indicator of it's non-conformance to the dictates of God's Church. If every civil power were to rise up against God's Church, then that would be to no avail. If every person were to vanish on earth, God's Church would still exist. The Church dies when God says it does. Good Ole' Ben was good at what he did, but it would seem knowing when to leave it to those who's job it is to know, the ministers of the true Church, wasn't one of his strong points.

Quote:

GRANT "Keep the church and state forever separated."

It would appear he lived up to his advice. His command to Sherman to raise, slaughter and to pillage every by now helpless Southern Village in their path showed he had free reign to do has he wished. Perish the thought that he should live up to Jesus's commands, for then by them he would learn that the essence of his ministry was mercy.

Quote:

love of the Truth - the Word of God that unites us (whether Catholic or Protestant) - doctrine DOES matter.

The contradiction is what separates us by the grace of God. If one Church is true, then the other cannot be if they differ in doctrine. We all wish the flock will one day return, but until then it is only a desire.

Quote:

The Bible says, we are headed for a one-world religion.

Not as implied yet to be made, but headed for realization of it's existance. The "Religion" replaced all others 2000 years ago and has been alive vibrant and healthy since then. The Church is there for everyone to see, and one day some will be held to account why they refused to benefit from it's fruits. The "Greatest Empire" is slowly detaching itself from submission to God, and is slowly making itself at par with God with it's decadence and devalueing of life. You reference scripture, but I see the symtoms differently. Sirach 10,5 directly places "the sovereignty of man in the hands of God, who imparts his majesty to the ruler". So there is no seperation of Church and State, has God would not have bonded us two entities into one bound to one common Godly law.

AndyF
Last edited by AndyF; May 14th, 2007 at 01:47 PM..
 
look3467
#26
Quote: Originally Posted by snfu73View Post

Although, I don't agree with Saint Lucifer and his particular way of putting things, I do think that bible is a book that should be open to criticism and debate. There are great number of...oddities...in the bible...and I can't say I know the bible all that well...but much of what I know I am very skeptical about.

Yes, I agree with you wholeheartedly that the bible should be open to criticism and debate. How else would we learn anything?

These oddities are there for debate, to investigate, study, accept or reject, but the key being that we do it in an attitude of love rather than by the letter of the law.
What I mean by that is that church organizations have their traditions, practices and beliefs that require their members to adhere to them, placing them under restraint.
Where Jesus releases us from them and gives us freedom to love.

There is a difference in these two words; want and have to. When we are free, we want, when we are under restraint, we have to.

Brother Sanctus, is Catholic and is restrained by the church to believe a certain prescribed way.

I, in the other hand am free "to want" rather than "have to" live and love without restraint.

What people do not understand, they fear, but when understanding comes, fear is cast away.

The bible is meant to be mauled over, debated, and earnestly prayed over, so that God who is the revealer of secrets opens of the windows of understanding and favors us with answers.

What mankind has done to the bible is to cloud it with their own views of what they think God is rather than what God is.

Jesus revealed God the Father to us in very simple terms, God is love and we should be like Him.

There, was that to hard to understand?

Peace>>>AJ
 
look3467
#27
Quote:

A tempered conscience only, formed this way by the Holy Spirit. That leaves many who's conscience needs work first, THEN, choosing an appropriate worship comes next. A properly formed conscience can only lead to the true Church. If one isn't there, it is an indicator his conscience needs work. This statement is too broad and all encompassing to be taken seriously.>>>AndyF

I tend to agree with that statement in that the conscience is the seed planted in every soul that breaks the womb. The conscience properly addressed will identify itself with the granter of it.
It is only through knowledge and understanding that this thing can come about.
God therefore reveals Himself through the workings of His Spirit which is identified as His Holy Spirit, while Jesus is the vehicle by which the Holy Spirit is established.
That is why He says “I am the way and the truth……”
Prior to Jesus’ coming, the Holy Spirit rested on but a few selected individuals like Moses, Abraham etc.

Peace>>>AJ
 
RomSpaceKnight
#28
I can't wait for the one world goverment. Bring it on and hurry, please.
 
Dexter Sinister
#29
GrosZ was just trolling. He/she/it signs up, makes two posts that resurrect a justifiably dead thread that should have been left dead, then disappears. I suggest we just let it die again.
 
chachynga
#30
The main thing is to be marked BY GOD, worry about that.
 

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