Chief Mogrifier
Posts: 8,475 
April 7th, 2008, 09:13 AM
You say our government is a joke. What would you replace it with?
Quoting Praxius
Disagree. It is good that some people at least, didn't want to put the country through the expense of another election that would have solved nothing.
Sorry, but after Dion making the majority of his party walk out on several votes in parlament and thus avoid an election each time, thereby making his own mockery of our political system, I have no sympathy for him if he can't speak above jeering mongrels and make sense at the same time.
And I've seen the Liberals do the same thing on countless similar situations before.... they're all guilty of doing this at one time or another.
Quite simply, our government is a joke.
And I've seen the Liberals do the same thing on countless similar situations before.... they're all guilty of doing this at one time or another.
Quite simply, our government is a joke.
You say our government is a joke. What would you replace it with?
Ponderous Intellect
Posts: 4,103
April 7th, 2008, 09:29 AM
Juan
Conscriptatory Service.
All individuals meeting qualification standards for voting in a Canadian election are sub-divided into categories. Catagories that have no over-arching influence like affiliation with some/a particular religion, political party, industrial or commercial enterprise etc.
Potential candidates are vetted for no criminal history, close association with extreme right-wing or left-wing political structures, competency in a field that relates to the government position being filled and performance analysis based on education, employment record and community involvement. (For starters)
The "conscript" would serve two terms. No candidate permitted to demonstrate vulnerability to nepotism or favoritism to corporate or industrial interests with de-selection as the consequences for obfuscating and misdirecting government policy to favor one socio-ethnic or religious or political construct.
I'm still fleshing out the details, but essentially, the prospective position holder would recieve remuneration commensurate with the rate of pay reasonably attributed to this persons skill level and expertise in the free-marketplace. Every piece of legislation and policy/program funded by "government" would have a built-in sunset clause that a majority of conscripts would ratify or not-ratify for continuation.
Like I said, I'm still working on it....
Juan
Conscriptatory Service.
All individuals meeting qualification standards for voting in a Canadian election are sub-divided into categories. Catagories that have no over-arching influence like affiliation with some/a particular religion, political party, industrial or commercial enterprise etc.
Potential candidates are vetted for no criminal history, close association with extreme right-wing or left-wing political structures, competency in a field that relates to the government position being filled and performance analysis based on education, employment record and community involvement. (For starters)
The "conscript" would serve two terms. No candidate permitted to demonstrate vulnerability to nepotism or favoritism to corporate or industrial interests with de-selection as the consequences for obfuscating and misdirecting government policy to favor one socio-ethnic or religious or political construct.
I'm still fleshing out the details, but essentially, the prospective position holder would recieve remuneration commensurate with the rate of pay reasonably attributed to this persons skill level and expertise in the free-marketplace. Every piece of legislation and policy/program funded by "government" would have a built-in sunset clause that a majority of conscripts would ratify or not-ratify for continuation.
Like I said, I'm still working on it....
Mass'Debater
Posts: 2,039
Location: Atlantic Canada
Location: Atlantic Canada
April 7th, 2008, 10:24 AM
He's got to grab his Cojones with one hand and point his finger in the air with the other and shout as loud as he can "You all tink I know fok nothing!! I know fok all!!!"
Quoting dancing-loon
Ah, but plenty of people in the world seem real nice and friendly, possibly intelligent when you know them personally or see a bit of insight of whom they are..... that doesn't mean they're good at the job they are currently doing.
Hi, Karrie;
perhaps you could be right, it's a point to debate. I go very much by personal intuition, by seeing him, his wife... both come across to me as intelligent, thoughtful and dignified people.
perhaps you could be right, it's a point to debate. I go very much by personal intuition, by seeing him, his wife... both come across to me as intelligent, thoughtful and dignified people.
Quote:
Perhaps you're right, but if he can't handle and control those in our own government when trying to debate politics, how are we supposed to expect he'll do better against other countries if he was the country's PM? They'd walk all over him, and that's the issue I have with Dion.... he doesn't have leadership qualities in my opinion.
His mistake was not considering his shy nature, which causes him to be tense and awkward, which in turn gives his uncultured opponents an easy opportunity to ping and jeer at him. They probably mean it in good sport, but he does not have the easy-going personalty to let it bounce off, or reciprocate with even sharper darts!
It's a chicken yard I would not want to be in!!! We have something similar right here at CC. Some people just never grow up!
It's a chicken yard I would not want to be in!!! We have something similar right here at CC. Some people just never grow up!
He's got to grab his Cojones with one hand and point his finger in the air with the other and shout as loud as he can "You all tink I know fok nothing!! I know fok all!!!"
Mass'Debater
Posts: 2,039
Location: Atlantic Canada
Location: Atlantic Canada
April 7th, 2008, 10:25 AM
Quoting #juan
I already explained that in another thread.
Disagree. It is good that some people at least, didn't want to put the country through the expense of another election that would have solved nothing.
You say our government is a joke. What would you replace it with?
You say our government is a joke. What would you replace it with?
Clever Clogs
Posts: 674
May 7th, 2008, 04:03 PM
Take a long walk L
Quoting china
CHINA, your bla bla bla is not funny. hehe
#juan
Modern Chinese Communism.Canada would be no 1 in no time. Hahaha
MikeyDB ,
It takes guts and there are non "Made in Canada".
Modern Chinese Communism.Canada would be no 1 in no time. Hahaha
MikeyDB ,
It takes guts and there are non "Made in Canada".
Take a long walk L
Steven Hawking's Tutor
Posts: 4,589
Location: Saint John, N.B.
Location: Saint John, N.B.
May 7th, 2008, 06:18 PM
Quoting Cobalt_Kid
Despite the fact I'm a Conservative, I agree on all points.
Dion has been under intense fire from the conservatives since he became Liberal leader, I doubt he cares about mindless heckling from the conservative benches.
And he's got a lot more class and personal strength than that buffoon Chretein.
And he's got a lot more class and personal strength than that buffoon Chretein.
Ponderous Intellect
Posts: 4,103
May 7th, 2008, 09:27 PM
Considering the feedback ...or absence thereof regarding conscriptatory democracy I suppose the only reasonable solution is to conclude that government as "concept" as it's exercised now and has been for the past hundred or so years is satisfactory to the people participating here at CC...!?
You'll never change anything by voting Liberal vs. Conservative...or Green Party vs. Freedom Party....
Why can't you people get you minds around the idea that the structure of government itself has to change?
Considering the feedback ...or absence thereof regarding conscriptatory democracy I suppose the only reasonable solution is to conclude that government as "concept" as it's exercised now and has been for the past hundred or so years is satisfactory to the people participating here at CC...!?
You'll never change anything by voting Liberal vs. Conservative...or Green Party vs. Freedom Party....
Why can't you people get you minds around the idea that the structure of government itself has to change?
Super Genius
Posts: 1,368
Location: Southern Ontario
Location: Southern Ontario
May 7th, 2008, 10:38 PM
I think our structure is actually alright for now. What we need is more communication amongst the people (voters). Instead that most of us vote for either the Conservatives or Liberals, we should divide our votes more evenly between the four main parties, namely the NDP and the Greens included. The French Block party doesn't count as a party for Canada, they only look after Quebec.
If we had the four parties fairly evenly represent us in parliament, none of them would have run-away power. They would be forced to work together for the good of the people, and not for the power and good of one party and their members.
We also should have an independent party who could be the voice for suffering minorities, like disabled people, people with a disability, the little elderly ladies, abused children and animals!
Talk about minorities!!! The Natives come to mind! They should always provide the Minister of immigration. It's their land and they should be in charge of whom they want to let in and how many. How about the Minister of Indian Affairs? Or is it called Northern Affairs? Shouldn't he/she also be a Native?
Quoting MikeyDB
Mikey;
Considering the feedback ...or absence thereof regarding conscriptatory democracy I suppose the only reasonable solution is to conclude that government as "concept" as it's exercised now and has been for the past hundred or so years is satisfactory to the people participating here at CC...!?
You'll never change anything by voting Liberal vs. Conservative...or Green Party vs. Freedom Party....
Why can't you people get your minds around the idea that the structure of government itself has to change?
You'll never change anything by voting Liberal vs. Conservative...or Green Party vs. Freedom Party....
Why can't you people get your minds around the idea that the structure of government itself has to change?
I think our structure is actually alright for now. What we need is more communication amongst the people (voters). Instead that most of us vote for either the Conservatives or Liberals, we should divide our votes more evenly between the four main parties, namely the NDP and the Greens included. The French Block party doesn't count as a party for Canada, they only look after Quebec.
If we had the four parties fairly evenly represent us in parliament, none of them would have run-away power. They would be forced to work together for the good of the people, and not for the power and good of one party and their members.
We also should have an independent party who could be the voice for suffering minorities, like disabled people, people with a disability, the little elderly ladies, abused children and animals!
Talk about minorities!!! The Natives come to mind! They should always provide the Minister of immigration. It's their land and they should be in charge of whom they want to let in and how many. How about the Minister of Indian Affairs? Or is it called Northern Affairs? Shouldn't he/she also be a Native?
Ponderous Intellect
Posts: 4,103
May 8th, 2008, 12:27 AM
Well Dancing_Loon I vehemently disagree!
We have short-sighted (non-visionaries) dancing on strings manipulated by Maurice Strong and the Stronachs and the Irvings and the wealthy upper-crust of Canadian Corporatism.
Frank McKenna is a member of the Carlyle Group and if there was ever a more profit-oriented cabal non-plussed at the debate surrounding spending Canadian dollars in the Afghanistan theatre as response to fiscal coercion from the United States.....
We are puppets to the American corporate-think...and have been since John Defenbakker sold the Avro Arrow out from under Canadians because American aerospace industry didn't want to be seen as playing catch-up to a bunch of back-woods dumb-country cousins that Americans regarded (and may still regard) Canadians as being!
It's all a complete sham and phoney as HELL!
The Liberals steal a few odd million from Canadians and....how much has been returned and who went to prison? A Quebec businessman too dumb to follow the lead of the Liberal elite in hiding his collusion! Stephen Harper apoints a man to deal with the softwood lumber dispute...who wasn't elected by the people of Canada and who "crossed" his political/philosophical lines to accept a cabinet post! This isn't democracy! Our government hops on the American Petroleum Cartel Bandwagon and talks about "Carbon-Credits" as strategy in fighting global warming..... which will effect no change of any kind to the increase in carbon emmissions! Our government stands around with their finger up their ass while the RCMP is proven to be not only complicit in the kidnapping of a Canadian citizen by the Americans but white-washes the ineffectiveness of the RCMP and CSIS investigations into the Air India terrorism of twenty years ago! Our government isn't working and when a government isn't working it's because there's something wrong/broken with it!
It's a lie and a fraud and unfortunately it's exactly what Canadians like and deserve!
Well Dancing_Loon I vehemently disagree!
We have short-sighted (non-visionaries) dancing on strings manipulated by Maurice Strong and the Stronachs and the Irvings and the wealthy upper-crust of Canadian Corporatism.
Frank McKenna is a member of the Carlyle Group and if there was ever a more profit-oriented cabal non-plussed at the debate surrounding spending Canadian dollars in the Afghanistan theatre as response to fiscal coercion from the United States.....
We are puppets to the American corporate-think...and have been since John Defenbakker sold the Avro Arrow out from under Canadians because American aerospace industry didn't want to be seen as playing catch-up to a bunch of back-woods dumb-country cousins that Americans regarded (and may still regard) Canadians as being!
It's all a complete sham and phoney as HELL!
The Liberals steal a few odd million from Canadians and....how much has been returned and who went to prison? A Quebec businessman too dumb to follow the lead of the Liberal elite in hiding his collusion! Stephen Harper apoints a man to deal with the softwood lumber dispute...who wasn't elected by the people of Canada and who "crossed" his political/philosophical lines to accept a cabinet post! This isn't democracy! Our government hops on the American Petroleum Cartel Bandwagon and talks about "Carbon-Credits" as strategy in fighting global warming..... which will effect no change of any kind to the increase in carbon emmissions! Our government stands around with their finger up their ass while the RCMP is proven to be not only complicit in the kidnapping of a Canadian citizen by the Americans but white-washes the ineffectiveness of the RCMP and CSIS investigations into the Air India terrorism of twenty years ago! Our government isn't working and when a government isn't working it's because there's something wrong/broken with it!
It's a lie and a fraud and unfortunately it's exactly what Canadians like and deserve!
Super Genius
Posts: 1,368
Location: Southern Ontario
Location: Southern Ontario
May 8th, 2008, 02:06 AM
Poor Mikey,
you are so bitter and disillusioned. You know too much!!! See, that's the bliss I live in... dumb as a doornail in these things.
You mention the name Stronach? Isn't that Belinda Stronach's Dad?
I googled for Maurice Strong... seems to be a crook.
Frank McKenna seems o.k. I liked him.
The Irvings I had to google: "The Irving Family is the dominant political, corporate and media force in Eastern Canada." Is that them?
Mikey, we can't avoid having rich people in our country! Most of them worked for it, or were smart and knew how to get a business going and generate some profit... To have a higher education also helps a lot.
I think my idea was pretty good! Besides, as long as the world has turned there have been rich and poor people. It's part of our learning curriculum. The rich have to learn to help the poor, and the poor have to learn not to be jealous.
Poor Mikey,
you are so bitter and disillusioned. You know too much!!! See, that's the bliss I live in... dumb as a doornail in these things.
You mention the name Stronach? Isn't that Belinda Stronach's Dad?
I googled for Maurice Strong... seems to be a crook.
Frank McKenna seems o.k. I liked him.
The Irvings I had to google: "The Irving Family is the dominant political, corporate and media force in Eastern Canada." Is that them?
Mikey, we can't avoid having rich people in our country! Most of them worked for it, or were smart and knew how to get a business going and generate some profit... To have a higher education also helps a lot.
I think my idea was pretty good! Besides, as long as the world has turned there have been rich and poor people. It's part of our learning curriculum. The rich have to learn to help the poor, and the poor have to learn not to be jealous.
Ponderous Intellect
Posts: 4,103
May 8th, 2008, 09:09 AM
Dancing_Loon
It may be conveniently dismissive to label me as "bitter" but what I "am" is a realist and a pragmatist and an unwillingness to call a spade a spade is voluntary lobotomization.
If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck ...
It sure ain't no goose!
When the financial elite of a nation are secure in their preferred positions of wealth and power while foodlines grow longer and there's great hardship and suffering from Davis Inlet to Vancouver's dirtiest neighborhoods....something is amiss.
And it has less to do with some innate genetic predisposition to generational cycles of poverty crime and injustice. It has everything to do with the fact that the scales of justice and prosperity are weighted in favor of the few while the many continue to get short-changed.
Dancing_Loon
It may be conveniently dismissive to label me as "bitter" but what I "am" is a realist and a pragmatist and an unwillingness to call a spade a spade is voluntary lobotomization.
If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck ...
It sure ain't no goose!
When the financial elite of a nation are secure in their preferred positions of wealth and power while foodlines grow longer and there's great hardship and suffering from Davis Inlet to Vancouver's dirtiest neighborhoods....something is amiss.
And it has less to do with some innate genetic predisposition to generational cycles of poverty crime and injustice. It has everything to do with the fact that the scales of justice and prosperity are weighted in favor of the few while the many continue to get short-changed.
Clever Clogs
Posts: 519
May 8th, 2008, 05:41 PM
He might have done a lot to fight the Bloq and PQ in the referendum but he also turned a lot of voters off. I'm not a conservative supporter but I never even considered voting Liberal in the late 1990s and early 2000s with a gun registry about 1000% over budget, letting Liberal riding officials disperse $1 billion in the HRDC scandal and the ad scandal.
Dion might not put on the charm in front of the cameras but I think he has an integrity Chretein never did.
Quoting Colpy
I've never met Chretien but both my mom and sister worked with him at different times. According to them unless the cameras were on he was cold and arrogant, the PM we saw giving the protestor the "Shawinigan handshake" was the real Chretien, the joking guy in front of the cameras was all fake.
Despite the fact I'm a Conservative, I agree on all points.
He might have done a lot to fight the Bloq and PQ in the referendum but he also turned a lot of voters off. I'm not a conservative supporter but I never even considered voting Liberal in the late 1990s and early 2000s with a gun registry about 1000% over budget, letting Liberal riding officials disperse $1 billion in the HRDC scandal and the ad scandal.
Dion might not put on the charm in front of the cameras but I think he has an integrity Chretein never did.
