How shall I put this? If you snooze you lose, so sayith God

They are certainly treated as qualifying for all sorts of experimentation on, with and without their knowledge or consent.

I think there must be several God's , I know some people God's tell them to do things and even go so far as to ram His agenda down people's throats. My God has never asked me to do anything, unless it's my conscience telling me to do what I think is right and otherwise mind my own business. Some of these Gods I hear about are down right pesky!

I did a thing where I was so frustrated I dared God to demonstrate He existed.

I went out and did WTF ever I chose, in order to see the results in order to tell by the results if there were results beyond science.

-- <-- click to play soundtrack

It's hard to explain, but it's not just miracles, it's a quantum mechanical phenomena...

I know how it happens but it's hard to explain.

Imagine how there's a relativistic effect around the charge position of an electron. Imagine that the electric field of an electron does not just go through three dimensions, but through four.

Imagine how that relativistic effect can reach through time, changing it by just thinking about it.

That is what gives humans free will.

Humans have free will, and I know you know what I'm talking about. You can choose to change time with a thought, and I know you know what I'm talking about.

And that is why God loves you.

That is why He is interested in keeping your mind alive after your body dies.

Pretend you are Him.

It's hard to explain how order can come out of chaos, but it did... in chaos there are no rules, including no rules saying order cannot happen, because it is true chaos.... such that out of chaos can come order in a form whereby if of its own free will it chooses to hang around it can, and it did. Try explaining that to a correctly natured yet flea-bitten guy bowing down before a burning bush.

-- <-- click to play

Options are for that which is good to feel good or for that which is bad to feel bad or for that which is bad to feel good or for that which is good to feel bad.

And the ultimate good feeling is love.

So, if we are of a breed to feel love and good when surviving, and if we are of a breed to feel bad about non-survival, that is obviously a breed God will pick.

Therefore, his challenge will be...if it does not feel good to do right, will you have the intellectual challenge-strength to do so.

I was listening to this while writing -- <-- click to play


Ultimately, the question I am getting down to, suppose one just naturally feels good to do right, and suppose one just naturally bad about doing wrong... that is exactly what a gazillion years of ancestral monkeys were sorting out...


But... what do we do about, and how do we manage, those antiquated sneek-throughs where someone feels good about doing wrong?

1) Send him back to Church to be healed?
2) Stick him in a jail?
3) Stick him in a capsule and blast him off to colonize Mars?

It was so simple in the old day. My Great Grandfather the ol' sod buster doing Montana said they'd just shoot them.

(By the way. You know the statement of "Mounties Always Get Their Man"? It came from a rag printer in Fort Benton Montana when they were so sick of being the south end of the Benton/Whoop-Up Trail that they were seriously glad to see Canada do something to shut the whiskey trade down).

In any case, if religion is going to get back to function, it needs to be like this:

1) God saves people who feel good about doing good and who feel bad about doing bad... duh... that's like saving an angel.

2) Amazingly serious respect is granted from the Heavenly Father and the Holy Spirit (the one who pampers and tells one how to pray to Him like how a mother tells you how to talk to your dad) is granted to those who don't feel good for being right, but a system has been set up where if being good doesn't feel right on this planet, if you'll just tough it out, your soul will be kept alive after your body dies because if you can be that strong mentally, you will be a great power in heaven and will be closer to hearing an answer to the question Moses asked before the burning bush.

n to say in a previous sentence... So, if we are of a breed to feel love and good when surviving and feel bad about non-survival, that is obviously a breed God would pick.

uh huh...

Salvation is not at all related to God
Generally people think that salvation is related to God. Salvation is not at all related to God since it means only liberation from misery and stress and hence, is related to the soul and not God. Salvation can be achieved atleast temporarily with the help of a Psychiatrist or drugs etc. Salvation can also be achieved by self realization as propagated by Shankara and it can be achieved with self effort. He was in the time of atheists and hence, introduction of God was not indicated since the atheists do not relish it. But, introduction of self is a higher level than the basic level of materialized gross body. Jumping from materialized body to energetic self will help the next jump, which is from subtle energetic self to unimaginable God.

Therefore, Shankara laid up the foundation for the spiritual knowledge in the minds of atheists. If you identify yourself to the materialized human body, all the bonds with body trouble you throwing yourself into misery and tension. If you think that you are the subtle energy in the body, all these bonds with the materialized body get disconnected. In such case, you will have the salvation through self-realization. Thus, salvation is a topic of Pravrutti and hence, there is no reference of Nivrutti in this. Salvation is a natural instinct of every living being. Any living being tries to come out of the problems and hence, there is no relationship with God. It is the very basis of Pravrutti. Salvation is a natural instinct present in every living being. Even an insect tries to get rid of the tension. Hence, there is no element of divinity in salvation.

Salvation Vs ‘Sayujyam’

Salvation is purely related to selfishness. You try to go near to God thinking that you will get the bliss from the blissful God. It is just like approaching the nearness of the fire to achieve heat in the winter. You can become close to God only when God is pleased with you. God is not like the inert fire to be approached at your wish. You must satisfy God in His tests through your sacrifice of anything including life for His sake. When God is satisfied by your true devotion, you will become very close to Him and this is called as ‘Sayujyam’, which is quite opposite to ‘Moksha’ or salvation.

You have to prove yourself as a true devotee through practical sacrifice to attain Sayujyam. Sayujyam is the subject related to God (Nivrutti) and Moksha or salvation is subject related to you (Pravrutti). Hanuman tried to sacrifice His life in searching for Sita and Gopikas sacrificed their lives by jumping into fire after Krishna. Therefore, Nivrutti is full of sacrifice, problems and tensions, which is called as the path of thorns. Salvation or Pravrutti is the path of effort to achieve happiness for the self. The ignorant people due to lack of knowledge and analysis use the word salvation in the spiritual path. When Krishna was suffering with head-ache and the dust of the feet was declared as medicine, no devotee including the wives of Krishna and even Narada came forward fearing for the hell. Everybody wants relief from the torture of the hell even though God is tortured by the head-ache. But, Gopikas came forward to give dust from their feet and were ready to go to hell because their sole aim is only happiness of God and not the self happiness.

Therefore, all the devotees are in the path of salvation and Gopikas and Hanuman alone are in the path of Sayujyam. All the practices of Yoga are only medical exercises and are related to salvation only without any reference to God. But, ignorant people are mislead to think that Yoga is a divine practice related to God. Jesus gave life through crucifixion for the sake of God since it was the program designed by God. He imagined the torture and prayed Lord to avoid it if possible. This prayer indicates the climax of torture. But, finally, He said that the will of God must prevail. Through sacrifice and torture only Jesus became very close to God and sat on the right lap of the Lord. Since there is no liberation of the self from the tension here, this is not salvation but is a case of Sayujyam.

Death still comes so salvation is not the proper term, crutch might be more suitable for those temporary aids that may/may not bring some form of comfort. The two references below explain fairly clearly that death is the land of the enemy, if that can't be overcome the smaller aches and pains mean nothing even if they can be 'cured'

M't.2:16
Then Herod,
when he saw that he was mocked of the wise men,
was exceeding wroth,
and sent forth,
and slew all the children that were in Bethlehem,
and in all the coasts thereof,
from two years old and under, according to the time which he had diligently enquired of the wise men.
M't.2:17
Then was fulfilled that which was spoken by Jeremy the prophet,
saying,
M't.2:18
In Rama was there a voice heard,
lamentation,
and weeping,
and great mourning,
Rachel weeping for her children,
and would not be comforted,
because they are not.

Jer.31:15
Thus saith the LORD;
A voice was heard in Ramah,
lamentation,
and bitter weeping;
Rahel weeping for her children refused to be comforted for her children,
because they were not.
Jer.31:16
Thus saith the LORD;
Refrain thy voice from weeping,
and thine eyes from tears:
for thy work shall be rewarded,
saith the LORD;
and they shall come again from the land of the enemy.
Jer.31:17
And there is hope in thine end,
saith the LORD,
that thy children shall come again to their own border.