Ignatieff Leader & the Liberal Party

[Goober]

Ignatieff Leader & the Liberal Party

Where does he stand and what does he stand for?
What do you really think would be different with Iggy as PM?
Please remember the absolute power that a PM has – For those that have forgotten refer to the Chretien times.
An open question for all –

 

[taxslave]

For one thing spell check would be required to get his name right.
I think letting a teacher run the country would be a disaster. NO business sense, no common sense and no job skills. He should be much the same as the last 4 or 5 PMs.

 

[brewmaster]

More talent?

Maybe the talent pool for the Liberal party might be a bit bigger in terms of competent ministers -- but that's quite debatable.

 

[Unforgiven]

Well now, doesn't he deserve a chance? Seems to me that was one of the reasons we needed to let Harper govern.

We need to get the money flowing again and the Conservatives obviously don't know how to do that.

We need to get some return on the money invested in this reccession or else it's simply blowing money. Again the Conservatives don't seem to have an idea on how to manage that.

The Liberals have a track history of managing money well and balancing the books to start with would be a good idea. Get the country back to work and then get back to paying down the debt.

 

[#juan]

Harper and crew talk about a 50 billion dollar deficit and maybe more. This after they frittered away the 13 billion dollar surplus that the Liberals left them. Remember the corporate tax credits that Harper handed out to his friends. Somebody said the deficit was only three percent of the GDP. If it were my money, and certainly some of it is, I would want it handled a little more carefully. The Harper government now has no buffer. Any additional money required will just add to the deficit and Harper doesn't even know how much that deficit will be. Aren't we glad we have the likes of Flaherty to handle our finances?....:roll:

 

[Goober]

Well now, doesn't he deserve a chance? Seems to me that was one of the reasons we needed to let Harper govern.

We need to get the money flowing again and the Conservatives obviously don't know how to do that.

We need to get some return on the money invested in this reccession or else it's simply blowing money. Again the Conservatives don't seem to have an idea on how to manage that.

The Liberals have a track history of managing money well and balancing the books to start with would be a good idea. Get the country back to work and then get back to paying down the debt.

Unforgiven

As I have not heard of one world leader that predicted this economic crisis then all should be replaced – is that your point?

Liberal track record – Budget was balanced in 96 or 97 – Racking up surpluses that enabled them to spend on their core voters – Oh yes and add a few billion in for corruption –
The whole world went thru a growth period – Canada included – Are you saying that Chretien and martin engineered a momentous growth spurt in the world economies??

Iggy ideas – Well he voted for the budget and put them on so called probation –
Do you think that Chretien and Martin would not do the same – do you really think that they would let the auto industry in Canada disappear – No – 10’s of thousands of jobs gone forever – Give me a break –
What has he specifically come up with for solving this problem – almost none – 1 grand idea is to lower the qualifying time for EI to 45 working days – That should get the economy roaring? Right.
Other idea – High speed rail link – 30 billion – more like 40-500 after all the pork is handed out –
Lastly – after this recession ends we are all going to pay for the deficit so where would Iggy find the money
As to Iggy – he changes positions according to what makes him look good –

Lastly – Harper was slammed for stating he was reviewing speeches and position by Iggy – Yet that is called dirty politics – Yet every politician is and has been held to their previous statements and positions – But for Iggy that is unfair.

Last but best of all – How he referred to “We Americans” in his NY Times article -
Where does Iggy stand – What will Iggy do – What is his grand plan to put 2 chickens in every pot and a car in every garage –

Oh yes – the 13 Billion surplus – 10 Billion went to pay down the deficit if you recall.

 

[petros]

Remember the corporate tax credits that Harper handed out to his friends.

Yup that covered the $40-50 Billion missing from revenues. Canada has one of if not the lowest business tax structure going. It's pure BS about being competitive. That lie is the match that lit the fire sale making 85% of business in Canada foreign owned and operated sending huge profits to the EU, USA and China. That money could have stayed at home being spent in Canada on Canadian goods and services.

 

[Goober]

Yup that covered the $40-50 Billion missing from revenues. Canada has one of if not the lowest business tax structure going. It's pure BS about being competitive. That lie is the match that lit the fire sale making 85% of business in Canada foreign owned and operated sending huge profits to the EU, USA and China. That money could have stayed at home being spent in Canada on Canadian goods and services.

Petros
And Iggy stated he would not change them – Why even Smylin Jack Mustache stated the same during the last election.

 

[petros]

Petros
And Iggy stated he would not change them – Why even Smylin Jack Mustache stated the same during the last election.

That is why I don't trust any of them Goobs.

 

[Goober]

That is why I don't trust any of them Goobs.

Petros
I do – But at the end of a noose.

 

[petros]

Petros
I do – But at the end of a noose.

Yeah but in the process one of their buddies would get the closed bid cost plus contract to build the gallows.

 

[Unforgiven]

Unforgiven

As I have not heard of one world leader that predicted this economic crisis then all should be replaced – is that your point?

It's not about crystal ball gazing, it's about measured reaction that has a positive effect on the economy. Why is this so difficult for some to understand?

Liberal track record – Budget was balanced in 96 or 97 – Racking up surpluses that enabled them to spend on their core voters – Oh yes and add a few billion in for corruption –

Key words here is budget was balanced. The country was handed over to the Tories who promised a reduction in taxes. This while the US was showing a faultering economy. As for coruption, Brian Mulroney/envelopes stuffed with cash. Need I say more?

The whole world went thru a growth period – Canada included – Are you saying that Chretien and martin engineered a momentous growth spurt in the world economies?

Martin must have done something right since long after the US economy started tanking, the Canadian economy continued growing. It always seems to be the same with neocons. Maybe the perfect plan didn't include invading Iraq and setting this whole thing off.

Iggy ideas – Well he voted for the budget and put them on so called probation –

As opposed to triggering an election that he would not have won? Yeah what an idiot. Then again maybe he should be on the Tory payroll if he is going to work for them eh?

Do you think that Chretien and Martin would not do the same – do you really think that they would let the auto industry in Canada disappear – No – 10’s of thousands of jobs gone forever – Give me a break –

Martin I don't know, Chretien I doubt would have let it get to this.

What has he specifically come up with for solving this problem – almost none – 1 grand idea is to lower the qualifying time for EI to 45 working days – That should get the economy roaring? Right.

Other idea – High speed rail link – 30 billion – more like 40-500 after all the pork is handed out –
Lastly – after this recession ends we are all going to pay for the deficit so where would Iggy find the money
As to Iggy – he changes positions according to what makes him look good –

Let's put him in and see what he can do. It's not like he could make things worse.

Lastly – Harper was slammed for stating he was reviewing speeches and position by Iggy – Yet that is called dirty politics – Yet every politician is and has been held to their previous statements and positions – But for Iggy that is unfair.

Yeah I guess he has the tapes, or so he says. What's dirty is taking out attack ads on the leader of the opposition when there isn't an election going on. Trying to cut the funding while the other three parties need it. That's dirty.
No one did that when lyin brian drove the Progressive Conservative party into the ground.

Last but best of all – How he referred to “We Americans” in his NY Times article -

Dude, Harper still has Bush's dick in his mouth and you're worried about Ignatief's Canadian citizenship?

Where does Iggy stand – What will Iggy do – What is his grand plan to put 2 chickens in every pot and a car in every garage –

What's Harpers? No one knows especially Flaherty. That's is one of the major problems with what's going on in Canada right now. The party that is running the country doesn't have a clue as to what it's doing nor what it should be doing.

Oh yes – the 13 Billion surplus – 10 Billion went to pay down the deficit if you recall.

What?

 

[Goober]

[/font][/size]

It's not about crystal ball gazing, it's about measured reaction that has a positive effect on the economy. Why is this so difficult for some to understand?

Point- And what have the Liberals come up with?


Key words here is budget was balanced. The country was handed over to the Tories who promised a reduction in taxes. This while the US was showing a faultering economy. As for coruption, Brian Mulroney/envelopes stuffed with cash. Need I say more?


Point – They reduced taxes – do I agree with all the cuts – No – Do I agree with the pittances that Martin offered – No – Do I think that infrastructure while not sexy does need massive improvement and does improve production and lower costs –
Corruption – Chretien – Makes Mulroney look like a piker.



Martin must have done something right since long after the US economy started tanking, the Canadian economy continued growing. It always seems to be the same with neocons. Maybe the perfect plan didn't include invading Iraq and setting this whole thing off.

Point – Off topic again –

As opposed to triggering an election that he would not have won? Yeah what an idiot. Then again maybe he should be on the Tory payroll if he is going to work for them eh?

Martin I don't know, Chretien I doubt would have let it get to this.


Point – Beyond any politicians control how fast they sank – No Govt would let the Auto Industry disappear – To many jobs – Ontario would have huge unemployment and massive bankruptcies of suppliers – What you see is nothing compared to what you would see if they went under

Let's put him in and see what he can do. It's not like he could make things worse.

Point- I agree – Iggy is an idiot – Good to see that you have at least opened one eye – Is it your good one????

Point – It not like we have any proof that he can do better.

Yeah I guess he has the tapes, or so he says. What's dirty is taking out attack ads on the leader of the opposition when there isn't an election going on. Trying to cut the funding while the other three parties need it. That's dirty.
No one did that when lyin brian drove the Progressive Conservative party into the ground.


Point – Again past history – But then again we could bring up Day care – promised in 93 – see it yet?? GST repealed – See it yet??

Dude, Harper still has Bush's dick in his mouth and you're worried about Ignatief's Canadian citizenship?


Point – If anyone is not a Liberal they must be slaves to the US – Really smart line – Really amazing comeback -

What's Harpers? No one knows especially Flaherty. That's is one of the major problems with what's going on in Canada right now. The party that is running the country doesn't have a clue as to what it's doing nor what it should be doing.



Point – Auto and banks have driven the deficit upwards – Monies that are going to the Auto Industry are on the books as a liability -
What?

Point - Cannot remember the exact year – 06 or 07 – paid 10 billion down on outstanding debt – The uproar from the Liberals and NDP was loud as usual. Did I agree with the pay down – Not all should have gone to that – some for Infrastructure – Day Care – Low Income / Affordable Housing – should be a definite priority in this country.

 

[Unforgiven]

If you need help with the quote feature just ask.

 

[captain morgan]

[/font][/size]

It's not about crystal ball gazing, it's about measured reaction that has a positive effect on the economy. Why is this so difficult for some to understand?

What exactly does this mean? In the end, the 'correct' or beneficial measured reaction requires that someone guess at what the future holds in terms of the applied variables.

... You guess wrong and the measured response was a massive mistake... The point being: hind sight is 20/20.

Key words here is budget was balanced. The country was handed over to the Tories who promised a reduction in taxes. This while the US was showing a faultering economy. As for coruption, Brian Mulroney/envelopes stuffed with cash. Need I say more?

Again, what's your point? If you really want to go back and talk about how someone has f*cked-up the economy and country, look to Trudeau... We are still paying down the debt he procured more than 30 years ago!

... Yeah, yeah, Mulroney added to it, but when Trudeau increases the size of gvt to almost 1/2 the Canadian working population (direct & indirect), what was ole lyin' Brian to do - Lay-off 1/2 the workforce?

Martin must have done something right since long after the US economy started tanking, the Canadian economy continued growing. It always seems to be the same with neocons. Maybe the perfect plan didn't include invading Iraq and setting this whole thing off.

Martin did lots right, but if you somehow believe that he was single-handedly responsible for spurring the entire global economy then there's nothing that anyone could ever do to sway your opinion.

Let's put him in and see what he can do. It's not like he could make things worse.

Yeah, right.... last time we had a ex-professor run the nation, we almost went bankrupt.... Do not underestimate Iggy, there is plenty of damage that he will cause.

Yeah I guess he has the tapes, or so he says. What's dirty is taking out attack ads on the leader of the opposition when there isn't an election going on. Trying to cut the funding while the other three parties need it. That's dirty.
No one did that when lyin brian drove the Progressive Conservative party into the ground.

Instead of blaming the cons for playing the tapes, why not ask Iggy why he made such remarkably stupid statements...

He can say/believe whatever he wants, but if he wants to slag his birth-nation from abroad, think twice about wanting to come back and leading the nation.

Dude, Harper still has Bush's dick in his mouth and you're worried about Ignatief's Canadian citizenship?

And Iggy is essentially blowing all the reps the US upper and lower houses and Wall Street.

Tell me I'm wrong.

The party that is running the country doesn't have a clue as to what it's doing nor what it should be doing.

What should Harper do?.. Go into debt to the tune of trillions of dollars and enact protectionist policy?... Better yet, allow all working Canadians to work 1.5 months per year and then pay them to stay at home and drink beer?

What a plan... Iggy is a real genius!

 

[Unforgiven]

What exactly does this mean? In the end, the 'correct' or beneficial measured reaction requires that someone guess at what the future holds in terms of the applied variables.

For starters you don't cut off money coming in when you know things are about to get bad. Even if you think it will win you an election. You do what's good for the country not what good for the party. Again like triggering a near over throw of the government in non confidence by playing partisan politics and closing down the government for six weeks and do nothing as the economy plummets around you.

... You guess wrong and the measured response was a massive mistake... The point being: hind sight is 20/20.

Flaherty doesn't even have hindsight.

Again, what's your point? If you really want to go back and talk about how someone has f*cked-up the economy and country, look to Trudeau... We are still paying down the debt he procured more than 30 years ago!

The point is that the conservatives weren't handed a problem they were handed a smooth running economy and a budget that was in surplus and paying down the debt. They ran that into the ground as fast as they possibly could. Simply because they don't have the first clue as to the nations finances. Flaherty did the same thing in Ontario. Hind sight may be twenty twenty but Flaherty is blind. And this is the Conservatives point man.

What is there plan to get things turned around?
Trying to get a Senate reform bill through that's what. Why not just prorogue parlament again?

... Yeah, yeah, Mulroney added to it, but when Trudeau increases the size of gvt to almost 1/2 the Canadian working population (direct & indirect), what was ole lyin' Brian to do - Lay-off 1/2 the workforce?

Sorry, how many evelopes of cash did Chretien fail to declare to Revenue Canada?
Anyone remember how the Conservatives were going to clean up the coruption in Ottawa? Shhhhhhhh

Martin did lots right, but if you somehow believe that he was single-handedly responsible for spurring the entire global economy then there's nothing that anyone could ever do to sway your opinion.

Because of him Canada's economy is still better off than everyone elses. Face facts, he took from the Conservatives a broken economy, put us on the straight and narrow path to living within our means and then started paying down more debt than at any time before. The conservatives took a surplus and screwed it up to the point it is now. And when the **** hits the fan, it's unavoidably apparent that the Finance minister doesn't know what the hell he's doing.

No matter how many people show you that he's a halfwit that is far over his head, you're not going to change your opinion of him.

Yeah, right.... last time we had a ex-professor run the nation, we almost went bankrupt.... Do not underestimate Iggy, there is plenty of damage that he will cause.

Yeah don't trust a teacher they're bad people and liars. Trust a lawyer because they are good people and deep down the most trust worthy self sacrificing folk in the land.

Did you take crazy pills today or something?

Instead of blaming the cons for playing the tapes, why not ask Iggy why he made such remarkably stupid statements...

How about dropping the negative attack ads and worrying about Conservative Party pensions and start focusing on the country and the problems everyone is facing with the economy? I know it's not really in the Conservative nature but how about thinking of others just for a little while?

He can say/believe whatever he wants, but if he wants to slag his birth-nation from abroad, think twice about wanting to come back and leading the nation.

I don't know anything about that. But I do know that in Canada whether you like it or not we are free to be critical of both country and government. He like every other Canadian has the right to run in an election as long as he meets the obligations to do so, and he has. Many Canadians live and work outside of the country, some for years and they are no less Canadians than you or I.

And Iggy is essentially blowing all the reps the US upper and lower houses and Wall Street.

I don't think he is. Of course you don't seem upset that Harper is still get his fudge packed by Bush who only appears on TV to remind himself that he's still real. Maybe he just hasn't noticed that there really really is a new POTUS.

Tell me I'm wrong.

You need someone to tell you that?

What should Harper do?.. Go into debt to the tune of trillions of dollars and enact protectionist policy?... Better yet, allow all working Canadians to work 1.5 months per year and then pay them to stay at home and drink beer?

What a plan... Iggy is a real genius!

Oh no, the best couse of action is to alienate the Europeans by telling them to bugger off with their ban on seal fur. That's smart. :roll:

The only thing he can do at this point is get out of the way fast so that those who can fix the problems can get started on it.

 

[#juan]

Quoting captain morgan Again, what's your point? If you really want to go back and talk about how someone has f*cked-up the economy and country, look to Trudeau... We are still paying down the debt he procured more than 30 years ago!

Trudeau got the debt up to around a hundred and fifty billion. Mulroney piled up another four hundred and fifty billion. For all his faults, Chretien bit the bullet and eliminated the deficit and started paying down the debt. Harper and Flaherty didn't have the brains to see that there was a world wide down turn coming and they cut the GST. They could have had a very nice buffer against the coming recession but they threw it away. The attack adds should show just what jackasses they really are.

 

[Socrates the Greek]

trudeau got the debt up to around a hundred and fifty billion. Mulroney piled up another four hundred and fifty billion. For all his faults, chretien bit the bullet and eliminated the deficit and started paying down the debt. Harper and flaherty didn't have the brains to see that there was a world wide down turn coming and they cut the gst. They could have had a very nice buffer against the coming recession but they threw it away. The attack adds should show just what jackasses they really are.

 

[captain morgan]

Harper and Flaherty didn't have the brains to see that there was a world wide down turn coming and they cut the GST.

... But you has the savvy to see it coming?.. Why didn't you call up the liberal brain-trust and give 'em a heads-up?

They could have had a very nice buffer against the coming recession but they threw it away. The attack adds should show just what jackasses they really are.

Let's see, the liberals under Chretin that promised to cut the GST (if elected) never did.... So, they had all of this money over 14 or so years.... We know that hundreds of millions went to sponsorship scandal, shawinigate, buying David Dingwall 'company BMW's' as well as flash money for misc expenses and the ever popular and effective multi-billion dollar gun registry that hasn't done dick... Oh, let's not forget tthe HRDC billion dollar boondoggle.


With all that GST money they never really knocked-down the debt did they? That said, I don't "the nice little buffer" argument.

 

[captain morgan]

Forgot to mention... The attack-ads were spawned by teh abject stupidity and teh big mouth of Iggy himself. Don't blame the cons for Ignatieff's dumb-ass decisions.