Clever Clogs
Posts: 647 
October 18th, 2006, 08:47 AM
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl.../National/home
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl.../National/home
Quote:
I would agree with the bolded quote that Harper is catering mostly to a fringe group and hence the downward trend. Conservatives simply do not have the numbers in Canada they do in the US and so Harper would need to govern more collectively. Harper is trying to be like George Bush but he doesn't realize Bush is losing support as well.
OTTAWA — The leaderless federal Liberals have caught up to Stephen Harper's Tories in electoral popularity for the first time since the federal election campaign, according to a new poll that shows the parties in a dead heat.
The survey, conducted for The Globe and Mail-CTV News, finds that the two parties would each receive 32 per cent of the votes were an election to be held today.
Perhaps the most sobering results for the Conservatives are in Quebec, where the party has been in a steady drop since May. At that time, it was the first choice of 30 per cent of Quebec voters, compared with 16 per cent today. The party received 25 per cent of Quebec votes in the Jan. 23 election.
By contrast, the Quebec numbers are good news for the Liberals, who are the first choice of 28 per cent of Quebeckers, up seven percentage points from January and 10 points from last month. The Bloc Québécois continues to lead the pack, with 44 per cent.
“There's a cumulative effect,” Mr. Gregg said. “If you consistently say things that voters disagree with, after some point in time you'll be saying ‘you're not like me and you're not for me.' “ At a national level, the survey finds that the Conservatives have dropped four percentage points from the January election, from 36 per cent to 32 per cent, while the Liberals have inched up two points from 30 points to 32.
The survey, conducted for The Globe and Mail-CTV News, finds that the two parties would each receive 32 per cent of the votes were an election to be held today.
Perhaps the most sobering results for the Conservatives are in Quebec, where the party has been in a steady drop since May. At that time, it was the first choice of 30 per cent of Quebec voters, compared with 16 per cent today. The party received 25 per cent of Quebec votes in the Jan. 23 election.
By contrast, the Quebec numbers are good news for the Liberals, who are the first choice of 28 per cent of Quebeckers, up seven percentage points from January and 10 points from last month. The Bloc Québécois continues to lead the pack, with 44 per cent.
“There's a cumulative effect,” Mr. Gregg said. “If you consistently say things that voters disagree with, after some point in time you'll be saying ‘you're not like me and you're not for me.' “ At a national level, the survey finds that the Conservatives have dropped four percentage points from the January election, from 36 per cent to 32 per cent, while the Liberals have inched up two points from 30 points to 32.
Bright Spark
Posts: 496 
Location: In Monsoon West (B.C)
Location: In Monsoon West (B.C)
October 18th, 2006, 09:04 AM
I agree to a certain extent. Governing to a right-wing base does not work, or a left-wing base in Canada. You have to be central, and Harper did that in the election and maybe a day after, but more and more he is showing that he and his party will continue with right-wing politics. Which will kiss away a majority, and eventually, hopefully next year cost him an election.
I agree to a certain extent. Governing to a right-wing base does not work, or a left-wing base in Canada. You have to be central, and Harper did that in the election and maybe a day after, but more and more he is showing that he and his party will continue with right-wing politics. Which will kiss away a majority, and eventually, hopefully next year cost him an election.
Metal King
Posts: 1,029 
Location: Golden Horseshoe, Ontario
Location: Golden Horseshoe, Ontario
October 18th, 2006, 09:34 AM
Too bad it's the Liberals with their leaderless party as the major "second contender", cos I don't particularly like the way that "leadership race" is stacking up- pretty much everyone in the running is more of a "conservative" than types like the much hated Mulroney, making the shift from centre-left to full-on right that the Liberals have been engaged in ever since the heady days of the CRAP pretty much a done deal
And agreed, Harper has hoped that the unshakable suport of lunatics will somehow beat out the majority, and it looks like the reality is not going to conform to that notion. I'm not sure what kind of game is being played on our federal stage right now, but I really don't like it- it's almost as if Harper is pushing REAL hard to the right so as to allow the Liberals to become more right-wing in their policies and still be viewed as some sort of "alternative", queer and disturbing it all is to me
Too bad it's the Liberals with their leaderless party as the major "second contender", cos I don't particularly like the way that "leadership race" is stacking up- pretty much everyone in the running is more of a "conservative" than types like the much hated Mulroney, making the shift from centre-left to full-on right that the Liberals have been engaged in ever since the heady days of the CRAP pretty much a done deal
And agreed, Harper has hoped that the unshakable suport of lunatics will somehow beat out the majority, and it looks like the reality is not going to conform to that notion. I'm not sure what kind of game is being played on our federal stage right now, but I really don't like it- it's almost as if Harper is pushing REAL hard to the right so as to allow the Liberals to become more right-wing in their policies and still be viewed as some sort of "alternative", queer and disturbing it all is to me
Stuck in Ontario...bah
Posts: 706
Location: Petawawa Ontario
Location: Petawawa Ontario
October 18th, 2006, 09:45 AM
I think if Rae wins the Liberals will loose a spring election, Rae is to liberal for most Liberal Cons.....so that would force them to vote Harper...Igntief however is just the right mix for us Liberal Cons....so If he won the leadership, the Harper Government could be in trouble.
I think if Rae wins the Liberals will loose a spring election, Rae is to liberal for most Liberal Cons.....so that would force them to vote Harper...Igntief however is just the right mix for us Liberal Cons....so If he won the leadership, the Harper Government could be in trouble.
Metal King
Posts: 1,029
Location: Golden Horseshoe, Ontario
Location: Golden Horseshoe, Ontario
October 18th, 2006, 10:03 AM
That was the crux of my point, I guess, and you pretty much summed it up perfectly with your post, ESS (and I ain't attackin you at all, no worries)
Ignatieff is a conservative in every respect, which has fully guaranteed that the Liberal party is likely no longer an option for more "left leaning former Liberals" like me, Ignatieff is pretty much Mulroney v 2.0 and I am not buying that business. It is odd how the Liberal base has followed along with this shift, and that is what has me kinda concerned- a lot of folks I speak with would identify themselves as "liberals" but are politically staunch conservatives and don't even realize it... I just find it odd and kinda frustrating I guess, the way the "labels" have remained despite a wholesale change in the contents
That was the crux of my point, I guess, and you pretty much summed it up perfectly with your post, ESS (and I ain't attackin you at all, no worries)
Ignatieff is a conservative in every respect, which has fully guaranteed that the Liberal party is likely no longer an option for more "left leaning former Liberals" like me, Ignatieff is pretty much Mulroney v 2.0 and I am not buying that business. It is odd how the Liberal base has followed along with this shift, and that is what has me kinda concerned- a lot of folks I speak with would identify themselves as "liberals" but are politically staunch conservatives and don't even realize it... I just find it odd and kinda frustrating I guess, the way the "labels" have remained despite a wholesale change in the contents
Stuck in Ontario...bah
Posts: 706
Location: Petawawa Ontario
Location: Petawawa Ontario
October 18th, 2006, 10:17 AM
I was one of those Liberals but Staunch Conservitve people...But I have recently realized it...So I hope Ignatieff wins. He seem like a good guy for the job, and with all this talk of wanting to be the next Peirre T. I would sya he has a decent shot at it. But I dont dislike Harper so fer ethier...so as long as rae doesnt win Ill be happy
I was one of those Liberals but Staunch Conservitve people...But I have recently realized it...So I hope Ignatieff wins. He seem like a good guy for the job, and with all this talk of wanting to be the next Peirre T. I would sya he has a decent shot at it. But I dont dislike Harper so fer ethier...so as long as rae doesnt win Ill be happy
Super Genius
Posts: 1,274
October 18th, 2006, 01:55 PM
I don't really understand why ANY Canadian would still support either the Liberals or Conservatives.
Harper has proven himself to be a total American sell-out, something most Canadians utterly abhor as it leas us to "total integration", which is a very real agenda that Harper continues to serve. Also, Canadians seemed to be much more proud when Canada was seen as a "Peacekeeper Force" compared to the current " Taliban killing force" that Harper has re-made our armed forces into.
The Liberals are still the thieves they were last term, and the term before that etc etc. Catering to the Elites, grabbing pieces of the pie whenever they can... And, apparently with Ignatieff, Liberals will be doing just what Harper is doing - pretending to be Canadian while doing whatever the Americans tell them to do [eg. - marijuana law reforms were ready to go thru in 1998, but the USA war on drugs told them not to do it and here we still are without even medical marijuana for the tragically ill].
I am no longer advocating for the NDP, who have shown themselves to be gutless and speachless over the past few years. Jack Layton has said very little about anything despite being able to call a press conferance anytime he wants to.
Global Warming, reducing our use of fossil fuels, and getting out from the USA's War on Terror and the War on Drugs , plus protecting Canada's water and energy resources, are issue that seem to have no champioins in Canadian political circles.
It would have to be a serious change in how we organised nominations and elections to get politicians into power who actually will fight for what the majority of Canadians want. Not one of the parties or members of this elected Federal house is doing it, or will ever do it.
I don't really understand why ANY Canadian would still support either the Liberals or Conservatives.
Harper has proven himself to be a total American sell-out, something most Canadians utterly abhor as it leas us to "total integration", which is a very real agenda that Harper continues to serve. Also, Canadians seemed to be much more proud when Canada was seen as a "Peacekeeper Force" compared to the current " Taliban killing force" that Harper has re-made our armed forces into.
The Liberals are still the thieves they were last term, and the term before that etc etc. Catering to the Elites, grabbing pieces of the pie whenever they can... And, apparently with Ignatieff, Liberals will be doing just what Harper is doing - pretending to be Canadian while doing whatever the Americans tell them to do [eg. - marijuana law reforms were ready to go thru in 1998, but the USA war on drugs told them not to do it and here we still are without even medical marijuana for the tragically ill].
I am no longer advocating for the NDP, who have shown themselves to be gutless and speachless over the past few years. Jack Layton has said very little about anything despite being able to call a press conferance anytime he wants to.
Global Warming, reducing our use of fossil fuels, and getting out from the USA's War on Terror and the War on Drugs , plus protecting Canada's water and energy resources, are issue that seem to have no champioins in Canadian political circles.
It would have to be a serious change in how we organised nominations and elections to get politicians into power who actually will fight for what the majority of Canadians want. Not one of the parties or members of this elected Federal house is doing it, or will ever do it.
Newbie
Posts: 40
Location: Ontario
Location: Ontario
October 21st, 2006, 05:19 AM
I am happy with the way Harper made things... I like the fact that our gst went down.... I don't see why people would vote liberal again after 13 years of corruption.... us canadians have to realize the harper government is trying its best.... I've been doign a lot of research in our politics and I see a past of corruption and broken promises much like the not so liked mulroney and chretien... I think paul martin tried to clean up after chretien but it was too late... Now I think harper is starting out good with good priorities in the future... It sometimes takes time for things to get done mostly because of meetings and a lot of paper work... If we continue with Harper's government we will eventually see a brighter future... We're finally gonna see more pollution control which I was reading about on their website and I really hope to see soemthign good with that... I would not like to see the liberals win again and have things fall back like before.... I'm not sayign the liberals are bad because they did some good in the last 13 years paying off a lot of our deficits while I was still a kid but what I think pays our deficits the most are taxes from the tobacco products... I hope Harper stays for a long time
I am happy with the way Harper made things... I like the fact that our gst went down.... I don't see why people would vote liberal again after 13 years of corruption.... us canadians have to realize the harper government is trying its best.... I've been doign a lot of research in our politics and I see a past of corruption and broken promises much like the not so liked mulroney and chretien... I think paul martin tried to clean up after chretien but it was too late... Now I think harper is starting out good with good priorities in the future... It sometimes takes time for things to get done mostly because of meetings and a lot of paper work... If we continue with Harper's government we will eventually see a brighter future... We're finally gonna see more pollution control which I was reading about on their website and I really hope to see soemthign good with that... I would not like to see the liberals win again and have things fall back like before.... I'm not sayign the liberals are bad because they did some good in the last 13 years paying off a lot of our deficits while I was still a kid but what I think pays our deficits the most are taxes from the tobacco products... I hope Harper stays for a long time
