New Medical Chief is a LIAR !!

Karlin

Council Member
Jun 27, 2004
1,275
2
38
K - the push to privatise everything, including medicine, is another capitalist tactic to concentrate wealth into just a few hands, and at a huge cost to ordinary people.

It is another glaring example of where capitalism defeats the ideals of democracy and goes against the good of the majority.

The commonality between all the privatising areas is deception; the arguements are not based in reality.

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Link to article:

http://www.straightgoods.ca/ViewFeature7.cfm?REF=353


exerpts:

Dr Day is President and CEO of Cambie Surgeries Corporation in Vancouver and is an outspoken advocate of private, for-profit medicine. He [wants to] increase privatization and contracting-out, introduce user fees and de-insure services.

His claims about Canada's health care system have been widely reported in the media but are not supported by the evidence.


The following is a fact check on claims frequently made by Dr Day:

Claim: The Canadian health system has been ranked 30th in the world by the WHO.

Fact: The 2000 World Health Organisation study presented a misleading representation of health care systems including Canada's. The WHO abandoned this ranking system because of seriously flawed methodology.

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Claim: "At $4,400.00 per capita [Canada] is the most expensive of all countries that offer 'universal' coverage."

Fact: Canada's per capita spending in 2004 was $3165 US. It is above the OECD average but below Norway, Switzerland, and Luxembourg. The US spent $6100 per capita in 2004.

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Claim: "In Canada 65 percent of sick children wait a 'medically unacceptable' period of time."

Fact: There is no evidence for this claim.

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Claim: "The assertion that our single-payer system is administratively efficient is hogwash."

Fact: Before Canada introduced a single-payer system, spending in Canada and the US was escalating in parallel. After 30 years of single-payer administration, Canada now spends almost fifty percent less than what Americans spend (9.9 percent of GDP in Canada vs 15.2 percent in the US) while providing equal or better care. All Canadians are covered while the US has 46 million citizens with no coverage.

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Claim: "In our country a dog can get a hip replacement in under a week, but a human may wait two years."

Fact: Access to veterinary care for animals is based on ability to pay. Dogs are put down if their owners can't pay. Access to care should not be based on ability to pay.

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Claim: "All other models of universal health care differed from the Canadian model in one fundamental way: They did not exclude competition from the private sector. Canada shared this distinction with just one other country — North Korea!"

Fact: Thirty percent of what Canadians spend on health care is private expenditure. Canada is below the OECD average on public health care spending. The argument that private for-profit health care does not play a significant role in Canada is false.

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Claim: "At the [Cambie Surgery] Centre we spend only 30 percent of our gross revenue on wages and salaries, compared with 70 percent in the public hospitals, yet we pay our nurses more."

Fact: Peer-reviewed evidence shows that for-profit investor-owned facilities skimp on staff and patients are at risk as a result. Where is the rest of Cambie's revenue going? Profits?

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Claim: "In striking down the existing laws, the judges said, 'The evidence shows that delays in the public health care system are widespread and patients die as a result of waiting lists for public health care... the courts have a duty to rise above political debate.'"

Fact: The Supreme Court of Canada's Chaoulli decision recognized that failure to ensure timely access to care endangers Canadians' well-being. But the remedy must be to ensure access for all — not just for those who can "afford to pay" for private care. Three dissenting judges warned that the Charter should not be used to roll-back benefits enjoyed by all Canadians, especially the poor.

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Claim: "Health care is approaching 50 percent of all spending in the provinces."

Fact: Health care spending is rising as a percentage of provincial budgets because of tax cuts and cuts to other program spending. Health care spending as a percentage of the economy is stable and takes up the same share of national income as 25 years ago — approximately 4 percent of GDP for hospitals and physicians. Why would someone concerned about rising costs advocate transferring cost from governments back on to patients and private insurance?

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Claim: "The coming changes will create a massive new industry and enable the Canadian health industry and its workers to enter the international health market and participate in the $2 trillion American health economy. On the basis of extrapolations from other countries, we may see $40 billion a year added to the Canadian health system."


Fact: There is a lot of money to be made by wrecking Medicare in Canada. But how is it in the public interest to drive up spending to US levels? If current levels of health care spending are said to be "unsustainable" why would one advocate spending an additional $40 billion a year?

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Brian Day's claims are not supported by the evidence. If Canadians are gullible and listen to the CMA and its new President about the miraculous powers of the market and private insurance to solve health care problems, we will pay dearly for the mistake.
 

DurkaDurka

Internet Lawyer
Mar 15, 2006
10,385
129
63
Toronto
Ok, how can the author of the article claim his "Facts" are facts when they are not backed up by anything other then his word?
 

#juan

Hall of Fame Member
Aug 30, 2005
18,326
119
63
Good post Karlin. All we hear is how bad our system is from people who should know better but don't.
 

iARTthere4iam

Electoral Member
Jul 23, 2006
533
3
18
Pointy Rocks
I understand the concern that Canadians have to any suggestion that we should alter our universal health care system. Canadians repeatedly express their desire to retain a system that is compassionate, in whichall Canadians are treated regardless of their financial status. The US with it's lack of medical insurance for millions and much publicized circumstances of bankrupcy due to major illness is the antithesis of Canadian values. There are many other nations in the world that have dealth with the health care issue and for us to only look to the situation in the US is short sighted. Many other nations pay for their citizens health care AND allow for private delivery of health care. Public private partnerships are one way that both the socialist health care and capitalist delivery can merge. There is no evidence that allowing private delivery of health care and having the government pay leads to a US style system.
 

Karlin

Council Member
Jun 27, 2004
1,275
2
38
privatisation serves the wealthy

Thanks for the replies.

The privatising of essential services like health care only serves to concentrate welath at the top. Thats why the wealthy people who influence the powers-that-be are pushing it.

In order to continue having any middle class at all, instead of just a super rich and a poor class, we have to cut down the expenses we all face, and health care is a huge one, energy is right up there too - governments could provide the essential things we all use at a lower cost to all people and then we would all have a little more money except for the wealthiest to whom that spending gnerally accumulates.
 

iARTthere4iam

Electoral Member
Jul 23, 2006
533
3
18
Pointy Rocks
Thanks for the replies.

The privatising of essential services like health care only serves to concentrate welath at the top. Thats why the wealthy people who influence the powers-that-be are pushing it.

In order to continue having any middle class at all, instead of just a super rich and a poor class, we have to cut down the expenses we all face, and health care is a huge one, energy is right up there too - governments could provide the essential things we all use at a lower cost to all people and then we would all have a little more money except for the wealthiest to whom that spending gnerally accumulates.

The "rich" will always have more money than the poor or the middle class that is the very definition, however the "rich" are not always the same people. One of the characteristics of our society is the freedom to get education and work hard and imporve one's financial position. If the US is the model of what unrestricted (or nearly so) private enterprise, including private medical insurance and providers, than your theory that the end result will be a stratified society of ultra rich and extremely poor is clearly a flawed one as there is obviously great wealth, a very developed middle class and poverty (poverty that often comes with abundant food, television, etc.).
 

Phil B

Electoral Member
Mar 17, 2007
333
10
18
Brighton,UK
Public private partnerships are one way that both the socialist health care and capitalist delivery can merge.

PPP is the spawn of satan - the deals only ever get made in the favour of the private side of the "partnership". Living in the UK there is quite a number of these around and when you actually look into the "deals" some of them are absolutely shocking
 

iARTthere4iam

Electoral Member
Jul 23, 2006
533
3
18
Pointy Rocks
PPP is the spawn of satan - the deals only ever get made in the favour of the private side of the "partnership". Living in the UK there is quite a number of these around and when you actually look into the "deals" some of them are absolutely shocking

Please explain the shocking part. Looking at countries such as France would show that PPP's allow the customer (patient) to shop around for the best provider (private) while the government (public) pays the bill. Which part to you is shocking?
 

Phil B

Electoral Member
Mar 17, 2007
333
10
18
Brighton,UK
Which part to you is shocking?

The part where it disguises state borrowings that are far in excess of where they should be if the project was financed by more traditional means, nor have the scales been balanced enough between the two parties - the value of an investment as we are all aware can go up as well as down, however that does not seem to be the case for the private companies entering into these sorts of ventures in the UK
 

MHz

Time Out
Mar 16, 2007
41,030
43
48
Red Deer AB
Universal health care is a cash-cow for big-pharm. Any prescriptions given 'free of charge' still end up in their pockets (when that prescription is filled).
Don't get me wrong, a shattered bone still needs 'educated men'.
Cancer is another matter, nobody gets any info that is not 'approved by big-pharm'. No Doctor is going to tell a patient to 'try oxygen theropy, while you are on a waiting list for 'chemo' or whatever. No Doctor is going to tell you to use Colloidal Silver because that was what was used before people had $500 to spend on the latest and greatest cure, that it has no side effects is completely irreverent BTW. The downside is you have to spend $30 of your own money and maybe an hour to make it. That is a WAY TOO MUCH TROUBLE for is sick person.
If a dandelion root can cure you (prepared properly) then it should be worth $100's /oz rather than free if you can find a few.
It wouldn't take many of those kinds of solutions to bring down the total cost of health care, without effect the saleries of the Doctors. Big-pharm would have their profits slashed.
If you don't thing big-pharms in North America are strictly 'for profit' do a little research on how they view 'phage medicine', let alone how many lawyers you would need to sue them for some 'not researched enough medicine', that is if they can even be sued anymore.
 

iARTthere4iam

Electoral Member
Jul 23, 2006
533
3
18
Pointy Rocks
Universal health care is a cash-cow for big-pharm. Any prescriptions given 'free of charge' still end up in their pockets (when that prescription is filled).
Don't get me wrong, a shattered bone still needs 'educated men'.
Cancer is another matter, nobody gets any info that is not 'approved by big-pharm'. No Doctor is going to tell a patient to 'try oxygen theropy, while you are on a waiting list for 'chemo' or whatever. No Doctor is going to tell you to use Colloidal Silver because that was what was used before people had $500 to spend on the latest and greatest cure, that it has no side effects is completely irreverent BTW. The downside is you have to spend $30 of your own money and maybe an hour to make it. That is a WAY TOO MUCH TROUBLE for is sick person.
If a dandelion root can cure you (prepared properly) then it should be worth $100's /oz rather than free if you can find a few.
It wouldn't take many of those kinds of solutions to bring down the total cost of health care, without effect the saleries of the Doctors. Big-pharm would have their profits slashed.
If you don't thing big-pharms in North America are strictly 'for profit' do a little research on how they view 'phage medicine', let alone how many lawyers you would need to sue them for some 'not researched enough medicine', that is if they can even be sued anymore.

You are of course free to injest whatever you wish, be it oxygen, shark cartilage, dandelions etc. but please don't blame doctors for adhering to medicines that have undergone strictly controlled double-blind testing. If you can prove (strictly controlled double-blind clinical testing) that oxygen therapy cures something (rather than destroys cells as it is well know that it does, which is why we are badgered endlessly about the importance of anti-oxidants) than all you have to do is publish your results and allow others to attempt to replicate your results. It is a simple and elegant method that has resulted in a vast array of marvelous drugs that have us living longer lives.