Once and for all, this is the Native stance on a soveriegn Quebec

CDNBear

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ABORIGINAL PEOPLES AND THE
1995 QUEBEC REFERENDUM:
A SURVEY OF THE ISSUES


Prepared by:
Jill Wherrett
Political and Social Affairs Division
February 1996




Following the election of the Parti Québécois in the fall of 1994, the Quebec government initiated steps toward secession. A draft bill calling for a unilateral declaration of independence was made public in December 1994, followed by the introduction of an Act respecting the future of Quebec (Bill 1) in the National Assembly on 7 September 1995.(5) The bill affirmed that a new Quebec constitution would recognize the existing constitutional rights of aboriginal nations, in a manner "consistent with the territorial integrity of Quebec." The bill clearly stated that Quebec would retain its boundaries as they currently exist within Canada. It also provided that under the new constitution, the right of aboriginal nations to self-government on the lands over which they have full ownership and their right to participate in the development of Quebec would be recognized.
In the lead-up to the referendum, aboriginal groups reacted in opposition to this position. In particular, the Crees argued that they had a right to maintain their territory in Canada. The Crees and the Quebec government dominated the debate on this issue, along with academic commentators. Since the referendum, the Crees and the Quebec government have continued to conflict on this matter, and the status of aboriginal territory has also become a prominent part of federal-provincial rhetoric on the terms of a possible secession.
A. Aboriginal Perspectives
1. The Crees of Quebec
The Grand Council of the Crees (of Quebec), under leadership of Grand Chief Matthew Coon Come, have been the most outspoken aboriginal group. The Crees have asserted for many years that they are a people, with a right to self-determination recognized under international law. They argue that no annexation of them or their territory to an independent Quebec should take place without their consent, and that if Quebec has the right to leave Canada then the Cree people have the right to choose to keep their territory in Canada. Cree arguments generally do not claim the right to secede from Canada; rather, the Crees see themselves as a people bound to Canada by treaty (the JBNQA), and as citizens of Canada.(6)
The Crees have stated that a unilateral declaration of independence by Quebec would be a violation of fundamental principles of human rights, democracy and consent. If secession were to proceed, the Crees argue they would seek protection through the Canadian courts as well as asserting Cree jurisdiction over its people and lands.
In the period leading up to the referendum, the Crees were active at both the domestic and international levels. A Cree Commission held 14 hearings in 10 different communities during August and September 1995. Its report, "The Voice of a Nation on Self-Determination," affirmed Cree opposition to secession without their consent, and restated their commitment to maintain a relationship with the federal government.
In October 1995, the Crees released a study, Sovereign Injustice, which cited a variety of Canadian and international sources to support their case.(7) The book updates a study completed in 1991 and submitted to the United Nations Commission on Human Rights at its forty-eighth session in February 1992. Sovereign Injustice emphasizes that aboriginal peoples have a right to self-determination, including a right to stay in Canada. It argues that the forcible inclusion of the Crees in any future Quebec state would lack validity and legitimacy from the viewpoint of international, Canadian, and aboriginal law and practice. Such an action, the Crees assert, would also seriously detract from Quebec’s claims that it is resorting to fair or democratic process to achieve its goals.
The study also argues that there is no rule under Canadian or international law that would ensure the present boundaries of Quebec would become those of a sovereign Quebec state.
The paper notes that portions of Quebec annexed to the province in 1898 and 1912 constitute in large part the traditional territories of the James Bay Cree and other aboriginal peoples, which were added to the province without their consent. It concludes that the James Bay and Northern Quebec Agreement provides for permanent federal obligations that could not be unilaterally undertaken by Quebec.
To highlight their opposition to Quebec secession, the Crees held a separate referendum on 24 October 1995. Cree voters were asked: "Do you consent, as a people, that the Government of Quebec separate the James Bay Crees and Cree traditional territory from Canada in the event of a Yes vote in the Quebec referendum?" The Crees voted 96.3% to stay with Canada. Of 6,380 eligible voters, 77% participated in the Cree referendum.
Cree concerns over secession continue in the post-referendum period. In late January 1996, Coon-Come urged the prime minister to make a formal declaration in the House of Commons supporting the Cree decision to remain in Canada if Quebec secedes. The Crees again asserted that the JBNQA is a treaty that binds the federal government to protect Cree interests in the event of a unilateral declaration of independence by Quebec.(8) The Crees also appeared during Senate Committee hearings on Bill C-110 (An Act respecting constitutional amendments). They opposed the bill, arguing that reforms should not be made at the expense of the Crees and other aboriginal peoples.(9) In their view, Bill C-110 could constrain the federal government from tabling constitutional initiatives to protect the rights of aboriginal peoples in the context of Quebec secession. The Crees proposed an amendment in the event that the Senate supported the bill, a non-derogation clause to ensure that the Act would not constrain the powers of Parliament to propose or to authorize an amendment to the constitution in order to: a) recognize, affirm or protect the aboriginal peoples and their aboriginal and treaty rights or other rights and freedoms, or b) preserve and protect the national unity and territorial integrity of Canada. The Crees also called for their inclusion in federal unity initiatives.
2. Inuit of Northern Quebec
The Inuit of Northern Quebec also raised significant concerns over the future of their territory. Like the Crees, they assert the right to self-determination, and the choice to remain in the Canadian federation. The Inuit held a separate referendum, on 29 October 1995. Inuit voters were asked the question: "Do you agree that Quebec should become sovereign?" With about 75% of eligible voters casting ballots, 96% voted against Quebec’s becoming sovereign. This result was similar to the outcome of the vote carried out by the Inuit parallel to the 1980 Quebec referendum, in which 94% had voted "no."
Inuit continue to argue that they have rights to remain Canadian citizens and keep northern Quebec within Canada, which are supported by section 35 of the Constitution Act, 1982 and the JBNQA. For reasons similar to the Crees’, the Inuit opposed Bill C-110. They recommended that the proposal be reconsidered, and if not, supported the adoption of an amendment identical to that put forward by the Crees.
3. Other Aboriginal Groups
Leaders of other aboriginal peoples in Quebec have also expressed their opposition to taking aboriginal land out of Canada. In early October 1995, First Nations Chiefs, in a statement entitled "Reaffirmation of Aboriginal Peoples of Quebec and Labrador’s Right to Co-Exist in Peace and Friendship," articulated their resistance to the forcible inclusion of aboriginal people in a new, independent state, arguing that it would be contrary to international law.(10)
Contrary to usual practice, many aboriginal peoples exercised their right to vote, the exception being Mohawks of Kahnasetake, Kahnawake, and Akwesasne. Elsewhere, Indians registered a strong federalist voice.(11) Published referendum results show that more than 95% of aboriginal peoples who participated in the referendum voted "no."
During the final week of the referendum campaign, Quebec chiefs, along with Assembly of First Nations Grand Chief Ovide Mercredi, made it clear that they expect to participate in any discussions on Canada’s future.


http://dsp-psd.communication.gc.ca/...HE REFERENDUM AND POST-REFERENDUM DEBATES(txt)
 

CDNBear

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"The Grand Council of the Crees (of Quebec), under leadership of Grand Chief Matthew Coon Come, have been the most outspoken aboriginal group. The Crees have asserted for many years that they are a people, with a right to self-determination recognized under international law. They argue that no annexation of them or their territory to an independent Quebec should take place without their consent, and that if Quebec has the right to leave Canada then the Cree people have the right to choose to keep their territory in Canada. Cree arguments generally do not claim the right to secede from Canada; rather, the Crees see themselves as a people bound to Canada by treaty (the JBNQA), and as citizens of Canada.(6)"

That's a pretty strong statement against being included in a Soveriegn Quebec.

The Crees voted 96.3% to stay with Canada. Of 6,380 eligible voters, 77% participated in the Cree referendum.

That's a pretty strong vote, in favour of staying within the confines of the Canadian Commonwealth.

The Inuit of Northern Quebec also raised significant concerns over the future of their territory. Like the Crees, they assert the right to self-determination, and the choice to remain in the Canadian federation

With about 75% of eligible voters casting ballots, 96% voted against Quebec’s becoming sovereign. This result was similar to the outcome of the vote carried out by the Inuit parallel to the 1980 Quebec referendum, in which 94% had voted "no."

Wow an increase in the "non" vote. A very clear view of where their support is.

Contrary to usual practice, many aboriginal peoples exercised their right to vote, the exception being Mohawks of Kahnasetake, Kahnawake, and Akwesasne. Elsewhere, Indians registered a strong federalist voice.(11) Published referendum results show that more than 95% of aboriginal peoples who participated in the referendum voted "no."

The only thing the Natives of Quebec support is there rights to self determination, that is more then abundantly clear in their voting.

Anyone that dismisses these FACTS is either a completely moron or so racist they can not phathom there meaning.

Logic 7 it is time to put up or shut up. Where is your proof that the Natives of Quebec support the separatist movement?

Or will you simply dismiss these facts?

If so, which label fits you better, pure racist or moron?(I'm not calling you names here logic7, I'm pointing out that these are facts, not myths, as your posts elude to, address the facts and recieve the label that best suits you, by which choice you make, accept the facts and concede, or deny and be exposed as a moron or racist or even worse a fascist.)
 

Sassylassie

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LOL Bear, having a debate with Logic is like having a "Battle of wits with the disadvantaged" give up. I'd rather bang my head up against a brick wall than:laughing7: listen to his blather and nonsense, thankfully the Library is closed today so Logic can't post.
 

CDNBear

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LOL Bear, having a debate with Logic is like having a "Battle of wits with the disadvantaged" give up. I'd rather bang my head up against a brick wall than:laughing7: listen to his blather and nonsense, thankfully the Library is closed today so Logic can't post.
rotflmffao, are you serious? Logic is a library dweller?

Hell you'ld think being surrounded by some deep thoughts, she'ld have one of her own just once.

I really want her to address this, I'm not holding my breath for it to be a logical response, or even an acceptance of her incorrect assertion, that the Natives support her beloved parti. Like I have had to do on other issues. Those that concede in the presence of fact and proof, only show that they are smarter and have the ablity to be educated, not weak. I feel that some can not see the difference in the two. Like logic.

It's odd, none of the sites separatist have been here to argue my points, lol.
 

Said1

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Das Kapital
Good sources, Bear. this is a prime example of how great a resource the internet can actually be, although I agree with Sassy on the Logic "thing'. :laugh:
 

CDNBear

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Good sources, Bear. this is a prime example of how great a resource the internet can actually be, although I agree with Sassy on the Logic "thing'. :laugh:
Thanx,

and for the record, I do not seek to be proven right, or to prove others wrong. I see this forum as a place of learning.

I stand corrected on issues such as...

The IDF, I was not fully aware that they were as indiscriminant as they were when targetting.
The dropping of the A bombs on Japan.
And the most important...
There are more views then just mine in this world. Which just adds to the excitement.

I actually feel sad for those that are so bigotted or what have you, that they refuse to accept fact and reason. Sometimes I feel sorry for me, lol.
 

Said1

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Apr 18, 2005
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Thanx,

and for the record, I do not seek to be proven right, or to prove others wrong. I see this forum as a place of learning.

I stand corrected on issues such as...

The IDF, I was not fully aware that they were as indiscriminant as they were when targetting.
The dropping of the A bombs on Japan.
And the most important...
There are more views then just mine in this world. Which just adds to the excitement.

I actually feel sad for those that are so bigotted or what have you, that they refuse to accept fact and reason. Sometimes I feel sorry for me, lol.

I always feel sorry for me. *sniff, sniff*
 

s_lone

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Feb 16, 2005
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Hello friends!

The native issue is clearly a big thorn in the foot for the seperatists. I personally think they should try to solve that problem before proceeding with any form of serious actions towards seperation. Is it solvable for them I really don't know. Would it be possible to convince the Cree and all other natives that they would do good in a country of Quebec? In the current situation I doubt it.

If I was a seperatist leader I think I would tend to have a pretty radical approach in which I would try to have the Natives feel more included within the state of Quebec. That means giving them a significant voice in the National Assembly. For example I would push towards giving the Natives some sort of veto over any environmental decision since control over the environment represents best what was taken from them. Any thoughts CDNbear?
 

CDNBear

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Hello friends!

The native issue is clearly a big thorn in the foot for the seperatists. I personally think they should try to solve that problem before proceeding with any form of serious actions towards seperation. Is it solvable for them I really don't know. Would it be possible to convince the Cree and all other natives that they would do good in a country of Quebec? In the current situation I doubt it.

If I was a seperatist leader I think I would tend to have a pretty radical approach in which I would try to have the Natives feel more included within the state of Quebec. That means giving them a significant voice in the National Assembly. For example I would push towards giving the Natives some sort of veto over any environmental decision since control over the environment represents best what was taken from them. Any thoughts CDNbear?
Bear the militant says...

Keep your grubby mits off of us and all our land. Or we will be forced to force you to. Then once we have beaten you back from the St.Lawrance and James bay, we will negotiate your surrender and the prices you will pay to access the Docks and Hydro.

Bear the Native says...

Screw'm all we'll separate from both and screw everyone. And do what the militant Bear says.

Bear the levelheaded says...

I would rather have the Native communities stay within Canada, I do not feel they are ready to negotiate any form of self governance with anybody.
I also do not trust the Quebecuois to not lie and/or cheat to buy the Native vote. They have tried, but their fascade is as transparent as celophane. So we didn't buy it at all.
It would be easier to accept the separation, if Quebec, gave up on our lands and conceded to our position.
 

Sparrow

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Nov 12, 2006
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Would you know anything about the Waban-Aki Nation? Where I live is supposed to be their land but of course most people say it never was their land. I have gone on their site but there is no history.
 

Sparrow

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CDN Bear

I agree, I don't trust them further than I can throw them they outright lie and lie by omission to try to get what they want.
 

CDNBear

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Sassylassie

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I hope the Natives continue to shun the Seperatist and stay true and strong with Canada.












:evil3: :evil3:
 

csanopal

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Dec 22, 2006
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Hello friends!

The native issue is clearly a big thorn in the foot for the seperatists. I personally think they should try to solve that problem before proceeding with any form of serious actions towards seperation. Is it solvable for them I really don't know. Would it be possible to convince the Cree and all other natives that they would do good in a country of Quebec? In the current situation I doubt it.

If I was a seperatist leader I think I would tend to have a pretty radical approach in which I would try to have the Natives feel more included within the state of Quebec. That means giving them a significant voice in the National Assembly. For example I would push towards giving the Natives some sort of veto over any environmental decision since control over the environment represents best what was taken from them. Any thoughts CDNbear?

Do you really think the seperartists care about the Indians or anyone besides themselves actually?
 

Zzarchov

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Aug 28, 2006
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Do you think federalists truly care about separatists? Or Natives (other than hoping they keep voting federalist)

Do you think Natives truly care about federalists or separatists beyond prefering the devil they know to the one they don't?

Im sure many individuals of all groups do care about other groups. But as a General rule most people care about groups they are in above groups they are not.

We care about the world, but about Canada more than Mozambique, We care about Canada..but not as much as our town. We care about our neighbours..but not as much as our family.

Its human nature (not that there are not individuals who are exceptions)
 

General James Wolfe

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Oct 30, 2006
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Well I for one know that if Quebec decide to to have a UDI then it will not be only the


Royal Canadian Armed Forces
Royal Commonwealth Armed Forces
Anglo-Quebec Militias
American Voluntere Militas


But also the combined force of the First Nations that will be against the PQ and their Terrorists. Beware Quebecois Nationalist you will face destruction by declaring a UDI for Quebec. When the Civil War is over in Quebec the peace terms will be far harsher then what happend in the Quebec Act.
 

Sparrow

Council Member
Nov 12, 2006
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Are you in Quebec?

There are land claims in Quebec...

http://www.abenakis.ca/english/grand_conseil/revendica_territoriales.html

My familiarity is pretty one sided, Haudenosaunee, but if you need more help to research it, just let me know. I'll ask around.

Yes I am in Quebec. I also need some Native History to quell what some people are saying. You hear a lot from people but I also hear a lot and it discusses me at the atitude towards the Native people. However as you have already stated a lot comes from the media who always potrays your people as the bad guys. Anything to sell paper eh! I also completely support your claims for your lands and please never give up.

Thank you for the link, I will read it carefully and if I have anymore questions I will let you know. It it very interesting discussing with you. Have to go for now but will be back later.
Thanks again.
 

CDNBear

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Sep 24, 2006
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I hope the Natives continue to shun the Seperatist and stay true and strong with Canada.

:evil3: :evil3:
As long as we breath I hope we shall.
Do you really think the seperartists care about the Indians or anyone besides themselves actually?
I personally do not, and I know I am not alone.
Do you think federalists truly care about separatists? Or Natives (other than hoping they keep voting federalist)

Do you think Natives truly care about federalists or separatists beyond prefering the devil they know to the one they don't?

Im sure many individuals of all groups do care about other groups. But as a General rule most people care about groups they are in above groups they are not.

We care about the world, but about Canada more than Mozambique, We care about Canada..but not as much as our town. We care about our neighbours..but not as much as our family.

Its human nature (not that there are not individuals who are exceptions)
There is much wisdom in your words Zzarchov.

I believe, if Quebec gets her way, that would the Native peoples within her to go their's, and I do not fully believe it will be with Canada. I think it may be the catalist they would need to become separate entities on their own. Or at least attempt.
Well I for one know that if Quebec decide to to have a UDI then it will not be only the


Royal Canadian Armed Forces
Royal Commonwealth Armed Forces
Anglo-Quebec Militias
American Voluntere Militas


But also the combined force of the First Nations that will be against the PQ and their Terrorists. Beware Quebecois Nationalist you will face destruction by declaring a UDI for Quebec. When the Civil War is over in Quebec the peace terms will be far harsher then what happend in the Quebec Act.
You and Bear the militant, would get along fine, if I didn't keep him locked up and smothered in Turkey gravy.
Yes I am in Quebec. I also need some Native History to quell what some people are saying. You hear a lot from people but I also hear a lot and it discusses me at the atitude towards the Native people. However as you have already stated a lot comes from the media who always potrays your people as the bad guys. Anything to sell paper eh! I also completely support your claims for your lands and please never give up.

Thank you for the link, I will read it carefully and if I have anymore questions I will let you know. It it very interesting discussing with you. Have to go for now but will be back later.
Thanks again.
Anytime Sparrow, just pm any questions you have to me and I'll try to answer them. I have a few contacts. One of which own the Tansi news paper. A paper I write for often. He is very mobile and is always visiting reservations for stories. If he can't get me some info, or point me in the direction, I'll wager it doesn't exist, lol.
 

CDNBear

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Here it is Logic, beat these numbers if you can!!!!!!!!!!

95% said "Non". That's pretty clear to the sane and intellegent.